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The Scriptures and Jesus Christ

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#1
i am more than happy to hash this out in another post . we been asked not keep debating this in this post. i had one post deleted and that does not make a happy camper.. so you or anyone else can start a post on the word of God and reading it..
K2, The Bible is Christ! In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God..(John 1:1). The same was in the beginning with God (John 1:2)
The Scriptures are our Bible. They are holy writings. That is, God caused them to be written. We can even see specific places in the Scriptures where God actually told someone to write down something. So the Scriptures are clearly meant to be read by us, and I believe the Lord knew what He was doing when He had people write them.

Now we like to call the Scriptures, "The Word of God". The reason seems obvious. He had them written, so they must be "The Word of God". I understand and this is not an argument about semantics. If the preacher at church says, "Open the Word up to Gen 15:1", I understand he is talking about the Bible as the Word.

Yet there is a problem, and a very serious problem that can happen. People can get confused and start thinking the reading and studying the Bible gives them eternal life. They can start thinking that because they know the Bible and study it, they are going to heaven. And if they think that they are not going to seek the Lord Jesus Christ and His voice, because they think they are already hearing it when they read and study the Scriptures.

Now God did cover this problem in the Bible in a number of places and in a number of ways. Jesus flat out told the Jews,

Jn 5:39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me, and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.

In the above verse we clearly see there is the Scriptures, that people search, and Jesus Christ who the Jews did not come to even though they were studying the Scriptures. So we can not say, "The Bible is Christ!" and be correct. The Scripture about reproves that issue!!!

So does that mean that we don't need to read and study the Scriptures? Of course not. For one thing, the Scriptures are good for reproof. I just used them for that purpose. And I can use another for that same purpose.

Gal 3:22 But the Scriptures has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those that believe.

Again there are the Scriptures, which has shut up everyone under sin, and Jesus Christ whom we have via a promise of finding by faith.

And Paul concludes, based upon the understanding above, Gal 3:24 Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ.

So the Scriptures are good for leading us to Jesus Christ. Which we also see as a reason to read and study them, in 2 Tim

2 Tim 15,16 ...the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All Scriptures is inspired b God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction...

So we should read and study the Scriptures, but are we preaching the Scriptures? The answer is NO!

Now a couple of verses later we read, 2 Tim 4:2 preach the word, be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience.

So here is the subject that need reproof, rebuke, and so forth, with great patience.

The Greek word used for Scriptures (your Bible) is Graphe. When you see "Scriptures" in the New Testament, it came from the Greek word Graphe, and Graphe is not translated "Word" So we are not told to preach the Scriptures, your Bible. And because we like to call the Bible the "Word of God" for reasons already discussed, we get that confused.

So what was Paul telling us when he wrote to preach the word? Well, He was telling us about Jesus Christ, of course!!!

In the Bible (the Scriptures) we see the Jesus Christ is called the Word of God. That is His name!!!!

Rev 19:13 He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.

Since it is in the book Revelation, it is obviously a revelation for some and some point. And it is at the end of the Bible, so you can figure that a person could read the entire Bible and not have gotten that, so God had it revealed at the end.

So why was it missed, and is it still missed?

I'm glad you asked, but I had better wrap up the OP
 
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#2
The Scriptures are our Bible. They are holy writings. That is, God caused them to be written. We can even see specific places in the Scriptures where God actually told someone to write down something. So the Scriptures are clearly meant to be read by us, and I believe the Lord knew what He was doing when He had people write them.

Now we like to call the Scriptures, "The Word of God". The reason seems obvious. He had them written, so they must be "The Word of God". I understand and this is not an argument about semantics. If the preacher at church says, "Open the Word up to Gen 15:1", I understand he is talking about the Bible as the Word.

Yet there is a problem, and a very serious problem that can happen. People can get confused and start thinking the reading and studying the Bible gives them eternal life. They can start thinking that because they know the Bible and study it, they are going to heaven. And if they think that they are not going to seek the Lord Jesus Christ and His voice, because they think they are already hearing it when they read and study the Scriptures.

Now God did cover this problem in the Bible in a number of places and in a number of ways. Jesus flat out told the Jews,

Jn 5:39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me, and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.

In the above verse we clearly see there is the Scriptures, that people search, and Jesus Christ who the Jews did not come to even though they were studying the Scriptures. So we can not say, "The Bible is Christ!" and be correct. The Scripture about reproves that issue!!!

So does that mean that we don't need to read and study the Scriptures? Of course not. For one thing, the Scriptures are good for reproof. I just used them for that purpose. And I can use another for that same purpose.

Gal 3:22 But the Scriptures has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those that believe.

Again there are the Scriptures, which has shut up everyone under sin, and Jesus Christ whom we have via a promise of finding by faith.

And Paul concludes, based upon the understanding above, Gal 3:24 Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ.

So the Scriptures are good for leading us to Jesus Christ. Which we also see as a reason to read and study them, in 2 Tim

2 Tim 15,16 ...the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All Scriptures is inspired b God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction...

So we should read and study the Scriptures, but are we preaching the Scriptures? The answer is NO!

Now a couple of verses later we read, 2 Tim 4:2 preach the word, be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience.

So here is the subject that need reproof, rebuke, and so forth, with great patience.

The Greek word used for Scriptures (your Bible) is Graphe. When you see "Scriptures" in the New Testament, it came from the Greek word Graphe, and Graphe is not translated "Word" So we are not told to preach the Scriptures, your Bible. And because we like to call the Bible the "Word of God" for reasons already discussed, we get that confused.

So what was Paul telling us when he wrote to preach the word? Well, He was telling us about Jesus Christ, of course!!!

In the Bible (the Scriptures) we see the Jesus Christ is called the Word of God. That is His name!!!!

Rev 19:13 He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.

Since it is in the book Revelation, it is obviously a revelation for some and some point. And it is at the end of the Bible, so you can figure that a person could read the entire Bible and not have gotten that, so God had it revealed at the end.

So why was it missed, and is it still missed?

I'm glad you asked, but I had better wrap up the OP
i see you made your own post i am removing mine
 
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#3
So why was it missed, and is it still missed?
Why did we miss the fact that Jesus Christ is the Word of God?

It's not because the Scriptures don't have it correct. They do. It is because when we got zealous for the Scriptures instead of the Lord Jesus Christ, we got adamant about calling the Scriptures "The Word of God", we confuse the Scriptures with Jesus Christ. This happened because we started searching the Scriptures thinking in them we had eternal life instead of seeking the Lord. But we don't understand we are doing that.

Let me explain. Jesus Christ is called the Word of God because He is the One that owns the words of God. They are actually His. Of the Father, Son, and Spirit, the words of God belong to the Son. And what happens is that the Spirit of God takes those words from the Son and speaks them to us. So we can have a conversation with Jesus Christ.

Thus the Spirit of God works kind of like a living telephone line to Jesus Christ, the Son.

Jn 16:13 But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own intiative, but whatever e hears , He will speak...

You seek how that works? The Spirit speaks, but He does not speak His words, but He speaks what He hears. It is just like what a telephone does. And when I am talking to my brother on the phone, I might say I am on the phone, but I don't say I am talking to the phone. I am talking to my brother. In the say way, I might say I am in the Spirit, but I don't say I am talking to the Spirit but I am talking to Jesus Christ. Of course I am actually taking to the phone and hearing the phone when I talk to my brother, and I am actually talking to the Spirit and hearing from the Spirit when I am talking to Jesus Christ.

The point of all this is that I can have a personal conversation with Jesus Christ!!!! That is why He is called the Word of God!!!

So isn't that the same thing that happens when a person reads the Scriptures?? Of course NOT!!

If you pick up a book and read it can you now go over to there house a say you know them? Of course NOT!!

Jesus said there would be many on that day who would tell Him that they healed the sick in His name, cast out demons in His name, and even prophesied in His name, but He was going to tell them He never knew them!!! How does that happen?? I mean this is terrible, that people should be doing all that and wind up in hell instead of heaven. What a mistake!!@

You have to know Him, and that mean having a personal relationship with Him. That means seeking Him and not just studying and reading the Book He had written. But "Many" are going to make that mistake, because we think the Scriptures are Him.

We Christians, by calling both the Scriptures and Jesus Christ, "The Word of God" have caused confusion.
 
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#4
i see you made your own post i am removing mine
Yeah, the Lord woke me up in the middle of the night (on the west coast) and actually said "Please" and asked me to do this. I'm going long, but it is an important topic. :)
 
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#5
Why did we miss the fact that Jesus Christ is the Word of God?
no body denies this . we are to study the word of GOD be doers of the word not hearers only .. every thing you posted was scripture ..so at some point and time you studied..that or you just copied and pasted something you found.. you can not do >Apologetics with out study...
We Christians, by calling both the Scriptures and Jesus Christ, "The Word of God" have caused confusion.
no confusion here just your argument
 
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#6
When we call two separate things by the same name we can cause confusion. Jesus Christ is a person, the Son. The Scriptures are a thing, the Sacred Writings. The confusion is a lot like that in the Abbot and Costello "Who's on first" comedy routine. The key to understanding the confusion in 'Who's on first' is understanding the "Who" is the name of the first baseman. And this is also a key to understanding the Bible.

Since "The Word of God" is the name of Jesus Christ, 'Jesus Christ' can be put in for 'the Word of God' and give us an understanding.

For example, Jn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. He was in the beginning with God.

Now to me, it seems pretty obvious that this is referring to Jesus Christ and not the Scriptures, but people get this wrong.

K2, The Bible is Christ! In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God..(John 1:1). The same was in the beginning with God (John 1:2)
The Scriptures, as writings, were not in the beginning. So we can not write correctly, 'In the beginning was the Scriptures. However we can write correctly 'In the beginning was Jesus Chist, and Jesus Christ was with God, and Jesus Christ was God.

Now Jn 1:3 All things came into being through Him...

So as a thing, the writing came into being through Him. Hey, He told people Like Moses and Paul to write and so they did, but Moses did not have the writing of Paul. They had not yet come into being.
 
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#7
no body denies this . we are to study the word of GOD be doers of the word not hearers only .. every thing you posted was scripture ..so at some point and time you studied..that or you just copied and pasted something you found.. you can not do >Apologetics with out study... no confusion here just your argument
It is not true to say no body denies this!! You are saying that you don't deny this, and I understand that. If Douglas Summers writes "The Bible is Christ!, then reading must be hearing. You understand the differences, but still, if your first advice and primarily advice to others it to study the Bible instead of seek the Lord, how well do you understand this. And if you are writing "study the word of GOD, instead of get to personally know the word of GOD, are you intent on leading people to Jesus Christ or getting them to search the Scriptures, in order to get eternal life. What are you actually doing. What is your real advice?

Are you actually following Jesus Christ by being lead by His voice. He, as I told you, got me personally up to write this. He even said 'please' because I don't really like doing this. And of course at some point I studied. He told me to!! He tells me to read, He tells me to look up things. Tonight He told me to get up in the middle of the night to post. He talks to me. That is the whole point!!

And if He will talk to me, He will talk to anyone!! I assure you He will! But who is willing to listen?

That being the case. Are we preaching the Bible as the Word, meaning we have to study it, or Jesus Christ as the Word, meaning we have to listen to Him.

If you listen He will most likely tell you to read and study the Bible, But what if you don't have one. What if you can't read. Abraham didn't have a Bible to study, but where are you going to find him? The Pharisees studied, and where are you going to find them? And there is nothing new under the sun. There are people studying but are going to wind up in hell, because some people "deny this". And if we are making it about studying the Bible instead of listening to the Lord, haven't we been leading them to think the Scriptures are going to give them eternal life. How come the Pharisees didn't know Jesus Christ when He showed up. They learned from someone, didn't they?

So when someone writes and tell us they read the Scriptures and found them boring so stopped reading them are we:
[A] Going to point them back to the Scriptures, which they read and found boring
or Going to point them to Jesus Christ so they can come to know Him

My friends, Jesus Christ is the Word of God we are preaching!!

We may and do call both the Scriptures and Jesus Christ the Word of God, but Jesus is not the Sacred Writings, He is the Lord. He is your Lord if you are talking to and hearing from Him. He will have to read the Scriptures, but life with Him is so very much more that reading and studying the Scriptures!!! It might mean He wakes you up in the middle of the night and say, "Karl, will you please get up and post" because there is a message He needs to get across. Funny, it is the same message that is in the Scriptures, but we don't get it.

Mat 17:5 "This is My beloved Son, with whom I am well-pleased; listen to Him!"

That's it, that is the message!

Is 1:2 Listen, O heavens, and hear O earth; For the Lord speaks

There it is again, that is the message!

Jn 18;37 ... Everyone who is of the truth hears My voice

And again.

Do you have ears to hear?

The message is about hearing from Him who speaks. His name is called the Word of God, and He is the Christ whom we call Jesus because He, and not the Scriptures, is our salvation!
 
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#8
So here is the subject that need reproof, rebuke, and so forth, with great patience.

The Greek word used for Scriptures (your Bible) is Graphe. When you see "Scriptures" in the New Testament, it came from the Greek word Graphe, and Graphe is not translated "Word" So we are not told to preach the Scriptures, your Bible. And because we like to call the Bible the "Word of God" for reasons already discussed, we get that confused.

So what was Paul telling us when he wrote to preach the word? Well, He was telling us about Jesus Christ, of course!!!

In the Bible (the Scriptures) we see the Jesus Christ is called the Word of God. That is His name!!!!

Rev 19:13 He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.

Since it is in the book Revelation, it is obviously a revelation for some and some point. And it is at the end of the Bible, so you can figure that a person could read the entire Bible and not have gotten that, so God had it revealed at the end.
K2, you go through such length to try to prove you are not wrong that by the time you are done it is like (as an example) saying that 1+3 is 13! You are all over the place?
 
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#9
When we call two separate things by the same name we can cause confusion. Jesus Christ is a person, the Son. The Scriptures are a thing, the Sacred Writings. The confusion is a lot like that in the Abbot and Costello "Who's on first" comedy routine. The key to understanding the confusion in 'Who's on first' is understanding the "Who" is the name of the first baseman. And this is also a key to understanding the Bible.

Since "The Word of God" is the name of Jesus Christ, 'Jesus Christ' can be put in for 'the Word of God' and give us an understanding.

For example, Jn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. He was in the beginning with God.

Now to me, it seems pretty obvious that this is referring to Jesus Christ and not the Scriptures, but people get

The Scriptures, as writings, were not in the beginning. So we can not write correctly, 'In the beginning was the Scriptures. However we can write correctly 'In the beginning was Jesus Chist, and Jesus Christ was with God, and Jesus Christ was God.

Now Jn 1:3 All things came into being through Him...

So as a thing, the writing came into being through Him. Hey, He told people Like Moses and Paul to write and so they did, but Moses did not have the writing of Paul. They had not yet come into being.
???
 
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#10
Do you have ears to hear?
i hear through the written scriptures ..not trying to be judgmental but your way out in left field
He is the Christ whom we call Jesus because He, and not the Scriptures, is our salvation!
i have never seen any one claim scripture is salvation .but scripture can lead to salvation 2 Timothy 3:16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, you have took the importance of the reading of God word and watered it down. i can not agree with your post
 
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#11
i hear through the written scriptures ..not trying to be judgmental but your way out in left field i have never seen any one claim scripture is salvation .but scripture can lead to salvation 2 Timothy 3:16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, you have took the importance of the reading of God word and watered it down. i can not agree with your post
No, we don't hear through the written Scriptures. We hear through the Holy Spirit, He might talk to us while we are reading the Scriptures, but it is the Spirit of God that speaks. He doesn't speak on His own imitative but as He hears He speaks! The Spirit takes the words of God that Jesus owns and speaks them to you. In that way you can hear from Jesus Christ, whose name is called the Word of God. Never-the-less it is the Spirit that actually speaks to our spirit.

Also, the Holy Spirit is not the only spirit that exists! Satan also quoted Scriptures, and that to Jesus of all things. So even if you hear a spirit talking to you while you read the Bible, you still need to test the spirits. And all this is explained in the Scriptures. Because we can find valuable information like this in the Scriptures, the Scriptures are certainly worth reading and studying, but if we read and we missed this information, then what?

What amazes me, is that a person that knows and hears from the Lord Jesus Christ should obviously understand this whether it is explained in the Scriptures of not. Moses, who did not have the Scriptures, knew about hearing with his spiritual ears. That is how he knew what to do. He got personal instructions from the Lord, and Moses knew the word was near you, though he did not have Scripture. So Moses wrote this information down to explain this to other people. And it is not different today.

The Lord woke me up in the middle of the night, last night. He talked to me and asked me to start this thread. The Scriptures didn't tell me to do that, but the Spirit of God spoke to me the words and request Jesus Christ had for me. Being an person, I told Him I was tired, and that I wanted to go back to sleep. So about three times (I'm not sure exactly how many because I was sleepy) He had to tell me and even said "Please". I heard that. And I was not reading the Scriptures. So I hear Him and it is different from reading the Scriptures, it is hearing from a person, the person of Jesus Christ.

Now Jesus explained to the Pharisees that they didn't hear His voice, and also asked why they didn't understand what He was saying, then He explained that it was because they didn't hear His words. Yet they read and studied the Scriptures.

Jn 8:43 Why do you not understand what I am saying? If is because you cannot hear My words.

Jesus said that to a group of people the studied the Scriptures as much as anyone of that day. The good news is that Jesus Christ stands at the door and knocks, and if anyone will hear His voice and open the door, He will come into them and eat with them and them with Him.

I tell you, if you seek the Lord you will find Him. He is not the Scriptures, of course. He is not writings but is a living and active person, and He send His Holy Spirit to speak to you the words for God He has for you personally!

Jn 16:13 But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak.... (14) He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you. All things that theFather has are Mine

All things would include the words of God. So it is not the Bible that speaks, but the Holy Spirit. And He speaks the words of God, which belong to the Son. This all happens by hearing with faith, not reading.

Gal 3:2 This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?
Gal 3:22 But the Scriptures has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.

I believe Jesus Christ, the person, never leaves me. So I hear from Him. Everyday I hear from Him. I have heard from Him today so much. From when He got me up at 3 Am to start this thread. To Him asking me to take ask my wife if she would like to go looking around yard sales. To telling me where He wanted me to have lunch, and where to get gas, and to having me take $4o out at the bank, to having me call me Son, and Daughter to catch up on things with them. It is like Isaiah wrote:

Is 30:21 Your ears will hear a word behind you, "This is the way, walk in it" whenever you turn to the right of to the left.

I don't always hear Him as often as today. I don't always listen like I should. But usually about a dozen different times a day, and most of it does not concern the reading of the Bible, though it can include where to read in the Bible and explanations and revelations about the Bible. But someone can't understand this if they do not hear His voice, can they?
 
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#12
Yeah, I know you think Jesus Christ is the Scriptures. And you are unwilling to accept my testimony about hearing the Lord. So you are going to have to take and approach of just saying I am all over the place and writing "???".

If you knew the person of Jesus Christ, you would know He is not a book but a person who talks to us. But if you don't hear His words spoken to you personally, how are you going to understand?

I would suggest that you start asking Jesus Christ to explain the Scriptures you read and listen the best you can in your spirit for His small voice. Then perhaps you can start separating the person of Jesus Christ from the book He had written to tell you about Him. Then you can start asking Him about other things in your life.
 
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#13
Yeah, I know you think Jesus Christ is the Scriptures. And you are unwilling to accept my testimony about hearing the Lord. So you are going to have to take and approach of just saying I am all over the place and writing "???".

If you knew the person of Jesus Christ, you would know He is not a book but a person who talks to us. But if you don't hear His words spoken to you personally, how are you going to understand?

I would suggest that you start asking Jesus Christ to explain the Scriptures you read and listen the best you can in your spirit for His small voice.(I have not known Christ to have a small voice, But a strong, powerful and reassuring voice of authority, and yet, a voice of mercy and grace) Then perhaps you can start separating the person of Jesus Christ from the book He had written to tell you about Him. Then you can start asking Him about other things in your life.
I hear Him K2, as all born again believers do, He is in us (Gal. 2:20). I did not say He was not in you either. Christ said let the wheat and the tares grow together till the time of the harvest (Matt. 13:24-30)...but He did not say they should rule together. It is the word of God that confirms the will of The Spirit (1 Cor. 2:10-16). But if Christ be in you (Rom. 8:9-11) Then we should not be CONTROLLED by the flesh. Tell me exactly why you think I'm wrong (by Scripture) and what is Christ telling you about me so I can correct the things He tells you I should change.

Thanks
Christ in us
Douglas Summers
 
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#14
No, we don't hear through the written Scriptures. We hear through the Holy Spirit, He might talk to us while we are reading the Scriptures, but it is the Spirit of God that speaks. He doesn't speak on His own imitative but as He hears He speaks! The Spirit takes the words of God that Jesus owns and speaks them to you. In that way you can hear from Jesus Christ, whose name is called the Word of God. Never-the-less it is the Spirit that actually speaks to our spirit.
lol you believe how you want .the scriptures do speak and yes everything is done through the agent of the Holy Spirit . when Jesus said it is written .he was using scripture the word of God sharper than a two edged sword faith comes by hearing HEARING comes from the word of God
3 Now ye are clean through the word scripture which I have spoken unto you.

4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.

5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

2 Peter 3:15-17Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
15 Also, regard the patience of our Lord as an opportunity for salvation, just as our dear brother Paul has written to you according to the wisdom given to him.16 He speaks about these things in all his letters in which there are some matters that are hard to understand. The untaught and unstable twist them to their own destruction," as they also do with the rest of the "Scriptures."

17 Therefore, dear friends, since you know this in advance, be on your guard, so that you are not led away by the error of lawless people and fall from your own stability.
but i did notice how you took the importance of reading studying the word and changed the subject
 
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#15
lol you believe how you want .the scriptures do speak and yes everything is done through the agent of the Holy Spirit . when Jesus said it is written .he was using scripture the word of God sharper than a two edged sword faith comes by hearing HEARING comes from the word of God
There is a person, Jesus Christ, whom you must know!!

He is not a book, He is not writings. He is a person; the Son of the Most High. He was in the beginning with God. He was with God and He was God (the Son). And all things were created through Him. His name is called the Word of God, because He speaks and He has a voice. God is spirit, but this person, the Christ, took on flesh and came to earth and walked among men. Yet those He came to did not recognized Him. That is because they didn't hear His voice. They had Scriptures and searched the Scriptures thinking in them they had eternal life, but it was those that testified about Him and they had been unwilling to come to Him so that they might live.

And there is nothing new under the sun. What happen still happens. Those born of God hear the sound of the wind and testify, but they reject our testimony. Just like they rejected the testimony of Moses and the Prophets which testified about the living and active Word of God, they reject the person of Jesus Christ today. To them, He is a book. They say the book talks to them, not knowing the person. So they point people to the Book instead of the Lord. And they search the Scriptures thinking in them they have eternal life. And they think the Book is alive. And the say the Book is the Christ. They have made an idol out of the Book. They write that the Book is the Word that was in the beginning with God, was with God, and is God, because they don't know the person who took on flesh.

Oh how I wish they knew the person of Jesus Christ. He is an awesome person to know. You can talk to Him in the morning when you get up. You can ask Him for advice about all the things in your life. He heals the sick. He is the Teacher who teaches you about all things, not just the Book. He jokes with you at times. And He gives wonderful counsel and His words to you are sharper than a two edge sword. He can and will talk to you about things that happened and things that will happen.

Still, He is wise, and what do you really need to know? 'Him', that is what you really need to know.

There is truly only one thing necessary, and that is sitting at His feet and listening to Him. Yet they have made it about knowing a Book instead of a person.


Jn 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that being that has come into being. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.
 
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#16
When we call two separate things by the same name we can cause confusion. Jesus Christ is a person, the Son. The Scriptures are a thing, the Sacred Writings. The confusion is a lot like that in the Abbot and Costello "Who's on first" comedy routine. The key to understanding the confusion in 'Who's on first' is understanding the "Who" is the name of the first baseman. And this is also a key to understanding the Bible.

Since "The Word of God" is the name of Jesus Christ, 'Jesus Christ' can be put in for 'the Word of God' and give us an understanding.

For example, Jn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. He was in the beginning with God.

Now to me, it seems pretty obvious that this is referring to Jesus Christ and not the Scriptures, but people get this wrong.



The Scriptures, as writings, were not in the beginning. So we can not write correctly, 'In the beginning was the Scriptures. However we can write correctly 'In the beginning was Jesus Chist, and Jesus Christ was with God, and Jesus Christ was God.

Now Jn 1:3 All things came into being through Him...

So as a thing, the writing came into being through Him. Hey, He told people Like Moses and Paul to write and so they did, but Moses did not have the writing of Paul. They had not yet come into being.
It all depends on the context of how you are speaking. Here are examples of that context......


What Does The Phrase, ?The Word Of God? Mean?


The phrase, “the Word of God” or “the Word of the Lord” has a number of different meanings in Scripture. It can mean either something that God has decreed, something that God has said when addressing humans, words that God spoke through the prophets, Jesus Christ, or finally God’s written Word.

1. It Is Something That God Has Decreed

When God decrees something that will, of necessity, come about, it is known as “the Word of God.” The psalmist wrote.

By the word of the LORD were the heavens made, their starry host by the breath of his mouth (Psalm 33:6).

These types of decrees were something that God desired to occur – they were not necessarily spoken to anyone.

2. It Speaks Of God Addressing Humans

When God verbally addressed certain humans it is also known as the Word of God. Scripture gives a number of examples of God addressing humans. At the giving of the Ten Commandments the Bible says.

And God spoke all these words: “I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. You shall have no other gods before me” (Exodus 20:1-3).

3. It Refers To God Speaking Through By The Prophets

The phrase “Word of God” is also used of something that is said by God’s chosen spokesmen. God spoke to His people through the mouth of the prophets. When the prophets spoke their words were called the, “Word of God.” The Lord said.

I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers; I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him. If anyone does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name, I myself will call him to account. But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded him to say, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, must be put to death (Deuteronomy 18:18-20).

The Lord promised to put His words into the mouth of Jeremiah.

But the LORD said to me, “Do not say, ‘I am only a child.’ You must go to everyone I send you to and say whatever I command you” (Jeremiah 1:7).

Jeremiah then said.

Then the Lord stretched out his hand and touched my mouth, and the Lord said to me, “Behold, I have put my words in your mouth” (Jeremiah 1:9).

Scripture makes no distinction in the authority of the words that God directly spoke and those things that were spoken by the prophets. All of it was considered to be the Word of God.

We must note that while God did personally speak to humans or used humans as His personal spokesmen these occurrences were rare – they were not the norm. This was not the way in which He regularly communicated with humanity.

4. Jesus Christ Is The Word Of God

God the Son, Jesus Christ, is known as the Word of God. At the beginning of John’s gospel we read.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God (John 1:1).

In the Book of Revelation John describes the risen Jesus.

[He is] clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and his name is called The Word of God (Revelation 19:13).

This description, the Word of God, is only used for God the Son. He is the one member of the Trinity who personally communicated God to humanity.

5. It Also Refers To God’s Written Word

The “Word of God” can refer to God’s Word in written form – the Bible. After being proclaimed orally God’s Word was put into written form. God’s Word was first put into written form in the Ten Commandments. God Himself wrote these tablets.

When he had finished speaking with him upon Mount Sinai, he gave Moses the two tablets of the testimony, tablets of stone, written by the finger of God (Exodus 31:18).

Jesus compared the written Word of God to the tradition of the people.

Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition (Matthew 15:6).

Jesus also said.

If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came – and the Scripture cannot be broken (John 10:35)

The Terms Are Used Interchangeably

The New Testament appears to use the terms “Word of God,” Word of the Lord,” and “Word of Christ” interchangeably. All of them refer to God’s authoritative Word.

Summary

The phrase, “the Word of God” is used in a number of different ways. It refers to something that God has decreed, the actual spoken words of God, words that God has spoken through the prophets, Jesus Christ, and finally God’s written Word. Scripture makes no distinction in the authority of the words that God directly spoke and those things that were written or spoken by God’s spokesmen – the prophets. All of it was considered to be the Word of God.

http://thewordmp3.com/BLBCD/BLB/faq/nbi/275.html
 
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#17
There is truly only one thing necessary, and that is sitting at His feet and listening to Him. Yet they have made it about knowing a Book instead of a person.
psst if you know the book spiritually you know jesus . i still cling to mine i have took scripture and showed you how Jesus speaks to us through the written word and yes the Holy spirit in it making it possible . other than that i am through :horse:horse
 
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for_his_glory

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#18
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

It's through belief in Christ that we will not perish, but have eternal life with the Father.
Belief comes first then comes faith which is Christ Jesus and how does the faith grow in us...........by hearing the word of God.............. and how do we hear the word of God,, but have eternal life with the Father.

Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. 14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? 15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things! 16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report? 17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

The gospel of peace that has been labeled the Holy Bible is the word of God penned by the prophets and Apostles (had others write if they could not) as they give first hand accounts of what God taught.
 
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#19
It all depends on the context of how you are speaking. Here are examples of that context......


What Does The Phrase, ?The Word Of God? Mean?


The phrase, “the Word of God” or “the Word of the Lord” has a number of different meanings in Scripture. It can mean either something that God has decreed, something that God has said when addressing humans, words that God spoke through the prophets, Jesus Christ, or finally God’s written Word.

1. It Is Something That God Has Decreed

When God decrees something that will, of necessity, come about, it is known as “the Word of God.” The psalmist wrote.

By the word of the LORD were the heavens made, their starry host by the breath of his mouth (Psalm 33:6).

These types of decrees were something that God desired to occur – they were not necessarily spoken to anyone.

2. It Speaks Of God Addressing Humans

When God verbally addressed certain humans it is also known as the Word of God. Scripture gives a number of examples of God addressing humans. At the giving of the Ten Commandments the Bible says.

And God spoke all these words: “I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. You shall have no other gods before me” (Exodus 20:1-3).

3. It Refers To God Speaking Through By The Prophets

The phrase “Word of God” is also used of something that is said by God’s chosen spokesmen. God spoke to His people through the mouth of the prophets. When the prophets spoke their words were called the, “Word of God.” The Lord said.

I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers; I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him. If anyone does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name, I myself will call him to account. But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded him to say, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, must be put to death (Deuteronomy 18:18-20).

The Lord promised to put His words into the mouth of Jeremiah.

But the LORD said to me, “Do not say, ‘I am only a child.’ You must go to everyone I send you to and say whatever I command you” (Jeremiah 1:7).

Jeremiah then said.

Then the Lord stretched out his hand and touched my mouth, and the Lord said to me, “Behold, I have put my words in your mouth” (Jeremiah 1:9).

Scripture makes no distinction in the authority of the words that God directly spoke and those things that were spoken by the prophets. All of it was considered to be the Word of God.

We must note that while God did personally speak to humans or used humans as His personal spokesmen these occurrences were rare – they were not the norm. This was not the way in which He regularly communicated with humanity.

4. Jesus Christ Is The Word Of God

God the Son, Jesus Christ, is known as the Word of God. At the beginning of John’s gospel we read.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God (John 1:1).

In the Book of Revelation John describes the risen Jesus.

[He is] clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and his name is called The Word of God (Revelation 19:13).

This description, the Word of God, is only used for God the Son. He is the one member of the Trinity who personally communicated God to humanity.

5. It Also Refers To God’s Written Word

The “Word of God” can refer to God’s Word in written form – the Bible. After being proclaimed orally God’s Word was put into written form. God’s Word was first put into written form in the Ten Commandments. God Himself wrote these tablets.

When he had finished speaking with him upon Mount Sinai, he gave Moses the two tablets of the testimony, tablets of stone, written by the finger of God (Exodus 31:18).

Jesus compared the written Word of God to the tradition of the people.

Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition (Matthew 15:6).

Jesus also said.

If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came – and the Scripture cannot be broken (John 10:35)

The Terms Are Used Interchangeably

The New Testament appears to use the terms “Word of God,” Word of the Lord,” and “Word of Christ” interchangeably. All of them refer to God’s authoritative Word.

Summary

The phrase, “the Word of God” is used in a number of different ways. It refers to something that God has decreed, the actual spoken words of God, words that God has spoken through the prophets, Jesus Christ, and finally God’s written Word. Scripture makes no distinction in the authority of the words that God directly spoke and those things that were written or spoken by God’s spokesmen – the prophets. All of it was considered to be the Word of God.

http://thewordmp3.com/BLBCD/BLB/faq/nbi/275.html
A word is obvious is just that, a word. So somebody's word is what they are saying, or it could be what they are writing. Of course the Bible wasn't written in English. In the Bible, there are two Greek words, Logos and Rhema that are translated "word" in an English Bible. There is another Greek word, Graphe that is translated 'Scripture' in an English Bible.

However, this thread is not really about the any of the above; it is about knowing Jesus Christ!

If we know a person, we know them because we spend personal time with them. Which means we have conversations back and for the with them. We don't get to know someone because we read a book on them, even if it is a book they wrote about themselves. We can get to know about them by reading the book, but reading the book does not mean we know them. And that is what this thread is about.

To make this point, trying going to a bookstore and buy a book then go to that authors house and tell them you know them because you read their book. The author will think you are crazy.

Yet Jesus Christ is a person you can get to know Him. You can have conversation with Him. God is spirit, and the Holy Spirit comes and speaks to us, but the Spirit of God does not speak on His own initiative. As He hears He speaks. He acts something like a living telephone line to Jesus Christ who the word of God come from. The Spirit take the words of God, which are from Jesus Christ, much like a phone hooks you up with someone. So Jesus Christ is called the Word of God, because He has the words of God for you, personally.

But there is and has been a problem, and that is that people tend to seek the Bible instead of seeking Jesus Christ. If that happens, they don't get to know Jesus Christ, but rather the Bible. If that happens they say things like 'The Bible is alive', 'The Bible saves', The Bible is Jesus Christ'. They have replaced knowing the person of Jesus Christ with knowing the Bible. To them, reading the Bible is hearing from the Lord, which is not the case.

And if they don't know Jesus Christ, they are not going to heaven, because they really don't believe in Him. And if they don't know Jesus Christ, they are not going to point other people to Him, but to religion and the Bible, so even the words that come out of their mouth are poisonous in the sense they actually lead others astray. This is why John call them Vipers, and Jesus proclaim John was right in doing it.

You should see that Jesus Christ is real. That His sheep do hear His voice. It's a voice personal spoken to you. We often call it the small voice. And you can have a conversation back and forth with Him. And for Him to actually be your Lord, you are hearing instruction for you personally, which can be concerning anything, though He does just say anything. He is love, so it should not be surprising that the most common thing I personally hear from Him is about Him loving me. I heard that personally spoken to me, from Him, about 30 minutes ago.

Because He talks to me and I know Him, I know He is not the Bible but rather the One the Bible is trying to you/us about.

Now, someone wrote in and said he was not reading his Bible, and wanted to know if we thought he was a bad person because of it. He explained he had read it, but was bored with it. The question is; do we point that person to the Bible or to Jesus Christ? The answer is that we are preaching Jesus Christ, thus we are pointing people to Him who can and will talk to them. He is called the Word of God because He can, will, and wants to talk to people, if only they would listen. But we don't tell them that. We don't point people to Jesus Christ, but to the Scriptures. We wind up preaching the Scriptures, because we ourselves don't listen to Him and know Him.

So again, this is not about semantics and the use of the word 'Word', but is all about hearing the Lord, preaching the Lord Jesus Christ, and pointing people to Him.
 
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Messages
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#20
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

It's through belief in Christ that we will not perish, but have eternal life with the Father.
Belief comes first then comes faith which is Christ Jesus and how does the faith grow in us...........by hearing the word of God.............. and how do we hear the word of God,, but have eternal life with the Father.

Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. 14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? 15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things! 16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report? 17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

The gospel of peace that has been labeled the Holy Bible is the word of God penned by the prophets and Apostles (had others write if they could not) as they give first hand accounts of what God taught.
The Bible clearly calls Jesus Christ "The Word of God" It calls Him that because He talks to us.

Where it is written, 17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. The Greek word use there is Rhema, and it means an utterance. It is not talking about reading the Bible but rather hearing that small voice of the Lord's spoken to you personally.

If it was from reading the Bible, then the Pharisees were all saved. But as it was a man named Saul, having studied the Scriptures was going to Damascus to put early believers in jail. However, Saul got a Rhema word on the way, "Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?" That was a Rhema word spoken to Saul, It is not a Rhema word spoken to you! It is not Scripture, which is 'Graphe' in Greek. You might consider it a Logos 'a word in general'. And Jesus is call the "Logos" Word of God because He speaks to us. But your faith that God exists does not come from reading the Bible, but rather from having a personal encounter with God, like Saul was having, but had not had until that point. It is from know Jesus Christ, whom we see that Saul did not know at that point.

Acts 8:5 And he said, "Who are you Lord?"

Saul, a Pharisee, was well trained in tradition and in the Scriptures, but there he was zealous for God but not knowing God. It was a problem then, and it is a problem now.

Do you get up in the morning and say "Good morning Lord", and hear Your Lord respond back? Do you and Him have conversation through out the day? When you pick up your Bible and ask Him where He thinks you should read from it today? Today, do you hear His voice?

Well, "Today" is the day you should have heard His voice speaking to you. And He is not the Bible but He should be your Lord. There is only one thing truly needed, and that is sitting at the feet of Jesus and listening to Him. If Christian were doing that, they would understanding what I have been trying to explain. But it is hard to explain, though I have tried hard to be to explain it.

Heb 5:11 Concerning him we have much to say, and it is hard to explain, since you have become dull of hearing.
 
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