True Christianity is not found in current Doctrine......

[Soma-Sight]

Jesus has shown us that it is perfectly acceptable to follow Jesus without getting involved in any kind of religion and without even mentioning Jesus name. Isn't that great. To follow Jesus you don't have to become a Christian.

What is the way to salvation that Jesus has shown us and that Christianity has rejected much to its own shame. Well let's look

Matthew 6:33 Seek first the Kingdom of God.

Very specific. Before you do anything, don’t go looking for a church , or a Bible, or a teacher. The very first thing you must do is seek the Kingdom of God.

So you say. How do I do that ?

Luke 17:21 The Kingdom of God is within you.

Jesus said he was the way. In other words if we followed him we would find the way. Here is your chance to follow him. He just told you that the first thing you must do is look within yourself for the kingdom of God. That's the way.

This is not something that religion is comfortable with. Christians have told me that I would open my mind to devils if I looked within myself for the kingdom of God. Yet Jesus said that is exactly what you must do.

And the same trouble you will have with religious people today Jesus had with them then when he taught his way.

 

[Lyric's Dad]

Soma, I pity the day you stand before God and answer for being a false teacher of His Word and not ever accepting what He offered.

Truly sad.

 

[Vic C.]

Matthew 6:33 Seek first the Kingdom of God.

Very specific. Before you do anything, don’t go looking for a church , or a Bible, or a teacher. The very first thing you must do is seek the Kingdom of God.

So you say. How do I do that ?

Luke 17:21 The Kingdom of God is within you.

Jesus said he was the way. In other words if we followed him we would find the way. Here is your chance to follow him. He just told you that the first thing you must do is look within yourself for the kingdom of God. That's the way.

You just backed yourself into a corner.

You say... "Very specific. Before you do anything, don’t go looking for a church , or a Bible, or a teacher"

Lets skip over looking for a congregation. (for someone so intent on bucking traditional Christianity, you sure use the word "church" a lot) Now no Bible? How am I supposed to know what to 'look' for 'within' myself if I don't have or know the word of God?

Then you say Jesus is the way. Who's Jesus? How do I learn more about this Jesus. What you say, He is written about in the New Testament of the Bible. But I was just told not to look for a Bible. I'm confused.

Wait! Someone just told me Jesus was a Rabbi, which is a teacher. But you said not to look for a teacher.

Oh goodness, now I'm really confused... :-?

:o


:

 

[Free]

What is the way to salvation that Jesus has shown us and that Christianity has rejected much to its own shame. Well let's look

Matthew 6:33 Seek first the Kingdom of God.

Very specific. Before you do anything, don’t go looking for a church , or a Bible, or a teacher. The very first thing you must do is seek the Kingdom of God.

The problem with this passage Soma is that it is not speaking of salvation but God's provision. And Jesus is speaking to those who already believe, as contrasted with the "pagans" in verse 30. You are right, it is very specific.

So you say. How do I do that ?

Luke 17:21 The Kingdom of God is within you.

Jesus said he was the way. In other words if we followed him we would find the way. Here is your chance to follow him. He just told you that the first thing you must do is look within yourself for the kingdom of God. That's the way.

A couple of things:

1. That verse is also translated, "The Kingdom of God is in the midst of [or among] you". It is not really that simple.

2. If the translation is "within you," "you" likely was a general term that didn't include the Pharisees. The Kingdom of God is only something would be in those who already believe, not the unbeliever.

3. Jesus never said that the "first thing you must do is look within yourself for the Kingdom of God;" that is New Age teaching, not Christ's.

What does Jesus say about salvation?:

Luk 12:8 "And I tell you, everyone who acknowledges me before men, the Son of Man also will acknowledge before the angels of God,
Luk 12:9 but the one who denies me before men will be denied before the angels of God.

Joh 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up,
Joh 3:15 that whoever believes in him may have eternal life.
Joh 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
Joh 3:17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Joh 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.

It is only through belief in the name of Jesus, and all that that belief implies, that one is saved.

I know you are hungry for spiritual things and are probably feeling dried up because of the legalism of the SDA church and tradition in general, but be very careful how you go about seeking spiritual things. There are points of similarity between Christian spirituality and Eastern mysticism, but there are even greater points of dissimilarity, and it is those that will kill you. Do not confuse the two as one leads to life and the other to death.

 

[Vic C.]

^^^ That's actually what I meant to say Free... :-D ^^^

 

[Gary]

Good posts Vic and Free.

 

[Kathy]

Luk 17:21 Neither3761 shall they say,2046 Lo2400 here!5602 or,2228 lo2400 there!1563 for,1063 behold,2400 the3588 kingdom932 of God2316 is2076 within1787 you.5216

G1787
ἐντός
entos
en-tos'
From G1722; inside (adverb or noun): - within.


G1722
ἐν
en
en
A primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state), and (by implication) instrumentality (medially or constructively), that is, a relation of rest (intermediate between G1519 and G1537); “inâ€Â, at, (up-) on, by, etc.: - about, after, against, + almost, X altogether, among, X as, at, before, between, (here-) by (+ all means), for (. . . sake of), + give self wholly to, (here-) in (-to, -wardly), X mightily, (because) of, (up-) on, [open-] ly, X outwardly, one, X quickly, X shortly, [speedi-] ly, X that, X there (-in, -on), through (-out), (un-) to(-ward), under, when, where (-with), while, with (-in). Often used in compounds, with substantially the same import; rarely with verbs of motion, and then not to indicate direction, except (elliptically) by a separate (and different) prep.

 

[Kathy]

Kindom

G932
βασιλεία
basileia
bas-il-i'-ah
From G935; properly royalty, that is, (abstractly) rule, or (concretely) a realm (literally or figuratively): - kingdom, + reign.

G935
βασιλεύς
basileus
bas-il-yooce'
Probably from G939 (through the notion of a foundation of power); a sovereign (abstractly, relatively or figuratively): - king.

There is nothing in these of the Kingdom being out there somewhere in a geographic location beyond the universe. The Kingdom of God is a "spiritual realm"

One has to attain to the level of spirituality to be able to enter in.

as no flesh or blood will enter the Kingdom of God.

which depicts the carnal adamic flesh nature within us all

the flesh must be crucified

the old man must go , the new man , the spiritual man is the only one that can enter the Kingdom of God

 

[Vic C.]

Concerning Luke 17:21...

1. That verse is also translated, "The Kingdom of God is in the midst of [or among] you". It is not really that simple. ...

I just checked my LITV. (Literal English translation of the Textus Receptus)

Lk. 17:21 - nor will they say, Lo, here! Or, Lo, there! For behold the kingdom of God is in your midst.

 

[Kathy]

in your midst.

IN your midst

in YOUR midst

in your MIDST

Jesus had the FULLNESS of the FATHER within. So all that pertains to the FATHER and His Kingdom was in fullness within Jesus. So that would mean that the Kingdom of God was in fact among them. Because Jesus dwelt among them. The seed is within each of us but cannot come into fullness without JESUS BEING WITHIN.

and when we receive Jesus ,

it is also in our midst as being within each of us as well if we have JESUS DWELLING WITHIN US .

once you receive the seal and deposit of the Holy Spirit then you can go on to having the Fullness of God within as well.

you can't have God within but His Kingdom without.

God is not divided.

there is a seed within every man,,, and when it it watered with the living waters, it will grow and eventually we too will have the fullness of God within and that also means His Kingdom is within

 

[Kathy]

as you read the scriptures you will see there are many phrases that refer to :

in the earth
on the earth
in the world

when it say "in the earth" it is not speaking about being in the literal earth as inside this planet,,

but is referring to "in the earth" which we are

we are "earthan vessels"
we are "from the earth earthy"

when it says "in the earth" it is referring to the "spirit man" within each one of us , within our earthan vessels,,,

there is a tremendous difference between "in the earth" and "on the earth" ,, two very different things

 

[Vic C.]

IN your midst

in YOUR midst

in your MIDST

It is also VERY possible, since Jesus was speaking directly to one particular group, that He was referring to them as being "in the midst" of the Kingdom. Meaning, they were "in the midst of the Kingdom by being in the presence of Jesus.

I'm beginning to believe that "within you" is not the best of translations.

 

[Kathy]

"in the midst of the Kingdom by being in the presence of Jesus.

I'm beginning to believe that "within you" is not the best of translations.

then where is "in the presense of Jesus now"? since He no longer walks the earth in a mortal body?

do we change the meaning behind the words to suit what we believe or what we have always been taught

or

do we change our understanding as new things are opened to us by Holy Spirit when we begin to learn the true translations and their meanings

There are many things that have been "wrongly" translated from the original texts. The KJV of the bible is one of the ones that have the most translation errors in it but it is also the one that most in the religous system sware by as well.

The Rotherham is a good translation and comes close to the original as is the Young's literal. But even in these one's there is still some error as well.

that is why it is very important that find a translation that comes as close as possible to the original texts and to know the meaning of what the words used sysmbolizes, and truly wait upon the Holy Spirit to "illuminate and give us understanding of all the scriptures" no matter how long it takes,, there has been much error passed down from man to man throughout the generations

From the Interlinear Scripture Analizer:

English Translation:
Luke:17,21

Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! , for, behold the kingdom of God is within you.

Original Greek words:

oude erousin idou hOde E ekei idou gar hE basilecia tou theou entos humOn estin

true translation of exact meaning of the greek words:

NOT-YETTHEY-SHALL-BE-declarING BE-PERCEIVINGhere OR there BE-PERCEIVING for THE KINGdom OF-THE God INside OF-YOU IS

according to the original greek,, within means "inside"

 

[Free]

according to the original greek,, within means "inside"

lol! "Inside" is still one of several possible words. Unless you have formally been taught Greek and are very advanced in it, I would suggest you stay away from being so adamant that your interpretation of the Greek is correct.

It is possible that the Kingdom of God is both spiritual and physical; but it definitely is physical.

 

[Kathy]

I would suggest you stay away from being so adamant that your interpretation of the Greek is correct.

there was nothing in my post that said "I am right and your are wrong" I am not adamant about anything. And what I posted was not my interpretation of the Greek. It is the interpretation of a bible program called Interlinear Scripture Analysis.

I was merely showing the interpretions as found in this paticular source. We need to look at everything from all angles. Unless you know the original Greek language, or know someone that can speak it fluently then all we have are tools such as these programs or concordances to go by and that is why we must look at all things from all angles.

As far as what I post at any given time on any given subject is only to share or bring to the Lord's table what I have. It is up to every one else to discern for themselves what is edible and what isn't. Just as we do with all posts from all posters.

The spirit of "I am right and you are wrong" is a filthy and destructive spirit which stunts ones growth in the Lord.

All there should be is a deep hunger and desire to know Truth. Which is Jesus Christ. And a deep hunger and desire to have what we learn applied so that we can come to the place where Christ is fully formed within. Is this not what we all are desiring? Whether it means we are right or whether it means we are wrong? Is not our soul purpose to have Christ in all His fullness?

To me it has nothing to do with "knowing anything" but all to do about "knowing Jesus". No matter what.

Is not what these "discussion" forums are all about is sharing and discussing what we have with others? Does it mean when you post something you are saying to the other person you are wrong and I am right?

All I do is post what I have thus far. And there have been many times thorughout my walk that I have had to lay down things that I once thought was true and right but later found them to be error. I doubt anyone can say they haven't had to do the same as it is from precept to precept . line upon line.

This I do know. Just becasue you don't see something I post as truth. Doesn't mean it isn't. Just might mean you don't see it yet is all. And vice versa.

The purpose is not to be right but to know Truth. No matter what.

Just because I posted what I found in a program that interprets original Greek to English doesn't mean I am adament about anything.

or is it when you have something to share and you post it , are you really saying "I am right"?

We all have some truth and some error. And that is the truth. And no one person has all the truth.

There is no one here that has Christ in all His fullness.

But this "should be our only purpose" . This should be the one thing that keeps us pressing on and pressing in. This should be our only desire. Even if it means throwing out most of what we do know to get to the "Truth" which is JESUS CHRIST! Not knowledge about Jesus Christ.

 

[dogfried]

Jesus has shown us that it is perfectly acceptable to follow Jesus without getting involved in any kind of religion and without even mentioning Jesus name. Isn't that great. To follow Jesus you don't have to become a Christian.

What is the way to salvation that Jesus has shown us and that Christianity has rejected much to its own shame. Well let's look

Matthew 6:33 Seek first the Kingdom of God.

Very specific. Before you do anything, don’t go looking for a church , or a Bible, or a teacher. The very first thing you must do is seek the Kingdom of God.

How embarrassing it must be to disregard context so blatantly.

By reading the short phrase "and when He was seated His disciples came to Him" (5:1) you could've saved yourself the shame of committing elementary-level misinterpretation.