R
Runner
Guest
I'm fresh from being banned on a very large religion forum where Christians, atheists, Buddhists, Muslims and New Agers mingle together. You mingle, however, only so long as the mostly atheist moderators find you tolerable. When a Christian actually meets their arguments head-on and tosses their ridicule and sarcasm back in their faces, he's history.
I was surprised, however, that my angriest opponents were not New Atheists but rather people calling themselves Christians. I came away believing this new breed of "Christian" poses a bigger threat to Christianity than the New Atheists could ever hope to be.
In this new "Christianity," God is purely a God of "love" - and love means "tolerance," nothing more and nothing less. God is essentially a doddering old grandfather who finds his grandkids' antics endlessly amusing and just wants them to have a good time, no matter how depraved their conduct might be.
In order to reinvent Christianity in this manner, you must (1) flush the entire Old Testament ("primitive hogwash" unworthy of God as we would like to imagine him); (2) disregard large swaths of the New Testament (Jesus simply "never said" anything we don't like, and Paul was of course beyond the pale); (3) toss out 2,000 years of Christian scholarship, leadership and worship; and (4) ignore core doctrines such as sin, repentance, atonement and salvation. Jesus' life, death and resurrection had nothing to do with anything you might describe as "atonement." No, Jesus was just giving us an example of how much God loves us, just the way we are.
I kept pointing out that "love = tolerance" is standard New Age treacle. I have no objection in principle to New Age treacle, just don't call it Christianity. How far would I get in the Muslim community if I insisted I were a Muslim but believed in the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus and thought Muhammad was a minor league bozo? These new "Christians," however, seem to think Christianity is fair game for anything and everything you want to call by that name. How about this, from a New Age website: "Ascended Master Jesus has recently become Chohan of the 2nd Ray." Is that Christianity?
To these new "Christians," God is solely a God of "love," the only commandment is "love your neighbor," and loving your neighbor means "tolerating and even celebrating everything your neighbor does," even if the Bible clearly condemns it and even if it is detrimental to the functioning of society as God intended. If you do this, your neighbor will be equally tolerant of you.
I kept pointing out that the God of Christianity is a God of perfect holiness, perfect justice and perfect love. The three are tied together as intimately as the three persons of the Trinity. You can't just separate out love, reformulate it as tolerance for everyone and everything, and claim this is Christianity.
But they do. And there are apparently a lot more of them than I had realized. In their view, I as a mainstream Christian was no Christian at all. This is actually what was stated: I had no understanding of Christianity whatsoever, was a mindless "fundie," and was an embarrassing example of everything wrong with Christianity today.
I will give one atheist credit. He pointed out that mainstream Christians at least have integrity. They accept God as he has revealed himself, even though they may be puzzled or even disturbed by some of what he has revealed. The new breed of "Christians," in contrast, just selectively cherry-pick the parts of Christianity they "like" and call the new religion they have invented Christianity.
If I were Satan and were hell-bent on deceiving mankind, I would not bother with cartoonish silliness like the Church of Satan or Wiccanism. No, I'd concentrate my efforts on a plausible counterfeit of Christianity, one that is attractive and appealing but that robs real Christianity of its core message and its explanatory power. Something like "God just wants you to love your neighbor" and "loving your neighbor means tolerating and celebrating everything your neighbor does." This is not the only counterfeit out there, but it appears to be one of the most appealing and deceptive.
"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires, and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths." 2 Timothy 4:3-4 (NASB). Bingo, that time is here.
I was surprised, however, that my angriest opponents were not New Atheists but rather people calling themselves Christians. I came away believing this new breed of "Christian" poses a bigger threat to Christianity than the New Atheists could ever hope to be.
In this new "Christianity," God is purely a God of "love" - and love means "tolerance," nothing more and nothing less. God is essentially a doddering old grandfather who finds his grandkids' antics endlessly amusing and just wants them to have a good time, no matter how depraved their conduct might be.
In order to reinvent Christianity in this manner, you must (1) flush the entire Old Testament ("primitive hogwash" unworthy of God as we would like to imagine him); (2) disregard large swaths of the New Testament (Jesus simply "never said" anything we don't like, and Paul was of course beyond the pale); (3) toss out 2,000 years of Christian scholarship, leadership and worship; and (4) ignore core doctrines such as sin, repentance, atonement and salvation. Jesus' life, death and resurrection had nothing to do with anything you might describe as "atonement." No, Jesus was just giving us an example of how much God loves us, just the way we are.
I kept pointing out that "love = tolerance" is standard New Age treacle. I have no objection in principle to New Age treacle, just don't call it Christianity. How far would I get in the Muslim community if I insisted I were a Muslim but believed in the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus and thought Muhammad was a minor league bozo? These new "Christians," however, seem to think Christianity is fair game for anything and everything you want to call by that name. How about this, from a New Age website: "Ascended Master Jesus has recently become Chohan of the 2nd Ray." Is that Christianity?
To these new "Christians," God is solely a God of "love," the only commandment is "love your neighbor," and loving your neighbor means "tolerating and even celebrating everything your neighbor does," even if the Bible clearly condemns it and even if it is detrimental to the functioning of society as God intended. If you do this, your neighbor will be equally tolerant of you.
I kept pointing out that the God of Christianity is a God of perfect holiness, perfect justice and perfect love. The three are tied together as intimately as the three persons of the Trinity. You can't just separate out love, reformulate it as tolerance for everyone and everything, and claim this is Christianity.
But they do. And there are apparently a lot more of them than I had realized. In their view, I as a mainstream Christian was no Christian at all. This is actually what was stated: I had no understanding of Christianity whatsoever, was a mindless "fundie," and was an embarrassing example of everything wrong with Christianity today.
I will give one atheist credit. He pointed out that mainstream Christians at least have integrity. They accept God as he has revealed himself, even though they may be puzzled or even disturbed by some of what he has revealed. The new breed of "Christians," in contrast, just selectively cherry-pick the parts of Christianity they "like" and call the new religion they have invented Christianity.
If I were Satan and were hell-bent on deceiving mankind, I would not bother with cartoonish silliness like the Church of Satan or Wiccanism. No, I'd concentrate my efforts on a plausible counterfeit of Christianity, one that is attractive and appealing but that robs real Christianity of its core message and its explanatory power. Something like "God just wants you to love your neighbor" and "loving your neighbor means tolerating and celebrating everything your neighbor does." This is not the only counterfeit out there, but it appears to be one of the most appealing and deceptive.
"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires, and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths." 2 Timothy 4:3-4 (NASB). Bingo, that time is here.