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Guest, Join Papa Zoom today for some uplifting biblical encouragement! --> Daily Verses
Courtship ain't necessary - divine direction is
- Thread starter Classik
- Start date
I strongly disagree that courtship isn't necessary. Courtship is how you get to know the other person in a variety of situations and social settings. It's how you get to know the others' family and friends. But even more importantly, it is how your family and friends get to know the other--this is how one should be getting good, spiritual counsel and advice regarding the other person and the relationship.
I am witnessing the utter destruction of a marriage due to "divine direction" only. It is the same as those who have come to these forums claiming that we don't need theologians and scholars to understand the Bible, all we need is to pray and the Holy Spirit will reveal to us the truth. Yet each of them disagrees with the other and most disagree with historic, orthodox Christian belief on certain matters.
While one can never know all about a partner, a "long enough" courtship where family and friends of both are involved goes a long, long way.
Jethro Bodine
Member
This advice got Hosea a gal named Gomer.
But, since God was in it I'm confident Hosea had God's grace to endure it to the end. And so it will be for us.
The danger is in going where God does not lead, as was the case with Solomon.
Classik
Member
But really, what was Solomon's sin? Marrying heathen women or marrying several women?
And then Moses married an Ethiopian wife.
Jethro Bodine
Member
Both, marrying foreign women, and too many of them (300!). And then there was the matter of his concubines (700).
And he ended up sending her away if I remember correctly.
Jethro Bodine
Member
I believe God will allow a marriage for the sake of the character development that will be provoked from the chaffing of the two in the relationship. This is, IMO, a form of God's divine direction in marriage too. What these two divinely appointed people need to do is be changed in character so they won't kill each other. That's God's will for them. God's will for marriage does not only exist in good marriages. He has a will for terrible one's too. The problem comes in when one or both in the marriage simply do not want to conform to God's will for them in the relationship.
Classik
Member
Maybe I need to make references to that account.
Christ_empowered
Member
I think courtship is probably a good idea. My older, wiser Pentecostal friend liked her (future) 2nd husband from day 1, but they played by the rules and got to know each other before they got married. I read that until the 19th century or so, marriage really was a duty, an obligation, a social instituation....a contract. social and economic shifts meant that a more modern version of "love" came to be viewed as an integral part of marriage. This is similar to how social and economic shifts changed the nature of childhood and later adolescence, probably mostly for the better.
I dunno. I think it you're going to partner up and stay married, courtship is a good idea. So are a lot of things that many people don't like to talk about so much, like talking about finances, division of labor, dedication to The Lord as individuals and as a couple, etc. back in the day, people could get married mostly based on economic stuff. Will the union help the families involved, at higher levels is the other person's background prestigious enough, etc. These days...well, I read somewhere that people still mostly marry mostly within their general social class (women tend to marry up a tad, men down a bit...), but that's not something people openly discuss as much, probably because of shifts in morals/values (marriage is about "love," right?).
I read somewhere that the US is now considered a "stable, high divorce rate society." We're not the 1st one. In some cultures, divorce was frequent. I seem to recall reading that in a lot of those cultures, raising children was a group effort, so the success or failure of the parents' marriage(s) wasn't a huge issue. Here, though, I think the US has a problem. Most people don't have strong extended families, much less close community ties. Our culture has largely disintegrated. If the parents mess the kids up, that's pretty much...well, that's it, folks. Personally, I think that's one reason why our culture is becoming more and more narcissistic, self-important, me-oriented. I don't think its all moral failing, I think a lot of people grow up with minimal extended family, not so stable immediate families, and very little in the way of meaningful community bonds to provide guidance, direction, morals, etc. Couple all that with a culture that's more and more hyper-competitive, hyper-individualistic, and...yeah. Trouble (note the capital T).
So...yeah. I think courtship is important, in today's culture. Looking at my parents, I think dedication to the instituation of marriage, to the union as something that is greater and more important than the individual components, is important, too. I dunno. Looking around, I'm kinda glad I'm a celibate, recovering former homogay. I think marriage as an institution is pretty much dead in America...its all about feelings and "love" and "growth," etc. This might explain why we suddenly have same-sex "marriage"...marriage doesn't really matter now.
I dunno. I think it you're going to partner up and stay married, courtship is a good idea. So are a lot of things that many people don't like to talk about so much, like talking about finances, division of labor, dedication to The Lord as individuals and as a couple, etc. back in the day, people could get married mostly based on economic stuff. Will the union help the families involved, at higher levels is the other person's background prestigious enough, etc. These days...well, I read somewhere that people still mostly marry mostly within their general social class (women tend to marry up a tad, men down a bit...), but that's not something people openly discuss as much, probably because of shifts in morals/values (marriage is about "love," right?).
I read somewhere that the US is now considered a "stable, high divorce rate society." We're not the 1st one. In some cultures, divorce was frequent. I seem to recall reading that in a lot of those cultures, raising children was a group effort, so the success or failure of the parents' marriage(s) wasn't a huge issue. Here, though, I think the US has a problem. Most people don't have strong extended families, much less close community ties. Our culture has largely disintegrated. If the parents mess the kids up, that's pretty much...well, that's it, folks. Personally, I think that's one reason why our culture is becoming more and more narcissistic, self-important, me-oriented. I don't think its all moral failing, I think a lot of people grow up with minimal extended family, not so stable immediate families, and very little in the way of meaningful community bonds to provide guidance, direction, morals, etc. Couple all that with a culture that's more and more hyper-competitive, hyper-individualistic, and...yeah. Trouble (note the capital T).
So...yeah. I think courtship is important, in today's culture. Looking at my parents, I think dedication to the instituation of marriage, to the union as something that is greater and more important than the individual components, is important, too. I dunno. Looking around, I'm kinda glad I'm a celibate, recovering former homogay. I think marriage as an institution is pretty much dead in America...its all about feelings and "love" and "growth," etc. This might explain why we suddenly have same-sex "marriage"...marriage doesn't really matter now.
Edward
2024 Supporter
So true. But that goes two ways too, lol.
The most horrible time period of my marriage, when her family moved to Colorado where we were, to be closer to their daughter. I flew to Florida and helped them pack and drove their moving truck and boat to Colorado...she helped them find a place to live when they got there. She got them a place where their front door, was about 6 feet away from our front door, yay!
It's funny now, but wasn't then. It was Everybody Loves Raymond, only I wasn't Raymond.