Is it a sin to take medications?

[Cornelius]

Exo 15:26 and he said, If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of Jehovah thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his eyes, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of the diseases upon thee, which I have put upon the Egyptians: for I am Jehovah that healeth thee.

Please take note that the Lord has conditions to healing.

1) Listening to His voice (that would be = to hearing what is written in the Bible)
2)Doing what is right (walking in the steps of Jesus)
3) Give ear to His commands and keep all his statutes ( Listen to all He says in the Word and do it )

In short: Walk as Jesus walked . We can only do this through faith, that Jesus will achieve this walk through us. In fact He has given all of us this ability already:2Pe 1:2 Grace to you and peace be multiplied in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord;
2Pe 1:3 seeing that his divine power hath granted unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that called us by his own glory and virtue;
2Pe 1:4 whereby he hath granted unto us his precious and exceeding great promises; that through these ye may become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped from the corruption that is in that world by lust.

 

[Cornelius]

I am grateful that the Lord did not leave us with a "maybe" religion, but with a sure clarity of His will in all matters

Healing is one such clear matter. Its been muddled up through the ages, but the Bible is clear that if we are not living in willing sin.........God will heal all . He will not bring you under the curse, if you are not living in willful sin. If you are living in the righteousness of Christ,then the curse has no power over you.

1)The curse (and sickness is part of the curse) with no cause will not come upon anybody:

Pro 26:2 As the sparrow in her wandering, as the swallow in her flying, So the curse that is causeless alighteth not.

2) God may want to test your faith, like Job, but the end should be victory and health.

 

[Vic C.]

Luke no doubt treated his patients with herbal medicines. Did he commit sin by doing so?

Wine was considered a treatment for certain ailments.

1 Tim 5:23 Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities.

Did Paul sin by suggesting this to Timothy?

2 Cor 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.
2 Cor 12:8 For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.
2 Cor 12:9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

So, was Paul willfully sinning? Was there a lack of faith in Paul that "prevented" God from healing him? Or is there something a bit left of center with "your name it and claim it" doctrine? Deceit can be sinful also.

Full healing isn't promised to the Christian this side of life but at the transformation and receiving of new, glorified, eternal bodies completely exempt from internal and external corruption... incorruptible.

Now, taking medications is a sinful as sipping down some wine now and then. It becomes sin when abused.

So Cornelius, we got your cart before the horse, so is your horse's name Yes or No?

 

[Cornelius]

Actually Paul's thorn is clearly stated in the verses you quoted:

2Co 12:7 And by reason of the exceeding greatness of the revelations, that I should not be exalted overmuch, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, a messenger of Satan to buffet me, that I should not be exalted overmuch.

and here Paul gives a list of the buffeting and sickness is not among them:2Co 11:24 Of the Jews five times received I forty stripes save one.
2Co 11:25 Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day have I been in the deep;
2Co 11:26 in journeyings often, in perils of rivers, in perils of robbers, in perils from my countrymen, in perils from the Gentiles, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren;
2Co 11:27 in labor and travail, in watchings often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness.

Now lets see if the messenger of Satan did his job well and kept Paul humble through this as he was suppose to do:


2Co 11:29 Who is weak, and I am not weak? who is caused to stumble, and I burn not?
2Co 11:30 If I must needs glory, I will glory of the things that concern my weakness.

It worked the messenger kept Paul right in God's will, where Paul learned that God's grace was enough to save Paul out of all that the enemy could bring. Paul overcame because he was weak and relied on God's strength and God came through for Paul every time.

In the beginning Paul wanted God to take this away, but God said : " My grace is sufficient for you" and Paul had to settle that in his mind. The buffeting did not stop, but Paul's faith in God's ability grew until he could say" "In my weakness I am strong"

Amen and it does not mention sickness here at all.

C

 

[Cornelius]

Full healing isn't promised to the Christian this side of life but at the transformation and receiving of new, glorified, eternal bodies completely exempt from internal and external corruption... incorruptible.

That is a sad gospel you bring brother Vic !

But luckily the truth is GOOD news ! Jesus came to set us free from the curse on this earth , while we are still alive. All you and I have to do to inherit the promises, is to believe them.

Here, look at this wonderful promise of God in Peter: 1Pe 2:24 who his own self bare our sins in his body upon the tree, that we, having died unto sins, might live unto righteousness; by whose stripes ye were healed.


My Bible says ....."WERE healed" does yours say "will be healed" or "were healed" Does God need a lesson in grammer ? Or does He know the difference between "were" and "will be"?

 

[Cornelius]

Gal 3:13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us; for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Another promise that is in the past tense ! redeemed .

Seems to me, we do not participate in the promises because we do not actually believe Jesus has finished what He came here to do. We, through unbelief, are living a life, that places all our hope in heaven. So now we do not live the life that Jesus bought with His blood for us.

If the curse is gone, why do we still submit to it?

C

 

[handy]

Please don't take this as a personal pot-shot, but I'm going to ask, Do you ever sin? Or do you walk sinless and face to face with God on a daily basis?

 

[Cornelius]

Please don't take this as a personal pot-shot, but I'm going to ask, Do you ever sin? Or do you walk sinless and face to face with God on a daily basis?

I can truly say that I reckon myself dead to sin. Rom 6:11 Even so reckon ye also yourselves to be dead unto sin, but alive unto God in Christ Jesus. and that I do not look at my life through human eyes, but I see the finished work of Christ as a done deal in me. I life in that faith , I walk in it and I speak it out to those around me. I know that if I should sin, and that sin is not willful, that I can confess it and it is under the blood of Jesus. If I will sin willfully, then I know that there is indeed no sacrifice for that sin (Hebrews 10) so I do not sin with my mind through choice. So from the view of my Father, the blood of His Son covers my sin, until I can walk in victory over it. And I will do that in this life. Not because I can, but because HE can and will and has overcome the world for me.Joh 16:33 ........but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world. So His victory is my victory, because He lives in me. Sin has been defeated by Jesus and as such is not a problem for Christians anymore. No Christian MUST sin anymore, but a Christian CAN sin. Non-Christian MUST sin, because they are still in the kingdom of darkness. We however have been translated into the Kingdom of Light.

Am I face to face with God on a daily basis? Well every Christian should be, because the Bible tells us:2Co 3:18 But we all, with unveiled face beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord (Jesus is the glory of the Lord), are transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as from the Lord the Spirit. So yes, by faith I see Him in the mirror, because my face is unveiled (no law) and the Holy Spirit is transforming me daily into that which I am seeing in the mirror.

blessings
C

 

[Cornelius]

You see a Christian has two identities. An old man and a new man.

They fight.

The way to kill the old man, is to "faith him to death" We renew our minds with the Word of God (That means we have to start to agree with God instead of changing His Word constantly so that it will fit our doctrines.)

Our doctrines have only one purpose, and that is they keep our flesh alive and they keep the spiritual man (Christ in us) down so that He cannot manifest through us.

Faith in the Word brings the New Man (Christ) to the front and it kills the old man (flesh) so that God can start to live His life through us.

So its up to you and me: We can either agree with the Word (although the Word does not make sense to the flesh) or we can agree with the senses (flesh) and the world and make the Word of no power.

Choice is ours. The life of faith is against the flesh.Also against most Christians. You will be persecuted if you want to walk in real faith.Persecuted by your brothers and sisters. Ask me, I know.

C

 

[handy]

I don't mean as beholding in a mirror, but face to face just like Adam did before the fall. Also, will you die if the Lord doesn't return soon?

My point of these questions is to bring out the fact that while Christ did take away the sin of the world, we, as did Paul and Peter before us, still stumble in sin and we still die and we don't walk face to face (not a metaphor, but actually face to face with God), because the effects of sin are still very much with us on this earth.

One of those effects is illness and ultimately death. Until Christ returns and all things are fulfilled, there will be illness and death. This isn't a matter of faith. If all it is is a matter of faith, then I want you to explain to my great-great-grandchildren why you didn't die of old age, or cancer, or heart failure just like the rest of us did in about 50 years from now.

Unless of course you are like 120 years old or older. If you are, then I totally withdraw all my counterpoints and will listen far more intently to what you have to say.

If not, then illness, death and other effects of the curse, all effects of the curse such as the animals eating each other and such things like that are still in effect. And, as Christians, we face day to day, even as we walk in faith. In faith, one may choose to walk without sin, but eventually one will fail. In faith, one can choose to either take medications or not, if one is ill, but still in faith, one will die and be gathered with one's fathers, just as all have done since Adam.

 

[Cornelius]

To be truthful we have just entered the age where some will indeed not die. See the Bible says that the LAST enemy is death.

So, you cannot "test" me on death, because death comes last, but death indeed will be overcome by some with faith. Here the Lord speaks of them:1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we that are alive, that are left unto the coming of the Lord, shall in no wise precede them that are fallen asleep.

1Co 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all his enemies under his feet.
1Co 15:26 The last enemy that shall be abolished is death.

OK, so Jesus must reign until death is also under His feet. We are His body here on earth, and we are then also part of the "feet".So then death will be under our feet.

If death is the LAST, then all the rest must be under our feet before death. This will include sickness and sin.

So your argument sounds solid, but not in the light of the Word. We are to start with the other "enemies" like sin and sickness and lastly death will be defeated too,...and not because we are in heaven. Death will be defeated here on earth.

C

 

[handy]

I agree that there will come a time when death and all else will be abolished. I just don't think that we are living in that time. I've known far too many Christians of rock solid faith, who have faced illness and death with courage and faithfulness to believe that anyone who is ill has little faith. Last summer, I was able to experience first hand what illness and death can be for a mighty Christian when we walked with my Dad through his cancer and death.

I've also been there to try to help some whose faith has been shipwrecked to the point of turning away from God because they were taught as you seem to believe, that all illness stems from either sin or a lack of faith, then have had to deal with an illness or the illness of a child in which all the sincere prayers and supplications did not heal.

At any rate, I've made all the points I have on this subject. This has been a good discussion, Cornelius, with much to think and pray over. I do respect your input here, I disagree with some of your conclusions, but I do respect that you have come to them via study and prayer.

And people say that Dave Slayer only asks silly questions!

 

[Vic C.]

I've also been there to try to help some whose faith has been shipwrecked to the point of turning away from God because they were taught as you seem to believe, that all illness stems from either sin or a lack of faith, then have had to deal with an illness or the illness of a child in which all the sincere prayers and supplications did not heal.

... and that my dear friend Dora, is where REAL Faith steps up. It's not in whether or whether not God heals someone, that's not a test of faith. The test is how we deal with calamity, trials and tribulation. It's running toward the One whos arms are wide open, ready to comfort us at the very time we need it the most. His primary goal is to heal hearts and souls, not this temporal, physical lump of flesh. His Holy Spirit is called The Comforter!!!

It's why I vowed to never change the verse in my signature.

 

[Free]

Interesting, so we cannot look at the original Greek, because it insults you when the translators translated the word sorcery from what the Greek says is medicine?

Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these: fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Gal 5:20 idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousies, wraths, factions, divisions, parties,


Here is it again, we can all read and Google it for ourselves. Its not insulting , its reality.

You will see that the Greek word is the word that we get Pharmacy from in the English:

G5331
ÆαÃÂμακεία
pharmakeia
far-mak-i'-ah
From G5332; medication (“pharmacyâ€Â), that is, (by extension) magic (literal or figurative): - sorcery, witchcraft.


God wrote this, not me. So be angry with Him, not me.I am just quoting what is written. Sorry if it disturbs you.

C

Well, things are not always as clear as we seem to think they are, even if we look to the Greek. Remember, it was the translators that chose "sorcery" and "witchcraft" but it does not follow that that is what was actually being said. There is good reason to believe that most translations have it wrong.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking medication.

To be truthful we have just entered the age where some will indeed not die.

And you know this how...?

1Co 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all his enemies under his feet.
1Co 15:26 The last enemy that shall be abolished is death.

OK, so Jesus must reign until death is also under His feet. We are His body here on earth, and we are then also part of the "feet".So then death will be under our feet.

That's stretching it.

If death is the LAST, then all the rest must be under our feet before death. This will include sickness and sin.

So your argument sounds solid, but not in the light of the Word. We are to start with the other "enemies" like sin and sickness and lastly death will be defeated too,...and not because we are in heaven. Death will be defeated here on earth.

The argument is sound. Just when is Death destroyed?

1Co 15:21 For as by a man came death, by a man has come also the resurrection of the dead.
1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive.
1Co 15:23 But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ.
1Co 15:24 Then comes the end, when he delivers the kingdom to God the Father after destroying every rule and every authority and power.

Death is finally defeated when all in Christ are raised from the dead and Death is thrown into the Lake of Fire. Up until the Judgment Seat of Christ there is still abundant sin on the Earth.

God never promises to heal us during our life here on Earth.

 

[JoJo]

I am grateful that the Lord did not leave us with a "maybe" religion, but with a sure clarity of His will in all matters

Healing is one such clear matter. Its been muddled up through the ages, but the Bible is clear that if we are not living in willing sin.........God will heal all . He will not bring you under the curse, if you are not living in willful sin. If you are living in the righteousness of Christ,then the curse has no power over you.

1)The curse (and sickness is part of the curse) with no cause will not come upon anybody:

Pro 26:2 As the sparrow in her wandering, as the swallow in her flying, So the curse that is causeless alighteth not.

2) God may want to test your faith, like Job, but the end should be victory and health.

Cornelius, when my son had cancer, he was 16 year old and quite capable of willfully sinning...I'll give you that much. But please explain the little boy who shared my son's room a couple of times. He was less than two years old and was stricken with cancer. Please tell me, how is it possible that he was guilty of living in willful sin???

Are you telling me that every person who gets sick is willfully living in sin?

 

[Cornelius]

Well, things are not always as clear as we seem to think they are, even if we look to the Greek. Remember, it was the translators that chose "sorcery" and "witchcraft" but it does not follow that that is what was actually being said. There is good reason to believe that most translations have it wrong.
.

That is certainly true, because they were too afraid to translate the word for what it means. They simply should have translated it "medications" because that is the meaning of the word.

So yes I agree with you. Sorcery is unclear, the verse should have read:

Gal 5:20 idolatry, medication , enmities, strife, jealousies, wraths, factions, divisions, parties,

Thank you for pointing that out

C

 

[Cornelius]

I am grateful that the Lord did not leave us with a "maybe" religion, but with a sure clarity of His will in all matters

Healing is one such clear matter. Its been muddled up through the ages, but the Bible is clear that if we are not living in willing sin.........God will heal all . He will not bring you under the curse, if you are not living in willful sin. If you are living in the righteousness of Christ,then the curse has no power over you.

1)The curse (and sickness is part of the curse) with no cause will not come upon anybody:

Pro 26:2 As the sparrow in her wandering, as the swallow in her flying, So the curse that is causeless alighteth not.

2) God may want to test your faith, like Job, but the end should be victory and health.

Cornelius, when my son had cancer, he was 16 year old and quite capable of willfully sinning...I'll give you that much. But please explain the little boy who shared my son's room a couple of times. He was less than two years old and was stricken with cancer. Please tell me, how is it possible that he was guilty of living in willful sin???

Are you telling me that every person who gets sick is willfully living in sin?

No, I did not say that , did I ?

We live in a world, that has a curse in it. This curse was brought about by the fall. Our children also are under that same curse even as to the fourth generation from the person who sinned.Exo 20:5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them, for I Jehovah thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, upon the third and upon the fourth generation of them that hate me, So as you can see the Bible says that you and I and our children can suffer because of something that happened long before they were born.

I know this well, because my father, passed the family curse unto me, and only the blood of Jesus broke it. It traveled down the family until it reached me.My father never were free from it and his brothers died in it as well. God had to show me, that I needed to be like David, who looked at Goliath (this was a giant to me). I had to allow the brook (the water of the Word) to smooth my five stones (my five senses) so that when I faced Goliath, I could kill him. I had to cut off his head , where he spoke his authority out over me. I killed Goliath with the Word of God, but only after my mind (five senses) were renewed by the washing of the Word.

In another parable, God showed me to be like Joshua , when he captured the five kings (five senses ) of the land (our land as Christians are ruled by the senses when we arrive) and I had to lock them up in the cave (shut my mouth) and place rocks in front of the cave (place the Word there) and not allow them to come out by themselves.
Then I had to take them and place my feet on their necks, so they cannot SPEAK (I was never to listen to the flesh and my senses) and I had to hang them on a tree (I had to crucify my senses).....THEN I could take the land.

People have not learned this, and they are coming against me and what I say, because their five kings are not in the cave. Their kings are speaking, and unlike David, they cannot face the giants, because their stones are rough and they have not bees smoothed by the water of the Word.

 

[Cornelius]

The Bible divides Christians into two groups. Here they are. One group believes the Word and the other group believe their eyes and ears etc.

Group one:

Num 13:30 And Caleb stilled the people before Moses, and said, Let us go up at once, and possess it; for we are well able to overcome it.

Group two:

Num 13:31 But the men that went up with him said, We are not able to go up against the people; for they are stronger than we.
Num 13:32 And they brought up an evil report of the land which they had spied out unto the children of Israel, saying, The land, through which we have gone to spy it out, is a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it are men of great stature.
Num 13:33 And there we saw the Nephilim, the sons of Anak, who come of the Nephilim: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight. (they go by sight and not the Word of God)


So when group one hears: Through his stripes we are healed, they say. We are well able to go against this sickness, because we have the Word and its our sword against this giant. Lets go and possess the Land!

Group two says: We cannot do that, this might not be God's will. How would be know if we will win? We cannot enter this land.


And God said:Heb 3:7 Wherefore, even as the Holy Spirit saith, To-day if ye shall hear his voice,
Heb 3:8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, Like as in the day of the trial in the wilderness,
Heb 3:9 Where your fathers tried me by proving me, And saw my works forty years.
Heb 3:10 Wherefore I was displeased with this generation, And said, They do always err in their heart: But they did not know my ways;
Heb 3:11 As I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.
Heb 3:12 Take heed, brethren, lest haply there shall be in any one of you an evil heart of unbelief, in falling away from the living God:


Heb 3:19 And we see that they were not able to enter in because of unbelief.

 

[Cornelius]

God never promises to heal us during our life here on Earth.

You are right, he has not promised to heal us in the future, His promise is that in Christ we were already healed at the cross . Its only our faith that keeps us from it.

1Pe 2:24 who his own self bare our sins in his body upon the tree, that we, having died unto sins, might live unto righteousness; by whose stripes ye were healed.

were
Verb
the form of the past tense of be: used after we, you, they, or a plural noun, or as a subjunctive in conditional sentences

 

[Cornelius]

I've also been there to try to help some whose faith has been shipwrecked to the point of turning away from God because they were taught as you seem to believe, that all illness stems from either sin or a lack of faith, then have had to deal with an illness or the illness of a child in which all the sincere prayers and supplications did not heal.

... and that my dear friend Dora, is where REAL Faith steps up. It's not in whether or whether not God heals someone, that's not a test of faith. The test is how we deal with calamity, trials and tribulation. It's running toward the One whos arms are wide open, ready to comfort us at the very time we need it the most. His primary goal is to heal hearts and souls, not this temporal, physical lump of flesh. His Holy Spirit is called The Comforter!!!

It's why I vowed to never change the verse in my signature.

Brother Vic, I love you in the Lord But you cannot say things like "REAL faith" and tell people its like an Oprah show. No offense meant , but what you are saying does not have its roots in the Bible, but rather in modern church doctrine, which we received via the hands of the reformers that came out of great apostasy, but they themselves did not come with ALL the answers. We are still suffering from our history as the church. Don't you want to be free from all that old doctrine that was preached during the Dark Ages?
I have SEEN the Lord work in regards to healing. I have witnessed the healing power of God. I have seen a body restored the very minute I laid my hands on the person. I heard the voice of the Lord and prayed and saw. I have seen the Lord work too many times, to NOT believe the Word of God regarding healing.

I mean it when I say, I love you in the Lord Vic, so please do not take offense, because none is intended brother.

C