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Guest, Join Papa Zoom today for some uplifting biblical encouragement! --> Daily Verses
Justification by Faith
- Thread starter iLOVE
- Start date
Nathan
Member
Do you believe it comes through faith?
dirtfarmer
Member
hello ILove, dirtfarmer here
Can Christ become "un-crucified"? Justification, "just as if I've never sinned", is a once and forever occurrence. Christ paid the debt of sin when he was on the cross. The only sin that will condemn a person is unbelief, not believing that Christ has suffered eternal separation(death) for God as the payment for sin. The sin of unbelief is not permanent condemnation while a person stills lives physically, but at physical death become eternal.
It is my believe that once a believer, you can never become an unbeliever again. You can break fellowship with God, but you can never break the relationship as a child of God. Scripture states that we are kept by the power of God. I do not believe that my individual power is more powerful than God's. There are some that hold to the belief that we, within ourselves, have more power than God, in that , we ourselves can break the seal of the Holy Spirit that we have been sealed with and lose our salvation.
Christ_empowered
Member
i get the sense this is going to put me in a minority group here, but I do think one can fall away and be condemned.
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Possibly with all those in Christ here that believe they are the captains of their own salvation, for their sakes and comfort we could eliminate Jn 3:16 also, and if they did fall and one day repent as Peter (I do not know Him - Lk 22:57) would our Savior have to die and rise a second time. Nah, I think not. God might just tell them: Because you believed Me not Num 20:12 to sanctify Me, Deut 32:50 says die in the mount whither thou goest up. Will they go to hell?
Rom 5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of One (Jesus for those that don't know),the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
Rom 4:25 (Jesus) Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification. (Jesus did this - not us?)
Possibly with all those in Christ here that believe they are the captains of their own salvation, for their sakes and comfort we could eliminate Jn 3:16 also, and if they did fall and one day repent as Peter (I do not know Him - Lk 22:57) would our Savior have to die and rise a second time. Nah, I think not. God might just tell them: Because you believed Me not Num 20:12 to sanctify Me, Deut 32:50 says die in the mount whither thou goest up. Will they go to hell?
Rom 5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of One (Jesus for those that don't know),the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
Cygnus
Member
the Bible teaches you can't be snatched from Jesus' hands.
John 10:28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
...if you can lose your justification..salvation....then the Bible is wrong and you can be snatched from Jesus' hand.
Cygnus
Member
If you can fall away from true faith, belief, salvation and become condemned again....then it has already happened to you.
iLOVE
Member
Why was Judas snatched from Jesus hand?
Jim Parker
Member
I'm with you.
Jim Parker
Member
He wasn't snatched.
He jumped out for 30 pieces of silver.
iLOVE
Member
LOL!
Jim Parker
Member
That is not a real Biblical status. It is a distortion of Paul's teaching to suggest that obedience to Jesus' commands are not necessary for justification. (Salvation)
Someone who has faith but no works is not yet a believer. "Only he who believes is obedient, and only he who is obedient believes." Dietrich Bonnhoeffer The Cost of Discipleship Part 1, Ch.2
Faith is the necessary beginning element. Without faith, no one will call upon the LORD. But, once a person has believed he must either move on to the next step which is discipleship that requires the disciple to obey everything that the LORD has commanded or he must decide that the cost is too high and choose to continue on his original path. There are two paths. One path leads to eternal life and one to eternal death.
The way to eternal life is very costly; it requires that you give up your life in order to gain life in Christ. The way to destruction is much easier but the end is death.
Mat 7:13-14 Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.
Faith without works is as real as a coin with only one side. When you flip it over you see that you have nothing in your hand.
Jas 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar?
Jas 2:24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.
Jas 2:25 Likewise, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way?
Jas 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
iakov the fool
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Cygnus
Member
Judas was never saved.
Cygnus
Member
So, the silver and it's influence snatched him.
Jim Parker
Member
UH,no....
This is faith without works isn't faith
Nathan
Member
He was chosen by God Himself, numbered by Christ Himself. He was God's - and a person without salvation is never considered such.
John 17
1 When Jesus had spoken these words, he lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, "Father, the hour has come; glorify your Son that the Son may glorify you,
2 since you have given him authority over all flesh, to give eternal life to all whom you have given him.
3 And this is eternal life, that they know you the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.
4 I glorified you on earth, having accomplished the work that you gave me to do.
5 And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed.
6 "I have manifested your name to the people whom you gave me out of the world. Yours they were, and you gave them to me, and they have kept your word.
7 Now they know that everything that you have given me is from you.
8 For I have given them the words that you gave me, and they have received them and have come to know in truth that I came from you; and they have believed that you sent me.
Christ specifically said Judas was 'lost' from the other twelve. So if Judas did not have the call of God for salvation, none of the rest did.
John 18:9 (ESV)
This was to fulfill the word that he had spoken: "Of those whom you gave me I have lost not one."
Christ did not loose Judas, he turned from Christ - and thus was lost.
In order to say Judas was not 'saved' you would have to say God did not choose him, and that Jesus only gives life to some who are called by Him.
ezra
Member
lol depends on how you say it.. but no we can,t lose our faith... we can not use it refuse it
Soul man
Member
Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: Romans 5:1.
Justification is one of the things that happens to person the moment they believe. It is a cross thing, faith in what God has done in Christ on the cross.
We are "complete in Him" Cor. 2:10.
We mistake a sinner who is an individual that has never been born again, with a sinning Christian or a Christian that sins.
Cygnus
Member
it's hard to argue against someone who is wrong and thinks their right.
Judas was never saved from the get go.
Question: "Was Judas Iscariot forgiven / saved?"
Answer: The Bible clearly indicates that Judas was not saved. Jesus Himself said of Judas, “The Son of Man will go just as it is written about him. But woe to that man who betrays the Son of Man! It would be better for him if he had not been born” (Matthew 26:24). Here is a clear picture of the sovereignty of God and the will of man working together. God had, from ages past, determined that Christ would be betrayed by Judas, die on the cross for our sins, and be resurrected. This is what Jesus meant when He said He would “go just as it is written about him.” Nothing would stop the plan of God to provide salvation for mankind.
rest of article.