It isn't Islamophobia when they really are trying to kill you!

[tessiewebb]

In my view, both Talmudic Judaism and Islam are evil. In your view, Jews are God's chosen people. In my view, that's anti-Christian.

Christians are the real Jews, the children of Abraham. The so-called Jews are people who follow the Talmud (which teaches that Jesus is being punished in boiling excrement) or have a jewish cultural heritage (e.g. Ashkenazis).

You can't refute what I say, so you attack my person.

I have to say with Reba that I've NEVER heard of any Jew, talmudic or otherwise behaving in such rash and violent behavior as their half brothers! They may not believe in Jesus, though there are many Messianic Jews who do and I have it on pretty good authority those numbers are quickly rising even in Israel. There is no way you can say the Jews as a race are not God's chosen ones and still read the Bible with any appreciation. Those Jews who believe in Jesus as their Messiah and Christians are, as Paul put it, one new man, god-men filled with the Holy Spirit of God. And as Paul also said, don't get too puffed up about Christians being grafted from a wild olive tree to the natural one because you too can be removed. (Rom 11:17-24 & Eph 2:15-22)

 

[tessiewebb]

"His perspective is that, since the Muslims hate the "joos", they can't be all that bad."

I don't hate Jews, but you do hate Muslims. Post 16 points out some facts that are contrary to what you want people to believe.

Christians don't, as Bible believers, "hate Muslims", Hammer, since we are taught to love and pray for our enemies. We do object rather strenuously, (though in my opinion way too little and too quietly) their intense, vocal, devilish hatred and violence against Jews and Christians, and oh, by the way, Hindus, Buddhists, and any other "religion", secular or otherwise, that doesn't agree with their rabid devotion to Muhammad.

And just because Christians are concerned for Muslim peoples souls doesn't mean we have to agree to their takeovers of governments, peoples, cities, towns, countries as they are doing all over the world. If you are not a Muslim, why are you justifying their faith?

 

[Hammer]

I have to say with Reba that I've NEVER heard of any Jew, talmudic or otherwise behaving in such rash and violent behavior as their half brothers! They may not believe in Jesus, though there are many Messianic Jews who do and I have it on pretty good authority those numbers are quickly rising even in Israel. There is no way you can say the Jews as a race are not God's chosen ones and still read the Bible with any appreciation.

The antichristian doctrine you promote has become very popular among Evangelicals in recent decades. But, it is false. Here's something from the Bible that's clear and simple for you to appreciate:

Hosea 1: I will no longer have compassion on the house of Israel, that I would ever forgive them... for you are not My people and I am not your God.

Those you call Jews aren't even even of the house of Israel. If God cut off the natural children of Abraham for lack of faith, just consider how perverse your doctrine is that calls gentile Talmudists God's chosen ones.

 

[jasoncran]

I have to say with Reba that I've NEVER heard of any Jew, talmudic or otherwise behaving in such rash and violent behavior as their half brothers! They may not believe in Jesus, though there are many Messianic Jews who do and I have it on pretty good authority those numbers are quickly rising even in Israel. There is no way you can say the Jews as a race are not God's chosen ones and still read the Bible with any appreciation. Those Jews who believe in Jesus as their Messiah and Christians are, as Paul put it, one new man, god-men filled with the Holy Spirit of God. And as Paul also said, don't get too puffed up about Christians being grafted from a wild olive tree to the natural one because you too can be removed. (Rom 11:17-24 & Eph 2:15-22)

most messianic jews are gentiles.not all jews who believed want to go that route. im one of those and so is my brother. biologically im of jewish descent but im wasnt raised in the temple.

 

[Hammer]

Christians don't, as Bible believers, "hate Muslims",

The man I said who hates Muslims does hate muslims. He has argued that all muslims are violent. That's not even remotely true. There are about two and a half million Muslims in the USA, and I bet they have cleaner criminal records than the average population.

The most hostile country in the world is Israel. Israel is in violation of more UN resolutions than any other country of the world, even with the US having veto power over resolutions (that's called a fact, what you have is dubious propaganda). The second most hostile country in the world is the US, and that's mainly because we're following Israel's lead. Israel wants us to attack Iran. We wouldn't for a second give real consideration to attacking Iran if not for Israel's desire that we attack. Yet, you're complaining Muslim's "intense, vocal, devilish hatred and violence against Jews." Pot, kettle, black.

Iran doesn't have a nuclear weapons program (as a matter of fact, that's the conclusion reached by various US intelligence agencies). Have your Zionist friends been calling for attacks against North Korea when they were developing nuclear weapons? How about Pakistan (yes, they have nukes)?

 

[tessiewebb]

The man I said who hates Muslims does hate muslims. He has argued that all muslims are violent. That's not even remotely true. There are about two and a half million Muslims in the USA, and I bet they have cleaner criminal records than the average population.

The most hostile country in the world is Israel. Israel is in violation of more UN resolutions than any other country of the world, even with the US having veto power over resolutions (that's called a fact, what you have is dubious propaganda). The second most hostile country in the world is the US, and that's mainly because we're following Israel's lead. Israel wants us to attack Iran. We wouldn't for a second give real consideration to attacking Iran if not for Israel's desire that we attack. Yet, you're complaining Muslim's "intense, vocal, devilish hatred and violence against Jews." Pot, kettle, black.

Iran doesn't have a nuclear weapons program (as a matter of fact, that's the conclusion reached by various US intelligence agencies). Have your Zionist friends been calling for attacks against North Korea when they were developing nuclear weapons? How about Pakistan (yes, they have nukes)?

It goes both ways with accusations. My "Zionist friends" are non existent entities except in your mind. Your stand however is very clear. You hate Jews and that in spite of the fact that they are a small country under threat from violent, devilish neighbors who are doing their level best to bring about the "end of the world" so their so-called imam can return from that well he's been hiding in. You obviously have no compassion for a small underdog nation being daily under threat of attack from all sides. Staff edit: personal attack.

And as I've said before, it isn't hatred if they are really trying to kill you!

 

[jwoods4290]

i completely disagree with hammer on all aspects and matters. Very intelligent, but also very ignorant when it comes to the land of israel. (sorry if i spelled it wrong ). Truthfully, i don't think there are "perfect people" in any culture or religion for that matter (the lord doesn't count what so ever, he's the creator of all and perfect in every way). So to judge a few people who happen to be jewish and to target a whole nation is ignorant and wrong. You have what you call a (i believe it's a 611 scam) where nigerians straight from nigeria try to sell you things on craigslist, and take your money through improper transfers, but is it right to call all of them "thieves?". No, there are good people and bad people no matter where you go. but with israel, it's like a 6 vs 1. almost every nation in that region hates the jewish people. so can you not be defensive against these matters? Just like there are "real christians" and "fake christians" and any christian who hates someone else is a "fake". love thy neighbor.

recently i believe it was iran flying sonor or something like that near the gaza strip. obviously israel shot it down. so let me ask you this, who is in the wrong for that?

 

[Hammer]

It goes both ways with accusations. My "Zionist friends" are non existent entities except in your mind. Your stand however is very clear. You hate Jews and that in spite of the fact that they are a small country under threat from violent, devilish neighbors who are doing their level best to bring about the "end of the world" so their so-called imam can return from that well he's been hiding in. You obviously have no compassion for a small underdog nation being daily under threat of attack from all sides.

That "underdog" nation has been a nuclear power for nearly 50 years, and is still the only nuclear power in the region. It has by far the most powerful military in the region, as well as being backed by the US. They have started every war they've been in. The occupy land from three different countries, land captured in wars they started. They deny the Palestinians statehood, the only people on the planet denied statehood.

And, they're not Jews.

 

[jwoods4290]

That "underdog" nation has been a nuclear power for nearly 50 years, and is still the only nuclear power in the region. It has by far the most powerful military in the region, as well as being backed by the US. They have started every war they've been in. The occupy land from three different countries, land captured in wars they started. They deny the Palestinians statehood, the only people on the planet denied statehood.

And, they're not Jews.

let me ask you a question, do you live there so you can actually say that is true, or did you hear this from our lovely "media"?

 

[julian]

 

[Man-After-God]

Imagine is we, Christians were out telling others about our Faith in Jesus Christ as quickly as the Muslims do. The Islamic religion is based upon a sinful man. Mine is Based upon a Sinless Son of God Jesus Christ; who is the Only way, the Truth, and the Life. Yes, Islam is an evil cult, and we should be out trying to witness to every Muslim, and share with them the Gospel of Jesus.

 

[tessiewebb]

That "underdog" nation has been a nuclear power for nearly 50 years, and is still the only nuclear power in the region. It has by far the most powerful military in the region, as well as being backed by the US. They have started every war they've been in. The occupy land from three different countries, land captured in wars they started. They deny the Palestinians statehood, the only people on the planet denied statehood. And, they're not Jews.

Really, no nuclear power??? So why does General Hossein Salami have this to say?: "TEHRAN, Iran (AP) — Israel will "definitely" face fierce retaliation if it attacks Iranian nuclear sites, the acting commander of Iran's powerful Revolutionary Guard warned Thursday. The remarks by Gen. Hossein Salami appear to be part of Iranian efforts to portray any strike against it as the trigger for a regional conflict that could draw in Iranian proxies, such as Lebanon's militant Hezbollah group, on Israel's borders. Iran's suspect nuclear program has topped the international agenda and pressures on Tehran are mounting."

I'd really like to be an eye on the wall if your homicidal neighbor insisted you "give" him your house, while you must remain there. See what your behavior would reflect then. Would it be "ah, poor guy, he needs a house". I seriously don't believe that!

I worry that people like you will somehow convince our wavering US government to stop supporting and to stand against Israel for if that day comes, this country is cursed.

As for Israel being the "most powerful military in the region", that is a very laughable statement considering they are VASTLY outnumbered by the countries aligned against them and Russia in the background. The land they occupy is not all they should have either for it doesn't include all the land given to Abraham, the father of the Israelis, by God's own mouth. May their God and mine give them all they were gifted with and peace besides!!

 

[Hammer]

Really, no nuclear power??? So why does General Hossein Salami have this to say?: "TEHRAN, Iran (AP) — Israel will "definitely" face fierce retaliation if it attacks Iranian nuclear sites, the acting commander of Iran's powerful Revolutionary Guard warned Thursday.

A dog with a big bite doesn't bark so much. Regardless, Iran is completely within reason and rights to promise to defend itself if attacked. For you to find fault Iran with promising to defend itself is bizarre, to say the least.

I'd really like to be an eye on the wall if your homicidal neighbor insisted you "give" him your house, while you must remain there. See what your behavior would reflect then. Would it be "ah, poor guy, he needs a house". I seriously don't believe that!

Modern Iran hasn't attacked its neighbors. Israel has attacked its neighbors, repeatedly.

I worry that people like you will somehow convince our wavering US government to stop supporting and to stand against Israel for if that day comes, this country is cursed.

They're not Jews. And, we are cursed for supporting Israel. Do you want to tally up costs vs. benefits of supporting Israel? 9/11, Iraq war, billions/year aid, etc. Vs. what? Some contributions from Israel's tech sector?

As for Israel being the "most powerful military in the region", that is a very laughable statement considering they are VASTLY outnumbered by the countries aligned against them and Russia in the background.

US military spending is over 10 times that of Russia's. And, Russia isn't blindly loyal to Arabs as the US is to Israel. Israel's own defense spending exceeds the combined spending of nearly every country in the region.

The land they occupy is not all they should have either for it doesn't include all the land given to Abraham, the father of the Israelis, by God's own mouth. May their God and mine give them all they were gifted with and peace besides!!

Israelis are not the children of Abraham. Even if they were the children of Abraham, in their state of rebellion, they have no right to the land. The Arabs, on the other hand, are the children of Abraham and they have the land that was promised to Abraham, from the Nile through the Euphrates.

 

[julian]

It is Christian doctrine that Genesis 12:3 applies to Christians.

Arabs are children of Abraham, yet you don't apply Genesis 12:3 to Arabs.

Israelis aren't children of Abraham. They're follows of the Talmud, who just call themselves Jews.

who was abraham gona kill ishmael or isaac?

 

[Hammer]

who was abraham gona kill ishmael or isaac?

What does it matter? Ishmael, the father of Arabs, was Abraham's son. (But, talmudic Jews aren't Isaac's children.)

If the promise is passed on by birth, it applies to Ishmael as much as Isaac. But, the promise is passed on by faith. That is why Isaac received it, not Ishmael. Christians are Abraham's children by faith. When the children of Isaac lost faith in God, God said He is not their God and they are not His people.

 

[julian]

Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad will get the same thing sadaam hussein got

 

[Nick]

A few posts were edited or deleted. Let's try and have a discussion without trying to start a flame war.

Oh, and by the way, the leash on anti-Jewish postings will only go so far. http://www.christianforums.net/showthread.php?t=14583

 

[julian]

im not anti jewish he is and hes obviously a muslim ....................................

 

[Nick]

im not anti jewish he is and hes obviously a muslim ....................................

I never said you were anti-Jewish. Just try not to antagonise him further.

To all: It would be nice if we could keep the personal stuff out of these threads.

Further issues with staff actions or other members should be taken to PM's.

 

[Hammer]

Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad will get the same thing sadaam hussein got

What's that? Saddam got 4000 dead Americans. We got him and a wrecked economy, which was pointless. We went in to destroy WMDs and to revenge 9/11, but both of those were false reasons. Attacking Iran would be both costly and pointless - and utterly evil. Iran has done nothing to justify being attacked.