Bible Study Envy

[B]

Envy is a sin right, a major sin at that?
So when God said ''I am a jealous God'' does that mean that God is sinning?

 

[Vic C.]

First off, show us where envy is one of the Ten Commandments?

Secondly, sin is sin. There is only ONE sin that is unforgivable.

See Matthew 12:31-32

I'll leave the Hebrew > English concerning the word jealous to someone else for now.

 

[B]

My apologies. I meant that envy is one of the 7 deadly sins.

But, the 1st commandment is ''thou shall have no other gods before me, for I am a jealous god.'' So basically God is envious of other gods hogging the limelight.

. ''There is only ONE sin that is unforgivable.'' You'll have to enlighten me, I don't have a bible handy.

 

[evanman]

"Jealousness" is not quite the same as "Envy".

Envy comes under "Covetousness".

God IS Jealous, and rightly so--This is not a sin for Him.

 

[Vic C.]

My apologies. I meant that envy is one of the 7 deadly sins.

Ahh...I must admit, that was the first thing that came to my mind when I read your post.

ok...the unpardonable sin.

Mat 12:31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
Mat 12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

And this is how God sees sin...

James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
James 2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.

 

[B]

Quote: ''First off, show us where envy is one of the Ten Commandments?''
Checking I see that the 10th commandment is''thou shall not covert thy neighbours wife/ox/ass etc''

To covert something is to desire it for yourself:
covet: TRANSITIVE VERB: 1. To feel blameworthy desire for (that which is another's).

So to covet something sounds to me like jealousy that the neighbour has the item in the first place.

You probably disagree. Anyhoo :

 

[Vic C.]

So to covet something sounds to me like jealousy that the neighbour has the item in the first place.

You probably disagree. Anyhoo

No, I won't disagree. But I will repeat what evanman said...

"Jealousness" is not quite the same as "Envy".

Envy comes under "Covetousness".

God IS Jealous, and rightly so--This is not a sin for Him.

 

[B]

I suppose god is allowed to kill (or ''smite'') as well? No sin there?

 

[evanman]

Jesus said

Lu 12:5 But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him.

 

[Guest]

I suppose god is allowed to kill (or ''smite'') as well? No sin there?

:B-fly: God is holy by his very nature,and only he can judge
rightly and fairly. If God kills someone he is killing what already
belongs to him. Everyone and everything is his.
A Mother cannot honestly say that her child is only her child.
The child belongs to God first. God is the only one who has the
right to kill. Man is not holy. God alone is holy.

 

[Chupacabra]

If God kills someone he is killing what already
belongs to him. Everyone and everything is his.

If I build a sand castle, I should have no blame in destroying it. But I never built a sentient, emotional, thinking, sand castle and caused this rational and feeling being to suffer for eternity because I designed it with a psychological drive to do that which I arbitrarily deem worthy of said punsishment. If you want, you can claim that your god has a "right" to destroy, to torment, and to torture, but there can be no denying the cruelty of such.

Everyone and everything is his.

Why? Because he is omnipotent? In the thread about sexism, I exposed your might makes right axiom. It is apparent once more here. Creating something doesn't make it yours. Construction workers do not own the buildings they toil long and hard to make, do they? God does not make each human being. Human beings are created by natural processes by their parents.

God is the only one who has the
right to kill. Man is not holy. God alone is holy.

If Jehovah is the originator of morality and the giver of moral laws which we are required to keep under penatly of death and torture, how much do these laws really mean if he is unable to keep them himself? You claim that god can sin because god is holy, giving him the right to do however he pleases, but isn't his sinning and disobedience of his own law sinning just the same?

 

[Restin]

The Potter and the clay....

"The thing molded will not say to the molder, 'Why did you make me like this,' will it? "Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use?" Romans 9:20,21

"Is the axe to boast itself over the one who chops with it?"
Isaiah 10:15

"You turn things around! Shall the potter be considered as equal with the clay? ....Or what is formed say to him who formed it, 'He has no understanding'"?
Isaiah 29:16

NASU emphasis supplied

God is the potter and we are the clay. Like it or not -- that is the way it is!

.........Restin

 

[Chupacabra]

Restin, if that post was directed at me, you failed to address any of my points. How can a supposedly morally perfect being bypass its own laws? Are Jehovah's actions cruel? If so, why would he be cruel? Does omnipotence give a being the moral right to do whatever it pleases?

 

[Restin]

Restin, if that post was directed at me, you failed to address any of my points. How can a supposedly morally perfect being bypass its own laws? Are Jehovah's actions cruel? If so, why would he be cruel? Does omnipotence give a being the moral right to do whatever it pleases?

Chu, my post was not directed at your post specifically but at the general thought "
Does God kill?"

I realize that there are some that are not looking for a 'spiritual' answer to this question. For myself, everything relating to God has a 'spiritual' significance, which is only spiritually understood. And the answer to this is that God is the potter and we are the clay. Another reference we are the 'axe' and God is the one who does the chopping.

You eat food, do you not? Does the food you eat, ask you why you are 'killing me'? The food dies to give you life -- so, in every death, there is purpose in everything that God does.

"For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God ...",
1 Corinthians 1:21

God Bless.......Restin

 

[Chupacabra]

And the answer to this is that God is the potter and we are the clay. Another reference we are the 'axe' and God is the one who does the chopping.

Refer to my sand castle reference here. Of course your god would have the right to do whatever he pleased with something inanimate, but people think and feel. Does this change the matter at all? On the clay analogy, doesn't that also mean that all our imperfections are the god's fault? Doesn't that make him unjustified in punishing anyone?

You eat food, do you not? Does the food you eat, ask you why you are 'killing me'? The food dies to give you life -- so, in every death, there is purpose in everything that God does.

I'm willing to accept this to a degree like in natural death, but when the god of the bible demands total slaughter of civilizations including children these deaths seem unjustified. Also, I don't eat organisms that had a capacity for rational thought. Food and human being are quite different, so I think your anology is a little flawed.

 

[Restin]

Flesh as grass....

I'm willing to accept this to a degree like in natural death, but when the god of the bible demands total slaughter of civilizations including children these deaths seem unjustified. Also, I don't eat organisms that had a capacity for rational thought. Food and human being are quite different, so I think your anology is a little flawed

• "All flesh is grass, and all its loveliness is like the flower of the field.
  "The grass withers, the flower fades, when the breath of the Lord blows upon it;
  surely the people are grass. Isaiah 40:6,7
  
  "Surely every man at his best is a mere breath."
  "Surely every man walks about as a phantom;." Psalm 39:5.6
  
  "For if anyone thinks he is something when he is nothing,
  he deceives himself."Galatians 6:3

These words are quotes from Bible Scripture -- not my words! There have been times
when I read scriptures apart from faith, I would become very offended at God.

• "Indeed, we had the sentence of death within ourselves so that we
  would not trust in ourselves, but in God who raises the dead;"
  2 Corinthians 1:9

But...God is a wonderful teacher. Doubt and unbelief are being replaced with
Faith and belief -- believing that God is able to raise the dead.
-- this is where I have peace and rest!

NASU - emphasis supplied

............Restin

 

[Guest]

Restin,That was beautiful,and as you know very true!

 

[Guest]

:B-fly: If you view God in a harsh way,then you are already
decieved before you ever had a chance.
God may appear mean to you,but it doesn't seem as though you
have really wanted to understand things from God's side.
Why should God have to tolerate evil and those who have no shame
to their game?
The only way you'll ever understand where God is coming from is
to truly seek him and honestly try to give him the benefit of the
doubt.
If you are not willing to do that,you will be given over to a reprobate
mind. We love God because he first loved us,not the other way around.
The people you claim were innocent are people you didn't know.
Either way,only God has the right to kill,and it's his world,not ours.

 

[B]

Quote;
''Why should God have to tolerate evil?''

Um, well, he created it.

 

[Guest]

Quote;
''Why should God have to tolerate evil?''

Um, well, he created it.

:smt035 God created us with free will. And if we didn't have
choices,we wouldn't have free will. God doesn't want robots,he
just wants children that love him because they want to.
When you begin to appreciate and value life,and I pray that will
happen,you might be able to get this,amen.