Growth Our God and Father

[Brother Mike]

Hi Mike and thanks for showing a concern for my posts.

God's blessings to your Family!

Thank you sir, and blessings to yours. God is our father, I think it takes constant meditation to get our heads wrapped around that reality.

The Son is not the Father and the Father is not the Son but they, along with Their Holy Spirit, are in one accord concerning everything (John 5:7). Prior to Christ's incarnation,

Scripture continuously stresses the Father being God, for Jesus said of Him, "He is greater than all" (John 10:29) and we also read, "But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things (creation),

This would be a Trinitarian understanding. Through the years and mix of denominations there have been branches off this concept of a Triune God. what happens is Jesus gets boiled down to just being the Word of God, when Jesus clearly said His father's Word and passages taken out of context to sort of mash all 3 together.

Trinity states there are 3 that bare record. So each 3 are separate and not each other. Jesus is not creator, not his Father, not the Holy Spirit. This leaves no scripture contradictions which is what the Original view of Trinity achieved perfectly, naming a 1st, 2nd and 3rd person in that order as part of the Godhead.

What Modelist have done to the horror of true trinity believers have taken the 1 is 3 approach, instead of the scripture that there are 3 that are as one.

They claim a trinity doctrine but what they say is not trinity, or even close. Jesus is (God the Father incarnate in the flesh) That removes the person of Jesus which Trinity does not do. Trinity recognizes Jesus as God also and looks at it more of a class of being. Jesus and the Father are God's , or the Son is like the Father, however you want to look at it.

James Strong (Strongs concordance) was anti trinity as he saw the Word translated God as a class of something and not a proper name of something. Trinity does also but in the Creed itself the Doctrine states.

Each are God, of God..............

That means the doctrine keeps away from all the scriptural contradictions and still maintains the belief of One God being a mystery.

It's the same concept of mystery Paul explained on how a Husband and wife are really just one flesh, but two people. One effects the function of the other as God (Father) made all things through and for his son. The whole creation rested only because of Jesus, through the Holy Spirit, through the Word, though the operation of ONE dynamic God, but 3 persons.

Modelist, Oneness (apostalic faith) say there is 1 in 3............. Not 3 that are 1.

So One God who has split personalities and become each different one as needed.

Trinity does not attempt to prove itself though scripture as there is no scripture contradictions anyway. The 1st person has a throne next to the 2nd person.

The only Mystery part is the part where all 3 are God, but are one as the scripture states in John. The Mystery can't be any more explained than a Husband and wife being one flesh.

Great stuff!!!

Mike.

 

[netchaplain]

The Mystery can't be any more explained than a Husband and wife being one flesh.

Thanks for your reply and your above example is quite applicable. To me, the phrase "one flesh" designs the intention of two having a singleness in spirit, just as the "Three are one" (1 John 5:7) to me mean They are in the same or single accord or agreement in everything; that They are one--in everything.

 

[Brother Mike]

Thanks for your reply and your above example is quite applicable. To me, the phrase "one flesh" designs the intention of two having a singleness in spirit, just as the "Three are one" (1 John 5:7) to me mean They are in the same or single accord or agreement in everything; that They are one--in everything.

Well, praise God............... However...... I don't see the post really getting into monotheism (Belief in just ONE God) I have been thinking about this.

Mat 7:11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?


How much more your father................ Not just God, or some being that answers prayer yes, no or maybe............ but How much more will YOUR Father give. Our Father lives where? in a place where the streets are made of Gold. A real Father, a real place a real home we get to go to once we finished what needs done here.

Money sent from Dad while the Children are out working and doing his will. Dad is not broke, nor ignores the request of the children. Jesus said seek the righteousness of God (And Kingdom of God) and all these things will be added. The righteousness of God is just right standing with God. It's this way and understanding that things get added.

Who could possibly be down or sad about anything if a person remembers home and who Daddy is?

There is so much here NetChaplain that could deliver someone aside from trying to figure out some Trinity concept. A girl I know got delivered by finding a scripture on a piece of paper... Jer 29:11........

On drugs, Bi-Polar and all that stuck with her was that God was not thinking bad things about her but good things about her. It took a month be she kept that paper and read it constantly and it set her free.

It became more real to her than all her issues in life. The word will do that if you take the time to just keep meditating on it. A completely different person today and it started with post like this, a scripture and light of hope.

One reason I am against any suffering doctrine, I hope you understand but post like this even get me thinking. How much do I really know that God is my father, I mean I know but how many levels more to go into understanding this?

Blessings.

Mike.

 

[reba]

I am closing this thread for moderator review/discussion..... I think this is out side the bounds of the FOS forum....

 

[Sparkey]

Debate (on topic) is fine for FoS and I'm thinking that the subject is a little difficult to define. Netchaplain started the thread to speak about how men who believe have changed in their relationship to God. The discussion is centered originally on dispensationalism, a divinely appointed order or age: the old Mosaic, or Jewish, dispensation; the new gospel, or Christian, dispensation.

Netchaplain points to Scripture and understandings to show (now my words, not his) how believers can truly consider God to be their Father (not just the title, but the relationship) through Jesus. The way he says it is that God was seen in the capacity of Creator (like a father) before, but absent son-ship. Probably the most succinct statement by OP on this may be found in his post #12:

That which produces the actual Father-son relationship with God comes only by rebirth through Christianity (Christian Jew first, then Gentile), which was always foreshadowed, similar as the Law was to Grace (Heb 10:1).

The recent posts have diverged from this theme to explore various aspects of trinity. This starts with Post #17. Another member spoke then of one of his favorite topics (Trinity vs Oneness vs Modalistic beliefs) and chimed in with thoughts about 'godhead'.

Netchaplain, offers his reply even though the first "train of thought" in the thread has effectively been derailed.

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Moderator Message: This is the Focus on Scripture Forum where moderators are charged with being consistent in enforcement of the rules, all the rules. Members are to refrain from posting in the forum whatsoever when the urge to post off topic becomes too great.

totopic

 

[JohnD]

Uh... from the guilty party post # 17, I apologize for derailing the discussion and ask moderators to move it to a new topic on the nature of God or the defense of the Trinity or something like rethinking our thoughts about the Trinity or some such thing.

Thank you.

 

[netchaplain]

Uh... from the guilty party post # 17, I apologize for derailing the discussion and ask moderators to move it to a new topic on the nature of God or the defense of the Trinity or something like rethinking our thoughts about the Trinity or some such thing.

Thank you.

Hi JD - I believe I'm also one of the elemental causes in this issue, maybe the primary, because of possibly being over-involved with my reply in post 19. My apologies to the Admin/Mod team and your site labors are greatly appreciated!!

 

[Sparkey]

I hope that I caught your drift well and was able to correctly summarize what you were trying to say here. I did like the thought expressed in the post that I quoted, essentially reinforcing the Scripture that nobody has seen the Father save the Son. We need Jesus to understand who God is. To me, that was the main ministry that was given Him - to show forth God. If it wasn't for the expressed love of our Lord, through his life and even his death on the cross, I would have been stuck with the Big-God-in-the-Sky concept where He has all these rule books and goes around looking for people to cross off His list. Nothing could be further from the truth.

The Pharisees understood that God is Holy (fearfully so) but they failed to understand who our Father really is and the depth of His love. Nobody gets it unless they look through the Light of the Word, our Christ. God continues to reveal Himself to us and that unfolding revelation is the process that culminates with our seeing Him even as we are seen. It's too precious for words.

 

[netchaplain]

I hope that I caught your drift well and was able to correctly summarize what you were trying to say here.

Hi SH - Looks good to me and thanks.