5 years since 9-11....

[ikester7579]

Just thought I'd bring up the topic for discussion. And also leave some really neat flash movies about this that were made.

My site on this: http://www.yecheadquarters.org/911/index.html

Flash movies: http://www.heartlight.org/dynimation/index.html

 

[ZeroTX]

Sadly, after only 5 years, many have forgotten and the youth barely know life before it.... they don't know life without terrorists being a thought...

Most importantly, we learned nothing. We have not done one real thing to stop these people, to defend ourselves.

We are chained down by self-inflicted political correctness standards. Why are we strip searching grandmas and babies in airports instead of picking out arab men in their 20's - 40's? Why are we using terms like "religious extremism" when we mean orthodox Islam? Why are we pussy-footing around with hostile countries that we know are harboring known terrorists? 50 years ago we (all threatened nations, working together, not the limp-wristed UN) would have given them the appropriate ultimatum and handled it. Handled it. Once and for all.

We learned nothing from 9/11. The terrorists are rejoicing in our weakness and failure to do even the basic things necessary to defend ourselves. We should not be cowering in fear, but collectively (as all nations of the free world) squashing these "extremists" like the bugs they are. People who kill innocents do not deserve to continue to enjoy life.

-Michael

 

[Quath]

I think a lot of perspectives have been messed with. What was the biggest killer of Americans in September of 2001? It was automobile crashes. We lose about 3,536 Americans per month due to car crashes.

We did not declare war on GM or Ford because of this. We decided that 3.5k deaths per month is an acceptable loss to travel around quicker.

Likewise, when it comes to crime, we don't spend all our money trying to stop it. We spend some on heath care, education, improving roads, etc. We have found a rough balance in crime prevention and our other desires.

The worst thing that could have happened from 9-11 was for people to over react, develop fear and act irrationally. Unfortunately, it seems that is what happened. For example, people were so scared to fly or were so inconvienced at the airport, that more people drove cars. Cornelle University estimated that the deaths from the extra people driving resulted in an additional 1,200 deaths.

I would bet that if 9-11 had not occurred, we would not have had the war in Iraq. Bush rushed into the war and pushed the inspectors out because he knew he would lose political capital if he waited too long. And we see how badly things are going in Iraq now.

In the end, we have wasted billions of dollars and have made the world a more dangerous place. If we had stayed in Afghanistan and worked to make it a better place, I think the world would see Americans in a better light. Now we are seen as a belligerent country and we have empowered the fanatics with this view.

Terrorists did spread terror on 9-11. But 5 years has allowed for people to calm down and accept a new post-cold war world. If there is ever another major terrorist attack, I hope we keep it all in perspective and remember the lessons from 9-11.

 

[Lewis]

Likewise, when it comes to crime, we don't spend all our money trying to stop it. We spend some on heath care, education, improving roads, etc. We have found a rough balance in crime prevention and our other desires.

Man cannot stop crime' his job is to keep it down, our courts have deviated from how the Bible tells man to deal with crime, so you see the results. But this mess will continue until our Lord comes back.

 

[ikester7579]

We need to also remember that things do not change over night because one president takes over. Clinton shares more blame for what happened in 9-11 then anyone in government. I don't say this just because I don't like the man. I say this because of his failure to take action because his political stance was more important than our safety.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2005 ... 0750.shtml
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/article ... 3534.shtml

http://www.time.com/time/covers/1101020812/story.html

Several of our Embassies were bombed. Clinton did nothing.
The Cole military ship was bombed, Clinton did nothing.
Clinton had a chance to nab Bin Laden. But was to busy with nabing Lewinsky.

So just like Clinton, we were caught with our pants down.

So for those who think it is all of Bush's fault, how could have Bush undone Clinton's not taking any action against several attacks? Can history be changed, does someone have a time machine?

 

[soma]

The Republicans have a time machine. Everytime something bad happens they go back six years to Clinton.

 

[Quath]

Several of our Embassies were bombed. Clinton did nothing.

Do you really believe this or is this just propaganda out of ignorance? Clinton tried to freeze the assets of bin Laden and people supporting terrorism. He also sent cruise missiles to Afghanistan and a pharmaceutical factory in Sudan. The missles in Afghanistan wee to target bin Laden. The missles in Sudan was to hit a factory that was suppose to be making chemical weapons. This seems to be false and I wonder how many people died from this intelligence failure. (It should be a lesson that foriegn intelligence has a lot of uncertainity.)

 

[soma]

5 years and nothing has happened. Osama Bin Laden is more powerful with a world network and Iran is the power house in the Middle East. 5 years later and all we can do is show pictures of the first day because the Republicans have done nothing. 12 million illegals have invaded our country and the Republicans have done nothing. Our port, airports, and railways are not secure. The money is being spent in Iraq. Repulicans can bad mouth other people, they are good at that so negative campaigns are on the way and Clinton can be brought up, but not the surplus. Are we more secure? The Republicans don't even think we are.

 

[Gabbylittleangel]

5 years and nothing has happened.

No more buildings have gone down. No more planes loaded with people used as bombs.
True. Nothing has happened.

 

[Vic C.]

The Republicans have a time machine. Everytime something bad happens they go back six years to Clinton.

We really should go all the way back to Carter. 8-)

 

[moniker]

5 years and nothing has happened.

No more buildings have gone down. No more planes loaded with people used as bombs.
True. Nothing has happened.

9-10-01 marked 5 years, 2 months, and 15 days to the most recent terrorist bombing in the United States. It was against a crowded area at the Atlanta Olympiad. All our varoius agencies and the Clinton-Bush Presidencies were doing a remarkable job at stopping all terrorist attacks by that point, ey?

How have we become more safe, as opposed to increasing the illusion of security? We haven't. 2 things have happened that have made the airline industry safer as a result of 9-11. Stronger cockpit doors/locks, and a change in the mindset of passengers in the event of a hijacking. Curiously enough, neither of those things hinder our natural rights and liberties.

When the system fails you won't know about it until it's too late. Now all we can do is examine the system, test the system, and see how it holds up to those rigors. Right now port security is non-existent, the rail lines are insecure, and GOA snuck enough radioactive material past border patrols to make 2 dirty bombs (which actually have no harmful effect on people past the mass hysteria and damage of the conventional explosive). The system is failing, and it needs to be fixed.

 

[Vic C.]

he system can't be fixed. Besides, it's not the system that needs fixing.

Also, what happened in Atlanta was not the product of "Islamic" radical terrorism, just like Oklahoma City.

http://english.people.com.cn/200504/14/ ... 80931.html

 

[moniker]

he system can't be fixed. Besides, it's not the system that needs fixing.

The system cannot be fixed? We can't install radiometers and better train our border security guards in terms of how to deal with such substances? We cannot scan and search freight coming in to port to ensure its safety? We cannot improve our intelligence capabilities and their interworking to make a more whole and clear picture of what we face as a nation? Then what did all those billions in the DHS do exactly? Replace the agencies stationary?

Also, what happened in Atlanta was not the product of "Islamic" radical terrorism, just like Oklahoma City.

http://english.people.com.cn/200504/14/ ... 80931.html

That does not in any way make it less of a terrorist attack nor something to be downplayed because it was just a homegrown incident. Besides, if we do ignore this and only qualify islamist attacks that would mean that we have an 8 year record of no terrorist attacks. Clearly the system works with such a record, going off of the 'no buildings collapsed in the last 5 years therefore Bush has made the country safer' logic.

 

[MrVersatile48]

This article draws in fascinating & thought-provoking insights following the 420 AD siege of Rome & from WW2:-

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2006/009/1.78.html

Anyone see the details of the 18 pre-9/11 attacks on USA & her embassies & bases @ http://www.revelation.TV - it was on 2/3 times, Fri-Mon

700 Club had helpful feature from ex-pilot Pat Robertson, who predicted a major terrorist attack before 9/11 & warns of worse to come

Revelation 6 is certainly involves co-ordinated strikes on many fronts, in many areas & in many ways

Praise God that it is the start of the time of God's wrath & judgement, so that we know, from 1 Thessalonians 4-5 etc, that 'we are not destined to go thru the time of wrath, but to be saved' - by the instant airlift Rapture rescue of all who love Jesus

Don't miss it!

& pass it in, so all you know & love have their chance to accept Christ as Lord & Saviour too, OK?

God bless!

Ian

 

[ZeroTX]

"The end times" are definitely near if we're listening to "prophecies" from Pat Robertson. Yikes. Why is the 700 club still on, again?

-Michael

 

[MrVersatile48]

If you read the Bible, it's very clear that Jesus promised the signs of the times heralding His return would be as clear, strong & obvious as accelerating, intensifying birthpains - Matt 24

Update from http://www.crosswalk.com

September 11: Lessons Learned and Unlearned
Chuck Colson

Today is the fifth anniversary of the attacks on the World Trade Center and
the Pentagon, as well as United Flight 93 in Pennsylvania, that took 3,000
innocent lives. At the time, more than a few commentators predicted that,
henceforth, our era would be divided between "pre-September 11" and
"post-September 11."

http://www.crosswalkmail.com/tukhhzje_ppingp.html

9/11 Firefighter Remembers 'Taste of Hell'
Michael Ireland

Larry Everett is a member of the elite Fairfax County, Virginia, Fire and
Rescue Department - and he remembers exactly where he was on Tuesday,
September 11, 2001.

http://www.crosswalkmail.com/kvxllikk_ppingp.html

 

[Vic C.]

The system can't be fixed. Besides, it's not the system that needs fixing.

The system cannot be fixed? We can't install radiometers and better train our border security guards in terms of how to deal with such substances? We cannot scan and search freight coming in to port to ensure its safety? We cannot improve our intelligence capabilities and their interworking to make a more whole and clear picture of what we face as a nation? Then what did all those billions in the DHS do exactly? Replace the agencies stationary?....

No offense, but what I said may have went right over your head. You are looking towards temporal solutions to fix something it is incapable of fixing.

 

[moniker]

The system can't be fixed. Besides, it's not the system that needs fixing.

The system cannot be fixed? We can't install radiometers and better train our border security guards in terms of how to deal with such substances? We cannot scan and search freight coming in to port to ensure its safety? We cannot improve our intelligence capabilities and their interworking to make a more whole and clear picture of what we face as a nation? Then what did all those billions in the DHS do exactly? Replace the agencies stationary?....

No offense, but what I said may have went right over your head. You are looking towards temporal solutions to fix something it is incapable of fixing.

I refuse to believe that religious extremism, and the terrorist track that this mindset runs along with, is an inevitable aspect of human nature, or that humanity cannot improve itself and its surroundings.

 

[Vic C.]

If humanity was able to improve itself, we wouldn't need a Savior now, would we? That is the problem with Man; he thinks he can fix it, but just makes things worse in the process.

 

[moniker]

So all the progresses that we have made in the last few centuries here in the US are not improvements? The ending of slavery, woman's suffrage, and at least attempting to minimize the influence of race, sex, etc. on opportunities is all for naught? Same regarding other developed worlds, and some of the assisstance given to developing nations. No, we may not be able to make things perfect, but we can make the world a better place than it is now.