7th Day Adventist

[Rollo Tamasi]

I went to one of their services once.

I sort of felt chased away.

They were pushing Ellen White books on me and telling me I should be giving 20% of my income to the church.

And this was on my one and only visit.

They certainly do separate themselves from the rest of christianity.

I've met plenty of them but never once did they talk about Jesus unless I brought it up.

Are they a cult?

This seems to be the controversy.

If they believe you must be saved through Jesus, I guess they are okay.

Just a little different from the rest of us.

 

[reba]

Went to a SDA service , family obligation, got about the same thing some years pass .... October 17, 1989 at 5:04 P.M I was coming too after surgery , yea the World series earthquake..! That night I was alone 5 stories up on a hill side about hour north of San Francisco lots can play on your mind... kinda a bit late the nurse comes in asks if she can pray with me....this was a SDA hospital ....I slept that night ....
Gods kids like our kids can be goofy, aggravating , or nurses who pray with ya.

 

[Webb]

I went to one of their services once.

I sort of felt chased away.

They were pushing Ellen White books on me and telling me I should be giving 20% of my income to the church.

And this was on my one and only visit.

They certainly do separate themselves from the rest of christianity.

I've met plenty of them but never once did they talk about Jesus unless I brought it up.

Are they a cult?

This seems to be the controversy.

If they believe you must be saved through Jesus, I guess they are okay.

Just a little different from the rest of us.

You can't find them in your Bible.

 

[JSD]

I was baptized in an SDA church in the late 80's. I wouldn't categorically classify them as a cult, just misguided (as most who profess Christianity tend to be). And no, I no longer subscribe to their organization.

All of us (believers) know we aren't walking as Christ walked (Christian). That 'should be' the bar, the perfection or completeness we should strive for, don't you think?

I'm not listed as a Christian here because I'm not walking as Christ walked. Yes, I believe in the Father and Son but I am far from complete and I don't always serve HIS will over mine. That 'should be' the requisite to calling yourself a Christian. Walk the walk.

Perhaps the next time we point out someone's flaws or beliefs, we should look at our own first and make sure we aren't suffering from the same malady, or worse?

Yes, it's easy to bash 'religions'...they're all easily bash-able with their hypocrisy and lack of the Spirit. As a friend of mine once said...and I believe she was right on this too..."Churches aren't a place to find God, they are man-made institutions."

A few verses...


The Pharisee and the Publican

9 And He also told this parable to some people who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and viewed others with contempt: 10 “Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood and was praying this to himself: ‘God, I thank You that I am not like other people: swindlers, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week; I pay tithes of all that I get.’ 13 But the tax collector, standing some distance away, was even unwilling to lift up his eyes to heaven, but was beating his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, the sinner!’ 14 I tell you, this man went to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted.â€
15 And they were bringing even their babies to Him so that He would touch them, but when the disciples saw it, they began rebuking them. 16 But Jesus called for them, saying, “Permit the children to come to Me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. 17 Truly I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child will not enter it at all.â€

22 So Paul stood in the midst of the Areopagus and said, “Men of Athens, I observe that you are very religious in all respects. 23 For while I was passing through and examining the objects of your worship, I also found an altar with this inscription, ‘TO AN UNKNOWN GOD.’ Therefore what you worship in ignorance, this I proclaim to you. 24 The God who made the world and all things in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands; 25 nor is He served by human hands, as though He needed anything, since He Himself gives to all people life and breath and all things;

Well...how is that for a first post? Shall I prepare a second course (denominations study) or should I close the kitchen? ;)

 

[Eugene]

Perhaps the next time we point out someone's flaws or beliefs, we should look at our own first and make sure we aren't suffering from the same malady, or worse?

Hi JSD and welcome to CF.net. Jeremiah 8:22 Is there no balm in Gilead; is there no physician there? why then is not the health of the daughter of my people recovered? and the balm is Jesus given to heal the sin-sick soul. May God bless your time with us in Jesus' name.

 

[JSD]

Hi JSD and welcome to CF.net. Jeremiah 8:22 Is there no balm in Gilead; is there no physician there? why then is not the health of the daughter of my people recovered? and the balm is Jesus given to heal the sin-sick soul. May God bless your time with us in Jesus' name.

Thanks Eugene! Good verse! Jeremiah has a way with words doesn't he!

13 “For from the least of them even to the greatest of them,
Everyone is greedy for gain,
And from the prophet even to the priest
Everyone deals falsely.
14 “They have healed the brokenness of My people superficially,
Saying, ‘Peace, peace,’
But there is no peace.
15 “Were they ashamed because of the abomination they have done?
They were not even ashamed at all;
They did not even know how to blush.
Therefore they shall fall among those who fall;
At the time that I punish them,
They shall be cast down,†says the Lord.


27 “I have made you an assayer and a tester among My people,
That you may know and assay their way.â€
28 All of them are stubbornly rebellious,
Going about as a talebearer.
They are bronze and iron;
They, all of them, are corrupt.
29 The bellows blow fiercely,
The lead is consumed by the fire;
In vain the refining goes on,
But the wicked are not separated.
30 They call them rejected silver,
Because the Lord has rejected them.

 

[Free Christian]

I hear them advocate vegetarian diets and that eating meat is wrong. The Bible says we can eat meat, Jesus fed the multitude with fish, asked the disciples to prepare the Passover lamb. The Bible tells us we can, they say we cant. I heard a radio play done by them where in Job the Devil/Satan was talking to Michael the Archangel instead of with God as the Bible clearly states. The list goes on with their biblical contradictions.
There are many nice, kind and sincere people in the SDA but it does not detract from the fact that their base/core beliefs or doctrines are wrong and biblically incorrect. Sorry, should also add the Ellen G White made false prophesies, prophesies that never came about. The Bible has quite a few things to say about false prophets. The main one being that we should reject them.
Any religion found by a false prophet, well, a Tree is known by its fruit, can a bad tree bear good fruit?

 

[Mitspa]

I hear them advocate vegetarian diets and that eating meat is wrong. The Bible says we can eat meat, Jesus fed the multitude with fish, asked the disciples to prepare the Passover lamb. The Bible tells us we can, they say we cant. I heard a radio play done by them where in Job the Devil/Satan was talking to Michael the Archangel instead of with God as the Bible clearly states. The list goes on with their biblical contradictions.
There are many nice, kind and sincere people in the SDA but it does not detract from the fact that their base/core beliefs or doctrines are wrong and biblically incorrect. Sorry, should also add the Ellen G White made false prophesies, prophesies that never came about. The Bible has quite a few things to say about false prophets. The main one being that we should reject them.
Any religion found by a false prophet, well, a Tree is known by its fruit, can a bad tree bear good fruit?

Well said! I have known many of these SDA, and have never seen what the bible defines as the fruit of the Spirit in any of them. What I see is a clear an evident error of those who reject the gospel of grace and go about to establish their own righteousness by keeping "parts" of the law.

Ellen G White is shown, without doubt to be a false phophet.

 

[Elijah674]

Surely can attest to that! Look what you just did and without any backing up of scripture. ;)

These statements are exactly how satan and his Gen. 4:7 ones use the Bible ‘testimony’. One needs the total 66 books studied on just the one subject at a time to get the accurate picture put together with all the inspired verses penned by Holy Men of God, while using their own descriptive words. Isa. 28:9-10 documents this Truth!

(it is like putting a puzzle together to get the accurate picture’s Truth)

And all of the prophets are subject to the same Holy Spirit! 1 Cor. 14:32. Meaning that if one of a dozen verses perhaps disagrees with another to your way of thinking, that it is your understanding that is false!

See Acts 10:13-19 and Peter said in ibid 14?? But why?)

Note the reason for this required study understanding....

[8] For all tables are full of vomit and filthiness, so that there is no place clean.[9] Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.
[10] For precept [must be ]upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

And Matt. 4
[4] But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, [but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God].

And 2 Tim. 3

[15] And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
[16] All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

And what is interesting on these forums is how 2000 years after Christ life on earth, most still do not know how wisdom is gained!

-The Time and Place to be considered- (in part only, and for knowing how anyone posted comments are to be understood!)

Regarding the testimonies, (of E.G.W. pen, nothing is ignored, nothing is cast aside, [but time and place must be considered]. Nothing must be done untimely. Some matters must be withheld some persons would make an improper use of the light given. Every jot and title is essential.
...

There will be those who will misrepresent. Their eyes have been blinded, and they set forth the figures and interpretations that Satan has worked out for them, and an entirely different meaning will be placed upon the words that Sister White has spoken. ... They have educated themselves in Satan’s school of misstating. A description of them is given in the third chapter of Zechariah.
..

Many from among our own people are writing to me, asking with earnest determination the privilege of using my writings to give force to certain subjects which they wish to present to the people in such a way as to leave a deep impression upon them.

It is true that there is a reason why some of these matters should be presented: but I would not venture to give my approval in using the testimonies in this way, or to sanction the matter which is good in itself the way which they propose.

...but nevertheless I dare not give the least license for using my writings in this matter which they propose. In taking account of such an enterprise, there are many things that must come into consideration; for in using the testimonies to bolster up some subject which may impress the mind author, the extracts may give a different impression than that which they would were they read in original connection..’

--Elijah

 

[By Grace]

I went to one of their services once. I sort of felt chased away. They were pushing Ellen White books on me and telling me I should be giving 20% of my income to the church. And this was on my one and only visit. They certainly do separate themselves from the rest of christianity. I've met plenty of them but never once did they talk about Jesus unless I brought it up. Are they a cult? This seems to be the controversy. If they believe you must be saved through Jesus, I guess they are okay. Just a little different from the rest of us.

Indeed, they are a cult, in my opinion.

They exalt a woman, the founder of Adventism to the extent that they believe the Bible is wrong, but she is right.
From the official SDA site, here is one fundamental belief:

18. The Gift of Prophecy:
One of the gifts of the Holy Spirit is prophecy. This gift is an identifying mark of the remnant church and was manifested in the ministry of Ellen. G. White . As the Lord's messenger, her writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction. They also make clear that the Bible is the standard by which all teaching and experience must be tested

​

Notice that her works are a continuing and authoritative source of truth. In practical terms, that means even the many instances of medical quackery that she produced is supposed to be true.

Notice also this parallel to 2 Timothy 3:16 in this portion church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction . Since this is an OFFICIAL STATEMENT they meant what they stated. Therefore it is not wrong to conclude that the works of Ellen G White sometimes surpass Scripture. in their importance.

Another distinctive of SDAism is that they preach "salvation by diet". Ellen declared some foods "unclean" (but did not follow the kosher laws) and said that humans were not to eat them. One example of this and is also an exta-Bible heresy is that she believed that whatever a person ingests, the "nature of that" is transferred to humans. if for example, one would eat meat, the "nature of that beast", be it chicken or beef would be going into a person. Since there are no beasts in heaven, humans with a "nature of a beast" can not get into heaven.

There are LOTS more, but this small bit should confirm to any reader what the nature of SD Adventism really is

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Thank you By Grace, but I already knew all that.
Regardless of how they practice their faith, if they receive Jesus as their Lord and savior, then they belong to Jesus.
Therefore, by definition of cult, they are not.

 

[By Grace]

Thank you By Grace, but I already knew all that. Regardless of how they practice their faith, if they receive Jesus as their Lord and savior, then they belong to Jesus. Therefore, by definition of cult, they are not.

Seriously, since you "knew all that" then how can you reconcile such aberrant theology with th4e Bible?

Have you also seen this Fundamental Belief?

10. Experience of Salvation:

In infinite love and mercy God made Christ, who knew no sin, to be sin for us, so that in Him we might be made the righteousness of God. Led by the Holy Spirit we sense our need, acknowledge our sinfulness, repent of our transgressions, and exercise faith in Jesus as Lord and Christ, as Substitute and Example. This faith which receives salvation comes through the divine power of the Word and is the gift of God's grace. Through Christ we are justified, adopted as God's sons and daughters, and delivered from the lordship of sin. Through the Spirit we are born again and sanctified; the Spirit renews our minds, writes God's law of love in our hearts, and we are given the power to live a holy life. Abiding in Him we become partakers of the divine nature and have the assurance of salvation now and in the judgment.

​

Where is " personal sin " mentioned here?
Where is "forgiveness"?
Where is the Atonement?
Where is "grace"?
Where is "Satan"?

They uniformly reject ALL of the Ecumenical Creeds, and of course, the 12 tenets of the Apostle's Creed as mere "inventions of man" nut give great authority to Ellen White, a cataleptic woman whom they revere as a "prophet"

I believe in God, the Father Almighty,
the Maker of heaven and earth,
and in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord:
Who was conceived by the Holy Ghost,
born of the virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, dead, and buried;
He descended into hell.
The third day He arose again from the dead;
He ascended into heaven,
and sitteth on the right hand of God the Father Almighty;
from thence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Ghost;
the holy catholic church;
the communion of saints;
the forgiveness of sins;
the resurrection of the body;
and the life everlasting.

How can you call their "salvation by diiet" and "salvation by works" Scriptural? I can't, nor can the National Association of Evangelicals.

 

[George Muller]

Ga 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

Ga 1:6 ¶ I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

There's no need to get emotional about this.
I think they are orthodox on central doctrines, and heterodox on lesser doctrines.
So, in the end, I think they are okay.
If they truly are servants of Jesus Christ, then I certainly don't want to judge them.
Don't you agree?

 

[George Muller]

Ellen White said for years she was unable to read, bolstering the claim that her beautiful prose was inspired by God. However, it has been discovered that she not only read, but plagiarized other Christian authors throughout virtually all her writings. The sad facts of this matter have been thoroughly and indisputably established in several books. (e.g., see; Rea, Walter, The White Lie; and Judged by the Gospel, pp. 361–83).

 

[George Muller]

There's no need to get emotional about this.
I think they are orthodox on central doctrines, and heterodox on lesser doctrines.
So, in the end, I think they are okay.
If they truly are servants of Jesus Christ, then I certainly don't want to judge them.
Don't you agree?

Well if looking to the scriptures is emotional? I hope to be an emotional all the time. These scriptures are as plain as day, and I dont judge them, Gods Word will judge all.
(also did you see post #9?)

Joh 5:45 Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust.
(KJV)

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Okay, if you believe John 5:45, then you need to be lovingly sharing what you believe to Seventh Day Adventists.
They are the ones that need to be heard by you without being accused by you.

 

[Eugene]

Do SDA's believe on the Lord Jesus Christ? As to falling from grace, that is not saying that they fall from salvation.

Regarding other doctrines of eating, keeping days, etc. I believe are considered in the following scripture.

Romans 14:3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

Romans 14:6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

My thoughts.

 

[George Muller]

Okay, if you believe John 5:45, then you need to be lovingly sharing what you believe to Seventh Day Adventists.
They are the ones that need to be heard by you without being accused by you.

Like I said, I believe the clear Word of God. I have posted the scriptures and if you think that is wrong? Then you can accuse "me" if you like. But it does not change the truth.

2Jo 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
10 ¶ If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds

Ga 1:6 ¶ I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed

 

[By Grace]

There's no need to get emotional about this. I think they are orthodox on central doctrines, and heterodox on lesser doctrines. So, in the end, I think they are okay. If they truly are servants of Jesus Christ, then I certainly don't want to judge them. Don't you agree?

Which of these do you consider "lesser doctrines"

• Our sins will ultimately be placed on Satan. (from White, Ellen, The Great Controversy, p. 422, 485.)
• Jesus is Michael the Archangel.
• Worship must be done on Saturday (the Sabbath).
• On October 22, 1844 Jesus entered the second and last phase of his atoning work.
• Investigative Judgment - the fate of all people will be decided based upon this event in the future.
• The dead do not exist anymore -- soul sleep.
• The wicked are annihilated.
• Ellen G. White, the "founder" of Seventh Day Adventism, was a messenger from God gifted with the spirit of prophecy.
• There is a sanctuary in heaven where Jesus carries out his mediatorial work.

The first makes Satan our sin bearer, not Jesus Christ.

The second is a denial of who Jesus Christ is, according to the Bible

The third is a return to the Galatians heresy.

The fourth, when fully examined says that before 1844, no one was saved.

The fifth, the so-called Investagative Judgment means that all will be judged according to the whims of Ellen, and we will not have an Advocate with the Father, namely Jesus Christ the Righteous.

The sixth denies the resurrection of the righteous and the unrighteous; the former into eternal bliss with Jesus Christ, the latter into eternal torment.

The seventh denies the existence of hell, and makes Jesus Christ a liar

The eighth makes a cataleptic woman into a prophet. it also destroys the role of Jesus Christ as prophet, Priest and coming King.

The last again makes Jesus into a liar because He said to one thief being crucified, "Today, you will be with me in paradise."

YOU may not want to "judge them" but when they make my Savior to be a liar, and attempt to limit the scope of the Atonement of Jesus to those who are "saved by diet" and are "Saturday worshipers" I get rather annoyed. I believe that EACH of these 9 things have major significance.
Don't you agree?