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Bible Study The Judgement of Christ

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I didn't start this Bible study to entice arguments and slanders between the brethren. I present what I believe to be truth, but yet never tell anyone they have to agree with me. I don't read nor do I study out of any book other than the Bible. I do not attend any particular church, but spend many hours a day studying the scriptures out of the KJV and the Jerusalem Bible. If we can not present ourselves pleasing to the Lord and discuss this topic as adults then I will ask the moderators to close this thread.

I give you these scriptures below for your consideration as they are part of what I have based this topic on and my understanding of them

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

John 5:21 For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will. 22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: 23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him. 24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. 25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. 26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself; 27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man. 28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. 38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. 39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him.

Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
 
New #75
I didn't start this Bible study to entice arguments and slanders between the brethren.
i dont see any arguments i just happen to disagree , what needs to be remembered is the same spirit that showed you. has showed others differently .on my part i dont go around saying the spirit showed me. many times i base my belief on much study. the spirit directs me to scriptures i have a older bro who is a pastor we dont agree on everything .same way with my older sister her and her husband believes you should dot every I cross very T or else you will go to hell. there is a security in our salvation . " jumping off that rabbit trail " if we really feared the judgement of God things would be different
 
It’s clear all who are before Him are His servants.
How is that clear? There is no reference to any servants in that passage.
You are inserting the previous
Not the world of unbelievers together with His people.
If they are all believers then none of them would be sent to hell.
What is clear is that those who did not show mercy were definitely NOT believers. If they were believers they would have don their Lords will. (Why do you call me Lord lord but don't do as I say?)
If they were all believers then they wold all inherit the kingdom.
There is no such thing as a believer who does not do the will of the LORD.
All knew He was Lord.
Even demons know He is the Lord.
When He comes, there will be no doubt in anyone's mind, believer or blasphemer, that He is the LORD.
All were expected to express love as His people.
And when they did not express love it was a clear sign that they were not "His people."
The context is clear.
Really?
 
There is only one judgement and it is clearly described in the Mat 25 passage.
Also, when judgment is referred to in the NT, it is referred to as "judgment" (singular) and never as "judgments." (plural)
Mat 25:31 He will sit on the throne of His glory.
Rev 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne
They are both referring to the same thing. (Even if it doesn't make for exciting preaching about two judgments.)

hello Jim Parker, dirtfarmer here

What is "the throne of His glory" but the throne of David in Jerusalem, which it is prophesied that he will set on. The great white throne is not the throne of David. We see from Revelation 20:11 that heaven and earth have fled away.
 
What is "the throne of His glory" but the throne of David in Jerusalem,
NO.
The throne of Glory is not the throne of the glory of David; it is the throne of the Glory of God.
Jesus will come FROM HEAVEN of His throne of Glory, not from earth on a throne that has long ago rotted and turned to dust.
 
How is that clear? There is no reference to any servants in that passage.
You are inserting the previous


I’m inserting the context that starts at Matthew 24:45 and continues through to Matthew 25:30.

Why would you expect anyone to ignore such a meticulous and clear context?


JLB
 
If they are all believers the

I didn’t say the word believers because that would mean they were all obeyers.

The ones on the left were His servants who became disobedient, or never did anything with the measure of faith they were given;
(Unfruitful branches) just as the examples and the context so plainly illustrates.


JLB
 
Why would you expect anyone to ignore such a meticulous and clear context?
Because that
I’m inserting the context that starts at Matthew 24:45 and continues through to Matthew 25:30.
Why would you expect anyone to ignore such a meticulous and clear context?
JLB
Mat 24:45Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his master made ruler over his household, to give them food in due season?"
This introduces a teaching about being a wise and faithful servant.
The servant who is not faithful and who acts foolishly will be excluded from the kingdom of heaven.
(Mat 24:51)
Mat 25:1Then the kingdom of heaven shall be likened to ten virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom."
This introduces a similar teaching abut being prepared for when the Kingdom comes.
She who does not maintain that preparedness will be excluded from the kingdom of God. (Mat 25:12)
Mat 25:14For the kingdom of heaven is like a man traveling to a far country, who called his own servants and delivered his goods to them."
This introduces a teaching about putting to use the gifts of God for the glory of God.
He who fails to do so will be excluded from the kingdom of heaven. (Mat 25:30)
Mat 25:31-32When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats."
This introduces the teaching about how Jesus will judge between the righteous and the wicked.

There is no indication that the judgment of "all nations" is limited to only the "servants of the Lord."
The context in no manner requires or even suggests such an notion.
 
The ones on the left were His servants who became disobedient, or never did anything with the measure of faith they were given;
There is nothing there to suggest that "all nations" are only "His servants"
There is no reason whatsoever to imagine that "all nations" means anything other than "all nations."
The three "Kingdom is like" teachings are for those who consider themselves to be servants. They teach that being a servant requires faithfulness and preparedness.
The teaching about the basis of judgment, however, applies, as it says it does, to all nations.
 
The earthly throne of David no longer exist in Jerusalem, but is now the heavenly throne of Christ in heaven. Jesus is not coming back to Jerusalem to sit on a literal throne of David as since His resurrection He rules from His throne in heaven at the right had of the Father.

Jeremiah 22:28 Is this man Coniah a despised broken idol? is he a vessel wherein is no pleasure? wherefore are they cast out, he and his seed, and are cast into a land which they know not? 29 O earth, earth, earth, hear the word of the LORD. 30 Thus saith the LORD, Write ye this man childless, a man that shall not prosper in his days: for no man of his seed shall prosper, sitting upon the throne of David, and ruling any more in Judah.

Jeremiah prophesied that no descendant of Jeconiah can ever sit on the throne of David in Judah. Jesus is a literal descendant of Jeconiah through Mary's genealogy and since there is no more throne in Judah (Jerusalem) the throne of His glory is the throne of David in heaven.

Jesus sits on His throne in heaven at the right hand of God until the last enemy, which is death, will be abolished at the resurrection, Acts 2:34-36; 1 Corinthians 15:25, 26; Hebrews 1:3, 8, 13; 10:11-13; Rev 3:21; John 5:28, 29; 6:40.

Jesus is reigning from the throne of His glory on the throne of David in heaven until His second coming when He returns an makes an end to all abominations, Rev 19:11-21. At that time everyone that are in the grave will hear His voice to rise from their graves and final judgement is made on the quick and the dead, Acts 10:42-48, John 5:28, 29.

1 Corinthians 15:22-28 at the second coming Jesus hands over the kingdom to God that He has ruled since His resurrection. Zechariah 6:12, 13 Jesus will be priest and king at the same time as He has built His temple, which is His church that is His temple, 1 Corinthians 3:16, 17.

One Lord, one faith, one baptism as all who believe in Him at His coming will not be condemned, but receive their rewards as a faithful servant as Jesus gathers all nations (quick and the dead) before Him as He separates the sheep from the goats as all must appear before Him, the sheep on His right hand and the goats on His left hand as final judgement is made for all, 2 Corinthians 5:10.

One resurrection on the last day, two separate judgements right hand left hand, all done at the great white throne judgement when the books are opened, including the Lamb's book of life and all are judged out of them as final judgement is made on all, Rev 20:11-15.
 
Mat 24:45Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his master made ruler over his household, to give them food in due season?"
This introduces a teaching about being a wise and faithful servant.
The servant who is not faithful and who acts foolishly will be excluded from the kingdom of heaven.

Exactly.


Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his master made ruler over his household, to give them food in due season?


Now look at Matthew 25 with that understanding.


“Then He will also say to those on the left hand, Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; Matthew 25:41


JLB
 
There is no indication that the judgment of "all nations" is limited to only the "servants of the Lord."
The context in no manner requires or even suggests such an notion.


Every ethnic group that comprises His servants.

Just because their are people of different ethnic groups there before Him, doesn't mean they are not His people.


Where do you see unbelievers, people who rejected Jesus Christ, in the Judgement of Matthew 25?


“When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats.


“Then He will also say to those on the left hand, Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’
“Then they also will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to You?’ Then He will answer them, saying, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.” Matthew 25:31-32,41-46



10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each of us may receive what is due us for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad. 2 Corinthians 5:10


  • Do you believe "we" refers to all people, believers and unbelievers, or His people?


17 For the time has come for judgment to begin at the house of God; and if it begins with us first, what will be the end of those who do not obey the gospel of God? 18 Now “If the righteous one is scarcely saved, where will the ungodly and the sinner appear?” 1 Peter 4:17-18


  • “If the righteous one is scarcely saved, where will the ungodly and the sinner appear?”



JLB
 
There is nothing there to suggest that "all nations" are only "His servants"


Of course there is, it's called context.


Matthew 24:45-25:46 is all about when Jesus returns and Judges His people according to their deeds.



But in accordance with your hardness and your impenitent heart you are treasuring up for yourself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, who “will render to each one according to his deeds”: eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath, tribulation and anguish, on every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek; but glory, honor, and peace to everyone who works what is good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. For there is no partiality with God. Romans 2:5-11


God who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:

  • eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;
  • but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,


JLB
 
Matthew 24:45-25:46 is all about when Jesus returns and Judges His people according to their deeds.

24:25 - 25:30 is about judging people who are his servants and people who just say they are His servants.
Mat 24:45Who then is a faithful and wise servant"
Mat 25:1Then the kingdom of heaven shall be likened
Mat 25:14For the kingdom of heaven is like
Those teachings are about faithful and unfaithful servants.
Mat 25:31-32When the Son of Man comes in His glory,
That teaching is about the basis on which Jesus will judge the entire world, servants and other wise.
"All nations" actually means "all nations."
 
Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

One resurrection, two different judgements of the quick and the dead, two final destinations all done at the judgement seat of Christ at the Great White Throne Judgement where the books, including the Lamb's book of life, are then and only then opened and all are judged out of them. Rev 20:11-15.

Below are the goats Jesus will gather to His left hand and they will be judge at the same time as the sheep on His right hand. Right hand and left hand is not a mixture of right and left, but one final judgement as the right hand will inherit the kingdom prepared for them from the foundation of the world. Those on the left hand will go away into everlasting punishment. John 5:28, 29.

Rev 3:15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. 16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. 17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: 18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. 19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. 20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. 21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne. 22 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

Matthew 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 For I was an hungered, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: 43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. 44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungered, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? 45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. 46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
 
24:25 - 25:30 is about judging people who are his servants and people who just say they are His servants.
Mat 24:45Who then is a faithful and wise servant"
Mat 25:1Then the kingdom of heaven shall be likened
Mat 25:14For the kingdom of heaven is like
Those teachings are about faithful and unfaithful servants.
Mat 25:31-32When the Son of Man comes in His glory,
That teaching is about the basis on which Jesus will judge the entire world, servants and other wise.
"All nations" actually means "all nations."

All nations does mean all nations “ethnic groups” Jews and Gentiles, who are comprised of His people.

Not the world.


JLB
 
All nations does mean all nations “ethnic groups” Jews and Gentiles, who are comprised of His people.
Not the world.
JLB
That is your eisegesis
Mat 25:32a “All the nations will be gathered before Him,
The phrase is "all nations" (πάντα τὰ ἔθνη - nominative case).
It is the same word used at Acts 2:5: "And there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men, from every nation (παντὸς ἔθνους - genitive case) under heaven."
The same Greek word is used in both caces. In Acts, Luke goes on to describe those nations. They include: "Parthians and Medes and Elamites, Cretans and Arabs." Those are an example of what is meant by the Koine Greek word (ἔθνος ethnos) that is translated into English as "nations."
There is nothing in the text to warrant your reduction of the meaning of the word to "Jews and Gentiles."
It is necessary for you only because of the particular theological view you have taken but certainly not because the text requires or even suggest it.
 
That is your eisegesis
Mat 25:32a “All the nations will be gathered before Him,
The phrase is "all nations" (πάντα τὰ ἔθνη - nominative case).
It is the same word used at Acts 2:5: "And there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men, from every nation (παντὸς ἔθνους - genitive case) under heaven."
The same Greek word is used in both caces. In Acts, Luke goes on to describe those nations. They include: "Parthians and Medes and Elamites, Cretans and Arabs." Those are an example of what is meant by the Koine Greek word (ἔθνος ethnos) that is translated into English as "nations."
There is nothing in the text to warrant your reduction of the meaning of the word to "Jews and Gentiles."
It is necessary for you only because of the particular theological view you have taken but certainly not because the text requires or even suggest it.

Really? So ethnos the word we get ethnic from doesn’t refer to Gentiles?

Ethnos - Strong’s # 1484

a multitude (whether of men or of beasts) associated or living together
a company, troop, swarm
a multitude of individuals of the same nature or genus
the human family
a tribe, nation, people group
in the OT, foreign nations not worshipping the true God, pagans, Gentiles
Paul uses the term for Gentile Christians



JLB
 
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