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We are not saved by faith alone as Martin Luther inferred..... here is the Biblical evidence

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#1
Most of "Saved by grace through faith" Christian teachings originated from Martin Luther. After diligently and deeply studying Bible for past 12 years, I came to the conclusion we are not saved by faith alone In Christ, as Martin Luther interpreted, but also through diligent obedience ---- doing the will of God versus our own will. Jesus Himself warns his followers about this in Matthew 7: 18-26.
18 “A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit.
19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.
True and False Disciples
21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’

23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

The Wise and Foolish Builders
24 “Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock.
25 The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock.
26 But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand.
Also the NT writer James in his epistle clearly cautions us about the futility of faith without works
James 2: 14-17 Faith Without Works Is Dead

14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead."

There are several other places where Jesus repeatedly warns about importance of Picking up His cross, denying the flesh daily and Following Him. I truly believe that due to Martin Luther's (mis)interpretation, the obedience part of salvation doctrine ( which is as important as repentant Faith in the Lord) was downplayed /watered down/ ignored by many / most Churches. I do believe it could be because of the greed to enter heaven and the fear of being condemned; since it's so much easier to just believe than to follow the Lord--- and we as Christians know Following Christ is a very hard walk. For it’s embracing righteousness over sinfulness. But friends, faith without obedience is dead, according to Bible and which in turn brings about possibility of condemnation on the Day of Judgment. Based on my findings i wrote a small ebook for 99 cents only. Here's the link to the ebook. You can return it to Amazon after reading it and claim full refund of 99 cents-- if book is returned within a week. So basically I'm offering it for free. It more or less says what I have written here. https://www.amazon.com/Christian-Fa...=UTF8&qid=1510484824&sr=1-1&keywords=raj+sahu
I’m NOT here to sell the book. Please don’t buy it. I want to bring awareness among fellow brothers and sisters in Christ that faith alone will not save anyone. For the full grace of the Lord we need to be obedient as well. Martin Luther was mostly relying on Paul's words in the NT to explain his point of view on Salvation. Luther should have realized that if Paul was talking about justification through faith alone why then did Paul and every apostle of the Lord ( save John to write the book of Revelation) lay down their lives ( Paul too was martyred-- he was beheaded ) for the sake of the Lord and His gospel. Here is the answer: The apostles knew the paramount importance of obeying the Lord's commandments and teachings. They obeyed even at the cost of their lives. They were obedient to the point of death. Are we greater than the apostles? No we are not. We don’t have to die for the Lord’s gospel as the apostles did. But at least we can keep His commandments --- if not all at least the one, the commandment of Love God and love ALL--- no exceptions. “Two commandments ( on which) depend all the Law and the Prophets”
Matthew 22:37-40
37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”

Christ's words in several places, including the Book of Revelation are very clear about salvation--- no obedience, no salvation.
Give precedence to the Lord's ( red lettered) words over His servants' words, no matter how hard anyone wants you to. Jesus Himself says ( John 15: 20) " No servant is greater than the Master". Nor was any New Testament writer greater than his master, Lord Jesus Christ.
Blessings to all and may the wisdom of the Lord be with you.
 
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#3
Most of "Saved by grace through faith" Christian teachings originated from Martin Luther. After diligently and deeply studying Bible for past 12 years, I came to the conclusion we are not saved by faith alone In Christ, as Martin Luther interpreted, but also through diligent obedience ---- doing the will of God versus our own will. Jesus Himself warns his followers about this in Matthew 7: 18-26.
18 “A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit.
19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.
True and False Disciples
21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’

23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

The Wise and Foolish Builders
24 “Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock.
25 The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock.
26 But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand.
Also the NT writer James in his epistle clearly cautions us about the futility of faith without works
James 2: 14-17 Faith Without Works Is Dead

14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead."

There are several other places where Jesus repeatedly warns about importance of Picking up His cross, denying the flesh daily and Following Him. I truly believe that due to Martin Luther's (mis)interpretation, the obedience part of salvation doctrine ( which is as important as repentant Faith in the Lord) was downplayed /watered down/ ignored by many / most Churches. I do believe it could be because of the greed to enter heaven and the fear of being condemned; since it's so much easier to just believe than to follow the Lord--- and we as Christians know Following Christ is a very hard walk. For it’s embracing righteousness over sinfulness. But friends, faith without obedience is dead, according to Bible and which in turn brings about possibility of condemnation on the Day of Judgment. Based on my findings i wrote a small ebook for 99 cents only. Here's the link to the ebook. You can return it to Amazon after reading it and claim full refund of 99 cents-- if book is returned within a week. So basically I'm offering it for free. It more or less says what I have written here. https://www.amazon.com/Christian-Fa...=UTF8&qid=1510484824&sr=1-1&keywords=raj+sahu
I’m NOT here to sell the book. Please don’t buy it. I want to bring awareness among fellow brothers and sisters in Christ that faith alone will not save anyone. For the full grace of the Lord we need to be obedient as well. Martin Luther was mostly relying on Paul's words in the NT to explain his point of view on Salvation. Luther should have realized that if Paul was talking about justification through faith alone why then did Paul and every apostle of the Lord ( save John to write the book of Revelation) lay down their lives ( Paul too was martyred-- he was beheaded ) for the sake of the Lord and His gospel. Here is the answer: The apostles knew the paramount importance of obeying the Lord's commandments and teachings. They obeyed even at the cost of their lives. They were obedient to the point of death. Are we greater than the apostles? No we are not. We don’t have to die for the Lord’s gospel as the apostles did. But at least we can keep His commandments --- if not all at least the one, the commandment of Love God and love ALL--- no exceptions. “Two commandments ( on which) depend all the Law and the Prophets”
Matthew 22:37-40
37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”

Christ's words in several places, including the Book of Revelation are very clear about salvation--- no obedience, no salvation.
Give precedence to the Lord's ( red lettered) words over His servants' words, no matter how hard anyone wants you to. Jesus Himself says ( John 15: 20) " No servant is greater than the Master". Nor was any New Testament writer greater than his master, Lord Jesus Christ.
Blessings to all and may the wisdom of the Lord be with you.
Interesting but does it have your spin, aka opinion, on it? Of course it does, we all could be found Guilty, if it were a crime, of this, especially me! Okay, so that you need not dig through my past posts to learn it I stand on the statement that; No scripture can ever be understood without the light of all other scripture shinning on it. Couple that with I will forever insist the Bible is from "In the beginning..." trough the very last verse of The Revelation of Jesus chapter 22 is of a single context and though written by about 40 scribes, it is authored/inspired by one author, Jesus, (John 1:1-30)

I see it more along the line of, especially the James Passage refers to the state of the saved man's condition. I know that when a man is saved he will demonstrate his or her salvation by works. There is nothing more that must be completed, that is covered with the death of our Master on the cross.

These passages, to me, illustrate that if a man, male, or female is saved, out of love for the LORD they will work. That is oe more of those Free Will things.
 
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#4
Martin Luther:
“Works are necessary for salvation but they do not cause salvation; for faith alone gives life.” [Martin Luther]

(from Introduction to Romans)
"a living, creative, active and powerful thing, this faith. Faith cannot help doing good works constantly. It doesn’t stop to ask if good works ought to be done, but before anyone asks, it already has done them and continues to do them without ceasing. Anyone who does not do good works in this manner is an unbeliever...Thus, it is just as impossible to separate faith and works as it is to separate heat and light from fire!" [Martin Luther]


Westminster Theological Seminary:
“Faith alone justifies but a justified person with faith alone would be a monstrosity which never exists in the kingdom of grace. Faith works itself out through love (Gal. 5:6). And Faith without works is dead (James 2:17-20).” [John Murray]

“It is living faith that justifies and living faith unites to Christ both in the virtue of his death and in the power of his resurrection. No one has entrusted himself to Christ for deliverance from the guilt of sin who has not also entrusted himself to him for deliverance from the power of sin.” [John Murray]


Contemporary Thelogian:
"The relationship of faith and good works is one that may be distinguished but never separated...if good works do not follow from our profession of faith, it is a clear indication that we do not possess justifying faith. The Reformed formula is, 'We are justified by faith alone but not by a faith that is alone.'” [R. C. Sproul]


Sola Fide (starting with Luther) has never taught antinomianism.
 
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#5
Only God knows who goes to heaven and who does not.

As for Martin Luther, he was not excommunicated for opposing the Catholic Church nor for starting a denomination of his own; the historical fact is that he was excommunicated for lying. And I know what Jesus said in the Bible about liars.
 
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#6
Most of "Saved by grace through faith" Christian teachings originated from Martin Luther. After diligently and deeply studying Bible for past 12 years, I came to the conclusion we are not saved by faith alone In Christ, as Martin Luther interpreted, but also through diligent obedience ---- doing the will of God versus our own will. Jesus Himself warns his followers about this in Matthew 7: 18-26.
18 “A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit.
19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.
True and False Disciples
21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’

23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

The Wise and Foolish Builders
24 “Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock.
25 The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock.
26 But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand.
Also the NT writer James in his epistle clearly cautions us about the futility of faith without works
James 2: 14-17 Faith Without Works Is Dead

14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead."

There are several other places where Jesus repeatedly warns about importance of Picking up His cross, denying the flesh daily and Following Him. I truly believe that due to Martin Luther's (mis)interpretation, the obedience part of salvation doctrine ( which is as important as repentant Faith in the Lord) was downplayed /watered down/ ignored by many / most Churches. I do believe it could be because of the greed to enter heaven and the fear of being condemned; since it's so much easier to just believe than to follow the Lord--- and we as Christians know Following Christ is a very hard walk. For it’s embracing righteousness over sinfulness. But friends, faith without obedience is dead, according to Bible and which in turn brings about possibility of condemnation on the Day of Judgment. Based on my findings i wrote a small ebook for 99 cents only. Here's the link to the ebook. You can return it to Amazon after reading it and claim full refund of 99 cents-- if book is returned within a week. So basically I'm offering it for free. It more or less says what I have written here. https://www.amazon.com/Christian-Fa...=UTF8&qid=1510484824&sr=1-1&keywords=raj+sahu
I’m NOT here to sell the book. Please don’t buy it. I want to bring awareness among fellow brothers and sisters in Christ that faith alone will not save anyone. For the full grace of the Lord we need to be obedient as well. Martin Luther was mostly relying on Paul's words in the NT to explain his point of view on Salvation. Luther should have realized that if Paul was talking about justification through faith alone why then did Paul and every apostle of the Lord ( save John to write the book of Revelation) lay down their lives ( Paul too was martyred-- he was beheaded ) for the sake of the Lord and His gospel. Here is the answer: The apostles knew the paramount importance of obeying the Lord's commandments and teachings. They obeyed even at the cost of their lives. They were obedient to the point of death. Are we greater than the apostles? No we are not. We don’t have to die for the Lord’s gospel as the apostles did. But at least we can keep His commandments --- if not all at least the one, the commandment of Love God and love ALL--- no exceptions. “Two commandments ( on which) depend all the Law and the Prophets”
Matthew 22:37-40
37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”

Christ's words in several places, including the Book of Revelation are very clear about salvation--- no obedience, no salvation.
Give precedence to the Lord's ( red lettered) words over His servants' words, no matter how hard anyone wants you to. Jesus Himself says ( John 15: 20) " No servant is greater than the Master". Nor was any New Testament writer greater than his master, Lord Jesus Christ.
Blessings to all and may the wisdom of the Lord be with you.
Rajesh,

Could you be confusing the difference between the origin of salvation (faith) and the fruit of salvation (good works)?

James 2:18 (NIRV) puts it clearly: 'But someone will say, “You have faith. I do good deeds.” Show me your faith that doesn’t cause you to do good deeds. And I will show you my faith by the goods deeds I do'.

James teaches that if we have true faith, it will be demonstrated by the works we do. Works do not cause salvation, but genuine faith must be followed by what a person does and not by what a person says.

Oz
 
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#7
Most of "Saved by grace through faith" Christian teachings originated from Martin Luther. After diligently and deeply studying Bible for past 12 years, I came to the conclusion we are not saved by faith alone In Christ, as Martin Luther interpreted, but also through diligent obedience ---- doing the will of God versus our own will. Jesus Himself warns his followers about this in Matthew 7: 18-26.
18 “A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit.
19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.
True and False Disciples
21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’

23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

The Wise and Foolish Builders
24 “Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock.
25 The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock.
26 But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand.
Also the NT writer James in his epistle clearly cautions us about the futility of faith without works
James 2: 14-17 Faith Without Works Is Dead

14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead."

There are several other places where Jesus repeatedly warns about importance of Picking up His cross, denying the flesh daily and Following Him. I truly believe that due to Martin Luther's (mis)interpretation, the obedience part of salvation doctrine ( which is as important as repentant Faith in the Lord) was downplayed /watered down/ ignored by many / most Churches. I do believe it could be because of the greed to enter heaven and the fear of being condemned; since it's so much easier to just believe than to follow the Lord--- and we as Christians know Following Christ is a very hard walk. For it’s embracing righteousness over sinfulness. But friends, faith without obedience is dead, according to Bible and which in turn brings about possibility of condemnation on the Day of Judgment. Based on my findings i wrote a small ebook for 99 cents only. Here's the link to the ebook. You can return it to Amazon after reading it and claim full refund of 99 cents-- if book is returned within a week. So basically I'm offering it for free. It more or less says what I have written here. https://www.amazon.com/Christian-Fa...=UTF8&qid=1510484824&sr=1-1&keywords=raj+sahu
I’m NOT here to sell the book. Please don’t buy it. I want to bring awareness among fellow brothers and sisters in Christ that faith alone will not save anyone. For the full grace of the Lord we need to be obedient as well. Martin Luther was mostly relying on Paul's words in the NT to explain his point of view on Salvation. Luther should have realized that if Paul was talking about justification through faith alone why then did Paul and every apostle of the Lord ( save John to write the book of Revelation) lay down their lives ( Paul too was martyred-- he was beheaded ) for the sake of the Lord and His gospel. Here is the answer: The apostles knew the paramount importance of obeying the Lord's commandments and teachings. They obeyed even at the cost of their lives. They were obedient to the point of death. Are we greater than the apostles? No we are not. We don’t have to die for the Lord’s gospel as the apostles did. But at least we can keep His commandments --- if not all at least the one, the commandment of Love God and love ALL--- no exceptions. “Two commandments ( on which) depend all the Law and the Prophets”
Matthew 22:37-40
37 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. 38 This is the great and first commandment. 39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”

Christ's words in several places, including the Book of Revelation are very clear about salvation--- no obedience, no salvation.
Give precedence to the Lord's ( red lettered) words over His servants' words, no matter how hard anyone wants you to. Jesus Himself says ( John 15: 20) " No servant is greater than the Master". Nor was any New Testament writer greater than his master, Lord Jesus Christ.
Blessings to all and may the wisdom of the Lord be with you.
Hi RS
Welcome to the forum.

So far I've read such nice posts. Jesus would be proud of us.

I'd have to agree with the last paragraph of atpollard .

We ARE saved by faith ALONE.
We cannot work our way to salvation. Our works do not mean anything to God unless we love Him.

AFTER we are saved by faith we are also to obey our master.
@th1btaylor touched on this.

And, as atpollard said, if we do not show our obedience, which includes works of any kind whatever, then our salvation can certainly be questioned.
 
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#8
"What is it about your own miserable works and doings that you think you could please God more than the sacrifice of His own Son?"
― Martin Luther
 
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#9
"What is it about your own miserable works and doings that you think you could please God more than the sacrifice of His own Son?"
― Martin Luther
Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends. -Jesus
 
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#11
Martin Luther compared people to excrement.
Isaiah compared people to a used tampon:

Isaiah 64:6 NASB For all of us have become like one who is unclean,
And all our righteous deeds are like a filthy garment;
And all of us wither like a leaf,
And our iniquities, like the wind, take us away.
 
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#12
When the woman with a hemorrhage went and touched Jesus' robe (Matt 9:20-22 ESV), that was the action (or work) she had to take in faith to get the response, "Daughter, take courage, your [type of] faith has made you well." [type of] mine. An active faith is what we need to live. If it's an inactive faith, or a dead faith, that means we are still not living, or dead. (Jas 2:14-26 ESV)

So the way I see active faith vs passive faith, is that you're not cooperating with your passive faith until you act, and it becomes active faith.

There was always a call to action when Jesus saw faith in a person. Take up your bed and walk, have Jesus say the word, touch the hem of his garment, extend your withered arm, pick up your cross and follow Me, pray, fast, worship, etc...

Jesus wouldn't condemn someone who didn't take action, but they would never have gotten Jesus' attention otherwise. And these are not works like good works are works. They are simply necessary life giving steps to make communication with God.
 
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#13
Most of "Saved by grace through faith" Christian teachings originated from Martin Luther.
To the contrary, RS. That teaching comes from the NT: 'God’s grace has saved you because of your faith in Christ. Your salvation doesn’t come from anything you do. It is God’s gift. 9 It is not based on anything you have done. No one can brag about earning it' (Eph 2:8-9 NIRV).

In addition, St Augustine of Hippo taught salvation by grace through faith:

Augustine: "Grace is give to you, not wages paid to you...it is called grace because it is given gratuitously. By no precedent merits did you buy what you have received. The sinner therefore received this grace first, that his sins should be forgiven him...good works follow after a justified person; they do not go before in order that he may be justified...good works, following after justification, show what a man has received" (source) (Augustine, Sermon 94).​

Oz
 
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#14
To the contrary, RS. That teaching comes from the NT: 'God’s grace has saved you because of your faith in Christ. Your salvation doesn’t come from anything you do. It is God’s gift. 9 It is not based on anything you have done. No one can brag about earning it' (Eph 2:8-9 NIRV).

In addition, St Augustine of Hippo taught salvation by grace through faith:

Augustine: "Grace is give to you, not wages paid to you...it is called grace because it is given gratuitously. By no precedent merits did you buy what you have received. The sinner therefore received this grace first, that his sins should be forgiven him...good works follow after a justified person; they do not go before in order that he may be justified...good works, following after justification, show what a man has received" (source) (Augustine, Sermon 94).​

Oz
Faith alone saves as "You have been saved." But to live, you need to act on faith. That's the "you are being saved" part of it (sanctification). And finally when our faith becomes sight, we see Jesus, "We will be saved" by Him.
 
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#15
Martin Luther compared people to excrement.
Paul said something very similar: 'More than that, I now regard all things as liabilities compared to the far greater value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things--indeed, I regard them as dung!--that I may gain Christ' (Phil 3:8 NET). The KJV uses the same language, 'do count them but dung'.

The NIV and NLT call it 'garbage' and the ESV, 'rubbish'.

Could Luther be close to being correct in regarding all things as liabilities, loss and dung?

Oz
 
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#16
Faith alone saves as "You have been saved." But to live, you need to act on faith. That's the "you are being saved" part of it (sanctification). And finally when our faith becomes sight, we see Jesus, "We will be saved" by Him.
DK,

My salvation means I am currently enjoying eternal life. John 3:16 confirms this: 'For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life' (NIV).

Both 'believes' and 'have' are present tense, continuous action, tenses in Greek. So the meaning is that 'whoever continues to believe in him shall not perish but continues to have eternal life'.

I have continuing eternal life/salvation NOW.

What is sanctification? To sanctify a person is to make him/her holy, set apart. It is the Christian life being refined, not 'being saved'. I'm already saved but need to become more like Jesus in holiness.

See: "What is sanctification? What is the definition of Christian sanctification?" (GotQuestions?)

Oz
 
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#17
Only God knows who goes to heaven and who does not.

As for Martin Luther, he was not excommunicated for opposing the Catholic Church nor for starting a denomination of his own; the historical fact is that he was excommunicated for lying. And I know what Jesus said in the Bible about liars.
Please document his excommunication because of lies! Otherwise, it's your assertion/opinion.
 
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#18
Faith alone saves as "You have been saved." But to live, you need to act on faith. That's the "you are being saved" part of it (sanctification). And finally when our faith becomes sight, we see Jesus, "We will be saved" by Him.
Doug,

Does salvation by grace through faith come from the NT?

Oz
 
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#19
Ephesians 2:8-9 .. We do not go sit in the field waiting for Jesus return, we do not roll over and quit life, we are given privilege and opportunity to become imitators of Jesus to share in his inheritance according to our works/deeds in this faith.. 1 Corinthians 3:11-15 especially verse 15 ''if it is burned up he will suffer loss but he himself will be saved ,but only as one being snatched by fire "like being dragged from a burning house with nothing but the clothes you're wearing, or nothing at all if you are naked at the time'' that means you are saved with no works in that case imo but the grace given by God from your faith saved you in spite of it your worthless wood, hay and stubble..
 
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Ephesians 2:8-9 .. We do not go sit in the field waiting for Jesus return, we do not roll over and quit life, we are given privilege and opportunity to become imitators of Jesus to share in his inheritance according to our works/deeds in this faith.. 1 Corinthians 3:11-15 especially verse 15 ''if it is burned up he will suffer loss but he himself will be saved ,but only as one being snatched by fire "like being dragged from a burning house with nothing but the clothes you're wearing, or nothing at all if you are naked at the time'' that means you are saved with no works in that case imo but the grace given by God from your faith saved you in spite of it your worthless wood, hay and stubble..
bru,

What has your comment about Eph 2:8-9 have to do with the content of that text?

Oz
 
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