Is futurism dying

Discussion in 'Preterism Discussions' started by thethinker, Aug 23, 2013.

  1. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    ok the elect are all over the place ... heaven, the winds, and earth.,.. Trying to understand your thinking.. JLB where does what is commonly called rapture fit in to this in your view?
     
  2. JLB

    JLB Member

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    • And then He will send His angels, and gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest part of earth to the farthest part of heaven. Mark 13:27

    This scripture encompasses His people who are on earth, and His people who are in heaven.

    The four winds or four corners of earth and heaven encompasses all of earth, and all of heaven, in which all of His people will be gathered together, unto Him, at His coming.

    This is called the gathering, in which He will gather His people from heaven and earth together, at His coming, or return from Heaven, where He is now seated at the right hand of God the Father.

    Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you... 2 Thessalonians 2;1

    • Yes the elect He is gathering from heaven, are in heaven [whose bodies will be resurrected], and the elect that are on earth are still on earth [who will be raptured].

    17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:17


    Those who are alive and remain, are caught up together with them.

    "Them" is those who have died and are with the Lord in heaven, in which their body is buried in the earth, and are resurrected first.

    16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-18


    Paul was comforting them about their loved ones who had passed away, but would be reunited together, when the Lord returned.



    JLB
     
  3. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    Nice post JLB but you did not answer the question
     
  4. JLB

    JLB Member

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    I answered your question about where the rapture fits into my view as thoroughly as I know how.

    I will try again.

    • Rapture = the gathering of His elect who are alive and remain on the earth, whose bodies will be transformed in the air, at His coming.
    • Resurrection = The gathering of those of His elect who have died and are in heaven, and will return with Jesus, to receive their resurrected, transformed bodies, at His coming.

    The resurrection/rapture is one event that is called the gathering, whereby those who have died and are in heaven, and those who are alive and remain on earth, will all be gathered together, unto Him.

    Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:17

    And then He will send His angels, and gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest part of earth to the farthest part of heaven. Mark 13:27

    Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you... 2 Thessalonians 2:1



    JLB
     
  5. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    Thanks very complete :)
     
  6. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    JLB not asking for a date..but asking when do you think this will be,,, something like any time, after the trib,.. pre, trip med trib? That kind of when..... I dont have a clue is also an honest answer.. .:)
     
  7. jasonc

    jasonc Member

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    Hitch chapter one verse one.consult that book
     
  8. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    sheesh I know Hitches opinion i am asking JLB about his.. jasonc :tongue
     
  9. jasonc

    jasonc Member

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    reference manual to answer your I don't know statement.
     
  10. DaveRC

    DaveRC Member

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    The verse in Zechariah is hyperbole we've seen this in 2 Samuel 22:1-16, Isaiah 34:5-6, Micah 1:1-9, etc.

    Take Revelation 6:12-17 for instance, what is their terror?

    A third of the stars of heaven?

    Stars which can dwarf our sun and a single star can swallow the earth like an ant in your fist. The earth would be vaporized.

    Or a third of the meteorites of heaven?

    Scientist estimate the colossal energy released in a single meteorite collision with earth would be equal to the detonation of up to 300 million hydrogen bombs, each some 70 times bigger than the atomic bomb that destroyed Hiroshima.

    Which terror are the citizens of earth facing in Revelation 6:12-17?

    A third of the stars of heaven?

    Or a third of the meteorites of heaven?

    Oh btw, this has happened before in history according to Isaiah 34:4, in a past fulfilled judgment on Edom!

    The prophets used idiom and hyperboles that exaggerated the fall of nations conquered by their enemies as if it were the destruction of the very material cosmos itself. They delivered it with great flourish.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2017
  11. DaveRC

    DaveRC Member

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    Did verses 3-4 literally happen in the passage below, when God judged Samaria and Jerusalem using the Assyrians and their king Sennacherib as His instrument?


    The word of the Lord that came to Micah the Morasthite in the days of Jotham, Ahaz, and Hezekiah, kings of Judah, which he saw concerning Samaria and Jerusalem.

    2 Hear, all ye people;
    hearken, O earth, and all that therein is:
    and let the Lord God be witness against you,
    the Lord from his holy temple.
    3 For, behold, the Lord cometh forth out of his place,
    and will come down, and tread upon the high places of the earth.
    4 And the mountains shall be molten under him,
    and the valleys shall be cleft,
    as wax before the fire,
    and as the waters that are poured down a steep place.
    5 For the transgression of Jacob is all this,
    and for the sins of the house of Israel.
    What is the transgression of Jacob?
    is it not Samaria?
    and what are the high places of Judah?
    are they not Jerusalem?
    6 Therefore I will make Samaria as an heap of the field,
    and as plantings of a vineyard:
    and I will pour down the stones thereof into the valley,
    and I will discover the foundations thereof.
    7 And all the graven images thereof shall be beaten to pieces,
    and all the hires thereof shall be burned with the fire,
    and all the idols thereof will I lay desolate:
    for she gathered it of the hire of an harlot,
    and they shall return to the hire of an harlot.
    8 Therefore I will wail and howl,
    I will go stripped and naked:
    I will make a wailing like the dragons,
    and mourning as the owls.
    9 For her wound is incurable;
    for it is come unto Judah;
    he is come unto the gate of my people,
    even to Jerusalem.
     

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