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Gary_Bee said:
  • "... Some of the Companions of the Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) were reluctant to have intercourse with the female captives in the presence of their husbands who were unbelievers. "
The women's HUSBANDS were still alive!! And these thugs wanted to RAPE them. Muhammad allowed it. He is sick and warped.


How sick and warped!
Click to expand...


Its difficult to believe that we are talking about sex within marriage if their husbands are still alive.


Is any woman likely to freely consent to either sex or marriage under the circumstance?
 
http://hindunet.org/hindu_history/moder ... _atro.html


The Magnitude of Muslim Atrocities


"The world famous historian, Will Durant has written in his Story of Civilisation that "the Mohammedan conquest of India was probably the bloodiest story in history".

India before the advent of Islamic imperialism was not exactly a zone of peace. There were plenty of wars fought by Hindu princes. But in all their wars, the Hindus had observed some time-honoured conventions sanctioned by the Sastras. The Brahmins and the Bhikshus were never molested. The cows were never killed. The temples were never touched. The chastity of women was never violated. The non-combatants were never killed or captured. A human habitation was never attacked unless it was a fort. The civil population was never plundered. War booty was an unknown item in the calculations of conquerors. The martial classes who clashed, mostly in open spaces, had a code of honor. Sacrifice of honor for victory or material gain was deemed as worse than death.

Islamic imperialism came with a different code--the Sunnah of the Prophet. It required its warriors to fall upon the helpless civil population after a decisive victory had been won on the battlefield. It required them to sack and burn down villages and towns after the defenders had died fighting or had fled. The cows, the Brahmins, and the Bhikshus invited their special attention in mass murders of non-combatants. The temples and monasteries were their special targets in an orgy of pillage and arson. Those whom they did not kill, they captured and sold as slaves. The magnitude of the booty looted even from the bodies of the dead, was a measure of the success of a military mission. And they did all this as mujahids (holy warriors) and ghazls (kafir-killers) in the service of Allah and his Last Prophet."
 
still unanswered by Qasim.....

Abrogation of the practice of raping female captives while their husbands were still alive

Qasim said:
This institution of the captives of war is now obsolete. Such inferiority of status, as there was, was in the status of captivity, not in the status of marriage as such, in which there are no degrees except in local customs, which Islam does not recognise. (Yusuf Ali Footnote)

In short Marriage to captives raised them to freedom. However since it does not exist anymore, it would not be relevant today.
Click to expand...

When were these surah from the Quran abrogated? Prove your point....

:-?

(For those unfamiliar with this concept of ABROGATION, let me explain. Abrogation is another Muslim trick to help them try and explain the contradictions in the Quran. The concept of "abrogation" is that Allah chose to reveal ayahs (verses) in the Quran that supersede/obsolete earlier revelation in the same Quran.)

:roll:
 
Relying on atheist sites again....

Your new atheist friend

I notice you rely on atheist sites again.

You want to study contradictions in the Quran?

As for so-called Bible contradictions...

:bday: :bday:
 
Contradictions in the Bible: http://www.ebonmusings.org/atheism/biblecontra.html.

Contradictions in the Quran: http://www.ebonmusings.org/atheism/korancontra.html.

Ebon Musings focuses on the contradictions that are most easily proven. You can always reconcile any contradiction in any holy book if you wish from the Illiad to the Book of Mormon. All you have to do is find a way out. Assume the author means something else, the author is no longer showing a story in chronological order, or the story is a metaphor.

A lot of contradictions are reconciled with first order corrections and ignore the effects of that change. For example, the Bible says that Satan and God make David count his fighting men. To reconcile that, some people say that God makes Satan do stuff. But after that, you have to assume that anytime Satan does something bad, it could be God doing it through him as before.

Quath
 
Thanks Gary.

Funny that the contradictions on the links you gave have mostly been rebutted on the site.
 
There may be no contradictions in the koran. However, The Koran contradicts the Bible.
 
Huja Mehmet said:
Most recent discoveries:

Recently Father Pecerillo, a famous Franciscan Archiologist, found more than twenty churches in Madaba at the south of Jordan. From the Forth Century we found houses in Syria, Lebanon, Iraq and Palestine with this inscription in Arabic :"Bism Allah al Rahman al Rahim" which showed that Christians were the first to use this name, Allah for GOD Almighty, which proves that the name of GOD Almighty in the Noble Quran, "Allah" is the correct one. This also proves to us that the Bible is not all found. There are still missing pieces in it that disprove trinity.



Further proofs from brother Tamer; may Allah Almighty always be pleased with him:

Even Jesus himself used the word Allah in Aramaic; the language Jesus spoke while he preached the words of GOD Almighty:

ALAAHAA - - - - God
EESHO - - - - Jesus
MSHEEKHAA - - - - Christ
MSHEEKHOOTAA - - - - Christianity
MARRYAA - - - - Lord
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
KRRISTEEAANAA - - - - Christian
MAAT MAARRYAAM - - - - our mistress Mary
OOMRRAA - - - - church
QAASHAA - - - - priest
MAARAAN - - - - our Lord Jesus Christ
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SLEEWA - - - - cross
SQEEPAA - - - - crucifix
MKHETAA D SQEEPAA - - - - crucify (verb)
QOORBAANAA - - - - communion / eucherest
QAARWIN - - - - the verb form of taking communion
DOOKHRAANAA - - - - sacrafice/remembrance
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SHAAMAASHAA - - - deacon
MAR GEEWERRGIS - - - - Saint George
SAALEE - - - - pray (verb)
SLOOTAA - - - - prayer
MAAKRRIS - - - - preach (verb)
MAAKRRESTAA - - - - preaching (noun)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SHMAYAA - - - - heaven
TISHBOOQTAA - - - - glory
MAALAAKHAA (M) / MAALAAKHTAA (F) - - - - angel
HAMIN - - - - believe (verb)
HAMENTA - - - - belief
TUKHNUNTAA - - - - intercession / fervent prayer
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
QAADEESHAA (M) / QAADISHTAA (F) - - - - holy / holy person / saint
BREEKHAA / BOORRKHAA - - - - blessed / blessed (past tense)
BARRIKH - - - - bless(verb)
DEENAA - - - - religion
EETAA - - - - a congregation of a church
INVEEYAA - - - - prophet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TERRYISAARR TELMEETH'E - - - - 12 desciples
PILEEPOOS - - - - phillip
SHIMOON - - - - simon
ANDREE0OS - - - - andrew
YAAQOO - - - - james
MET'E - - - - matthew
BAARTOOMAA - - - - bartholomew
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TELMEETHA - - - - desciple
YOOKHENAA - - - - john
POOTROOS - - - - peter
YEHOODAA - - - - judas
TOOMAA - - - - thomas
ADAY - - - - thadeus
YEHOODAA ISKHAARRYOODEE - - - - judas (the second one)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
QATOOLEEQ'E - - - - catholic
MISHILMAANAA (M) / MISHILMENTAA (F) - - - - muslim
HOODAAYAA (M) / HOODETAA (F) - - - - jewish/hebrew
HINDOOAAYAA (M) / HINDOOETAA (F) - - - - hindu
BOODAAYAA (M) / BOODETAA (F) - - - - buddist
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OSHAANAA - - - - Hosana = an exclaimation of praise to God / also a leaf of a palm tree (the same leaves that Eeshoo walked on when he went to Jersusalem from Nasserine a few days before He was crucified at 33 years old.
PAAPAA- - - - pope
PAATRREEAARRQAA - - - - patriarch
MUKHRUMTAA - - - - excommunicate
ROOSHUMTAA D SLEEWAA - - - - the action of forming a cross across your chest or face
DYAANTAA - - - - judgement
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MESER / MESRRAAYAA - - - - egypt / egyptian
ORROOSHLOOM - - - - jerusalem
BETILKHIN - - - bethleham
NAASRRIN - - - - nasarine
QYEMTAA D MAARRAAN - - - - resurrection
MELKOOTAA D SHMAYAA - - - - the kingdom of heaven (the kingdom of God)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SKHETAA - - - - worship
MAASAAR'E - - - - the yearly donation you give to a church
MISHKHETAA - - - - the tribute you give when they pass around the collection plate
DWEKHTAA - - - - donation ** DOOKH - donate (the verb)
PAASHUMTAA / PSHEEMAA - - - - repentance / repent (verb)
MOWDEEYTAA / MOWDOOY'E - - - - confession / confess (verb)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MAARR - - - - saint
RRUBAANTAA - - - - nun
USRRAA POOYDAAN'E - - - - 10 commandments
YAATEEQ'E - - - - testemant
OORRETAA / YAATEEQ'E ATIQTAA - - - - Bible (Old Testemant)
KHDETAA / YAATEEQ'E KHETAA - - - - Bible (New Testemant)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BERRYAANAA - - - - creator
QOWLAA - - - - covenent
BURROOMRRAA - - - - monk
SAANAAM'E - - - - idol
QAAYIMTAA - - - - statue
SAAKHDAAN'E - - - - worshipers
SHLEEKHAA - - - - apostle
KHAANPAA - - - - pagan
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PAARROOQAA / PAARQAANAA - - - - savior
BEESHAA - - - - evil/bad
DAAVAA / SPAAYOOTAA - - - - good
ROOKHAA D QOODSHAA - - - - holy spirit / holy spirit
ROOKHAA - - - - soul / spirit
GAANAA - - - - spirit
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TISHBOOQTAA - - - - glory
HEKLAA D ALAAHAA - - - - temple of God
MAAR DINKHAA IV - - - - the name of our patriarch from 1975 to present
M'KHOOSH'E - - - - three wise men
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JAHENEM - - - - hell
SAA'TD'AANAA - - - - satan
AAKHILQAARRSAA - - - - the devil. Literally, "the accuser"
YEZEDAAYAA - - - - devil worshipper
SYEMTAA - - - - ordain
MEEYAA BOORRKH'E - - - - holy water
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JOORRAABAA - - - - temptation
ABOONAA - - - - bishop
LAA M'HOOMNAA (M) / LAA M'HOOMINTAA - - - - athiest / non-believer
KNOOSHYAA - - - - gathering / convention / meeting
KNOOSHYAA D HOODAAY'E - - - - synagogue
MAACHIT - - - - mosque
KHTEETAA - - - - sin
ULMEEN - - - - eternity
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
KPOORRYAA - - - - blasphemy / denial of God
KAAPOORRAA (M) / KAAPOORRTAA (F) - - - - infidel / pagan / non-christian
SAAHDAA - - - - martyer
SAAHDOOTAA - - - - martyerdom
QIBLAA - - - - when you give for recieving something special from God
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
YOSIP - - - - Joeseph
MOOSH'E - - - - Moses
OWRRAAHIM - - - - abraham
NOOKH - - - - noah
QEEWOOTAA - - - - ark
'TD'OPAANAA - - - - flood
ADAAM OO KHAAWAA - - - - adam and eve
GENTAA D EDEEN - - - - garden of eden
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
EEDAA SOORRAA- - - - Christmas
LEL'E D EEDAA - - - - Christmas eve
EEDAA GOORRAA - - - - Easter
RROOTAA D KHISHAA - - - - day of suffering / sorrow (Good Friday)
EEDAA D MAAT MAARYAAM - - - - the day of our mistriss Mary (I gotta look this up (anyone?))
YOOMAA D AAVGAARR - - - - the day of King Abgar Okoomaa (the black one).
December 20 is the day we commemorate our first Chirstian King, King Aavgaar Okhooma V (son of Mano). He was an Ashuree king of Edessa (a city/state in modern day northern Syria) around 32 A.D.. He had a mortal sickness (leprosy) and had told Eeshoo (Jesus) in a letter that he had heard a great deal of him and his miracles. He said he believes in him , "you must be God or the son of God and I ask you to come and cure my sickness". Jesus wrote back and said that his time was occupied but he would send his two apostles (desciples), Didymas Mar Toomaa (Thomas) and Mar Addai (Thaddaeus). After he was cured, he ordered his entire kingdom to convert to Christianity. We
celebrate this day to honor the first Christian Assyrian king, Melka Aavgaarr. Thus, the Assyrians became one of the first Chirstians during the life of Eeshoo Msheekhaa (Jesus Christ). (300 years before Constantinople / Rome). We still, after 2000 years, liturigically honor him in church.
YOOMAA D QAADEESHAA - - - - holy day
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SOMAA - - - - fasting from dairy products and meat
SEEMIT (M) ? / SIMTIT (F) ? - - - - are you fasting?
BAAOOTAA - - - - fasting from all food and water. Usually short. can also mean commitment. people fast baootaa if they desire something holy from God (a child, cure the sickness of a mother, etc.) and to remember the Rogation of the Ninevites
SEEMIT BAAOOTAA (M) ? / SIMTIT BAOOTAA (F) ? - - - - are you fasting the fast of Baootaa ?
AANAA SEEMIN - - - - i am fasting
MAAMOODOOTAA / MAAMOOD'E - - - - christiananize-baptize // Christianize-baptize (verb)
AAJIBOOTAA - - - - miracles
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phrases and Common Sayings:
ALAAHAA REKHMAANEL'E - - - - God is merciful
BE KHDETA - - - - on the word of the bible
YA ALAAH - - - - Oh God
ALAAHAA MINAAKH (F) / MINOOKH (M) - - - - God be with you
MINOOKH MOODAAL'E (M) / MINAAKH MOODAAL'E (F) - - - - with you also (the response)
ALAAHAA NAADIRAAKH (F) / NAADIROOKH (M) - - - - God keep you in well being
ALAAHAA MAANIKHL'E (M) / MAANIKHLAA (F) - - - - God rest his (M) / her (F)
soul (What you say to someone when someone they love dies.)
ALAAHAA BAARIKHLAAKH (F) / BAARIKHLOOKH (M) - - - - God bless you
SHIMAA D ALAAHAA - - - - in the name of God
SHQEER'E D ALAAHAA - - - - thanks to God
BRREKHM'E (BEE RREKHM'E) - - - - with His (God's) mercy. what you say to someone after they sneeze
MAARRYAA / AALAAHAA SAAHAADIL'E - - - - honest to God / the lord/God is the witness
MINTAA MIN ALAH / MINTAA MIN MAARRYAA - - - - with thanks to God/the lord / with obligation to God/the lord . MINTA=obligation
BRROOCHTAA D MAARRYAA / BROOCHTAA D AALAAHAA - - - - a blessing from lord/God. When God has given a person , family, home something blessed. (EX. if you have a wonderful wife, you say to her, "AATEN EEWAAT BOORRICHTAA D AALAAHAA (you are a blessing from God)").
Click to expand...
YESHUA did not speak aramaic HE spoke ivrit (hebrew) like a good Jewish boy would do and you spell jerusalem Yerushalayim and bethlem is beit lechem which means the house of bread still as to this day so get of it your a liar. There is no truth in any of what you have posted so do us a favor stop
shalom chana
 
Qasim786 said:
All the hadith you quoted, about Muhammed allowing to have have intercourse with slaves, must be in accordance with the Quran verse, and they must get married first with the permission from the owners. If the Hadith says that you can have intercourse before marriage, then we must question its authenticity. Any hadith that does not go in accordance with the Quranic laws, is not authentic. But Hadeeths are the words of the prophet who was a man, and words of men can sometimes be misunderstood of Misinterpreted or can be imcomplete. However the Words of the Quran are directly from God, therefore there is nothing incomplete about that.[/quote

excuse me but who wrote the Qur'an? and if the hadeeths are the words of the prophet who was a man, and words can sometimes be misunderstood of Misinterpreted or can be imcomplete. However the Words of the Qur'an are directly from God. So we have 2 different author one for the hadeeths and one for the Qur'an so who wrote what and if it is the same author then how do you explain the errors in the hadeeths I am very confused to say the least the hadeeths can be explained away and the Qur'an is the word of god but isn't it the same man who is behind both book mainely Muhammad? or did someone else write the Qur'an what I am getting at how can you as a muslim defend the Qur'an as being the word of god and then tell us the hadeedths can be flawed by mistakes because the words are not of god?
And wasn't the Qur'an written after the death of Muhammad?
chana
Click to expand...
 
The Quran is the complete and infallible word of Almighty Allah, revealed to the prophet Muhammed (peace be upon him) throught the angel Gabriel. The proof that it is from God is the book itself. Read it. It is a miracle of Miracles. It is pure and is the only religious book that has not been changed, not even one word.(In the arabic)

http://www.harunyahya.com/miracles_of_the_quran_01.php

Im not quite sure the point you are trying to make, the Hadith are the sayings of the Prophet Muhammed, some authentic, some not as much, and some are not very authentic. The sayings of the prophet were collected and compliled during and after his life by his companions. So yes there are two different authors, the Quran is the revealed word of God, and the hadith the words of the prophet, written down by his companions. The same author is not behind both the Quran and the hadith, and that is the reason why they are kept seperate. Muhammed was not the author of the Quran because he was an illiterate person, If you take your time to have a look at the Harun Yahya link, you will see that it was impossible for any human to be the author of the Quran.

The Quran was not only orally transimitted during the lifetime of the prophet but it had also been written down in its entirety, but not yet compiled. It was compiled together soon after the death of Prophet Muhammed (p.b.u.h), in the time of the caliphs Abu Bakr and Uthman.

The Hadiths are not flawed with Mistakes, its just that some are considered less authentic or from doubtful sources. The ones most widely used are the Sahih Bukhari and Muslim. These are considered authentic. There are other authentic sources used as well.
 
I MUST WARN EVERYONE ABOUT KEEPING CALM. THIS DEBATE IS IN DANGER OF BECOMING TOO PERSONAL.

DO NOT ACCUSE ANY ONE OF BEING A LIAR.

IF I SEE ANY INSULTS AND PERSONAL REMARKS ABOUT OTHERS I SHALL TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION.
 
Muhammed was not the author of the Quran because he was an illiterate person, If you take your time to have a look at the Harun Yahya link, you will see that it was impossible for any human to be the author of the Quran

Now I am really confused so who wrote the Qur'an? And how did the Qur'an come into existence did GOD send Gabriel down with the Qur'an or what? who wrote the Qur'an not Muhammad because he was as you said illiterate, and I remember to have read somewhere that the Qu'ran was written down 400 years after the death of Muhammad and that someone got the idea to write down the hadiths. And that now someone have fund several different manuscript of the Qu'ran not just one but several so much for the authentic of the Qur'an.
in order for anyone to have written down the sayings of Muhammad he would had to be with him day and night?
And of course to have a pen and paper ready every time Muhammad got a bright idea.
shalom and love in the name of YESHUA returning soon better be ready my friend
chana
 
Chana Said: "Now I am really confused so who wrote the Qur'an? And how did the Qur'an come into existence did GOD send Gabriel down with the Qur'an or what? who wrote the Qur'an not Muhammad because he was as you said illiterate, and I remember to have read somewhere that the Qu'ran was written down 400 years after the death of Muhammad and that someone got the idea to write down the hadiths. And that now someone have fund several different manuscript of the Qu'ran not just one but several so much for the authentic of the Qur'an.
in order for anyone to have written down the sayings of Muhammad he would had to be with him day and night?
And of course to have a pen and paper ready every time Muhammad got a bright idea.
shalom and love in the name of YESHUA returning soon better be ready my friend
chana "

Qasim Said: Whats confusing about what i said. The Quran was not written by Muhammed, nor by any other human, it was revealed to him by God, through the angel Gabriel. The words were Gods, by the angel was dictacting them to Muhammed (peace be upon him). Just like the Injil was revealed to the Prophet Jesus, and the Taurat was revealed to Moses.
What is confusing you is that you, in your understanding, cannot admit that the Quran are Gods revealed words, so you are looking for another solution. You dont have to look far or dig deep to work out that the Quran is indeed the Word of God. As i have already stated the whole Quran had been revealed during the lifetime of the prophet, and it had also been written down. However it had not been put together yet in the order that we see today. Where did you read that the Quran was revealed 400 years after the Prophets (peace be upon him) death. That is quite an absurd idea seeing that we have a complete manuscript of the Quran done by the 3rd Caliph (Uthman alaihisalam) fully preserved for everyone to see, which is fromthe late 7th centurty. But even then, we still know that the whole Quran had been revealed during the prophets life. I dont know about the several manuscripts, but every single manuscript of the Quran is exactly the same word for word. They dont differ, even by the letter (in the arabic). The sayings of Muhammed were recorded throughout his prophethood, and we have even the Minute details, such as his appearence, the way dressed, what he ate etc. I dont think he dictated his sayings to his companions as you assume, the Quran was what was dictated word for word by the Angel Gabriel.



Assalamualaikum
 
Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.
John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
John 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
John 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

Genesis 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

Isaiah 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.
Matthew 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Isaiah 9:7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.



John 6:32 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven.
John 6:33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
John 6:34 Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread.
John 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

John 8:12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.



John 10:37 If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not.
John 10:38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him.

John 12:44 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.
John 12:45 And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.
John 12:46 I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.
 
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