I believe that all who are in Christ are no longer under the old Covenant law

Discussion in 'Theology' started by new covenant preacher, Sep 11, 2017.

  1. new covenant preacher

    new covenant preacher Member

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    Christ also came to redeem those who were under the old Covenant law, that they too might receive the adoption and be called the sons of God (Gal 4:5, Eph 1:15).

    Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

    Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the old law, that the blessing of Abraham might be available to us all through the Lord Jesus.

    This blessing is the promise of the Spirit through faith (Gal 3:7-14).

    [​IMG]

    Gal 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness is through the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

    We are not under the Old Covenant law, but all may be covered by new law of Christ.

    Mark 2:22 And no man putteth new wine into old bottles: else the new wine doth burst the bottles, and the wine is spilled, and the bottles will be marred: but new wine must be put into new bottles.

    The New Testament Covenant has the saving blood of Christ. Those who were under the Old Covenant law only had a covering for sin, but the blood of Christ takes away sins.

    Romans 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

    Putting new wine into an old bottle will cause both to perish, because the old bottle is not designed for the new. Under the old Covenant law the temple of God was a building. Under the new Covenant law of Christ, we are the temple that he dwells in (1 Cor 3:16-17; 1 Cor 6:19).

    If we claim to be under the old Covenant law do we understand the new law of Christ?

    Not only is the new law of Christ better, it also is the only one available, as the old has passed away. Any man in Christ is a new creation and all things have become new.

    This new bottle then, refers to our vessel that the Holy Spirit can reside in. If we try and remain under the old Covenant law, the Holy Spirit is barred from entering in, and the end result is that of destruction. All in Christ are a new creation, through His Word of reconciliation (2 Cor 5:17-19; 2 Tim 2:21).

    Jesus Christ has brought forth the new wine, which is the new covenant last. That which Christ supplies is available to all that ask (1 John 3:22).

    Isaiah 65:8 Thus saith the LORD, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants’ sakes, that I may not destroy them all.

    The old wine was available to those who were under the old Covenant law. The Old Testament Law was fulfilled by Christ on the Cross, and is finished (John 19:30).

    Heb 8:13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

    No man also that drinks the old wine immediately is desirous of the new, for he reckons that the old is better (Luke 5:39).

    Gal 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

    The second covenant was the Law of Christ written in the hearts of men, which represents Israel after the Spirit (Rom 11:26, Gal 6:15-16).

    John 1:11-12 He came unto his own, and his own received him not. But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name.

    This article is penned by John Alexander
    Source The Word of God
    Old Covenant Law
     
  2. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    IF we are not under the law .. is it ok to commit murder, adultery.. have other Gods? etc?
     
  3. new covenant preacher

    new covenant preacher Member

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    Come on did you read my post? Really?
     
  4. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    Yes , the battle of are we under the law has been posted about for ever around here.
     
  5. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    Are you going to answer?
     
  6. new covenant preacher

    new covenant preacher Member

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    Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

    Matt 22:37-40 (KJV)
    The first commandment of Christ is "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind" (Mat 22:37-38).

    When we bear one another's burdens, we fulfill the law of Christ (Gal 6:2).

    The second commandment of the new the law of Christ is fulfilled in this; thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself (Gal 5:14, Mat 22:39). This was not realized by many who were under the Old Testament law, and that is why six of the commandments were unto doing no harm to others. The commandment of loving each other is much greater than these.

    Gal 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

    We are not under the Old Testament law, but the law of Christ’s grace.

    Gal 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

    Those of the religions of judaism and christianity, who claim to be under the Old Testament law do not have a personal relationship with the creator Christ the King.

    To claim righteousness by attempting to follow the works of the law without faith was and still is dead works.

    Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

    We need to be led by the spirit of truth, which declares that we are not under the Old Testament law of bondage, but the law of Christ wherein we can have liberty.

    Gal 6:15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

    Again it is not at all about religious persuasions or doctrines of men, but a new life in Christ. This can only be understood by those who are taught of the Holy Spirit, which is given to the faithful who come to Jesus as little children.

    Gal 6:16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

    The Israel of God represents all believers who are in Christ.
     
  7. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    So you choose not to answer :shrug no surprise

    Edited to add.


    Clarify you choose not to answer a direct question with a direct answer
     
  8. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    Let me try real simple .is murder etc. still sin under Grace
     
  9. new covenant preacher

    new covenant preacher Member

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    Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
    I did answer you. By the way if I had a dollar for every time I heard that response I'd have like a thousand dollars or so!!!

    Let me break that commandment down for you!
    If you love your neighbour as yourself do you think you can kill or steal from them?
     
  10. new covenant preacher

    new covenant preacher Member

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    I'd like to become a moderator what is the entrance fee?
    Do I have to take a test?
     
  11. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    My point was made .

    The OT guys also had Grace .
     
  12. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    There is no fee nor test.

    When the need is persived noticed adding mods isvby invation

    I need spell check for this new tablet big time
     
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  13. I'M Grams

    I'M Grams Member

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    This is from our Church may be this can help some one ? I sure hope so ! :)

    Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth

    'Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the world of truth."(2 Tim. 2.15)

    · Have you ever wondered why today's Christians can eat pork even though in the Old Testament men were forbidden to do so?

    · Or, do you know people (or, perhaps yourself) who shun Christianity because Christians can't seem to agree on anything?

    · And what about all those contractions in the Bible?



    These are all valid concerns, but when a person begins to "rightly divide" the word of truth, as admonished by Paul to Timothy, these seeming difficulties and disputations are resolved. To "rightly divide" means that God has dealt with mankind at different times with different expectations from him. Although it is profitable for us to read the entire Bible (2Tim.3:16), it is imperative that we understand which part of the Bible is intended primarily for us in this time of Grace. The following excerpt from the book "Things That Differ" by C.R. Stam explains:

    "If I should step inside a modern United States Post Office all would doubtless seem very confusing to me. But it would be a mistake to suggest piling all the mail neatly into one corner and handing it out promiscuously to all comers as some would do with the Bible. The postal employees must rightly divide the mail so that each person receives what is addressed to him. What seems like confusion to the novice is really a simplification of the work to be done in getting each person's private mail
    to him.


    It is granted that in the Bible even that which was addressed to those of other dispensations is given to us for our learning and profit, but we must not confuse this with our own private mail or make the mistake of carrying out instructions meant particularly for others.

    While I am reading mail addressed personally to me, a friend may hand me, for my interest or information, mail addressed to him. His mail and mine may all prove informative and profitable, but I must still be careful not to confuse the two, expecting to receive things promised to him or carrying out instructions addressed to him.

    Thus, all the Bible is for us, but it is not all addressed to us or written about us, and if we would really understand and enjoy it; if we would really know how to use it effectively in service for Christ, we must be careful always to note who is addressing whom, about what and when and why" (p.20).



    In every dispensation, righteousness before God has always been achieved by believing what God has said and acting upon it. For example, the law required every male child to be circumcised, but that is not God's requirement today.

    The LAW says: And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant. Gen. 17:14.

    But GRACE says: And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands...Col. 2:10,11.



    There were also many dietary laws, and one in particular many people remember is the prohibition not to eat pork. But under the dispensation of Grace, we are not under those prohibitions.

    The LAW says: And the swine, because it divideth the hoof, yet cheweth not the cud, it is unclean unto you: Ye shall not eat of their flesh, nor touch their dead carcass. Deut. 14:8

    But GRACE says: For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer. 1Tim: 4:4



    And the Sabbath day. In our day of grace, one day is like unto another. All are to be lived to the glory of God.

    The Law says: Remember the sabbath day to keep it holy. But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God...Ex. 20:8,10.

    But GRACE says: Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days... Col.2:16,17


    And because of the finished work of Jesus Christ at the Cross, we are no longer under any provision of the law for the forgiveness of sin.

    The Law says: And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. (Matt. 6:12) For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses. Matt. 6:14,15.

    But GRACE says: And ye be kind one to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ’s sake hath forgiven you. Eph. 4.32.


    The ultimate example of the difference between law and grace is the sacrifice of Jesus Christ on the Cross. The law required annual blood sacrifices for the forgiveness of sins, which we now understand were but a foreshadow of the ultimate sacrifice Christ Jesus would make for the complete payment for all of our sins.

    The Law says: The blood of bulls and goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifiethto the purifying of the flesh. Heb. 9:13

    But GRACE says: Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us. Heb. 9:12


    For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth. (Romans 10:4)

    For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. (Eph. 2:8,9)


    Where the dispensation of the law was entrusted to Moses (John 1:17), the dispensation of the grace of God was entrusted to Paul. Why is understanding this so important? Because it is by this message of grace, dispensed by Paul, that God will judge us. Remember, righteousness comes by believing what God says (i.e., what God is saying to us in this age of Grace) and acting on it. That is what faith is: believing God; trusting Him and His Word. Paul says in Romans 2:16:

    In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to MY Gospel.


    Paul tells us that he was appointed by God to be the Apostle to the Gentiles, "For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the Apostle of the Gentiles,..." (Ro. 11:13) and that his message was revealed to him directly by Jesus Christ:

    But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached to of me is not after man. For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by revelation of Jesus Christ. (Gal.1:11,12)


    How then does Paul's gospel differ? Pastor Thomas Brusha, in his booklet "Dictionary of the Gospel" gives a clear explanation:

    God promised in the Old Testament to set up a Kingdom here on earth through the nation Israel, in which Christ would reign as King! Christ was here; and the good news proclaimed was that the Kingdom was at hand. In Matthew 10:7 we find this to be the same gospel the Twelve Apostles were sent to preach. Also, in Matthew 10:5,6 we learn that this gospel was good news for the Nation of Israel. It is amazing, yet true, that after the Twelve Apostles had been preaching this gospel now, for some time, they still did not know about Christ's purpose to go to the Cross and die for their sins. We know this is true because when Christ began later to tell his Apostles that he was going to Jerusalem to die, they didn't believe him, nor did they understand what he was talking about. The reason being, they were preaching the good news about the Kingdom. They expected Christ to establish Israel's Kingdom and to take the throne as their King - see Matthew 16:21,22; Luke 18:31-34: and Luke 19:11.


    How then, could the twelve Apostles have preached the same gospel the Apostle Paul later preached, when they did not know or understand anything about the Cross at that time? Paul preached :

    "THE CROSS" and "CHRIST CRUCIFIED (1 Corinthians 1:18,23)

    The point is this. The gospel that the Twelve Apostles preached during the earthly ministry of Christ is not the same gospel the Apostle Paul was sent to preach later. According to 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 the gospel Paul preached was the GOOD NEWS of the DEATH, BURIAL, and RESURRECTION of Christ FOR OUR SINS.

    Paul tells us in Galatians 1:11,12 where his gospel originated. It was after the resurrection and ascension that the Lord Jesus Christ revealed to the Apostle Paul all that was accomplished on the Cross. In acts 20:24 Paul calls this message "THE GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD." In Galatians 2:1,2 we see that this gospel is intended for the Gentiles as well as the Jews; and in Galatians 2:6-10 we find that the Twelve Apostles learned of this gospel from Paul.

    In this present age of "GRACE", God has set Israel as a nation aside, and the Kingdom promised to them has been postponed until a future time. Therefore the "GOSPEL OF THE KINGDOM" is NOT God's message of good news for today, but rather the good news of how the Cross saves Sinners of all nationalities. This is God's message for today! (pp6-8).


    The following books are recommended:

    "Dictionary of the Gospel" by Thomas Bruscha
    "Things That Differ" by C. R. Stam
    "The Dispensations" by Hazel I. Brown
     
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  14. selihah

    selihah Member

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    The Gospel itself refutes your opinion, for in Matthew 5:17-20, Jesus says to his disciples, "Think not that I am come to destroy the Law or the Prophets; I am not come to destroy but to fulfill; for verily I say unto you, till Heaven and earth pass one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law till all is fulfilled;" "Whosoever, therefore, shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of Heaven; but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of Heaven."

    Christians seem here to abandon the solid foundation on which we rest our hopes, and act from self-formed opinions. The Gospel presents no express code on the points in question, and if these laws are no longer valid, why did not Jesus introduce new regulations in lieu of the laws of Moses? In modern days it seem you are partly guided by the Mosaic code, and partly by human enactments at various periods. They make changes and alterations, accommodating them to the customs of the day, and render established principles subservient to temporary wants and arbitrary innovations. Convinced, as we Israelites are, that the divine revelation proceeds from Infinite Wisdom, and is, therefore, in itself complete and perfect in its aim, we cannot possibly admit of any change, deviation, addition, or diminution. Holy Writ warns us on this point. Deuteronomy 4:2, "Every word which I command you ye shall observe and do. Thou shalt not add unto it, and not diminish therefrom." Further (Deuteronomy 4:8), "Where is a nation so great which has such just and righteous statutes as all this law which I place before you this day?", "If thou wilt obey the voice of Yehovah thy God to observe His commandments and His statutes which are written in this book of this law," etc. In the same book (Deuteronomy 33:4) we read, "The law that Moses commanded unto us is an inheritance of the congregation of Jacob." To this we add the words of the Psalmist (Psalm 19:8-10 [19:7-9]), "The law of the Yehovah is perfect, restoring the soul; the testimony of Yehovah is faithful, making wise the foolish; the statutes of Yehovah are just, rejoicing the heart; the commandments of Yehovah are pure, enlightening the eyes; the fear of Yehovah is clean, standing forever; the judgments of Yehovah are true and righteous altogether." In the same book (Psalm 119:44) he says, "And I will keep thy commandments for ever and ever." We refer also to the conclusion of the prophecy by Malachi, who says, "Remember ye the law of my servant Moses which I commanded him in Horeb, concerning all Israel (giving them), statutes and judgments." These verses give satisfactory evidence, that the divine law in its sublime perfection and simplicity is not to be enlarged or curtailed, and much less to be abrogated and superseded by any other code. The immutability of the law is pronounced in Deuteronomy 28:1, "And thou shalt listen to the voice of the Lord, and do all His commandments which I command thee this day.
     
  15. dirtfarmer

    dirtfarmer Member

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    hello selihah, dirtfarmer here

    Christ, as you say, didn't destroy the law. He fulfilled it therefore taking it out of the way and "replaced" it with grace. The law was never given to bring salvation but it was to reveal how exceedingly sinful sin is and the need for a savior. Before the law came. was it OK to murder? Was it only after the law that murder became a sin?

    We, as believers, are not under condemnation but under grace because of the blood of Christ. Unbelief is the only thing that will consign a person to the eternal punishment, and that only after dying physically without Christ as your savior.
     
  16. Kidron

    Kidron Member

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    Yes.
    The Law is designed to show us our unrighteousness situation as we stand guilty of SIN before a Holy God.
    OH WHAT TO DO ABOUT IT !!!!!!!!!
    = Grace through redemption is freely given as an eternal solution to this situation, "to all who would come"...

    Grace is a Savior taking our sin, taking our eternal judgement due, upon Himself, so that we can thereby receive God's righteousness as our very own.
    This is the "Atonement".
    This is ROMANS 3:21-28.
    Its God the merciful, offering us a final and free solution regarding our damned by our sin situation.. John 3:36... by offering Himself virgin born and incarnated on a Cross, .. 1st Timothy 3:16 ... as the ONLY means to allow us pardon and restored righteousness that is equal to the very righteousness of Christ, as its His righteousness that we are gifted with, via our Faith....."The gift of Righteousness".
    Amazing solution.
    Thank you God. !!
    Praise you Jesus. !!

    """"""""Amazing Grace, that saved a wretch like us.
    Oh Crimson is the flow, that makes us white as SNOW.
    What is all my RIGHTEOUSNESS ?????
    = Nothing but the BLOOD of Jesus.""""""""
     
  17. selihah

    selihah Member

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    I agree Jesus said he did not come here to destroy the law rather he came to fulfill the law which means to carry it out. But grace is something we've always had as example: king David accused of adultery, murderer of his own, conspiracy. Breaks down, repents and pleads for forgiveness, and God forgives him. That is grace, An all powerful God, the Creator of the universe need not sacrifice himself or anyone to be a graceful King. It is written: And David said unto Nathan: 'I have sinned against Yehovah.' And Nathan said unto David: 'Yehovah also hath put away thy sin; thou shalt not die.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017
  18. th1b.taylor

    th1b.taylor Member

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    As stated, this is not true any individual that has made their own wine, as well as anyone that researches the subject deeply enough will know it to be untrue, I had a friend that produced his own supply of wine each year. Because of the cost of good bottles he retained the glass bottles, cleaned them and bought new corks for them, each year.

    Wine does not soak into Glass Bottles as it does Wine Skins, you made 9it fals3 when you updated the skins to bottles.
     
  19. for_his_glory

    for_his_glory Member

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    To all those who think that all the laws have been fulfilled in Christ you are very wrong as below are the laws that are written upon our heart and can only be fulfilled when Christ returns and makes an end to sin by throwing it into the lake of fire with that of the beast and the false prophets. The only laws that Christ has fulfilled so far are that of the Temple and its sacrifices. Someone please show me in scripture where Jesus has fulfilled all the laws, because in Matthew 22:35-40 and Matthew 5:17, 18 Jesus does not say that he has already fulfilled all of them, but that love was the greatest of them all.

    There are laws (commandments) that were especially written just for the Hebrews pertaining to the rituals of the Temple, sacrifices, festivals, Torah, Kohanim and Levites, the King and the Nazarite and then there are the existing moral laws (commandments) for all of us to still follow as in prayers and blessings, love and brotherhood, the poor and unfortunate, treatment of the Gentiles, Marriage, divorce and family, forbidden sexual relations, business practices, employees and servants, vows, oaths, swearing, Court and Judicial procedures, injuries and damages, property and property rights, Criminal laws, prophecy, idolatry and all its practices as the moral laws (commandments) keep us in line with the will of God that we present ourselves a vessel of honor that God delights in as we allow the light of Christ shine in us and through us as a testimony of Gods grace and mercy as it is not ourselves that do any good thing, but Gods Spirit working in us and through us as we surrender our will to that of Gods will to be done.

    Matthew 22:
    35 Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying,
    36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
    37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
    38 This is the first and great commandment.
    39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
    40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

    Matthew 5:
    17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill.
    18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
     
  20. th1b.taylor

    th1b.taylor Member

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    As stated, this is not true any individual that has made their own wine, as well as anyone that researches the subject deeply enough will know it to be untrue, I had a friend that produced his own supply of wine each year. Because of the cost of good bottles he retained the glass bottles, cleaned them and bought new corks for them, each year.

    Wine does not soak into Glass Bottles as it does Wine Skins, you made it false when you updated the skins to bottles. That will not work and claiming it does, as a proclaimed pastor, it discredits your knowledge of scripture, at the least.
     

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