Growth Abundant life?

[Kidron]

(1) It is very difficult to achieve material wealth with God as your primary focus.

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You are making a grand generalization....... as you are decided that if a person works hard, creates wealth, then this person cant be as spiritual as the person that is living at home with his mother, 40 years old, has 134 bibles, and watches christian TV all day till its time to go to church and take communion again.
So, really, .....each person has to be credited with their own heart and motives, and as i said, if a person cant love and serve God and also have money, then this person also cant love God and be poor.
To be poor does not prove spirituality, and to be rich does not prove the prosperity gospel.

 

[Kidron]

So all elders should be rewarded with monetary raises.
Yes, your church is very generous indeed.

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Its a shame that Jim Morrison is in hell.
He was unique.
And yes, dont you think that if anyone "working" is doing a work that is worthy of a good paycheck, it would be someone who is trying to keep souls out of hell?
What "work" can compare to the importance of that work?
Dentist?
Surgeon?
anything?
So, i guess it depends on your perspective, but i can assure you that God is not the author of poverty, and that being a "joint heir" with Jesus the King of Kings is not a place of "lack".
Have you ever read this New Testament Scripture??
"As JESUS IS (right now) so are WE (believers) in the earth". 1 John 4:17
So, what is Right now?....= HE's SINLESS and HE's a KING.
OR, Is he suffering on a cross and rejected?
Or is he a King in Glory who is SINLESS?
You are a "joint heir" with one of those conditions......I suggest you choose the current reality according to your bible....period.
I did.

 

[for_his_glory]

"""""""I agree in this day and age it does take money to get by on, but it's not the way God intended it to be in the beginning"""""""""


Well, we are not in the beginning.
Different rules apply now.
We are now in the "time of the gentiles" and Paul is your gentile apostle, and no other apostle has this title.



""""""This is what these prosperity teachers""""


Yes, i understand your issue with prosperity preachers.
The only thing worse is a preacher that preaches that you can lose your salvation.

Has God ever changed, no, Hebrews 13:5-9. Has His provision ever changed, no, Genesis 1:29; Philippians 4:19. Did God create Jew and Gentile, no, Genesis 1:26,27. So, what has changed, God or man!

Man walked away from Spiritual fellowship cause them to fall in the beginning as it will still be in the end. There were no saving provisions within the law, but if one was obedient to Gods laws, and not what man added to them to justify their own deeds, those who were obedient in the OT times before the cross were counted as being faithful to God who truly blest their comings and goings. Today it has all changed as man relies more on money forsaking the Spiritual relationship with God, but when things turn sour for them they curse God instead of turning back to Him. Many of monetary wealth that call themselves Christians would rather go out of their way as to not walk past one in the street that is in need and truly can not help them self and then you have the one with the two mites that will go without in order to help someone else knowing God will truly bless their giving as it came out of a heart of compassion and love for others. So, no, there are not different rules today, just more disobedient people.

 

[Jim Parker]

So all elders should be rewarded with monetary raises.
Yes, your church is very generous indeed.

The elders (presbyters) were full time ministers. The modern English word used to refer to what the early church called an elder is "priest."
Here's what scripture teaches:
1Co 9:13-14 (RSV) Do you not know that those who are employed in the temple service get their food from the temple, and those who serve at the altar share in the sacrificial offerings? In the same way, the Lord commanded that those who proclaim the gospel should get their living by the gospel.
Note: The LORD commanded.

Also: 1Co 9:9 For it is written in the law of Moses, "You shall not muzzle an ox when it is treading out the grain." Is it for oxen that God is concerned?
And: 1Ti 5:17-19 Let the elders who rule well be considered worthy of double honor, especially those who labor in preaching and teaching; for the scripture says, "You shall not muzzle an ox when it is treading out the grain," and, "The laborer deserves his wages."


iakov the fool

 

[Jim Parker]

When we stay "victory" we are speaking Victory in every capacity, be it spiritual, financial, domestically, physical, etc. God's Prescribed Order of Victory is "the Cross of Christ."

The victory which Christ won by the cross was the victory over death. (1 Cor 15:51-57) By it He insured all of mankind would be raised from the dead immortal and incorruptible.
Christ did not suffer, die by crucifixion, and raise again from the grave so that we could have "financial victory." Paul specifically refuted that notion. (1 Tim6:3-5)

Here's how the "prosperity Gospel" is perceived by the unsaved:

Oh Lord, won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz?
My friends all drive Porsches, I must make amends.
Worked hard all my lifetime, no help from my friends,
So Lord, won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz?

Oh Lord, won't you buy me a color TV?
Dialing For Dollars is trying to find me.
I wait for delivery each day until three,
So oh Lord, won't you buy me a color TV?
Janis Joplin

Oh Lord, won't you buy me a night on the town?
I'm counting on you, Lord, please don't let me down.
Prove that you love me and buy the next round,
Oh Lord, won't you buy me a night on the town?

 

[iLOVE]

The victory which Christ won by the cross was the victory over death. (1 Cor 15:51-57) By it He insured all of mankind would be raised from the dead immortal and incorruptible.
Christ did not suffer, die by crucifixion, and raise again from the grave so that we could have "financial victory." Paul specifically refuted that notion. (1 Tim6:3-5)

Here's how the "prosperity Gospel" is perceived by the unsaved:

Oh Lord, won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz?
My friends all drive Porsches, I must make amends.
Worked hard all my lifetime, no help from my friends,
So Lord, won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz?

Oh Lord, won't you buy me a color TV?
Dialing For Dollars is trying to find me.
I wait for delivery each day until three,
So oh Lord, won't you buy me a color TV?
Janis Joplin

Oh Lord, won't you buy me a night on the town?
I'm counting on you, Lord, please don't let me down.
Prove that you love me and buy the next round,
Oh Lord, won't you buy me a night on the town?

Nothing was left undone!
Do you tithe at 10% gross plus give Jesus an offering every paycheck?

 

[reba]

Maybe that lost child had had enough of the hypocrisy

 

[Jim Parker]

Nothing was left undone!
Do you tithe at 10% gross plus give Jesus an offering every paycheck?

Since the Tithe is part of the Law of Moses and I am not under the Law of Moses (only 1/4 Jewish) I do not tithe.
Rather, I follow the instruction provided in the New Covenant by the apostle Paul at 2Co 9:7.
If you tithe, do you follow the law according to Deut. 14? Use you tithe for the first two years and go to Jerusalem to celebrate what the Lords has done for you and in the third year, the year of the tithe, bring it to the storehouses in your town so that there will be provision for the widow, orphan, stranger, and Levite. (Do you know anyone who is a descendant of Levi?)
That's what giving a tithe is.
Offerings are also part of the Old Covenant.

iakov the fool

 

[Jim Parker]

Maybe that lost child had had enough of the hypocrisy

It's hard to fool children. Preachers preaching the tithe and driving Mercedes Benzes while the older members of the congregation eat popcorn for dinner twice a week so they can "pay their tithes" and stay out of hell, tend to drive the kids away. PK syndrome.

 

[reba]

DH is a cement mason... doing a 'side' job with a buddy.. pouring some concrete around a church... DH knowing my dad was going to not accept any pay for the job.. til the pastor showed up in a Caddy

 

[Eugene]

I hear and am asked all the time by Christian men and women “Where is this abundance we are supposed to have?” They somehow think that they are supposed to have wealth and health and the things of this world, but this is not speaking of such things.

Dear brother Paul, have you considered that abundant grace covered even the sin of David? When need appears in our lives God gives more grace, and even the power upon us as we go on in spiritual warfare is dealt out as great grace. My reading and experience has taught me to realize it is the very things allowed to test us that drive us to seek deliverance by the grace of God; read all of the Apostle Paul’s testimony. Can we even fathom the miracle of grace extended unto Saul of Tarsus to receive a dispensation of grace given him for our benefit?

Blessings in Christ Jesus.

 

[Jim Parker]

DH is a cement mason... doing a 'side' job with a buddy.. pouring some concrete around a church... DH knowing my dad was going to not accept any pay for the job.. til the pastor showed up in a Caddy

HAH!
Love it!