guibox, thank you for your thoughtful reply to me. I am enjoying this study. I will try and respond to each point you raised, and then I had a few more Scriptures that I would like to present on this topic.
Concerning the dual application of the language in the example of Edom, a literal city. I want to ask you a few questions. Was the fall of Adam and Eve literal or spiritual? Was the shedding of blood by God to cover their nakedness literal, or spiritual? Was the ark of salvation, for Noah and his family, literal or spiritual? Were Jacob and Esau literal people, or were they a picture of things spiritual? Was the exodus of Egypt literal or spiritual? I happen to believe that all of these events were literal, and spiritual, pictures...arrows pointing to Christ. Did Christ use literal events to explain spiritual things, and was the Old Testament Scripture ever used for that purpose by Him? You are correct in that I applied a dual application...both a literal, and a spiritual application. Which means that Edom, the enemy of God, will be in the Lake of Fire for eternity with their smoke ascending forever...and the severe language is quite accurate.
Did Hannah really mean forever, or did she mean until Samuel died? Would Samuel ever be back with her? Wasn’t it forever? Because Hannah’s words lived on in God’s word, is it by accident that her language can also be used in a spiritual application about Samuel’s life, and Him belonging to the Lord forever? Is this not a principal of us giving the life we have been given by Him, back to Him? The general theme in the whole of Scripture is Christ, and the events surrounding what happens to the eternal souls of men...All actual events are pictures of the Gospel, and a revelation about what God did, is doing, and will do with respect to that.
I do not see anyone disputing the meaning of the words eternity, and forever, when it applies to the believers, and eternal life. These words mean what they say they mean.
2nd Peter 3:10-15 is referring to the time when the earth and Heaven are burned, but it does not specifically speak to the presence of men, but rather “worksâ€Â. The battle in Rev 20:9 that involves God sending a devouring fire on those who were called God and Magog. The deceived nations. Who are these nations of deceived men? They are not resurrected persons, but rather men who were deceived into literally fighting a loosing battle...it led to their death. These were those under the rule of Christ, and the resurrected martyrs. The text says that they were burned up by God.
2nd Peter 3:10-15 gives a discription of Heaven, and Earth, being consumed ,and all the works therein. The works could mean the works (Creation) of God...the entire Universe. We must assume that men are still present on earth at this time...or had they been already killed by the fire that God destroyed them with when they attempted to attack Christ, and the martyrs? Scripture doesn't say. I have an idea of how I see the time line of these events, but I do not believe that Scripture lays it out for us in certain terms. Prophecy of the contemporary day of the Lord (literal judgement), and the future day of the Lord (spiritual judgement) are contained in the Bible...in places like Daniel, Amos, and Joel. By my count, two things will happen with all men...believer, and unbeliever, alike. All will die, and all will be resurrected again. Believers to eternal life, and unbelievers to eternal damnation. Please consider the following verses to back up this point that all will be resurrected.
Daniel 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
John 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
Acts 24:15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.
Revelation 20:4-6 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
What is the second death referring to here, and why is it powerless against the believers?
Revelation 20:11-15 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
How do you respond to the indication of a resurrection for all here?
And last, I would like to reply to a few statements. First of all, concerning the knee jerk reaction comment, I do not feel as if that describes any of my responses. I do not presume to be wise enough about anything to be confidant in having a knee jerk reaction response to God's Word. Scripture teaches that there is nothing new under the sun, not even the latest exegesis of Scripture in the world today. I am not above that, nor is anyone else.
Second, concerning the following statement that has been echoed, or perhaps is an echo of what others have said here as well, that a traditional view of Hell doesn't stand up to logical scrutiny, divine love or justice, and even common sense. Hmmm...I suppose I do lack logic, common sense, and a full understanding of God's divine love and justice. I would be an atheist if God had not filled my heart with His Spirit, and caused me to lay these things down concerning His existance, and the supernatural nature of who He is. What He has given me (an offensive worm) is His love, and I can not get over why...it is something that surpasses the very things you have listed. Ephesians 3 I want to highlight verse 19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fullness of God. I am not saying this makes me right (because I have so much to learn), but I am saying that this indicates that the list you have given is not to be trusted over what God says in His Word, especially if I want the fullness of Him. We do not have to fear stating that the Holy Spirit is teaching our hearts many of God's mysteries that surpass our knowledge, and it does not make believers self-righteous to acknowlede this. In fact, God says it is so in His Word. So, I do not always trust men who can not say this (that the Holy Spirit is teaching their hearts), but are more comfortable with their own logic, and how God fits into their mind. The Lord bless you
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