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ok the elect are all over the place ... heaven, the winds, and earth.,.. Trying to understand your thinking.. JLB where does what is commonly called rapture fit in to this in your view?
 

JLB

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ok the elect are all over the place ... heaven, the winds, and earth.,.. Trying to understand your thinking.. JLB where does what is commonly called rapture fit in to this in your view?
  • And then He will send His angels, and gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest part of earth to the farthest part of heaven. Mark 13:27

This scripture encompasses His people who are on earth, and His people who are in heaven.

The four winds or four corners of earth and heaven encompasses all of earth, and all of heaven, in which all of His people will be gathered together, unto Him, at His coming.

This is called the gathering, in which He will gather His people from heaven and earth together, at His coming, or return from Heaven, where He is now seated at the right hand of God the Father.

Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you... 2 Thessalonians 2;1

  • Yes the elect He is gathering from heaven, are in heaven [whose bodies will be resurrected], and the elect that are on earth are still on earth [who will be raptured].

17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:17


Those who are alive and remain, are caught up together with them.

"Them" is those who have died and are with the Lord in heaven, in which their body is buried in the earth, and are resurrected first.

16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-18


Paul was comforting them about their loved ones who had passed away, but would be reunited together, when the Lord returned.



JLB
 

JLB

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Nice post JLB but you did not answer the question

I answered your question about where the rapture fits into my view as thoroughly as I know how.

I will try again.

  • Rapture = the gathering of His elect who are alive and remain on the earth, whose bodies will be transformed in the air, at His coming.
  • Resurrection = The gathering of those of His elect who have died and are in heaven, and will return with Jesus, to receive their resurrected, transformed bodies, at His coming.

The resurrection/rapture is one event that is called the gathering, whereby those who have died and are in heaven, and those who are alive and remain on earth, will all be gathered together, unto Him.

Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:17

And then He will send His angels, and gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest part of earth to the farthest part of heaven. Mark 13:27

Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you... 2 Thessalonians 2:1



JLB
 
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JLB not asking for a date..but asking when do you think this will be,,, something like any time, after the trib,.. pre, trip med trib? That kind of when..... I dont have a clue is also an honest answer.. .:)
 
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JLB not asking for a date..but asking when do you think this will be,,, something like any time, after the trib,.. pre, trip med trib? That kind of when..... I dont have a clue is also an honest answer.. .:)
Hitch chapter one verse one.consult that book
 
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DaveRC

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Zechariah 14 is what Jesus was referring to when He taught His disciples privately from the very Mt of Olives He would return to.

Behold, the day of the Lord is coming,
And your spoil will be divided in your midst.
2 For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem;
The city shall be taken,
The houses rifled,
And the women ravished.
Half of the city shall go into captivity,
But the remnant of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

3 Then the Lord will go forth
And fight against those nations,
As He fights in the day of battle.
4 And in that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives,
Which faces Jerusalem on the east.
And the Mount of Olives shall be split in two,

From east to west,
Making a very large valley;
Half of the mountain shall move toward the north
And half of it toward the south.
5 Then you shall flee through My mountain valley,
For the mountain valley shall reach to Azal.
Yes, you shall flee
As you fled from the earthquake
In the days of Uzziah king of Judah.

Thus the Lord my God will come, and all the saints with You.

6 It shall come to pass in that day
That there will be no light;
The lights will diminish.

7 It shall be one day
Which is known to the Lord—
Neither day nor night.
But at evening time it shall happen
That it will be light.

8 And in that day it shall be
That living waters shall flow from Jerusalem,
Half of them toward the eastern sea
And half of them toward the western sea;
In both summer and winter it shall occur.
9 And the Lord shall be King over all the earth.
In that day it shall be—
“The Lord is one,”
And His name one.
Zechariah 14:1-9


“When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats.
Matthew 25:31-32


In that Day we will admire Him, and see Him on His throne.

For now, we do not see Him, but we believe by faith.

6 In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, you have been grieved by various trials, 7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ, 8 whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, 9 receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls. 1 Peter 1:6-9



JLB
The verse in Zechariah is hyperbole we've seen this in 2 Samuel 22:1-16, Isaiah 34:5-6, Micah 1:1-9, etc.

Take Revelation 6:12-17 for instance, what is their terror?

A third of the stars of heaven?

Stars which can dwarf our sun and a single star can swallow the earth like an ant in your fist. The earth would be vaporized.

Or a third of the meteorites of heaven?

Scientist estimate the colossal energy released in a single meteorite collision with earth would be equal to the detonation of up to 300 million hydrogen bombs, each some 70 times bigger than the atomic bomb that destroyed Hiroshima.

Which terror are the citizens of earth facing in Revelation 6:12-17?

A third of the stars of heaven?

Or a third of the meteorites of heaven?

Oh btw, this has happened before in history according to Isaiah 34:4, in a past fulfilled judgment on Edom!

The prophets used idiom and hyperboles that exaggerated the fall of nations conquered by their enemies as if it were the destruction of the very material cosmos itself. They delivered it with great flourish.
 
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DaveRC

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Did verses 3-4 literally happen in the passage below, when God judged Samaria and Jerusalem using the Assyrians and their king Sennacherib as His instrument?


The word of the Lord that came to Micah the Morasthite in the days of Jotham, Ahaz, and Hezekiah, kings of Judah, which he saw concerning Samaria and Jerusalem.

2 Hear, all ye people;
hearken, O earth, and all that therein is:
and let the Lord God be witness against you,
the Lord from his holy temple.
3 For, behold, the Lord cometh forth out of his place,
and will come down, and tread upon the high places of the earth.
4 And the mountains shall be molten under him,
and the valleys shall be cleft,
as wax before the fire,
and as the waters that are poured down a steep place.
5 For the transgression of Jacob is all this,
and for the sins of the house of Israel.
What is the transgression of Jacob?
is it not Samaria?
and what are the high places of Judah?
are they not Jerusalem?
6 Therefore I will make Samaria as an heap of the field,
and as plantings of a vineyard:
and I will pour down the stones thereof into the valley,
and I will discover the foundations thereof.
7 And all the graven images thereof shall be beaten to pieces,
and all the hires thereof shall be burned with the fire,
and all the idols thereof will I lay desolate:
for she gathered it of the hire of an harlot,
and they shall return to the hire of an harlot.
8 Therefore I will wail and howl,
I will go stripped and naked:
I will make a wailing like the dragons,
and mourning as the owls.
9 For her wound is incurable;
for it is come unto Judah;
he is come unto the gate of my people,
even to Jerusalem.
 

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