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The falling away from the faith and that man of sin

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n2thelight said:
So you saying they would had made the same choice either way,if so ,why did God interfere?
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I'm not saying they would have made the same choice either way. God provided the stimulus they each needed to make the right choice to further His plan. In Jonah's case the 'right' choice was to foolishly resist God before finally capitulating. Pharoah foolishly resisted, gave in, reneged, and clearly brought upon himself and his false gods humiliation before the God of Abraham. Paul's wise choice was the right choice for furthering the reach of the Gospel. Each case serves as a teachable moment for others.
 
Sinthesis said:
I'm not saying they would have made the same choice either way. God provided the stimulus they each needed to make the right choice to further His plan. In Jonah's case the 'right' choice was to foolishly resist God before finally capitulating. Pharoah foolishly resisted, gave in, reneged, and clearly brought upon himself and his false gods humiliation before the God of Abraham. Paul's wise choice was the right choice for furthering the reach of the Gospel. Each case serves as a teachable moment for others.
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Paul made the right choice because Christ appeared before him.Goes back to my original point,Paul was justified before he was ever born,and he didn't even know it,until later
 
n2thelight said:
Paul made the right choice because Christ appeared before him.Goes back to my original point,Paul was justified before he was ever born,and he didn't even know it,until later
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So you believe Paul/Saul was justified while he was persecuting Jesus and Jesus' followers even to the death?

Did Pilate make the right choice when Christ appeared before him?
 
Sinthesis said:
So you believe Paul/Saul was justified while he was persecuting Jesus and Jesus' followers even to the death?

Did Pilate make the right choice when Christ appeared before him?
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Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed thee in the belly I know thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations."

Ephesians 1:4 "According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love:"

Those chosen are the elect,that's why I earlier made the comment that just because one is saved,don't make them of the elect

What does it mean to be "chosen"?

It means that there are certain people that God chosen in the first earth age, to do a task for Him in this flesh earth age. This is not reincarnation, for it is appointed for each of us to go through this earth age, the flesh earth age, once and only once. We read; "...It is appointed unto men once to die [in the flesh], but after this the judgment." Hebrews 9:27 This appointing and choosing took place before the foundation of this earth age; the second earth age [cosmos] that we now live in.

The only way you could understand this is to know that there was a age before this one,and since I know you and most can't see it I'll just leave it alone.

What do you think we were doing before satan rebelled?
 
n2thelight said:
Paul made the right choice because Christ appeared before him.Goes back to my original point,Paul was justified before he was ever born,and he didn't even know it,until later
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Acts 17:
24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;
25 Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;
26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;

No one is here by accident of space, time and circumstances.

27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
 
n2thelight said:
What does it mean to be "chosen"?

It means that there are certain people that God chosen in the first earth age, to do a task for Him in this flesh earth age. This is not reincarnation, for it is appointed for each of us to go through this earth age, the flesh earth age, once and only once. We read; "...It is appointed unto men once to die [in the flesh], but after this the judgment." Hebrews 9:27 This appointing and choosing took place before the foundation of this earth age; the second earth age [cosmos] that we now live in.

The only way you could understand this is to know that there was a age before this one,and since I know you and most can't see it I'll just leave it alone.

What do you think we were doing before satan rebelled?
Click to expand...

We didn't exist before Satan rebelled, except in God's perfect foreknowledge of how His creation would play out.
 
Sinthesis said:
What does the bible say?
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Job 38:4 "Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding."
Job 38:5 "Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?"
Job 38:6 "Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
Job 38:7 "When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for Joy?"

Who were these "sons of God" [the stars that sang], and when did these sons of God sing for Joy? We are talking about the angels here, that sang before the establishment of this earth age of the flesh. All souls were there and Satan also was there with all of them. Some how the people of this earth age are trying to forget Satan and the role that he played at the rebellion in that first earth age. We see that Satan was not in the conversation with Job and his friends at this time. They all have overlooked the overall plan of God. However had Job known the plan of God, where would he have been then, when the foundations of this earth were laid and the angels were rejoicing? Of course He would have been there with the rest of them, where we all were. You see, we the elect of God were chosen before the foundations of this earth were laid, and so was Job.


Ephesians 1:4 "According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world [age], that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love:"


Ephesians 1:5 "Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children of Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,"



 
n2thelight said:
Job 38:4 "Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding."
Job 38:5 "Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?"
Job 38:6 "Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
Job 38:7 "When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for Joy?"

Who were these "sons of God" [the stars that sang], and when did these sons of God sing for Joy? We are talking about the angels here, that sang before the establishment of this earth age of the flesh. All souls were there and Satan also was there with all of them. Some how the people of this earth age are trying to forget Satan and the role that he played at the rebellion in that first earth age. We see that Satan was not in the conversation with Job and his friends at this time. They all have overlooked the overall plan of God. However had Job known the plan of God, where would he have been then, when the foundations of this earth were laid and the angels were rejoicing? Of course He would have been there with the rest of them, where we all were. You see, we the elect of God were chosen before the foundations of this earth were laid, and so was Job.


Ephesians 1:4 "According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world [age], that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love:"


Ephesians 1:5 "Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children of Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,"
Click to expand...

Yet the story you've been telling says that the elect somehow earned their status through their work in some previous age.
 
Does anyone here think it possible the false prophet (/teacher? teaching?) might be that teaching/spirit which has turned Christendom on its ear, namely man's inane theory of evolution? (As origins.) - Which began as a man, Darwin, but now is a white smocked magician with many miracles and modern wonders?

Which will come to include the 666 apparatus/ability, whatever it turns out to be.. and also included the event of 13:13 (which hAs occurred but is missed because we've put Revelation in a box called 7 years from start to finish, which imo, is an error).

I can't help but notice how the man of sin thinks of himself as a god.. the highest power.. and isn't that what 'evolution' declares? And how it says he will not honor any god..

Which I think is the ripe fruit.. of the grapes of wrath.. that there's only two directions in life, toward God or away from God.. Yet God Himself is life(surely?) and also is perfection.. so when God endowed thinking ability which includes choice, a whole new world (tree) of possibilities came about.. This life being an unavoidable journey and lesson, if there's to be thinking ability that is. (This learning of good from evil / life from death,nonlife. I can't believe any scenario or doctrine which assumes God made some sort of mistake or some event took Him by surprise. Nope, I'm thinking it has to be God's endowing thinking ability as it includes the ability to make choices. But obviously God is not after some sort of ant farm.. or robots.)

The false prophet (teaching/theory) being the great delusion which has caused the falling away of the culture from the faith.

The 666 man of sin however, as we know, has not yet been revealed. But 13:13 pinpoints an office- not an individual, but an office said individual is in at one time or another(?) And the false prophet gave this office the capability.

That's my 'theory' anyway..
God bless! :)
 
How blessed that part of our rescue and salvation includes a new and better body! This one being subject to sin (gr- "missing the mark"; flawed; imperfect; sharing the imperfection of our flawed character and nature).

Not that "the flesh" and problem is matter, as the Gnostics thought! For God created.. and said "behold it's all good!" (Glory!) This whole imperfect state can't be some sort of mistake our Heavenly Father made.. or something occurred which was outside His plan, doing and intent, and took Him by surprise, rofl.. as if! :))

And boy oh boy we sure can see that new (old) man of sin with his new God... himself! Man now devoutly and almost violently being asserted as the highest power. (Violently soon enough, harnessing a sword of hate?) Shaking their fist at heaven and Yahweh.. Of course, but for the grace of God... every generation as rebels.. it's just now ripe and progressed, now at the end of the age.. which Jesus will destroy at His coming.. and make of the two.. one, the born again one, so that when all is complete, God will be all in all.. The 'serpent seed totally defeated along with the death, it brings... A spiritual seed, the lower, carnal / flawed nature, all made subject to, by our Heavenly Father... all men everywhere born of Adam so all included.. An unavoidable condition.. or journey/lesson - this life of learning good from evil (learning Life from death/nonlife). Which of course has to be learned.. unless we were to be robots.. or an ant farm!? Because with thinking ability comes choice/ the ability to make choices. (Hence a whole new world/tree of possibilities came about).

And in this way, all born of Adam - and Yahweh only creating the universe and man and woman, not only after the first bound to occur rebel thought occurred, but after that rebel thought had fully matured into outright sedition and trickery! Hence "all in heaven and earth" are learning this foundation lesson (truth) all together at once. (Experience being the best teacher!)

Father being so infinitely wise!!

"As in Adam all die.." 1 Cor. 15:22-28..

He is Perfection and Life.. So imperfection is the opposite of life.. To wander from Him can only ever result in a self destructive puff of smoke; apocalypse.. collapse/destruction being the unveiling of true from untrue..

He is creating the best... in the age to come, we will serve.. 2 ages? the millennium and 'day' of White Throne Judgment..

God bless! :)
 
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