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Unlearned and Self Willed

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#1
Those who do not know the Gospel and it's doctrine by rebirth (Spiritually) are tossed to and fro by every wind of doctrine and self willed carnal understanding. (Eph. 4:13-15) Those who do not understand or comprehend the Scripture, and the doctrine of Christ, tend to think no one else does. (and I see to many agreeing with false doctrine) Therefore they are ready to trash those who know the Truth, and are criticized by those who think that every believer has the right to believe the way they want and still be sanctified and the right to claim to be a Christian. And what makes it worse is those who agree with false doctrine of others, do nothing but puff up the pride of those in error. Because someone agrees with you does not make it correct doctrine though it puffs you up in pride of so called knowledge. But as Noah preached about the flood to a unbelieving people...many will be left behind in disbelief. Trust the Lord.
In His Eternal mercy and Grace
Douglas Summers
 

Truthfrees

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#2
Those who do not know the Gospel and it's doctrine by rebirth (Spiritually) are tossed to and fro by every wind of doctrine and self willed carnal understanding. (Eph. 4:13-15) Those who do not understand or comprehend the Scripture, and the doctrine of Christ, tend to think no one else does. (and I see to many agreeing with false doctrine) Therefore they are ready to trash those who know the Truth, and are criticized by those who think that every believer has the right to believe the way they want and still be sanctified and the right to claim to be a Christian. And what makes it worse is those who agree with false doctrine of others, do nothing but puff up the pride of those in error. Because someone agrees with you does not make it correct doctrine though it puffs you up in pride of so called knowledge. But as Noah preached about the flood to a unbelieving people...many will be left behind in disbelief. Trust the Lord.
In His Eternal mercy and Grace
Douglas Summers
this is a common situation - believers disagreeing on the interpretation of scripture - as per the plethora of christian denominations

it's true that someone and possibly both parties are wrong

i think Romans 14:1-23 will help us not to judge one another - but rather bless each other in our attempt to please God

when sincere christians both prayerfully study scripture and still disagree on the interpretation then what do you suggest they do

God bless you
 
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#4
this is a common situation - believers disagreeing on the interpretation of scripture - as per the plethora of christian denominations

it's true that someone and possibly both parties are wrong

i think Romans 14:1-23 will help us not to judge one another - but rather bless each other in our attempt to please God

when sincere christians both prayerfully study scripture and still disagree on the interpretation then what do you suggest they do

God bless you
Hi Truth, God is not a God of confusion...the problem is indoctrination...Either by self will (pride or ignorance or both) or by a denomination doctrines of their own self willed beliefs. All false doctrines are by carnal reasoning, and all are influenced by Satan. The one thing absent from false doctrine is absence of Christ's love in the message and messenger. We are talking about the doctrine of Christ "Whoever transgresseth and abide not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God, he that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son". (2 John 9) Also "Not stealing, but showing all good fidelity, That they may adorn the doctrine of God, our Savior, in all things (Titus 2:10). It is not Holy Days or eating certain foods as in Romans chapter 14 that we stand against, but the false doctrines. I see so many who say they accept Christ, but have no Idea what His doctrine is, The doctrine should be Spiritually discerned, not carnal. I know the Truth of the doctrines of Christ, because of my teacher (Spirit) as do all born again believers. But we are also to contend for the principles of the doctrine of Christ on the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, of the doctrine of Baptisms, of the laying on of hands, and of the resurrection of the dead and of eternal judgment. (Heb. 6:1-2) Our battles is against the principalities of the wickedness in high places, and tearing down those thresholds against the doctrine of the kingdom of God...but instead, there is division and schism among the visible church, against the born again believer.
 
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#5
You're right.
Sounds like a typical Christian forum. :)
Hi Jim, I picked up a book called, Doctrines that Divide by Erwin Lutzer. He discusses the doctrines that divide the whole of Chistendom and the many reasons for them, many of the same things that I noticed also..It is a good study.
 
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#6
Hi Jim, I picked up a book called, Doctrines that Divide by Erwin Lutzer. He discusses the doctrines that divide the whole of Chistendom and the many reasons for them, many of the same things that I noticed also..It is a good study.
thanks :salute:)
 

Truthfrees

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#7
Hi Truth, God is not a God of confusion...the problem is indoctrination...Either by self will (pride or ignorance or both) or by a denomination doctrines of their own self willed beliefs. All false doctrines are by carnal reasoning, and all are influenced by Satan. The one thing absent from false doctrine is absence of Christ's love in the message and messenger. We are talking about the doctrine of Christ "Whoever transgresseth and abide not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God, he that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son". (2 John 9) Also "Not stealing, but showing all good fidelity, That they may adorn the doctrine of God, our Savior, in all things (Titus 2:10). It is not Holy Days or eating certain foods as in Romans chapter 14 that we stand against, but the false doctrines. I see so many who say they accept Christ, but have no Idea what His doctrine is, The doctrine should be Spiritually discerned, not carnal. I know the Truth of the doctrines of Christ, because of my teacher (Spirit) as do all born again believers. But we are also to contend for the principles of the doctrine of Christ on the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, of the doctrine of Baptisms, of the laying on of hands, and of the resurrection of the dead and of eternal judgment. (Heb. 6:1-2) Our battles is against the principalities of the wickedness in high places, and tearing down those thresholds against the doctrine of the kingdom of God...but instead, there is division and schism among the visible church, against the born again believer.
o i see - sorry i misunderstood what you were talking about

God bless you
 
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#8
o i see - sorry i misunderstood what you were talking about

God bless you
Hi Truth, Your Scripture was good, which brings up another controversy. Those who say we should not celebrate holy days (holidays), But as long as a man celebrates it to the Lord, it is between him and the Lord. What ruins holidays is the commercializing of it, and yes, we should minister to the weak brother and encourage them.
Thanks
Bless you back
Douglas Summers
 

Truthfrees

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#9
Hi Truth, Your Scripture was good, which brings up another controversy. Those who say we should not celebrate holy days (holidays), But as long as a man celebrates it to the Lord, it is between him and the Lord. What ruins holidays is the commercializing of it, and yes, we should minister to the weak brother and encourage them.
Thanks
Bless you back
Douglas Summers
amen - true
 

for_his_glory

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#10
this is a common situation - believers disagreeing on the interpretation of scripture - as per the plethora of christian denominations

it's true that someone and possibly both parties are wrong

i think Romans 14:1-23 will help us not to judge one another - but rather bless each other in our attempt to please God

when sincere christians both prayerfully study scripture and still disagree on the interpretation then what do you suggest they do

God bless you
Actually we are to judge and also expose those who are teaching false doctrines and to also give out their names, but before we do we had better know truth and discern that of what others are teaching if it be truth or error, 1 John 4:1-6.

Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. 18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

Ephesians 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

1 Timothy 5:20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.

Titus 1: 10 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision: 11 Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake. 12 One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies. 13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith; 14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth. 15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. 16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Titus 3:9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain. 10 A man that is an heretic after the first and second admonition reject; 11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.
 
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#11
Actually we are to judge and also expose those who are teaching false doctrines and to also give out their names, but before we do we had better know truth and discern that of what others are teaching if it be truth or error, 1 John 4:1-6.
Paul dedicated a significant portion of his letters to addressing false doctrine. (Gentiles keeping the Law and being circumcised, the resurrection already happened, there is no resurrection, we can sin because we're saved, etc.)

And Paul said to imitate him as he imitates Christ. (1COr 11:1) Jesus showed no patience with false doctrine ot those who taught it. (Mat 23 is a good example.)

Today, we have widely accepted but opposing doctrines which cannot all be correct.
OSAS or not.
The sign gifts ended or they continue.
Good works are or are not necessary to receive eternal life.
The Eucharist is symbolic of or it really is the Body and blood of the Lord.
Water baptism is or is not required for salvation.

So Satan, having heard Jesus' words at Mat 12:25 has succeeded in dividing the Kingdom of God using a favorite activity of Christians: theology. And the pagan world, confused and repulsed by the disunity and infighting within the body of Christ, seeks meaning elsewhere. :sad

May God have mercy.

iakov the fool
 

for_his_glory

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#12
Paul dedicated a significant portion of his letters to addressing false doctrine. (Gentiles keeping the Law and being circumcised, the resurrection already happened, there is no resurrection, we can sin because we're saved, etc.)

And Paul said to imitate him as he imitates Christ. (1COr 11:1) Jesus showed no patience with false doctrine ot those who taught it. (Mat 23 is a good example.)

Today, we have widely accepted but opposing doctrines which cannot all be correct.
OSAS or not.
The sign gifts ended or they continue.
Good works are or are not necessary to receive eternal life.
The Eucharist is symbolic of or it really is the Body and blood of the Lord.
Water baptism is or is not required for salvation.

So Satan, having heard Jesus' words at Mat 12:25 has succeeded in dividing the Kingdom of God using a favorite activity of Christians: theology. And the pagan world, confused and repulsed by the disunity and infighting within the body of Christ, seeks meaning elsewhere. :sad

May God have mercy.

iakov the fool
Very well put Jim. It's up to each of us on an individual basis to seek truth and discern what we are being taught. What one believes is their belief of either how they understand scripture or by sitting back and reading along with the sermon, but putting their Bible on a shelf until next church meeting. There is no reason to argue and fight over who is right or wrong, but that we present our beliefs and let others take what we give and study it for themselves through the Holy Spirit so they can Spiritually discern truth from error. In all we do and say we must be pleasing to the Lord.
 
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#13
Very well put Jim. It's up to each of us on an individual basis to seek truth and discern what we are being taught. What one believes is their belief of either how they understand scripture or by sitting back and reading along with the sermon, but putting their Bible on a shelf until next church meeting. There is no reason to argue and fight over who is right or wrong, but that we present our beliefs and let others take what we give and study it for themselves through the Holy Spirit so they can Spiritually discern truth from error. In all we do and say we must be pleasing to the Lord.
Hi glory, We have a zeal to not let the teachings handed down to us from Christ and the apostles to be deviated from, and even more, we have the Spirit of Christ's indwelling Holy Spirit that warns us of even subtle changes and strange fire beliefs that will lead to even more changes in the visible church. We might be accused of being a little over enthusiastic in our defense of the faith, but nevertheless, it is only derogatory to those who are offended that their own beliefs are questioned. And even if I or Jim or others were in error, A born again believer should have come to us and discussed there beliefs in question, I'am capable of misunderstanding someone's post, But what came out of some of this forum's members was an unchristian tirade. I was grieved in the Spirit for the disruption of the unity of the brotherhood from some of the private childish name calling post I received that were not even true of my defense of the faith. It did not bother me personally, but Spiritually...But I stand firm in the defense of the faith against all self willed who trespass into things they know nothing of. All of us will have to give an account of our actions when we meet the Lord.
In His Mercy and Grace...to all that will receive it,
Douglas Summers
 

for_his_glory

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#14
Hi glory, We have a zeal to not let the teachings handed down to us from Christ and the apostles to be deviated from, and even more, we have the Spirit of Christ's indwelling Holy Spirit that warns us of even subtle changes and strange fire beliefs that will lead to even more changes in the visible church. We might be accused of being a little over enthusiastic in our defense of the faith, but nevertheless, it is only derogatory to those who are offended that their own beliefs are questioned. And even if I or Jim or others were in error, A born again believer should have come to us and discussed there beliefs in question, I'am capable of misunderstanding someone's post, But what came out of some of this forum's members was an unchristian tirade. I was grieved in the Spirit for the disruption of the unity of the brotherhood from some of the private childish name calling post I received that were not even true of my defense of the faith. It did not bother me personally, but Spiritually...But I stand firm in the defense of the faith against all self willed who trespass into things they know nothing of. All of us will have to give an account of our actions when we meet the Lord.
In His Mercy and Grace...to all that will receive it,
Douglas Summers
The visible church has become so socially acceptable and politically correct for so long now they refuse to hear truth as they are drawn away by seducing spirits that lead them astray as we see so much increase in this. The last Pastor I had made a statement that is so true. He said we not only teach the gospel, but are also repairers of it.

1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
 
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#15
The visible church has become so socially acceptable and politically correct for so long now they refuse to hear truth as they are drawn away by seducing spirits that lead them astray as we see so much increase in this.
This is what happened in the Roman Empire after it had been Christian (by imperial edict) for 3 or 4 hundred years.
It is the normal progression of societies where Christianity has become "normal." At first the society receives it happily and many strive for holiness, but after a few generations the same society is just going through the motions.
So we see Europe, the birthplace of the Reformation, having become a post-Christian, socialist (atheist) union which has allowed Islam to enter in mass and which will, in a generation or two, Islamic Europe.
America is also post-Christian with half the country working hard to remove any vestige of Christianity from sight as the Gospel is the enemy of socialism which promises a godless, secular, utopia.

Somebody said that there is nothing new under the sun.

iakov the fool
 
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#16
This is what happened in the Roman Empire after it had been Christian (by imperial edict) for 3 or 4 hundred years.
It is the normal progression of societies where Christianity has become "normal." At first the society receives it happily and many strive for holiness, but after a few generations the same society is just going through the motions.
So we see Europe, the birthplace of the Reformation, having become a post-Christian, socialist (atheist) union which has allowed Islam to enter in mass and which will, in a generation or two, Islamic Europe.
America is also post-Christian with half the country working hard to remove any vestige of Christianity from sight as the Gospel is the enemy of socialism which promises a godless, secular, utopia.

Somebody said that there is nothing new under the sun.

iakov the fool
It seems, nobody learns from history. Look how the progressive left is grooming the school children into bashing the NRA and conservatives in to a left political socialist propaganda machine.
DS
 

for_his_glory

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#17
This is what happened in the Roman Empire after it had been Christian (by imperial edict) for 3 or 4 hundred years.
It is the normal progression of societies where Christianity has become "normal." At first the society receives it happily and many strive for holiness, but after a few generations the same society is just going through the motions.
So we see Europe, the birthplace of the Reformation, having become a post-Christian, socialist (atheist) union which has allowed Islam to enter in mass and which will, in a generation or two, Islamic Europe.
America is also post-Christian with half the country working hard to remove any vestige of Christianity from sight as the Gospel is the enemy of socialism which promises a godless, secular, utopia.

Somebody said that there is nothing new under the sun.

iakov the fool
Time to get out of the comfort zone and let God out of the box many keep Him in before it's to late and the door of Salvation will be closed forever.
 

blessedsmithereens

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#18
Like a ship on a stormy sea until the Lord Christ stills the waters , emotions, that are all under his command. The parable when Peter was to walk to Jesus when Jesus was walking on the sea of Galilee. Peters faith brought him out of the boat and he took purchase atop the water. Then he realized where he was and his far of drowning overcame his trust of his Lord and he almost drowned. Until Jesus raised him up.
 

for_his_glory

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#19
Like a ship on a stormy sea until the Lord Christ stills the waters , emotions, that are all under his command. The parable when Peter was to walk to Jesus when Jesus was walking on the sea of Galilee. Peters faith brought him out of the boat and he took purchase atop the water. Then he realized where he was and his far of drowning overcame his trust of his Lord and he almost drowned. Until Jesus raised him up.
The storm is here and waxing worse, but nothing to fear, but fear itself. Our trust is the faith we have in Christ therefore we stand firm.
 
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#20
Those who do not know the Gospel and it's doctrine by rebirth (Spiritually) are tossed to and fro by every wind of doctrine and self willed carnal understanding. (Eph. 4:13-15) Those who do not understand or comprehend the Scripture, and the doctrine of Christ, tend to think no one else does. (and I see to many agreeing with false doctrine) Therefore they are ready to trash those who know the Truth, and are criticized by those who think that every believer has the right to believe the way they want and still be sanctified and the right to claim to be a Christian. And what makes it worse is those who agree with false doctrine of others, do nothing but puff up the pride of those in error. Because someone agrees with you does not make it correct doctrine though it puffs you up in pride of so called knowledge. But as Noah preached about the flood to a unbelieving people...many will be left behind in disbelief. Trust the Lord.
In His Eternal mercy and Grace
Douglas Summers
Wolves should beware those who know the scriptures and see their stalking so as to divide the church.
Romans 16
16. Greet one another with a holy kiss. All the churches of Christ send you greetings. 17Now I urge you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and obstacles that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Turn away from them. 18For such as these are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive