The components in a solar panel array

[tim-from-pa]

We see solar panels popping up all over on rooftops left and right these days. I don't have panels yet (but I do have oversized passive solar gain windows for heat), however I may in the future want some to give a little extra energy during those daylight hours or power outages. I think one day we'll all go solar and become self-sustaining.

The main components in a solar array are:

1. The solar panels
2. Charge controller
3. Battery bank and
4. an inverter

1. The solar panels are basically banks of photo diodes. A photo diode converts light into electricity -- it is a semi-conductor. Thus the power it puts out while there's light shining on them is direct current like you have coming out of a battery.
3. (I'll get to #2 in a moment). The battery banks are batteries that store a lot of "ampere-hours" and are deep discharge types that can last awhile. The goal is to have the solar panels constantly charging the batteries, so the electricity comes from the panels, but the batteries store the charge during off-hours to have power long after the sun sets.
2. The charge controller I jokingly call "a big diode" because when the sun goes down and the panels no longer produce electricity, the batteries can discharge back into the solar panels since it is forward-biased for those of you technical enough to know what I am saying. A diode lets current flow in one direction but not another. But.... charge controllers can do other things such as showing status and keeping the batteries from being overcharged if the daylight is long and intense.
4. Lastly, the inverter changes the battery direct current to 110 volt- 220volt alternating current, the type of current your house uses now. I won't go into the technical details why alternating current is better than direct current for power loads, but the main point is to make the battery power usable.

With all that said, here's a picture link showing these components.

http://www.hightechscience.org/Solar_System_Set-up_1a.gif

 

[th1b.taylor]

And Solar Panels kill birds and the Wind Turbines kill Eagles. And that is nature friendly?

 

[JohnDB]

We, the average person, can't have the good panels which produce the good watts per hour. Those are reserved for NASA. Just because the silicone is doped with uranium....its not radioactive but....

A small bathroom needs at least 800 watt/hrs to be usable. And at $100 per watt (complete with installation) it's just too expensive. 20 years to pay for itself and break even is too much.

Commercial buildings in order to get permitted to be built must have some kind of "green" features such as solar panels bicycle racks and etc. But if it wasn't necessary no one would add the extra expense. Because it isn't cost effective and actually destroys more of the environment than it helps.

BUT

I heard of a guy who took junked alternators out of a car, car batteries and built a windmill out of scrap as well and actually got ahead of the game. Of course he needed an inverter. Band pass filtered so the signal was clean and a transfer switch.
But again... Knowledgeable guy...not average... And not enough for air conditioning.

 

[jasonc]

Nevermind the problem of days without sun in some states.

 

[tim-from-pa]

And Solar Panels kill birds and the Wind Turbines kill Eagles. And that is nature friendly?

Not as bad as the emissions that carbon and natural gas (which is worse) gives off. Plus my outdoor cats and my smoke from my oil furnace killed more birds falling down the chimney, too. Windmills and solar panels kills birds like Linux gets viruses, right?

 

[tim-from-pa]

Nevermind the problem of days without sun in some states.

You may need more panels in those states for a do-it-yourselfer, or simply use the conventional electrical infrastructure already here with solar farms generating the power which is already happening. It's best to have them out in the desert or on a roof somewhere where they don't hurt anything like plant growth by blocking sun. In the case of a roof is perfect since you just have smelly asphalt shingles absorbing the sun instead. Might as well put it to good use with thousands of watts. Also, they are experimenting with solar panel window technology. Keep in mind--- it's the light that activates the panels so even an overcast day will generate some. Calculators have "solar" cells on them but we turn on the room light to power them.

 

[Knotical]

I have looked into getting solar panels, but really don't want to have them installed on my roof. I was thinking about attaching them to a pergola in my back yard, but from my research I have discovered I would need about 18 panels. These panels are generally 5 feet by 3 and a half feet in size and can run about 40-50 pounds. Obviously, I would need a structure that would be able to support that kind of weight (upwards of 1,000 pounds). Also, I wanted to tie in a battery system, but all the ones on the market are big, messy, and cost prohibitive. Elon Musk's company is developing a much better solution for this, but it is not commercially available, yet.

Right now, for me at least, getting solar panels is just not a viable option.

 

[jasonc]

You may need more panels in those states for a do-it-yourselfer, or simply use the conventional electrical infrastructure already here with solar farms generating the power which is already happening. It's best to have them out in the desert or on a roof somewhere where they don't hurt anything like plant growth by blocking sun. In the case of a roof is perfect since you just have smelly asphalt shingles absorbing the sun instead. Might as well put it to good use with thousands of watts. Also, they are experimenting with solar panel window technology. Keep in mind--- it's the light that activates the panels so even an overcast day will generate some. Calculators have "solar" cells on them but we turn on the room light to power them.

Only feasible if you own property.if not then you are slaves to those that can charge you for power.

 

[JohnDB]

Coal fired Electric generation is clean. Cleaner than most. Especially with the scrubbers they must have these days.

Nuclear power is just for weaponry...so it's very expensive all the way around.
(Depleted uranium for bullets and plutonium for bombs)

Solar panels usually are more expensive than any other form of power due to repairs and maintenance.

A "do it yourself" out of "junk" tends to be cheaper and cleaner than any other "off grid" power generation.
All recycled materials and reduced solid waste. Any good junkyard will have most everything you need.

 

[tim-from-pa]

Right now I would want solar just for power failure back-ups and/or small energy loads. It is true that the technology needs to come a tad further (we're almost there) to make it even more cost effective, and that's being done now. Nevertheless, solar cells and even the diagram I've shown is yet 1970's technology when my dad and I experimented with the stuff. But whenever there's a superior technology being developed, the old ways, namely BIG corporations with $$$ want to squelch it otherwise solar would be a lot further along than it is now (and then after they suppressed it have the gall to erroneously say "it does not work" or is not "cost effective"). After all, the solar constant is about 1kw per meter (~yard) squared. Do you know how many square feet your roof has, even on some city homes? The thousands and thousands of watts being generated by FREE sunlight! Cheapness and technological advancement motivates me with this solar stuff. I don't want to burn fossil fuels like a caveman any more than I have to --- that's maybe ONE source as a back-up that's OK to use, but the renewables are here like fresh air and we should look to other things free. That's the advanced and technical thing to do.

 

[th1b.taylor]

Not as bad as the emissions that carbon and natural gas (which is worse) gives off. Plus my outdoor cats and my smoke from my oil furnace killed more birds falling down the chimney, too. Windmills and solar panels kills birds like Linux gets viruses, right?

Only you Tim would know where my sarcasm lays. And your right in your inference, I am not anti-progress.

 

[JohnDB]

Right now I would want solar just for power failure back-ups and/or small energy loads. It is true that the technology needs to come a tad further (we're almost there) to make it even more cost effective, and that's being done now. Nevertheless, solar cells and even the diagram I've shown is yet 1970's technology when my dad and I experimented with the stuff. But whenever there's a superior technology being developed, the old ways, namely BIG corporations with $$$ want to squelch it otherwise solar would be a lot further along than it is now (and then after they suppressed it have the gall to erroneously say "it does not work" or is not "cost effective"). After all, the solar constant is about 1kw per meter (~yard) squared. Do you know how many square feet your roof has, even on some city homes? The thousands and thousands of watts being generated by FREE sunlight! Cheapness and technological advancement motivates me with this solar stuff. I don't want to burn fossil fuels like a caveman any more than I have to --- that's maybe ONE source as a back-up that's OK to use, but the renewables are here like fresh air and we should look to other things free. That's the advanced and technical thing to do.

They have better panels...it's not big business that's squelching it it's our Government... We can't have them which could be cost effective. Mostly because the satellites that watch for radioactive material coming into America can't tell the difference AND the proliferation of technology for purifying uranium...which probably would be done in third world countries... Usually a rogue state.

So they look for new battery technology, new hydrogen ion technology and etc...

I know that it's not power that is the problem... It's consumption.

America uses 25% of the world's power, drives 75% of the world economy and yet feeds 60% of the food supply. But we have roughly 20% of the population of the world.

Since most of the manufacturing is done outside the Nation most of the power consumption is in homes.

Motors and heating elements consuming most of that power.
Your average house or apartment has a minimum of 25 motors in it...really.

3 for your fridge and furnace a piece minimum... Sometimes more. Your computer has a minimum of two if not three to four.
Add in a garbage disposal, ceiling fan, bath fan, washing machine, dishwasher , dryer and....

So...guess what?

No one snowflake feels responsible for the avalanche.
I know.... Everyone is God's special snowflake.

 

[jasonc]

Outside the water heater ,heater then ac,your computer,laptop are the largest consumers of power.this I know as my department does surveys.

 

[Edward]

It would be nice to be prepared for outtages and to have the capability to go, off-grid.

I seen some real nice skylights going into a house where I was working. They was about 24 to 30" in diameter, and a round mirrored type surface inside of it. They had 2 in the garage and 3 more throughout the house. They let in enough moonlight to read a book by (working late, lol). I like those.

They have some nice wall hung gas lamps too. It'd be pretty easy to run soft copper lines through the walls for the LP gas.

Couldn't you make a big bank of marine batteries (like, 20-30) and run that to the inverter for normal daily usage, and then every few days (laundry day,lol) fire up the gennie to charge up the batts again? That way you'd only have 1 or 2 noisy days per week...

 

[jasonc]

I will ask but you are swapping masters.the cost of solar power and lp cng over the utilities. I loose security lights after a few days of clouds.at present it's not feasible. Perhaps in the future.if you are on solar and a hurricane Rips it's off ,you will need a generator back up.and it can take days ,or months to get power back.any Florida will know that roofing repairs took two or more years to get done after the 4 hurricanes as the damage was that bad and the lack of roofers along with insurance claim back log

 

[Knotical]

It would be nice to be prepared for outtages and to have the capability to go, off-grid.

I seen some real nice skylights going into a house where I was working. They was about 24 to 30" in diameter, and a round mirrored type surface inside of it. They had 2 in the garage and 3 more throughout the house. They let in enough moonlight to read a book by (working late, lol). I like those.

They have some nice wall hung gas lamps too. It'd be pretty easy to run soft copper lines through the walls for the LP gas.

Couldn't you make a big bank of marine batteries (like, 20-30) and run that to the inverter for normal daily usage, and then every few days (laundry day,lol) fire up the gennie to charge up the batts again? That way you'd only have 1 or 2 noisy days per week...

I would wait for that battery that Elan Musk's company is developing. It would take up way less space.

 

[JohnDB]

Water wheels, or oxen or horses and even bicycles can generate power. All dependant upon how much power you need.

 

[JohnDB]

It would be nice to be prepared for outtages and to have the capability to go, off-grid.

I seen some real nice skylights going into a house where I was working. They was about 24 to 30" in diameter, and a round mirrored type surface inside of it. They had 2 in the garage and 3 more throughout the house. They let in enough moonlight to read a book by (working late, lol). I like those.

They have some nice wall hung gas lamps too. It'd be pretty easy to run soft copper lines through the walls for the LP gas.

Couldn't you make a big bank of marine batteries (like, 20-30) and run that to the inverter for normal daily usage, and then every few days (laundry day,lol) fire up the gennie to charge up the batts again? That way you'd only have 1 or 2 noisy days per week...

There's a loss in stored power like batteries. Also losses over diodes and capacitors and band pass filters and coils. (Parts of an inverter)

Also IR losses. (In wire)

Usually you lose 20% going in and 10% coming out. Then time also... I'm forgetting that rate.

So...a largely renewable source of power.

A gasifer has been fairly successful but the gas isn't storable and a poorly designed or maintained system will have you cleaning your motor to get it to run again. (Organic material is burned to release combustible gases......vehicles have been designed to run off wood pellets and corn)

Google "wood gasifier ".

But like I've said...they tend to gum up carburetors and injectors and valves. Consistent sized pellets really are essential for a clean gas.

There's a way to make soft yellow coal out of tree trimmings and brush...then take that coal and make diesel to burn in a generator. It's complicated and difficult but with some natural resources it can be a good solution for a long term solution.

 

[tim-from-pa]

They have better panels...it's not big business that's squelching it it's our Government... We can't have them which could be cost effective. Mostly because the satellites that watch for radioactive material coming into America can't tell the difference AND the proliferation of technology for purifying uranium...which probably would be done in third world countries... Usually a rogue state.

So they look for new battery technology, new hydrogen ion technology and etc...

I know that it's not power that is the problem... It's consumption.

America uses 25% of the world's power, drives 75% of the world economy and yet feeds 60% of the food supply. But we have roughly 20% of the population of the world.

Since most of the manufacturing is done outside the Nation most of the power consumption is in homes.

Motors and heating elements consuming most of that power.
Your average house or apartment has a minimum of 25 motors in it...really.

3 for your fridge and furnace a piece minimum... Sometimes more. Your computer has a minimum of two if not three to four.
Add in a garbage disposal, ceiling fan, bath fan, washing machine, dishwasher , dryer and....

So...guess what?

No one snowflake feels responsible for the avalanche.
I know.... Everyone is God's special snowflake.

Sorry.... I meant big competing business like gas and oil. And those window "renewal" guys came to my home and after 20 years I wanted replacement windows and he as much as tapped his finger on my table and told me why I DON'T want high solar heat gain coefficient windows in my house (I already aligned my house to the 4-cardinal points like the Great Pyramid and that was the sole purpose of that to get sun- LOL) He told me that admitting the sun in the summer would just make the AC run more (and a lot of other carp) that is not true, but he thought I'd use MORE energy in the long run. For starters, here at 40 degrees north latitude, for south-facing vertical windows in the dead of summer, the sun angle is LOW to the windows and very little sun gets in, plus I have overhangs and reflective blinds to keep the sun out. But in the winter when the sun is direct (high), you can benefit by keeping the furnace off all day. Moral of the story, you can REDUCE the sun in the summer, but if the windows are tinted and the sun can't get in, you have no choice (i.e. you can't INCREASE the sun). In short, he's full of it with serious errors. Me thinks this is big corporate $$$ who wants to push their old energy like that big gas pipeline who wants to take my land by unconstitutional "eminent domain" because "we need the energy". Well, That got me all the more converted to solar type all the more because I'm taking this personally now. While I always believed in it, I now want to make it my job and to shut up some ugly "drill-baby-drill" hags.

 

[JohnDB]

Ummm. They can take your land to build a mall if they want to these days.

An oil pipeline in their eyes is better than a lot of other reasons they might want your land.