isreal and the trib and millenium

[n2thelight]

my major beef with futurism that is on isreal is the idea that they are used instead of the church in this millenium with a return not even to the law but works only( a totally fail on what the lord did then).

Revelation 20:12"And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works."

Notice there are two sets of books here. The first called "The Books" is to judge the unsaved. The second is the "Book of Life" where only the names of the saved are recorded. The saved have had their sins removed from God's judgment and booted out. Though they were committed, the blood of Christ has covered them from being used against us.

Notice how all souls are judged "according to their works". Does it talk about faith here after the Millennium? No. The "great white throne judgment" will not take faith into consideration. The first resurrection takes faith into consideration. That was back on "the Lord's day". That was Jesus Christ's "great day". On the last day of the Millennium age souls are judged by works only.

Why are you judged for works only? Faith is something hoped for but unseen. You don't see Jesus Christ on earth today, you will see his wonderful works, and be led by Him and His Spirit in the Millennium age. Today He is in heaven and not walking on this earth. However, in the millennium, He will be on earth, and all will have full intelligence, with full recall and will be taught. The Heavenly Father honors all those with grace, that have accepted His Son by faith through repentance without Christ's physical presence here on earth, if you believed in His Word.

To those who are not under grace in the Millennium, their salvation will be only through and by their works. For faith doesn't exist to them. There will be no ignorance, physical handicap, for you will see, know, and experience Our Lord first hand.

 

[jasoncran]

sorry. that isnt what justin martyr. believed nor the early church that did believe in a millenium. works of the law dont get nor were ever made or designed to save you. that cant be. the law isnt going to return for why would it per the writer of hebrews. christ is superior to aaron. so there wont be much saved in that millenium as few will be able without god. the problem you must figure out is that noah found grace. yet there was no law per moses.

believing On god is a work.

 

[Hitch]

To those who are not under grace in the Millennium, their salvation will be only through and by their works. For faith doesn't exist to them. There will be no ignorance, physical handicap, for you will see, know, and experience Our Lord first hand.

To repeat,this qualifies as 'another gospel'. It is wholly untrue.

 

[jasoncran]

yes and well i guess he doenst read all revalation and paul where works are mentioned and being judged for them. really,the isrealites saw signs and miracles and so forth. they didnt believe them and they knew god was there and real. a pillar of smoke by day and fire at night. kinda hard not to notice that. mana from heaven, nah they must have not noticed them.

 

[n2thelight]

yes and well i guess he doenst read all revalation and paul where works are mentioned and being judged for them. really,the isrealites saw signs and miracles and so forth. they didnt believe them and they knew god was there and real. a pillar of smoke by day and fire at night. kinda hard not to notice that. mana from heaven, nah they must have not noticed them.

So why are they called the dead???????

 

[Robert Hern]

sorry the new covenant is for all that has been fulfilled.

he made that for them at the cross.the problem is then will that apply to the people like rachab? and other gentiles who joined themselves to isreal. then theres the parts in these millenial verses of yours that mention levites offering up sin sacrifices and the law being used. hmm that is too ot testament like to be under this new way with the law in them. the blood of animals doesnt save. so why would jesus go back?

The new covenant is not for all:

“The days are coming, declares the Lord,
when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel

Hebrews 8

Christians are under Grace, not this covenant

 

[Hitch]

The new covenant is not for all:

“The days are coming, declares the Lord,
when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel

Hebrews 8

Christians are under Grace, not this covenant

LOL the covenant of Christ's own blood is the highest expression of grace.

 

[Robert Hern]

Absolutely by grace for Christians
the covenent is for the Jews
But what about the Jews according to Paul:
Romans 11

1 I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means!
I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God did not reject his people, whom he foreknew.

 

[Sinthesis]

Absolutely by grace for Christians
the covenent is for the Jews
But what about the Jews according to Paul:
Romans 11

1 I ask then: Did God reject his people? By no means!
I am an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God did not reject his people, whom he foreknew.

According to Paul, he himself is a person of Israel. Are you claiming the new covenant was not for Paul? Or are you claiming that grace is not the new covenant?

 

[Robert Hern]

I am claiming the new covenant is for the Jews not for the Christians

the Jews in Jerusalem were never called Christians

the believers of Jesus in the church of Jerusalem lead by James half brother of Jesus, continued to follow the Law of Moses

 

[Hitch]

I am claiming the new covenant is for the Jews not for the Christians

the Jews in Jerusalem were never called Christians

From your next line ;the believers of Jesus in the church of Jerusalem

the believers of Jesus in the church of Jerusalem lead by James half brother of Jesus, continued to follow the Law of Moses

I know what you're claiming and it it anti-scriptural and idiotic.

 

[Robert Hern]

Are you not familiar with these scriptures

you could be nice and ask for references

 

[Hitch]

Are you not familiar with these scriptures

you could be nice and ask for references

There are no scriptures that teach men to resume the Law,Sacrifices ,etc, just silly doctrines .

Just as there are no scriptures that teach Christianity will ever be replaced.

Just as there are no scriptures that teach that any one will ever need do anything but repent and follow Christ. Just like the believers of Jesus in the church of Jerusalem.

It is not the Spirit of God that has taught you that anyone at any time will gain right standing with the Father through shedding the blood of animals.

I strongly suggest a review of Pau'ls Apostolic definition of the Kingdom of God.

 

[Robert Hern]

read the Word of God yourself

these are the believer of Jesus in the Church of Jeruselam lead by Jameshalf brother of Jesus

your zeal has blinded you my friend

it good that you have passion but also add truth in the Word of God



Acts 21:17

17 When we arrived at Jerusalem, the brothers and sisters receivedus warmly. 18 The next day Paul and the rest of us went to see James,and all the elders were present.

20 When they heard this, they praised God. Then they said to Paul:“You see, brother, how many thousands of Jews have believed, and all of themare zealous for the law. 21 They have been informed that youteach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to turn away from Moses,telling them not to circumcise their children or live according to our customs.22 What shall we do? They will certainly hear that you have come, 23 so do what we tell you. There are four men with us who have madea vow. 24 Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay theirexpenses, so that they can have their heads shaved. Then everyone will knowthere is no truth in these reportsabout you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the law.

 

[Hitch]

Acts 21:17

17 When we arrived at Jerusalem, the brothers and sisters receivedus warmly. 18 The next day Paul and the rest of us went to see James,and all the elders were present.

20 When they heard this, they praised God. Then they said to Paul:“You see, brother, how many thousands of Jews have believed, and all of themare zealous for the law. 21 They have been informed that youteach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to turn away from Moses,telling them not to circumcise their children or live according to our customs.22 What shall we do? They will certainly hear that you have come, 23 so do what we tell you. There are four men with us who have madea vow. 24 Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay theirexpenses, so that they can have their heads shaved. Then everyone will knowthere is no truth in these reportsabout you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the law.

Is there some point you wish to make?

 

[Robert Hern]

There are no scriptures that teach men to resume the Law,Sacrifices ,etc, just silly doctrines .

Just as there are no scriptures that teach Christianity will ever be replaced.

Just as there are no scriptures that teach that any one will ever need do anything but repent and follow Christ. Just like the believers of Jesus in the church of Jerusalem.

It is not the Spirit of God that has taught you that anyone at any time will gain right standing with the Father through shedding the blood of animals.

I strongly suggest a review of Pau'ls Apostolic definition of the Kingdom of God.

this is for you:

read the Word of God yourself

these are the believer of Jesus in the Church of Jeruselam lead by Jameshalf brother of Jesus

your zeal has blinded you my friend

it good that you have passion but also add truth in the Word of God



Acts 21:17

17 When we arrived at Jerusalem, the brothers and sisters receivedus warmly. 18 The next day Paul and the rest of us went to see James,and all the elders were present.

20 When they heard this, they praised God. Then they said to Paul:“You see, brother, how many thousands of Jews have believed, and all of themare zealous for the law. 21 They have been informed that youteach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to turn away from Moses,telling them not to circumcise their children or live according to our customs.22 What shall we do? They will certainly hear that you have come, 23 so do what we tell you. There are four men with us who have madea vow. 24 Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay theirexpenses, so that they can have their heads shaved. Then everyone will knowthere is no truth in these reportsabout you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the law.

 

[Hitch]

this is for you:

read the Word of God yourself

these are the believer of Jesus in the Church of Jeruselam lead by Jameshalf brother of Jesus

your zeal has blinded you my friend

it good that you have passion but also add truth in the Word of God



Acts 21:17

17 When we arrived at Jerusalem, the brothers and sisters receivedus warmly. 18 The next day Paul and the rest of us went to see James,and all the elders were present.

20 When they heard this, they praised God. Then they said to Paul:“You see, brother, how many thousands of Jews have believed, and all of themare zealous for the law. 21 They have been informed that youteach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to turn away from Moses,telling them not to circumcise their children or live according to our customs.22 What shall we do? They will certainly hear that you have come, 23 so do what we tell you. There are four men with us who have madea vow. 24 Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay theirexpenses, so that they can have their heads shaved. Then everyone will knowthere is no truth in these reportsabout you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the law.

To repeat;
Is there some point you wish to make?

 

[reba]

GUYS ,2.5: Respect each others' opinions. Address issues, not persons or personalities. Give other members the respect you would want them to give yourself.

 

[Hammer]

I am claiming the new covenant is for the Jews not for the Christians

the Jews in Jerusalem were never called Christians

the believers of Jesus in the church of Jerusalem lead by James half brother of Jesus, continued to follow the Law of Moses

Paul continued to observe the letter of the law so that he might win Jews. The Jews themselves, even though no longer under the law, could hardly be expected to change their ingrained devotion to the law overnight. So, God gave them 40 years before ending he Temple age. This was time for all Jews to hear the Gospel, and for the old ones who can't change their ways to die off.

You know that in Christ there is neither Jew nor gentile. So, don't say otherwise.

Also, this is purely academic. The house of Judah was destroyed in 70AD. There are no Jews according to the flesh.

 

[jasoncran]

robert, im of isreal. cranman is an ashakanazi jewish name. so i wont be in the church? sheesh. this jew worship by some here is amazing. the bible doesnt support the idea of a seperation of a jew in the things to come. a jew represents something to god in the past spiritually and now the church has taken that role. it was always meant to be a gentile-hebrew peoples coming to god. under the torah it was as isreal, now its all as in christ. hmm nah that is too much.