Bible Study JESUS OUR EXAMPLE and the APOSTLES OBEYED GOD'S LAW and the SABBATH!

[LoveGodsWord]

WHAT DID JESUS AND THE APOSTLES TEACH ABOUT GOD’S LAW
(the scriptures below are no where near exhaustive)

Jesus taught the 10 commandments…..

1. Jesus kept God’s Law (10 commandments) and said the Law and the prophets would not pass away (Matt 5:17-18)
2. Jesus taught others to follow the 10 commandments (Mark 10:17-21)
3. Jesus taught that Love is the fulfilling (doing) of God’s Law (10 commandments Matt 22:36-40)
4. If we break God’s Law by following man-made traditions we are not following God (Matt 15:3-9)
5. Jesus says if we commit sin we are a servant of sin and he has come to free us from sin (John 8:32-36)
6. Jesus taught if you love God you will keep God’s Law and abide in His Love (John 14:15; 15:10
7. If anyone is breaking any of God’s commandments and teaching others to do so will be called least in the kingdom of heaven <least = lost> (Matt 5:19)
8. No one can obey God’s Law producing the fruit of obedience of ourselves and unless we abide in Jesus we can do nothing (John 15:4-10)

Paul affirms the Ten Commandments……

1. Paul teaches God's people keep the Sabbath Hebrews 4.
2. Paul tells gentiles that "what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of GOD" 1 Cor 7:19
3. Paul tells gentiles "it is not the HEARERS of the Law that are just before God but the DOERS of the Law will be justified... on the day when according to my GOSPEL God will judge all mankind" Rom 2:13-16
4. Paul asks that gentiles consider the doctrine of LAW "Do we then make void the LAW of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we establish the Law of God" Rom 3:31
5. Paul tells ALL Christians that it is only the lost who will "not subject themselves to the Law of God neither indeed CAN they" Rom 8:6-8
6 Paul reaches all Christians under the NEW Covenant that God's LAW as known in Jer 31:31-33 is "written on the heart and mind" Heb 8:7-11
7. Paul tells all Christians that the OT text is to be used for Doctrine 2Tim 3:16
AND He never claims that "if I did not write it -- it is not scripture for us today" -- as one or two have imagined for us.
8. Paul tells all Christians that the 5th commandment is the "FIRST commandment with a promise" Eph 6:1-2 and is binding on all Christians.
9. God's Law (10 commandments) are holy, just and good (Rom 7:12)
10. God's Law gives us a knowledge of what sin is (Rom 3:20; 7:7)
11. The penalty of breaking God's Law without Jesus is death (Rom 6:23)
12. If we break God's Law we dishonor God (Rom 2:23)
13. If we sin we are "under the Law" and guilty before God (Rom 3:19)
14. We are saved by faith but our faith establishes the Law in us (Rom 3:31)
15. If we are saved by grace we should not break God's Law (Rom 6:1-7)
16. We should not break God's Law if we are under grace (Rom 6:15)
17. We are to serve the Law of God through the mind because that is where sin starts (Rom 6:17; 7:25; 8:4; 12:2)
18. It is God's Law that brings us to Jesus (Gal 3:24)
19. God's salvation frees us from sin so we can be obedient to God's Law and live a life of holiness (Rom 6:22)
20. We will be judged by God's Law and only those that are obedient will be justified because of their faith (Rom 2:4-13)
21. God's Law can only be obeyed through love and a changed heart which comes by faith in God's Word (Rom 2:21-29; 13:9-10; Heb 8:9-10)
22. If we break God's Law and are in unrepentant sin we will be lost and will received God's judgements (Heb 10:26-27)

John affirms the 10 commandments……

1. John says it is only by keeping God’s 10 commandments that we know that we know God (1 John 2:3)
2. If someone says that they know God and do not keep God’s 10 commandments they are lying and not telling the truth (1 John 2:4)
3. We should purify ourselves as Jesus is pure (1 John 3:3)
4. Sin is the breaking of God’s 10 commandments (1 John 3:4)
5. Whoever is abiding in Christ does not commit sin (1 John 3:6; John 15:4-10)
6. If you are in unrepentant sin you have not seen Jesus or know him (1 John 3:6)
7. John warns us that only those that are obedience to God’s Law are his true followers (1 John 3:7)
8. If someone is committing unrepentant sin they are following the devil and not God (1 John 3:7)
9. If you are born of God and abiding in him you will not commit sin (1 John 3:9; 1 John 3:6; John 15:4-10
10. It is the keeping of God’s commandments that is the difference between those that are following God and those that are not following God (1 John 3:10; 1 John 5:3)
11. It is only by Love through faith that we can keep God’s commandments (1 John 5:3-4)
12. God’s true believers in the end days will keep all of God’s commandments through faith in Jesus (Rev 14:12; 22:14)

James also affirms the 10 commandments…….

1. James says God’s Law (10 commandments) are a Royal Law (James 2:8)
2. If we break one of God’s commandments we a guilty before God as sinners breaking all of God’s Law and gave some examples of breaking God’s Law (James 2:9-11)
3. James says God’s Law is a law of liberty and freedom (James 2:12)
4. The 10 commandments (God’s Law) are the standard in the judgment (James 2:12)
5. If our faith does not have the fruit of obedience to God’s Law it is dead and not true faith (James 2:16-26)

Peter affirms the 10 commandments……..

1. Sanctification is to obedience to God’s Law (1 Pet 1:2)
2. We can only be changed from sin to obedience to God’s Law by the power of God and it will be revealed in the last days (1 Pet 1:5)
3. We should give up our sins to be holy because Jesus is holy (1 Pet 1:13-16)
4. Jesus is your example who did no sin (1 Pet 2:21-22)
5. Cease from sin and do not live in the flesh (1 Pet 4:1-3)
6. Judgement will begin at the house of God and sinners (those breaking God’s 10 commandments) will not be saved.
7. God has given us his precious promises and as we believe them God will grant us his divine power to live a life of Godliness (obedience to God’s Law; 2 Pet 1:2-4)
8. The Un-Godly (disobedient to God’s Law) will be like Sodom and Gomorrah (2 Pet 2:6)
9. If any turn away from God’s Law and are in unrepentant sin breaking any of God’10 commandments they will be lost (2 Pet 2:20-22)
10 God is not willing that any should perish but that everyone should come to repentance and turn away from sin to follow God’s 10 commandments because those that do not will receive the judgements of God (2 Pet 3:5-14)

 

[LoveGodsWord]

What did Jesus and the Apostles teach about the Sabbath in the New Testament?

1. It is lawful to do good on the Sabbath (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56)
2. Jesus made the Sabbath for all mankind (Hebrews 1:2; John 1:1-3; 14; Ephesians 3:9; Colossians 1:16-17; Mark 2:27)
3. Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath (Mark 2:28)
4. If you do not believe and follow God you cannot enter His Sabbath rest (Hebrews 4)
5. It is one of God’s 10 commandments we break it we are guilty or breaking all (James 2:8-12)
6. Breaking it is sin (1 John 3:4)
7. God’s true followers keep it Holy as God commanded (Rev 14:12; Rev 22:14; Eze 20:20)
8. Jesus is our example and he kept the Sabbath (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56; John 2:6; Matt 16:24; 1 Cor 11:1; Eph 5:1-21; Pet 2:20-22)
9. The Apostle kept the Sabbath (Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4; Rev 1:10)

God’s Law in the NC is written on our hearts it is through love and it is love the fulfils God’s Law in us as we walk not after the flesh but after the spirit and is why Jesus says f you love me keep my commandments. (John 14:15; John 15:10). If we knowingly break one of God’s commandments we commit sin (1 John 3:4). This includes the 7th Day Sabbath which Jesus made for us and commands us to keep as a holy day.

In Christ Always!

 

[Jim Parker]

This includes the 7th Day Sabbath which Jesus made for us and commands us to keep as a holy day.

(1) There are 613 laws, not just 10. If you are going to keep the law then need to keep all 613 of them and forget about Christ being of any benefit to you.
Gal 5:4 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.

(2) Jesus was a Jew under the law and He preached to Jews who were also under the law.

(3) Jesus kept the Law BECAUSE He was a Jew.

(4) The 7th day Sabbath was given as a sign between Israel and God.
EX 31:14 " `Observe the Sabbath, ....... 17 It will be a sign between Me (God) and the Israelites forever
Keeping the Sabbath is for Jews, not for Gentiles.

(5) The CHRISTIAN Church has ALWAYS observed the First day of the week because on that day the Lord raised from the grave and saved mankind from the wages of sin which is death. Jesus' resurrection is the most important event in the history of the universe. It is the key to the Christian faith.
1Cor 15:13-17 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ has not been raised; if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is in vain and your faith is in vain. We are even found to be misrepresenting God, because we testified of God that he raised Christ, whom he did not raise if it is true that the dead are not raised. For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised. If Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile and you are still in your sins.

Gentiles were never required to keep the Law.
Acts 15:23-29
They wrote this letter by them:
The apostles, the elders, and the brethren,
To the brethren who are of the Gentiles in Antioch, Syria, and Cilicia:
Greetings.
Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying, “You must be circumcised and keep the law”—to whom we gave no such commandment— it seemed good to us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men to you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who will also report the same things by word of mouth. For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: that you abstain from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well.
Farewell.

Please read Paul's letter to the Galatians. (FIVE TIMES without stopping) It is a refutation of the notion that Christians must keep the law.

Gal 3:10-14 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.” But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for “the just shall live by faith.” Yet the law is not of faith, but “the man who does them shall live by them.”
Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree” that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

Gentiles are grafted into Israel by having the faith of Abraham and receiving the blessing of Abraham through faith, not by keeping the Law.

If you are preaching that Christians must keep the law then you are preaching a different gospel than that found in the Bible.
Paul said that such preachers are accursed.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Hi Jim, so nice to meet you here and hope you are well.

Thanks for your comments. Just leaving some comments for your consideration below. I might have to make a few posts to cover everything in your post however.

(1) There are 613 laws, not just 10. If you are going to keep the law then need to keep all 613 of them and forget about Christ being of any benefit to you.

Jim do you know what the Old Covenant is, what it is made up of and what makes it different to the NEW Covenant?

What is the purpose of God’s LAW (10 commandments) and the Mosaic laws written in the book of Moses in your view?

These are important questions because if you do not know what the Old Covenant is you will not understand what the NEW Covenant is and if you do not know what the NEW Covenant is you will not understand what the Gospel is.

Look forward to hearing back from you on the above questions.

Gal 5:4 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.

Love the scripture here but not sure why it is that you have posted it? No one is saying to anyone that we are justified by the works of the LAW. We are saved by GRACE through FAITH and not of ourselves it is a GIFT of GOD and not of WORKS lest any man should boast (Ephesians 2:8).

However if your FAITH does not have the FRUIT of OBEDIENCE then God’s WORD tells us our FAITH is dead and we are still in our SINS and do not KNOW him who loves us (James 2:18; 20; 26; 1 John 3:6-8)

(2) Jesus was a Jew under the law and He preached to Jews who were also under the law. (3) Jesus kept the Law BECAUSE He was a Jew.

Yes Jesus was a Jew but in the NEW Covenant God’s Israel are those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW the WORD of GOD. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness (2Ti 3:16) and we are to LIVE by EVERY WORD that proceeds out of the MOUTH of God (Matthew 4:4) When we become BELIEVERS and FOLLOWERS of God’s WORD we become a part of God’s ISRAEL

Who are Israel?

Let’s have a look at the scriptures……..

"Israel" is only a name given by God himself to represent his people. The origin of the name "Israel" come from Genesis 32:28 where Jacob wrestled with the Angel and prevailed ...for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed. Its meaning is his posterity will rule as God. Jacob had 12 sons representing the 12 tribes of Israel.

Israel is only a name given by God that represents God's people and today anyone who is following Jesus is part of God's Israel according to God's Word.

What does God's Word say.....................................…

Let God be true and every man a liar that thou might be justified in thy sayings, and might overcome when thou art judged.

Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He says not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, AND TO YOUR SEED, WHICH IS CHRIST (Galatians 3:16)

Abraham’s seed is Israel............................................

THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: FOR YOU ALL ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS AND IF YOU BE CHRISTS, THEN YOU ARE ABRAHAM'S SEED FOR YOU ARE ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS and IF YOU BE CHRISTS, THEN ARE YOU ABRAHAM'S SEED, AND HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE PROMISE (Galatians 3:28).

No explanation needed, believe God's Word, and again..........................

FOR THEY ARE NOT ALL ISRAEL WHICH ARE OF ISRAEL,: NEITHER, BECAUSE THEY ARE THE SEED OF ABRAHAM, ARE THEY ALL CHILDREN: but in Isaac shall thy seed be called <Christ> That is, THEY WHICH ARE THE CHILDREN OF THE FLESH, THESE ARE NOT THE CHILDREN OF GOD: BUT THE CHILDREN OF THE PROMISE <those who believe> ARE COUNTED FOR THE SEED (Romans 9:6).

FOR HE IS NOT A JEW WHICH IS ONE OUTWARDLY; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OUTWARDS IN THE FLESH: BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; and CIRCUMCISION IS OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT, AND NOT IN THE LETTER; whose praise is not of men, but of God. (Romans 2:28-29)

and again...................

Galatians 3:28-29,
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Colossians 3:11,
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

Romans 10:11-13,
For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Romans 2:28-29,
For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

The New Covenant is for God's Israel..........................

Jeremiah 31:33-4,
But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, says the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, says the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

Hebrews 8:10-12,
For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

Hebrews 10:14-17,
For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, this is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; and their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

Galatians 3:29,
And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise

The New Covenant is for God's Israel which represent God’s followers the believers. If you are not part of God's Israel you are not part of the New Covenant (Hebrews 8:10-12).

God's Israel are those that believe the Word of God and follow it and is why Jesus says If you love me keep my commandments (John 14:15)

(4) The 7th day Sabbath was given as a sign between Israel and God.
EX 31:14 " `Observe the Sabbath, ....... 17 It will be a sign between Me (God) and the Israelites forever
Keeping the Sabbath is for Jews, not for Gentiles.

Already answered above with New Covenant scripture. God’s Israel in the NEW Covenant are those that BELIEVE and FOLLOW God’s WORD. (Gal 3:27-28 see above too many scriptures) The scripture you quoted also says it is a SIGN FOREVER.

(5) The CHRISTIAN Church has ALWAYS observed the First day of the week because on that day the Lord raised from the grave and saved mankind from the wages of sin which is death. Jesus' resurrection is the most important event in the history of the universe. It is the key to the Christian faith.

Many do indeed OBSERVE the first day of the week in honor of Jesus resurrection. Yet there is no scriptures in God’s Word that tell us that God’s 4th commandments has been ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to Keep Sunday in its place. What you will find however that this is a man-made tradition and teaching that has been handed down to you by the Catholic Church and Protestantism of today.

continued.....

 

[LoveGodsWord]

1Cor 15:13-17 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ has not been raised; if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is in vain and your faith is in vain. We are even found to be misrepresenting God, because we testified of God that he raised Christ, whom he did not raise if it is true that the dead are not raised. For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised. If Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile and you are still in your sins.

I love the scripture Jim, is there a reason why you have quoted this?

Gentiles were never required to keep the Law.
Acts 15:23-29 They wrote this letter by them: The apostles, the elders, and the brethren,
To the brethren who are of the Gentiles in Antioch, Syria, and Cilicia: Greetings.
Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying, “You must be circumcised and keep the law”—to whom we gave no such commandment— it seemed good to us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men to you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who will also report the same things by word of mouth. For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: that you abstain from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.

This is why I was asking a little earlier do you know what the OLD Covenant is and what makes up the Old Covenant and if you understand what the purpose of the Old Covenant laws are. Many get the Mosaic laws mixed up with God’s LAW. We can discuss this more latter. For now let’s look at the scripture you quoted here in a little more detail……..

Acts 15
1, And certain men which came down from Judea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved <The controversy is that if you are not circumcised after the law of Moses you cannot be saved>.
2, When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question.
3, And being brought on their way by the church, they passed through Phenice and Samaria, declaring the conversion of the Gentiles: and they caused great joy unto all the brethren.
4, And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.
5, But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
6, And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.
7, And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
8, And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
9, And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
10, Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
19, Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God: <New converts do not need to be circumcised after the law of Moses>
20, But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
21, For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath day <the new converts will learn more because the scriptures are read in the synagogues every Sabbath>.
22, Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren:
23, And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia:
24, Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment: <what law are we referring to? The law of Moses; circumcision>

As mentioned above already the Mosaic laws (not God's Law; 10 commandments) that were the cure for sin in the Old Covenant pointing to Jesus have been done away. They were shadows that pointed to Jesus and were fulfilled at the cross. For example with circumcision...........................

Romans 2
28, For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29, But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Now let’s look at the interpretation of Acts 15 where you state;

Gentiles were never required to keep the Law

Now we have shown above already that the CONTEXT of Acts 15 is referring to CIRCUMCISSION as a REQUIREMENT for SALVATION. Circumcision is a requirement under the law of Moses. In fact God’s LAW is not mentioned except for Idolatry as a requirement for the new Gentile converts. WHY? Because Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath day v21

This chapter has nothing to do with Gentiles not obeying God’s LAW (10 commandments) it is about CIRCUMCSION in the Mosaic law being a REQUIREMENT for SALVATION v1-5

You state the above because none of God's Law (10 commandments) are mentioned that the Gentiles do not need to follow them. So Jim, if you follow this view through to its logical conclusion, Gentile believers can go kill, steal, covet murder and break all of God’s commandments as long as they abstain from things contaminated by idols and from fornication and from what is strangled and from blood v20. I am sure you do not believe this, do you Jim? God’s WORD certainly does not teach this as it says those who are living a life of KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN will not enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN because those who are practicing SIN have rejected the GIFT of God’s dear son (Hebrews 10:26-27).

Please read Paul's letter to the Galatians. (FIVE TIMES without stopping) It is a refutation of the notion that Christians must keep the law.
Gal 3:10-14 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.” But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for “the just shall live by faith.” Yet the law is not of faith, but “the man who does them shall live by them.”
Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree” that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

Yes thanks for sharing Jim but I also believe we do not keep God’s LAW (10 commandments) to be saved. No one is saying to anyone that we are justified by the works of the LAW. We are saved by GRACE through FAITH and not of ourselves it is a GIFT of GOD and not of WORKS lest any man should boast (Ephesians 2:8).

However if your FAITH does not have the FRUIT of OBEDIENCE then God’s WORD tells us our FAITH is dead and we are still in our SINS and do not KNOW him who loves us (James 2:18; 20; 26; 1 John 3:6-8)

Gentiles are grafted into Israel by having the faith of Abraham and receiving the blessing of Abraham through faith, not by keeping the Law.

Ditto; IF your FAITH does not have the FRUIT of OBEDIENCE then God’s WORD tells us our FAITH is dead and we are still in our SINS and do not KNOW him who loves us (James 2:18; 20; 26; 1 John 3:6-8)

If you are preaching that Christians must keep the law then you are preaching a different gospel than that found in the Bible.
Paul said that such preachers are accursed.

What is being shared through God’s Word is that RIGHTEOUSNESS is by FAITH. If you do not have the FRUIT of OBEDEINCE your tree will be cast down and thrown into the Fire.

Hope this is helpful. Please forgive my slow replies here as I am not that active here but will pop in as time permits.

May God bless you as you seek him who loves all through His Word.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

God's Law (10 commandments) in the New Testament (Covenant)

1. You shall have no other gods before Me.
It is written: You shall worship the Lord your God and Him only you shall serve. (Luke 4:8; Matthew 4:10; Revelation 14:7)

2. You must not make for yourself a carved image, a likeness of anything in heaven, on earth, or under the sea.
God is Spirit and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth. (John 4:24; Acts 15:20; 1 Corinthians 6:9; Ephesians 5:5; 1 Peter 4:3; 1 John 5:21; Revelation 2:14)

3. You shall not take the Name of the Lord your God in vain.
(1 Timothy 6:1, James 2:7)

4. Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
The Sabbath [seventh day] was made for man, not man for the Sabbath, so the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath. (Mark 2:27-28, Hebrews 4; Matthew 12:8; Matthew 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56(Mark 2:28; Matthew 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56; John 2:6; Matthew 16:24; 1 Corinthians 11:1; Ephesians 5:1-21; 1 Peter 2:20-22; Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4; Revelations 1:10 Is binding on all mankind today COL 2:14-17 THE REAL TRUTH THREAD (Linked)

5. Honour your father and mother.
Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right. (Ephesians 6:1; Colossians 3:20; Matthew 15:4; Matthew 19:19)

6. You shall not murder.
I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. (Matthew 5:44-45; Matt. 5:21-26; Romans 13:9; 1 Timothy 1:9; 1 John 3:15; James 2:11; Matthew 19:18)

7. You shall not commit adultery.
I say to you whoever even looks at another in lust has already committed adultery in their heart. (Matthew 5:28, 1 Cor. 5:11, 1 Cor. 6:18, Galatians 5:19, Hebrews 13:4, James 2:11, Matthew 19:19, Romans 13:9)

8. You shall not steal.
Neither thieves, the greedy, or drunkards and robbers will inherit the Kingdom. (1 Corinthians 6:10, Romans 2:21, Mark 7:21, Ephesians 4:28, Romans 13:9, Matthew 19:18)

9. You shall not bear false witness.
For by your words, you will be justified and by your words you will be condemned. (Matthew 15:19, Ephesians 4:25, Col. 3:9; Matthew 19:18, Romans 13:9)

10. You shall not covet your neighbours possessions.
Take heed and beware of covetousness, for one’s life does not consist of the things he possesses. (Luke 12:15, Romans 7:7, Ephesians 5:3, 1 Tim. 6:10, Hebrews 13:5, Romans 13:9)

...........................

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?

May God bless you as you seek him through His Word.

 

[th1b.taylor]

The Ten Commandments and the New Covenant

God's Law (10 commandments) in the New Testament

1 You shall have no other gods before Me.
It is written: You shall worship the Lord your God and Him only you shall serve. (Luke 4:8; Matthew 4:10; Revelation 14:7)

2 You must not make for yourself a carved image, a likeness of anything in heaven, on earth, or under the sea.
God is Spirit and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth. (John 4:24; Acts 15:20; 1 Corinthians 6:9; Ephesians 5:5; 1 Peter 4:3; 1 John 5:21; Revelation 2:14)

3 You shall not take the Name of the Lord your God in vain.
(1 Timothy 6:1, James 2:7)

4 Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
The Sabbath [seventh day] was made for man, not man for the Sabbath, so the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath. (Mark 2:27-28, Hebrews 4; Matthew 12:8; Matthew 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56(Mark 2:28; Matthew 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56; John 2:6; Matthew 16:24; 1 Corinthians 11:1; Ephesians 5:1-21; 1 Peter 2:20-22; Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4; Revelations 1:10 Is binding on all mankind today COL 2:14-17 THE REAL TRUTH THREAD (Linked)

5 Honour your father and mother.
Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right. (Ephesians 6:1; Colossians 3:20; Matthew 15:4; Matthew 19:19)

6 You shall not murder.
I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. (Matthew 5:44-45; Matt. 5:21-26; Romans 13:9; 1 Timothy 1:9; 1 John 3:15; James 2:11; Matthew 19:18)

7 You shall not commit adultery.
I say to you whoever even looks at another in lust has already committed adultery in their heart. (Matthew 5:28, 1 Cor. 5:11, 1 Cor. 6:18, Galatians 5:19, Hebrews 13:4, James 2:11, Matthew 19:19, Romans 13:9)

8 You shall not steal.
Neither thieves, the greedy, or drunkards and robbers will inherit the Kingdom. (1 Corinthians 6:10, Romans 2:21, Mark 7:21, Ephesians 4:28, Romans 13:9, Matthew 19:18)

9 You shall not bear false witness.
For by your words, you will be justified and by your words you will be condemned. (Matthew 15:19, Ephesians 4:25, Col. 3:9; Matthew 19:18, Romans 13:9)

10 You shall not covet your neighbours possessions.
Take heed and beware of covetousness, for one’s life does not consist of the things he possesses. (Luke 12:15, Romans 7:7, Ephesians 5:3, 1 Tim. 6:10, Hebrews 13:5, Romans 13:9)

...........................

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?

May God bless you as you seek him through His Word.

I would love it if people would study to learn because they do believe that that using the Ten Laws God gave us demands we also live with the other 603, made by men, must be, strictly, observed also and that isjust not true.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I would love it if people would study to learn because they do believe that that using the Ten Laws God gave us demands we also live with the other 603, made by men, must be, strictly, observed also and that isjust not true.

Good point Bill,

Thanks for sharing. I believe as you most likely do as well that all scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness (2 Tim 3:16) and we are to live by every word of God (Matt 4:4). There is an OLD Covenant and a NEW Covenant. Many do not understand the OLD so find it difficult to understand the NEW because they have been taught something different from others. I believe spritual things are spiritually discerned and we can only KNOW and FIND the truth as we seek it in FAITH and follow it asking Jesus through the Word of God and that is where we need to point all because it is ONLY in the Word of God that anyone can FIND Jesus and KNOW him as they seek him through HIS Spirit.

Following man made teachings and traditions can lead one away from God's Word and His truth. This was something that Jesus also talks about and shared with the people in His day.....

Matthew 15
3, But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
4, For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.
5, But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;
6, And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.
7, Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,
8, This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.
9, But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

These are interesting scriptures and says quite a bit..................

v1 We can transgress God's LAW by following man made traditions
v6 Making the commandment of God of no effect
v8 Breaking God's commandments is and profession to follow God is only lips service to God with no change of heart
v9 We are NOT following God's Word if we follow man made traditions that break God's commandments

.........................

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

IN times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men every where to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?

Something to pray about. Thanks for sharing your thoughts

God bless you as you continue in His Word

 

[Jim Parker]

Jim do you know what the Old Covenant is, what it is made up of and what makes it different to the NEW Covenant?

I think that after 7 years of seminary I have a pretty good handle on it.

What is the purpose of God’s LAW (10 commandments) and the Mosaic laws written in the book of Moses in your view?

The 10 commandments are PART of, NOT separate from, the Law.

You are professing that Christians must keep the law.
That is false.

Eph 2:14-16 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.

Rom 10:1-4 Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel for I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

Rom 8:3-4 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

Rom 13:8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law.
https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/gal/5/14/s_1096014
Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”

Col 2:16-17 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.

No Christian is required to keep the Sabbath.

We celebrate the resurrection of Christ by which he destroyed the power of the devil who, through sin, caused man to die. Because Christ became man, died and rose again, no one will remain in the grave. All will be raised.

(hmmmmm - I can't make the bold type go away....)

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Hi Jim, nice to see you again. Hope you are well today?

LoveGodsWord said: ↑
Jim do you know what the Old Covenant is, what it is made up of and what makes it different to the NEW Covenant?

I think that after 7 years of seminary I have a pretty good handle on it.

Thats great Jim. Sounds like you are very learned spending all that time at college studying God's Word. As for me I am not learned like you studying God's Word at college. I do LOVE God's Word however, and pray and study for myself asking Jesus at home so please forgive me if I seem a little slow sometimes .

So what does the OLD Covenant mean in your view? What makes up the Old Covenant and what is the purpose of God's LAW (10 commandments) and the Mosaic laws written in the book od Moses under the Old covenant?

The 10 commandments are PART of, NOT separate from, the Law.

Really Jim? If that were true, why do you think God asked Moses to keep his 10 commandments separated from the Mosaic book of the law and did not add anything else to the 10 commandments and why did he bother making them and speaking them himself? (Exodus 31:18; 40:20; Deuteronomy 10:1-2; Deuteronomy 31:26; 5:22)

You are professing that Christians must keep the law. That is false.

Jim this is not true my friend. As I mentioned in my earlier post you may have missed it, I am not the best writer sometimes. I believe we are saved by GRACE through FAITH and not of ourselves or WORKS lest any man should boast (Ephesians 2:8)

However if your FAITH does not have the FRUIT of OBEDIENCE then you are still in your SINS because your FAITH is dead and do not yet KNOW him who LOVES you (James 2:18; 20; 26; 1 John 3:3-9)

RIGHTEOUSNESS by FAITH is to be MADE Righteous by FAITH in the WORD of GOD. It is BEING FREE from SIN to LOVE him who FIRST LOVED US and is why Jesus says if you LOVE me keep my commandments because LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW in those who WALK in His Spirit. (Romans 1:17; 3:22; Philipians 3:9; Hebrews 11:7; John 8:31-36; Romans 13:8-10; Romans 8:1-4)

Eph 2:14-16 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.

Jim I love all the scriptures you quoted below they are some of my favourites in there. Seems we have a lot in common. I will add some comments next to each scripture below.

Eph 2:14-16 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.

You choose to use this verse to mean God's LAW (10 commandments) are ABOLISHED right?

The Greek word for ordinances (I highlighted in the verse above) in this verse is the same word used in Colossians 2:14 that refers to what was nailed to the cross. Paul reveals in Colossians 2:16 that these ordinances had “meat and drink offerings,” “holy feast days,” “monthly new moon festivals” and “yearly sacrificial Sabbaths” that Ezekiel 45:17 ever so plainly reveals that this is what was practiced to make reconciliation for sin. In other words, the sacrificial law, which was part of the Mosaic Law. The Ten Commandments were written in the Ten Commandments while the Mosaic Law was written in the Mosaic Law.

Here is what the Strong's and Thayer dictionaries state on the Greek word dogma for ordinances used in this verse. "ORDINANCE" G1378 δόγμα dogma dog'-mah From the base of G1380; which means; civil, ceremonial or ecclesiastical law: - decree; Thayer Ordinance; dogma dog'-mah From the base of G1380 rules and requirements of the law of Moses.

As you can see, there is not so much as a hint of the Ten Commandments being mentioned. Strong's effectively labelled it the ceremonial law while the Thayer dictionary was even clearer stating it was the rules and requirements of the law of Moses. The ordinances are also called the Law of Moses. I have a more detailed study on this I will put it up as a thread latter on looking at dogma and Colossains 2:14-17. It would be nice to have some of your input being learned and all.

And here is another example for even more clarity. Before the cross in the Old Covenant there were both the Ten Commandments and the Ordinances as also seen from Luke 1:6 that alone proves they are not the same thing.

Luke 1
6, And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the COMMANDMENTS and ORDINANCES of the Lord blameless.

Hebrews 9:1-2 below states that the Old (first) Covenant also had ordinances and hence is clarifying that the New Covenant does not. And if the Old Covenant “had also” which means in addition to something. Then what is left? See Luke 1:6 again for the obvious answer. So to ask an obvious question.

Do these two verses refer to the moral law or the sacrificial law?

Note that the “worldly sanctuary” in verse 1 and “the candlestick, and the table, and the showbread; which is called the sanctuary” in verse 2 unmistakably belong to the temple or sanctuary which is where the animal sacrifices were carried out and hence the sacrificial law and not the moral law.

Hebrews 9:1-2
“Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary. 2 For there was a tabernacle made; the first, wherein was the candlestick, and the table, and the showbread; which is called the sanctuary.”

And a little bit further into the chapter the author makes reference to the ordinances again and the meat and drink offerings Paul speaks of in Colossians 2:14. Note in verse 12 it says, “Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place.” I am sure it requires no explanation that this is not referring to the Ten Commandments but to blood sacrifices for sin which are the ordinances as stated in verse 1 and 10.

Hebrews 9:10-12
“Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation. 11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building; 12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.”

Ok sorry spent too much time on that one but it will set the scene for the rest of the scriptures you quote below.

to be continued......

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Rom 10:1-4 Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel for I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

Yes Christ is the end of the LAW not meaning God's LAW (10 commandments) is ABOLISHED because if God's LAW was abolished there would be NO KNOWLEDGE of SIN (Romans 3:20) If there was no knowledge of SIN there would be no need for a Savior as no one would know they are SINNERS. IF we have no need of a Savior then we have no salvation. If we have NO Salvation then we are LOST and still IN our SINS.

What the scripture is talking about is that God's LAW brings us to Jesus. It shows us who we are because God's LAW is the standard of SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS. It is the KNOWLEDGE of Good and Evil. It shows us that we are ALL SINNERS in need of a Savior and as the scriptures say.......

Romans 3:19
Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

God's LAW is our school master that leads us to Christ that we might be justified by FAITH that is the meaning of Christ being the END of the LAW it means the God's LAW brings the SINNER to the CROSS

You cannot separate God's LAW (10 commandments) from GRACE the one leads to the other.

GOD'S LAW (10 commandments) KNOWLEDGE of SIN >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CHRIST (end)

Christ is the END of the LAW the one leads to the other. The scripture does NOT say God's LAW is abolished which is how you are interpreting it.

continued............

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Rom 8:3-4 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

Absolutely, but keep in mind God only gives the Holy Spirit to those who OBEY and FOLLOW him by FAITH

Acts 5
32, And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.

If anyone is still in their SINS they have neither SEEN Him or know him (1 John 3:6-8)

Rom 13:8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law.

Absolutely I will share some more on this latter. LOVE is the Fulfilling of God's LAW in those who by FAITH walk in his Spirit. (Romans 13:8-10). Once again however the scriptures say if anyone is still in SIN they are not free to LOVE another and do not KNOW God and is why Jesus says If you LOVE me KEEP my commandments (John 14:15; 15:10)

Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”

Ditto as above..

continued.........

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Col 2:16-17 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.

This one has been partly addressed in the first scripture you posted from Ephesians 2. I will make a more detailed thread in relation to these few scriptures latter when I get some time.

Here is a summarized version.........

(1) CONTEXT of COL 2:16 is v14. is talking about the Mosaic laws for remission of sin that were shadows pointing to Jesus; not the ten commandments of God’s Law. Nowhere are the 10 commandments mentioned in Col chapter 2.

v11-13 Shadows of Mosaic laws of circumcision of the new heart in Christ....

14, BLOTTING OUT < G1813 ἐξαλείφω exaleipho (ex-a-lei'-fō) v. means to rub out, i.e. obliterate, erase> the HANDWRITING < G5498 χειρόγραφον cheirographon (chei-ro'-gra-fon) n. means something
hand-written (“chirograph”), i.e. a manuscript specially, a legal document > of ORDINANCES < G1378 δόγμα dogma (d̮og'-ma) n. means ordinance; civil, ceremonial or ecclesiastical > that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

v20, Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances, v21, Touch not; taste not; handle not; v22, Which all are to perish with the using; after the commandments and doctrines of men?

CONTEXT of the chapter is the CEREMONIAL Mosaic laws for remission of sin that are shadows pointing to Jesus and nailed to the cross with our sins.

This is further highlighted that at the death of Jesus the temple vail was torn in two meaning the END of the Mosaic ceremonial laws for remission of SINS as these were fulfilled in Christ (Matthew 27:51).

Further proof that Col 2:16 is talking about the annual Jewish festivals and Mosaic laws for remission of sin? Let’s look at the subject matter of v16

(2) SUBJECT MATTER OF v16 is (1) meat, or in drink, or in (2) respect of an holyday, or of the (3) new moon, or of the (4) sabbath days (plural)

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in (1) meat, or in drink, or in (2) respect of an holyday, or of the (3) new moon, or of the (4) sabbath days (plural):

Compare Col 2:16 with the annual Jewish festivals from the Mosic laws for remission of sin...

Ezekiel 45
17, And it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and (1) meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the (2) feasts, and in the (3) new moons, and in the sabbaths <Plural>, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.
18, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the first month, in the first day of the month, thou shalt take a young bullock without blemish, and cleanse the sanctuary:
19, And the priest shall take of the blood of the sin offering, and put it upon the posts of the house, and upon the four corners of the settle of the altar, and upon the posts of the gate of the inner court.
20, And so thou shalt do the seventh day of the month for every one that erreth, and for him that is simple: so shall ye reconcile the house.
21, In the first month, in the fourteenth day of the month, ye shall have the (2) passover, a feast of seven days; unleavened bread shall be eaten.

All CONTEXT and points 1-4 match perfectly to the Annual Jewish festivals detailed in both scriptures; also detailed in Leviticus 23; (1) meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the (2) feasts, and in the (3) new moons, and in the sabbaths <Plural>

So it is very clear the Col 2:16 is in reference to the annual Jewish Festivals from the Mosaic laws for remission of sin NOT God's 4th commandment....

Now we have already shown that the CONTEXT of Col 2 is discussing the Mosaic ceremonial laws for remission of sin written in the book of Moses as being the Shadows pointing to Christ. It is NO WHERE talking about God’s 10 commandments in the whole chapter.

Let's focus now on the last part of v16 Sabbath days.

The root or base word for Sabbath comes from the Hebrew word for RESTED H7673. Let’s start with the Hebrew word meaning for Sabbath…..

Genesis 2:1-3; RESTED which is in reference to the 7th day of the creation week meaning H7673 שָׁבַת shabath (shaw-ɓath') v. to repose, i.e. to cease from exertion. KJV: (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep (sabbath), suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.

The commandment H7676 means from one Sabbath to the next Sabbath is to be RESTED cease from work on the 7th day of the Week…..

Exodus 20:8-11; SABBATH meaning H7676 שַׁבָּת shabbath (shab-bawth') n-e. 1. intermission, a period of temporary rest. 2. (specifically) the Sabbath, the seventh day being the day of rest.
[intensive from H7673] KJV: (+ every) sabbath. Root(s): H7673


Leviticus 23: 3; 24; 32 SABBATH and RESTED separate or together meaning H7677 שׁבּתון shabbâthôn shab-baw-thone' From H7676; a sabbatism or special holiday: - rest, sabbath.

So the base meaning of Sabbath in the Hebrew is to rest from work (Gen) the commandment is every 7th day rest from work and THEN WE HAVE THE SPECIAL FESTIVAL SABBATH(S) <more than one> OF THE MOSIAC ANNUAL FEAST LAWS, THAT WERE NOT THE 7TH DAY SABBATH OF THE 4th COMMANDMENT AND COULD FALL ON ANY DAY OF THE WEEK. (John 19:31 see also High Sabbaths Wiki)

So very clearly Col 2 and v16 is referring to the ceremonial Mosaic laws for remission of sin which includes annual festival Sabbath’s <plural as there is more than one of them linked to different festivals> that can fall on any day of the week; New Moons and Meat and Drink offering’s which are all linked in context to the Jewish annual festivals.

Col 2 is not talking about God's LAW (10 commandments) and is not talking about God's 4th commandment. It is talking about the Mosaic Shadow laws written in the book of Moses that are fulfilled in Christ. It is why we no longer do animal sacrifices etc.

continued......

 

[LoveGodsWord]

No Christian is required to keep the Sabbath. We celebrate the resurrection of Christ by which he destroyed the power of the devil who, through sin, caused man to die. Because Christ became man, died and rose again, no one will remain in the grave. All will be raised.

Really Jim? Where does it say in God's WORD that God's 4th commandment has been ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day?

The scriptures say all who continue in KNOWN UNREPENTANT SIN will perish in SIN because they refuse the gift of God's dear son (Romans 6:23; Hebrews 10:26-27; 6:4-8)

(hmmmmm - I can't make the bold type go away....)

Jim nice chatting to you please forgive my slow replies as I may not be as active here as I would like but I will try and pop in as I can. I enjoy our discussions very much. Sometimes I have the same problem with the formatting try using Ctrl key and B (bold) I (italic) etc. If you still have problems hit the advanced button or preview button then will refresh the screen and give you formatting access.

Hope this helps.
......................
IN times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men every where to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word ofGod?

 

[Jim Parker]

pending all that time at college studying God's Word.

Seminary studies are pursued after college. They are graduate studies.

What makes up the Old Covenant and what is the purpose of God's LAW (10 commandments) and the Mosaic laws written in the book od Moses under the Old covenant?

The Old Covenant is the Law. (all 613)
The purpose of the Law is to lead us to Christ. (Gal 3;24)

(1) why do you think God asked Moses to keep his 10 commandments separated from (2) the Mosaic book of the law and did not add anything else to the 10 commandments and why did he bother making them and speaking them himself?

(1) Scripture does not say.
(2) It;s not "the Mosaic book." Moses did not come up with those laws; God did. As you read through Exodus, Leviticus and Deuteronomy you will find that God gave every one of the 613 commands, ordinances, statutes, and laws to mMoses. Moses did not make up ANY of them.
Deu 4:1-2 Now, O Israel, listen to the statutes and the judgments which I teach you to observe, that you may live, and go in and possess the land which the LORD God of your fathers is giving you. You shall not add to the word which I command you, nor take from it, that you may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.

The notion (commonly expounded by 7th Day Adventists) that the 10 commandments are the law that God gave and the rest are rules that Moses made up is false.

 

[Jim Parker]

Where does it say in God's WORD that God's 4th commandment has been ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day?

Have you not read what I posted to you?
Col 2:16-17 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.

Eph 2:14-15 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,

Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

Rom 7:6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.

The Sabbath is a sign between Old Testament Israel and God.
EX 31:14 " `Observe the Sabbath, because it is holy to you. (God was speaking to Israel; there were no Christians then.)....17 It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested.' "

I am a Gentile and I am not under the Law. I am not required to keep the Law.
The apostles and leaders of the Jerusalem Church said so. It's part of scripture.
The Sabbath is a holy day for OT Israel, not for NT Christians.
If you insist on keeping the Law then you must keep ALL of the Law, all 613 laws. You can't.
The day of Christ's resurrection is observed by CHRISTIANS because, without His resurrection, we would still be dead in our sins.
I have already provided you with the citations in my previous posts.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Seminary studies are pursued after college. They are graduate studies.

Thats great Jim sounds like you are a real scholar.

Although, I must admit, I am having some trouble trying to understand your interpretation of the scriptures as they seem to contradict other scriptures in God's Word and you seem to be quite reluctant to answer my questions or only providing part answers for some reason I am not sure why, or do you want to address the posts and scriptures I send to you disagreeing with your interpretation of the scriptures.

How can you say the scripture does not say this or that when I provide scriptures to you that says the things you say they are not saying. As a scholar should you not at least try and address the posts and the scriptures shared with you and adress the questions asked of you?

Well that is how I thought a conversation goes anyways.

Now you ask me a question saying did I not read what you posted to me. Yet you can see I read what you posted and replied to what you posted section by section with questions and also supplied a rebuttal of your interpretation of the scriptures and adressed each section with a detailed reply from the scriptures showing why it is I do not agree with your interpreation of the scirptures.

I provided scriptures for each rebuttal but you ignore the scriprtures sent to you which seem to be saying the opposite of what you are claiming and just try and re-post the same scriptures.

Should you not in turn reply to the scriptures I have provided showing you why your interpretation is not correct?

Now, just ignoring all the scriptures posted along with all the questions will not make them magically go away because you do not wish to answer them or believe they exist. Only God's Wors is true my friend and we should believe and follow it.
.........................

There is not one scripture in ALL of God's WORD that says God's 4th commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to worship God on Sunday in it's place. This is a tradition and teaching of man that has been handed down to the Protestant Churches by the Roman Catholic Church

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

IN times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men every where to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word ofGod?

 

[JLB]

WHAT DID JESUS AND THE APOSTLES TEACH ABOUT GOD’S LAW
(the scriptures below are no where near exhaustive)

Jesus taught the 10 commandments…..

1. Jesus kept God’s Law (10 commandments) and said the Law and the prophets would not pass away (Matt 5:17-18)
2. Jesus taught others to follow the 10 commandments (Mark 10:17-21)
3. Jesus taught that Love is the fulfilling (doing) of God’s Law (10 commandments Matt 22:36-40)
4. If we break God’s Law by following man-made traditions we are not following God (Matt 15:3-9)
5. Jesus says if we commit sin we are a servant of sin and he has come to free us from sin (John 8:32-36)
6. Jesus taught if you love God you will keep God’s Law and abide in His Love (John 14:15; 15:10
7. If anyone is breaking any of God’s commandments and teaching others to do so will be called least in the kingdom of heaven <least = lost> (Matt 5:19)
8. No one can obey God’s Law producing the fruit of obedience of ourselves and unless we abide in Jesus we can do nothing (John 15:4-10)

Paul affirms the Ten Commandments……

1. Paul teaches God's people keep the Sabbath Hebrews 4.
2. Paul tells gentiles that "what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of GOD" 1 Cor 7:19
3. Paul tells gentiles "it is not the HEARERS of the Law that are just before God but the DOERS of the Law will be justified... on the day when according to my GOSPEL God will judge all mankind" Rom 2:13-16
4. Paul asks that gentiles consider the doctrine of LAW "Do we then make void the LAW of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we establish the Law of God" Rom 3:31
5. Paul tells ALL Christians that it is only the lost who will "not subject themselves to the Law of God neither indeed CAN they" Rom 8:6-8
6 Paul reaches all Christians under the NEW Covenant that God's LAW as known in Jer 31:31-33 is "written on the heart and mind" Heb 8:7-11
7. Paul tells all Christians that the OT text is to be used for Doctrine 2Tim 3:16
AND He never claims that "if I did not write it -- it is not scripture for us today" -- as one or two have imagined for us.
8. Paul tells all Christians that the 5th commandment is the "FIRST commandment with a promise" Eph 6:1-2 and is binding on all Christians.
9. God's Law (10 commandments) are holy, just and good (Rom 7:12)
10. God's Law gives us a knowledge of what sin is (Rom 3:20; 7:7)
11. The penalty of breaking God's Law without Jesus is death (Rom 6:23)
12. If we break God's Law we dishonor God (Rom 2:23)
13. If we sin we are "under the Law" and guilty before God (Rom 3:19)
14. We are saved by faith but our faith establishes the Law in us (Rom 3:31)
15. If we are saved by grace we should not break God's Law (Rom 6:1-7)
16. We should not break God's Law if we are under grace (Rom 6:15)
17. We are to serve the Law of God through the mind because that is where sin starts (Rom 6:17; 7:25; 8:4; 12:2)
18. It is God's Law that brings us to Jesus (Gal 3:24)
19. God's salvation frees us from sin so we can be obedient to God's Law and live a life of holiness (Rom 6:22)
20. We will be judged by God's Law and only those that are obedient will be justified because of their faith (Rom 2:4-13)
21. God's Law can only be obeyed through love and a changed heart which comes by faith in God's Word (Rom 2:21-29; 13:9-10; Heb 8:9-10)
22. If we break God's Law and are in unrepentant sin we will be lost and will received God's judgements (Heb 10:26-27)

John affirms the 10 commandments……

1. John says it is only by keeping God’s 10 commandments that we know that we know God (1 John 2:3)
2. If someone says that they know God and do not keep God’s 10 commandments they are lying and not telling the truth (1 John 2:4)
3. We should purify ourselves as Jesus is pure (1 John 3:3)
4. Sin is the breaking of God’s 10 commandments (1 John 3:4)
5. Whoever is abiding in Christ does not commit sin (1 John 3:6; John 15:4-10)
6. If you are in unrepentant sin you have not seen Jesus or know him (1 John 3:6)
7. John warns us that only those that are obedience to God’s Law are his true followers (1 John 3:7)
8. If someone is committing unrepentant sin they are following the devil and not God (1 John 3:7)
9. If you are born of God and abiding in him you will not commit sin (1 John 3:9; 1 John 3:6; John 15:4-10
10. It is the keeping of God’s commandments that is the difference between those that are following God and those that are not following God (1 John 3:10; 1 John 5:3)
11. It is only by Love through faith that we can keep God’s commandments (1 John 5:3-4)
12. God’s true believers in the end days will keep all of God’s commandments through faith in Jesus (Rev 14:12; 22:14)

James also affirms the 10 commandments…….

1. James says God’s Law (10 commandments) are a Royal Law (James 2:8)
2. If we break one of God’s commandments we a guilty before God as sinners breaking all of God’s Law and gave some examples of breaking God’s Law (James 2:9-11)
3. James says God’s Law is a law of liberty and freedom (James 2:12)
4. The 10 commandments (God’s Law) are the standard in the judgment (James 2:12)
5. If our faith does not have the fruit of obedience to God’s Law it is dead and not true faith (James 2:16-26)

Peter affirms the 10 commandments……..

1. Sanctification is to obedience to God’s Law (1 Pet 1:2)
2. We can only be changed from sin to obedience to God’s Law by the power of God and it will be revealed in the last days (1 Pet 1:5)
3. We should give up our sins to be holy because Jesus is holy (1 Pet 1:13-16)
4. Jesus is your example who did no sin (1 Pet 2:21-22)
5. Cease from sin and do not live in the flesh (1 Pet 4:1-3)
6. Judgement will begin at the house of God and sinners (those breaking God’s 10 commandments) will not be saved.
7. God has given us his precious promises and as we believe them God will grant us his divine power to live a life of Godliness (obedience to God’s Law; 2 Pet 1:2-4)
8. The Un-Godly (disobedient to God’s Law) will be like Sodom and Gomorrah (2 Pet 2:6)
9. If any turn away from God’s Law and are in unrepentant sin breaking any of God’10 commandments they will be lost (2 Pet 2:20-22)
10 God is not willing that any should perish but that everyone should come to repentance and turn away from sin to follow God’s 10 commandments because those that do not will receive the judgements of God (2 Pet 3:5-14)

I am 100 % for obeying the commandments.

I am against obeying the Sabbath according to the law of Moses.


JLB

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I am 100 % for obeying the commandments.
I am against obeying the Sabbath according to the law of Moses.
JLB

Hi JBL,

So nice to meet you here.

Why do you believe we keep 9/10 of God's 10 commandments and not all of them througth FAITH?

The 4th commandments is also one of God's 10 commandments.

Are you not concerned that it is written that if we break one commandment we stand guilty before God of breaking ALL of God's LAW?

James 2
8, If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
9, But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10, For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
11, For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
12, So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Where does it say in the scriptures that God's 4th commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are to keep Sunday in it's place?

The reason why I am asking is that God's LAW (10 commandments) are the standard of SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS. As it says above if we KNOWINGLY break ANY one of them we stand guilty before GOD in SIN and the scriptures say that those practicing UNREPENTANT SIN will NOT enter the Kingdom of Heaven because they have rejected the GIFT of God's dear son (Hebrews 10:26-27; 6:4-8; Matthew 7:13-23; Romans 6:23; 3:31; 1 John 3:3-9; 1 John 2:3-4)

IN times of ignorance however, God winks at but now (when a KNOLEDGE of the truth is come) calls all men every where to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

Thanks for your thoughts JBL

 

[JLB]

Why do you believe we keep 9/10 of God's 10 commandments and not all of them througth FAITH?

Again, I believe we are to keep all His Commandments.

I don't believe we are to keep the Sabbath according to the law of Moses.

The Sabbath is for man to rest each week.

I didn't say we don't keep the Sabbath.

I said I believe we don't keep the Sabbath according to the law of Moses.

You shall keep the Sabbath, therefore, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it shall surely be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. Exodus 31:14-15

I don't see this requirement of putting to death those who pick up sticks to make a fire on the Sabbath which is what the law of Moses required.


4 Who are you to judge another’s servant? To his own master he stands or falls. Indeed, he will be made to stand, for God is able to make him stand. One person esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike.Let each be fully convinced in his own mind. 6 He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord; and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it. He who eats, eats to the Lord, for he gives God thanks; and he who does not eat, to the Lord he does not eat, and gives God thanks.
Romans 14:4-6

• He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord; and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it.

The law of Moses was added to the Abrahamic Covenant until the Seed should come.


19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator.
Galatians 3:19

The Seed has come and the law has been nailed to the cross, abolished in His flesh, having become obsolete and has vanished away.


How many people have you put to death because they did work on the Sabbath?



JLB