Christian Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • Focus on the Family

    Strengthening families through biblical principles.

    Focus on the Family addresses the use of biblical principles in parenting and marriage to strengthen the family.

  • Guest, Join Papa Zoom today for some uplifting biblical encouragement! --> Daily Verses
  • The Gospel of Jesus Christ

    Heard of "The Gospel"? Want to know more?

    There is salvation in no other, for there is not another name under heaven having been given among men, by which it behooves us to be saved."

Are Christians Wretched??? Paul's answer might surprise you:

2024 Website Hosting Fees

Total amount
$905.00
Goal
$1,038.00

chessman

Member
By his own post-conversion admission, Paul's body/flesh was (still) a wretched, slave to sin.

Romans 7:24-25 (LEB) Wretched man that I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself with my mind am enslaved to the law of God, but with my flesh I am enslaved to the law of sin.

Paul was still wanting/needing his body to be rescued!

Yet his mind (his inner person, v23) had already been rescued and become a slave to God's law.

So, how long does Paul say his body (his flesh) would be a "slave to the law of sin"???

Romans 7:1 (LEB) Or do you not know, brothers for I am speaking to those who know the law, that the law is master of a person for as long a time as he lives?

Paul was expecting that his wretched body would be, just that, a wretched slave to sin for as long as his body lived. Yet conversely, his mind would be a slave to the law of God for as long as his mind lived.

So when was Paul expecting that his mortal body would join his already rescued mind and become a slave to God's law too?

Romans 8:11, 23 (LEB) And if the Spirit of the one who raised Jesus from the dead lives in you, the one who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also make alive your mortal bodies through his Spirit who lives in you. ...
Not only this, but we ourselves also, having the first fruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves while we await eagerly our adoption, the redemption of our body.

Just as sure as Christ Jesus was first raised bodily, surely this same one who raised Him, will secondly redeem and raise our wretched bodies too. Problem is, that body must first die. [even Paul's]
 
By his own post-conversion admission, Paul's body/flesh was (still) a wretched, slave to sin.

Romans 7:24-25 (LEB) Wretched man that I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself with my mind am enslaved to the law of God, but with my flesh I am enslaved to the law of sin.

Paul was still wanting/needing his body to be rescued!

Yet his mind (his inner person, v23) had already been rescued and become a slave to God's law.

So, how long does Paul say his body (his flesh) would be a "slave to the law of sin"???

Romans 7:1 (LEB) Or do you not know, brothers for I am speaking to those who know the law, that the law is master of a person for as long a time as he lives?

Paul was expecting that his wretched body would be, just that, a wretched slave to sin for as long as his body lived. Yet conversely, his mind would be a slave to the law of God for as long as his mind lived.

So when was Paul expecting that his mortal body would join his already rescued mind and become a slave to God's law too?

Romans 8:11, 23 (LEB) And if the Spirit of the one who raised Jesus from the dead lives in you, the one who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also make alive your mortal bodies through his Spirit who lives in you. ...
Not only this, but we ourselves also, having the first fruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves while we await eagerly our adoption, the redemption of our body.

Just as sure as Christ Jesus was first raised bodily, surely this same one who raised Him, will secondly redeem and raise our wretched bodies too. Problem is, that body must first die. [even Paul's]

"Yet his mind (his inner person, v23) had already been rescued and become a slave to God's law."

1 Corinthians 9:
14Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

15But I have used none of these things: neither have I written these things, that it should be so done unto me: for it were better for me to die, than that any man should make my glorying void. 16For though I preach the gospel, I have nothing to glory of: for necessity is laid upon me; yea, woe is unto me, if I preach not the gospel!

17For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.18What is my reward then? Verily that, when I preach the gospel, I may make the gospel of Christ without charge, that I abuse not my power in the gospel.

19For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more. 20And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law; 21To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law. 22To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some. 23And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you."
 
By his own post-conversion admission, Paul's body/flesh was (still) a wretched, slave to sin.

Romans 7:24-25 (LEB) Wretched man that I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself with my mind am enslaved to the law of God, but with my flesh I am enslaved to the law of sin.

Paul was still wanting/needing his body to be rescued!

Yet his mind (his inner person, v23) had already been rescued and become a slave to God's law.

So, how long does Paul say his body (his flesh) would be a "slave to the law of sin"???

Romans 7:1 (LEB) Or do you not know, brothers for I am speaking to those who know the law, that the law is master of a person for as long a time as he lives?

Paul was expecting that his wretched body would be, just that, a wretched slave to sin for as long as his body lived. Yet conversely, his mind would be a slave to the law of God for as long as his mind lived.

So when was Paul expecting that his mortal body would join his already rescued mind and become a slave to God's law too?

Romans 8:11, 23 (LEB) And if the Spirit of the one who raised Jesus from the dead lives in you, the one who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also make alive your mortal bodies through his Spirit who lives in you. ...
Not only this, but we ourselves also, having the first fruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves while we await eagerly our adoption, the redemption of our body.

Just as sure as Christ Jesus was first raised bodily, surely this same one who raised Him, will secondly redeem and raise our wretched bodies too. Problem is, that body must first die. [even Paul's]
Well said. :clap:clap:clap:clap:clap :thumbsup :amen
 
By his own post-conversion admission, Paul's body/flesh was (still) a wretched, slave to sin.

Romans 7:24-25 (LEB) Wretched man that I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself with my mind am enslaved to the law of God, but with my flesh I am enslaved to the law of sin.

Paul was still wanting/needing his body to be rescued!

Yet his mind (his inner person, v23) had already been rescued and become a slave to God's law.

So, how long does Paul say his body (his flesh) would be a "slave to the law of sin"???

Romans 7:1 (LEB) Or do you not know, brothers for I am speaking to those who know the law, that the law is master of a person for as long a time as he lives?

Paul was expecting that his wretched body would be, just that, a wretched slave to sin for as long as his body lived. Yet conversely, his mind would be a slave to the law of God for as long as his mind lived.

So when was Paul expecting that his mortal body would join his already rescued mind and become a slave to God's law too?

Romans 8:11, 23 (LEB) And if the Spirit of the one who raised Jesus from the dead lives in you, the one who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also make alive your mortal bodies through his Spirit who lives in you. ...
Not only this, but we ourselves also, having the first fruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves while we await eagerly our adoption, the redemption of our body.

Just as sure as Christ Jesus was first raised bodily, surely this same one who raised Him, will secondly redeem and raise our wretched bodies too. Problem is, that body must first die. [even Paul's]


Jesus Christ did rescue Paul, because Paul learned and taught us the answer to victory over the sinful cravings and desires of the flesh.

There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. Romans 8:1
  • Those Christians who live according to the desires of the flesh are condemned.
  • Those Christians who live according to the Spirit are under no condemnation.

There are two ways for the Christian to live their life on earth: according to the flesh or according to the Spirit.

Therefore, brethren, we are debtors—not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh.
For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.
Romans 8:12-13

Those who live their lives obeying the unrighteous desires of the flesh will receive God's wrath.
Those who live their lives in obedience to the Spirit, will receive eternal life.


God, who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:
eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;
but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,
Romans 2:6-8


Chapter 6, he says it this way:

16 Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness? Romans 6:16




JLB
 
There is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. Who will bring a charge against God’s elect?

Those Christians who live according to the desires of the flesh are condemned.

Romans 8:33-35 (NASB) Who will bring a charge against God’s elect? God is the one who justifies; who is the one who condemns? Christ Jesus is He who died, yes, rather who was raised, who is at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us. Who will separate us from the love of Christ? Will tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

The relevant question is, however; how shall Christians still live in sin yet know there is now no condemnation??? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase??? No! Know, however, ALL of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death

Romans 6:2b-4 (NASB) How shall we who died to sin still live in it? Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death? Therefore we have been buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life. ...​
 
There is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. Who will bring a charge against God’s elect?



Romans 8:33-35 (NASB) Who will bring a charge against God’s elect? God is the one who justifies; who is the one who condemns? Christ Jesus is He who died, yes, rather who was raised, who is at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us. Who will separate us from the love of Christ? Will tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

The relevant question is, however; how shall Christians still live in sin yet know there is now no condemnation??? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase??? No! Know, however, ALL of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death

Romans 6:2b-4 (NASB) How shall we who died to sin still live in it? Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death? Therefore we have been buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life. ...​

There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Romans 8:1-6

  • There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh.
  • that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh.

12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtorsnot to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. 13 For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. Romans 8:12-14

  1. if you live according to the flesh you will die
  2. if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live
The two choices each of us have, is to live according to the flesh, or live according to the Spirit.
  1. obey unrighteousness.
  2. obey righteousness.

God, who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:
eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;
but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,
Romans 2:6-8

  1. eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;
  2. those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,

  • These two opposing choices are seen, throughout the bible:

Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness? Romans 6:16

...you are that one’s slaves whom you obey:
  1. whether of sin leading to death
  2. obedience leading to righteousness

7 Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. 8 For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life. Galatians 6:7-8

...whatever a man sows, that he will also reap.
  1. he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption
  2. he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life



JLB
 
There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.

This topic and the explanation in the above verse it so important. There is a law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus and it is not the same as the law of sin!!

We see this "law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus" in so many places in the Bible, but it is missed and not understood.

For example: What is the greatest commandment? Ask most Christians and they will say it is to love the Lord you God with all you have and your neighbor as yourself. That is the greatest command in the law of sin. We know we should do that but we don't know how. The command is the "law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus" explains how.

A scribes comes up to Jesus and asks Him, "What commandment is the foremost of all", and Jesus answers is recorded in Mark 12:29

Jesus answered, "The foremost is, HEAR, O ISRAEL!....

Hear, O Israel is commanded in other places in the Bible.

Ps 81:8 "Hear, O My people...

Is 1:2 Listen, O heavens, and hear, O earth

Deut 6:3 O Israel, you should listen and be careful to do it,

Still Moses explained to them, Deut 8:20 ... you shall perish; because you would not listen to the voice of the Lord your God.

And what happens if we would seek out and listen to the voice of the Lord our God? Well, let's go back to Mark 12 and check out the next verse. Mark 12:30 AND YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WIL ALL YOUR HEART...

If we keep the foremost command to listen to the voice of the Lord, which is the command in "the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus", then we will love the Lord our God with all our heart, because hearing what He has to personally say to you will cause you to see His love for you. It will give you wisdom, knowledge, and understanding. You will see how His was are right and not yours. You will see how He loves His creation and wishes that they would just turn to Him and listen to Him. Which can also been seen in Ps 81 after we are told to Hear.

Ps 81:13 Oh that My people would listen to Me.

He wants us to listen to Him, He wants a relationship. So it is that "the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus" is what sets us free. But who is listening? Are His people listening to Him, or are Christians today so often just saying they are?

Ps 81:15 Those who hate the Lord would pretend obedience to Him

Is 30:9 For this is a rebellious people, false sons, Sons who refuse to listen to the instructions of the Lord.

There is nothing new under the Sun. God's chosen people did not in general listen to Him. And the Prophets explained it to them. And now the gentiles have been given a chance and been grafted into the Jewish root, but are we having that same problem.

I confess that I don't listen to Him like I should. I hear Him everyday, and perhaps a dozen times a day, but that is not enough. I could hear Him a lot more, and I know I should. Yet I run across Christian, and it seems like most Christians, that don't think hearing the Lord is something that should even happen daily. Apparently "the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus" was never made clear to them and they often have been going to a Christian church for years. How sad is that. We need to make the message clear.
 
Jesus Christ did rescue Paul, because Paul learned and taught us the answer to victory over the sinful cravings and desires of the flesh.

There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. Romans 8:1
  • Those Christians who live according to the desires of the flesh are condemned.
  • Those Christians who live according to the Spirit are under no condemnation.

There are two ways for the Christian to live their life on earth: according to the flesh or according to the Spirit.

Therefore, brethren, we are debtors—not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh.
For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.
Romans 8:12-13

Those who live their lives obeying the unrighteous desires of the flesh will receive God's wrath.
Those who live their lives in obedience to the Spirit, will receive eternal life.


God, who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:
eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;
but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,
Romans 2:6-8


Chapter 6, he says it this way:

16 Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness? Romans 6:16




JLB
Very well said my friend JLB. :goodpost :clap
Love You,
Chopper
 
This topic and the explanation in the above verse it so important. There is a law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus and it is not the same as the law of sin!!

We see this "law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus" in so many places in the Bible, but it is missed and not understood.

For example: What is the greatest commandment? Ask most Christians and they will say it is to love the Lord you God with all you have and your neighbor as yourself. That is the greatest command in the law of sin. We know we should do that but we don't know how. The command is the "law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus" explains how.

A scribes comes up to Jesus and asks Him, "What commandment is the foremost of all", and Jesus answers is recorded in Mark 12:29

Jesus answered, "The foremost is, HEAR, O ISRAEL!....

Hear, O Israel is commanded in other places in the Bible.

Ps 81:8 "Hear, O My people...

Is 1:2 Listen, O heavens, and hear, O earth

Deut 6:3 O Israel, you should listen and be careful to do it,

Still Moses explained to them, Deut 8:20 ... you shall perish; because you would not listen to the voice of the Lord your God.

And what happens if we would seek out and listen to the voice of the Lord our God? Well, let's go back to Mark 12 and check out the next verse. Mark 12:30 AND YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WIL ALL YOUR HEART...

If we keep the foremost command to listen to the voice of the Lord, which is the command in "the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus", then we will love the Lord our God with all our heart, because hearing what He has to personally say to you will cause you to see His love for you. It will give you wisdom, knowledge, and understanding. You will see how His was are right and not yours. You will see how He loves His creation and wishes that they would just turn to Him and listen to Him. Which can also been seen in Ps 81 after we are told to Hear.

Ps 81:13 Oh that My people would listen to Me.

He wants us to listen to Him, He wants a relationship. So it is that "the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus" is what sets us free. But who is listening? Are His people listening to Him, or are Christians today so often just saying they are?

Ps 81:15 Those who hate the Lord would pretend obedience to Him

Is 30:9 For this is a rebellious people, false sons, Sons who refuse to listen to the instructions of the Lord.

There is nothing new under the Sun. God's chosen people did not in general listen to Him. And the Prophets explained it to them. And now the gentiles have been given a chance and been grafted into the Jewish root, but are we having that same problem.

I confess that I don't listen to Him like I should. I hear Him everyday, and perhaps a dozen times a day, but that is not enough. I could hear Him a lot more, and I know I should. Yet I run across Christian, and it seems like most Christians, that don't think hearing the Lord is something that should even happen daily. Apparently "the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus" was never made clear to them and they often have been going to a Christian church for years. How sad is that. We need to make the message clear.

So true.

One of the big strategies of the devil is to stop God's people from learning to hear the Voice of the Lord and be led by the Spirit, by the false teachings in the Church ranging from:

Cessationism; that the "sign gifts" such as prophecy, healing and speaking in tongues ceased with the apostles and the completion of the canon of Scripture.

to

OSAS: the belief that a person who believes in Jesus Christ is saved and has eternal life at that moment, no matter how they live their lives, they will go to heaven, even if the blaspheme the Holy Spirit, or depart from the faith, in which the no longer believe.




JLB
 
So true.

One of the big strategies of the devil is to stop God's people from learning to hear the Voice of the Lord and be led by the Spirit, by the false teachings in the Church ranging from:

Cessationism; that the "sign gifts" such as prophecy, healing and speaking in tongues ceased with the apostles and the completion of the canon of Scripture.

to

OSAS: the belief that a person who believes in Jesus Christ is saved and has eternal life at that moment, no matter how they live their lives, they will go to heaven, even if the blaspheme the Holy Spirit, or depart from the faith, in which the no longer believe.




JLB

Well, since we have the keys, and the gates can't stand against us, I say we do a little prison break. I'll get the ropes and horses.........
 
So true.

One of the big strategies of the devil is to stop God's people from learning to hear the Voice of the Lord and be led by the Spirit, by the false teachings in the Church ranging from:

Cessationism; that the "sign gifts" such as prophecy, healing and speaking in tongues ceased with the apostles and the completion of the canon of Scripture.

to

OSAS: the belief that a person who believes in Jesus Christ is saved and has eternal life at that moment, no matter how they live their lives, they will go to heaven, even if the blaspheme the Holy Spirit, or depart from the faith, in which the no longer believe.




JLB
That is so true my friend. Satan has deceived our church leaders for centuries about the loss of those gifts of the Holy Spirit. It's no wonder that our churches are so weak and without power.
 
Paul was expecting that his wretched body would be, just that, a wretched slave to sin for as long as his body lived. Yet conversely, his mind would be a slave to the law of God for as long as his mind lived.
I don't think so. He taught that we should take control of our bodies.
Rom 8:3-5 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
The word, "walking" refers to a person's habitual behavior. "Walking" according to the Spirit is bearing the fruit of the spirit instead of doing the works of the flesh. So those who "walk...according to the Spirit" have subdued and taken command over the lusts of the flesh.

Rom 8:12 -13 So then, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh--for if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body you will live.

Rom 6:17-18 But thanks be to God, that you who were once slaves of sin have become obedient from the heart to the standard of teaching to which you were committed, and, having been set free from sin, have become slaves of righteousness.

So, yeah, we don't always win but, we are no longer enslaved to sin and we are supposed to actively engaged in "putting to death the deeds of the flesh" and "living by the Spirit".

Iakov the fool
 
He taught that we should take control of our bodies.

The passage you posted doesn't say anything about us "taking control" of our bodies.

For example; Can you raise your body from the dead, or rather, can the Spirit (capital S) who lives in you do that for you??? (We both know the answer)

Romans 8:11 And if the Spirit of the one who raised Jesus from the dead lives in you, the one who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also make alive your mortal bodies through his Spirit who lives in you.

The word, "walking" refers to a person's habitual behavior.
Okay. I'll buy that.

Then our habitual behavior (our walking) sould be according to ______?

A. Our control of our bodies
B. The Spirit's control

If you live according to the flesh, you are going to die, but if by ______ you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. For all those who are led by ________, these are sons of God?

A. Our control of our bodies
B. The Spirit of God

In affliction we prevail completely through _______?

A. Our control of our bodies.
B. the One who loved us.
 
Everyone is wretched. No one can say there perfect in the flesh.

Thinking we are perfect (and we all do that) then what motive do we have for seeking the Lord?

That is why repentance and humility is important. A truly repentant and humble person realizes that it is not their thinking and their ways which are good, but only God is good. The outcome of that thinking is regularly seeking the voice of the Lord for what He has to say. And since it is written that all those who seek find, we will find Him and HIs little voice with love, wisdom and instructions for us.

Thus the opposite is true, If you are not seeking the voice of the Lord it is because of your pride (that idea that you are perfect). Oh, someone might try to tell themselves that they don't hear and seek the Lord because He does not exists, but that is really only a reason we make to ourselves to explain away our not seek God. Wisdom would say that even if you weren't sure whether God did exist you would still seek Him out to see if He does, because of the possibilities. And the Spirit of God, who is sometimes referred to as Wisdom, is always trying to draw people to the Lord.

So while I can not agree that no one can say we are perfect, simply because we all do that at times, I can certainly agree that everyone is wretched, and that because we do say we are perfect instead of seeking the Lord like we should.
 
I'm going to add this into the mix, cause it for some reason got skipped.

Romans 8:9-11 You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you.

As I was writing out this scripture I noticed something. First he says, Christ in us........body dead/spirit alive. Then he says (he who raised christ) will give life to our mortal body

It's almost saying there is a double security when it comes to sin. Christ and then the Father will help also.
 
I'm going to add this into the mix, cause it for some reason got skipped.

Romans 8:9-11 You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you.

As I was writing out this scripture I noticed something. First he says, Christ in us........body dead/spirit alive. Then he says (he who raised christ) will give life to our mortal body

It's almost saying there is a double security when it comes to sin. Christ and then the Father will help also.

Double security?
 
Double security?

When I read God's word, it sets in my mind and in my heart as 100% true. So he's saying because of Christ the body may be dead because of sin, but Christ will guide you unto righteousness. Then he says he who raised Christ will also give life to our mortal body. (Double action taking place)
 
Back
Top