What does the term "flesh" mean?

[George Muller]

Many seem to be confused about this biblical term, but what the word represents is the "natural" man, born unto this world. (as the Lord said) For that which is born of the flesh "is Flesh". Now religion has attempted to confuse this by some doctrines that promote a false understanding of the term? Many would claim there is a good part of the natural man (acceptable to God) and then a "sinful nature" in natural man. This is a complete error. "NOTHING GOOD LIVES IN THE FLESH" Until a believer becomes as Paul described as one who has "NO CONFIDENCE IN THE FLESH" and only trust in the Spirit of God, working righteousness through faith and love from the spirit, that believer is what the scriptures call "carnal". They are not "spiritual". For those who are "spiritual" are not looking and judging things according to the flesh, but according to the spirit. This is a mystery and the "mystery of godliness" but one MUST ACCEPT THE CROSS OF CHRIST, AS ONES OWN DEATH, to enter into true Godliness and true holiness.

 

[Brother Mike]

Now religion has attempted to confuse this by some doctrines that promote a false understanding of the term? Many would claim there is a good part of the natural man (acceptable to God) and then a "sinful nature" in natural man.

What doctrine is this? Flesh sides with what makes it comfortable, even sinful. To be carnal is to give into the lust and desires of the flesh. There is no scriptures that says at times giving into the flesh is a good thing. As you said, we need to put the flesh under the Working of our born again spirit with the Holy Spirit, otherwise the flesh will run crazy. Our mind (soul) had to be renewed and transformed by the Word of God because we have nothing in ourself that would please God.

Is this a denominational doctrine? Which denomination? I have never heard this stance that anything good being corruptible is in the flesh.

Good post.......

Mike.

 

[George Muller]

Now religion has attempted to confuse this by some doctrines that promote a false understanding of the term? Many would claim there is a good part of the natural man (acceptable to God) and then a "sinful nature" in natural man.

What doctrine is this? Flesh sides with what makes it comfortable, even sinful. To be carnal is to give into the lust and desires of the flesh. There is no scriptures that says at times giving into the flesh is a good thing. As you said, we need to put the flesh under the Working of our born again spirit with the Holy Spirit, otherwise the flesh will run crazy. Our mind (soul) had to be renewed and transformed by the Word of God because we have nothing in ourself that would please God.

Is this a denominational doctrine? Which denomination? I have never heard this stance that anything good being corruptible is in the flesh.

Good post.......

Mike.

Well there is a translation that changes the very term to "sinful nature" and I have heard many teach as if the natural man is not in a condition of utter sinfulness. Any suggestion that a believer can work righteousness by self-effort and "will of man" is in effect to deny the flesh. The scriptures are replete with this error, as Paul wrote many times, "WE ARE THOSE WHO WORSHIP GOD IN SPIRIT AND HAVE NO CONFIDENCE IN THE FLESH" So the intention of this thread is to manifest what this term actually means, I believe many seem to think it means "doing bad" when in fact it is a term that describes "natural" man, that may "think" he has the ability to do and choose good and evil, but his own sinful flesh deceives him into think in this religious mindset. If you have thoughts on your understand of the term? I would be glad to hear them.

 

[Brother Mike]

Rom_8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

I believe many seem to think it means "doing bad" when in fact it is a term that describes "natural" man, that may "think" he has the ability to do and choose good and evil, but his own sinful flesh deceives him into think in this religious mindset. If you have thoughts on your understand of the term? I would be glad to hear them.

Thank you George. Ummm, I think it's a bit more complex than this? Or we making it more complex?

I believe man has the ability to choose good or evil, can know the difference, but the flesh is extremely weak in choosing things that God would approve. You know that cake in the fridge will make you fat, you know you should stay on your diet, but your only able to resist to a certain point before coming up with enough reason to just eat it anyway. The flesh seems to have no ability to hold it together.

I use to drink like a fish, about a case of beer a day. I thought about it at work, first thought in the morning, I liked beer. When I got saved, the Lord delivered me from it. Now I don't think of beer at all, but once in a great while (Like last year) I drank a beer and that was it. I have no issue if someone at dinner ordered me a beer and drinking it, even though I don't drink now.

I have seen people at AA telling people about the eight years they have been sober with no drink. They say it's a battle every day sometimes. That tells me they are fighting the flesh with flesh everyday and are miserable. The fear of failing in peoples eyes, and fear of things is the only thread to keep them Sober for 8 years. It only takes enough buttons to be pushed though before their fear, and strength of the flesh crumbles and right back to being a Alcoholic.

Even through our own soul (Thinking) we can't please God, because what we see as Good, is often not the will of the Lord or the plan of God. Some ministry's open a food pantry because it seemed good to their thinking (soul-flesh) and soon end up bankrupt trying to keep the thing running. If it's God, if it's Spirit, then it works. Their good deed though is not counted for anything because it was not the Lord's direction for them.

So, George, even things blatant good, or evil. Even things that are good, but not the plan of God, appear to me to be works of what we want, and what our flesh wants as opposed to God's plan. All of it is filthy rags and count for nothing. Our flesh, our wants, our desires if not in line with God, end up a big zero.

So my view is looking at any desire of our flesh, ending up a big failure. I believe we can choose good as in not to steal, yet unless completely renewed by the Word and following the Spirit of God, though we don't steal, there is 10 other things that will bring us down.

That is how I see it.

God bless George.

Mike.

 

[George Muller]

Rom_8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

I believe many seem to think it means "doing bad" when in fact it is a term that describes "natural" man, that may "think" he has the ability to do and choose good and evil, but his own sinful flesh deceives him into think in this religious mindset. If you have thoughts on your understand of the term? I would be glad to hear them.

Thank you George. Ummm, I think it's a bit more complex than this? Or we making it more complex?

I believe man has the ability to choose good or evil, can know the difference, but the flesh is extremely weak in choosing things that God would approve. You know that cake in the fridge will make you fat, you know you should stay on your diet, but your only able to resist to a certain point before coming up with enough reason to just eat it anyway. The flesh seems to have no ability to hold it together.

I use to drink like a fish, about a case of beer a day. I thought about it at work, first thought in the morning, I liked beer. When I got saved, the Lord delivered me from it. Now I don't think of beer at all, but once in a great while (Like last year) I drank a beer and that was it. I have no issue if someone at dinner ordered me a beer and drinking it, even though I don't drink now.

I have seen people at AA telling people about the eight years they have been sober with no drink. They say it's a battle every day sometimes. That tells me they are fighting the flesh with flesh everyday and are miserable. The fear of failing in peoples eyes, and fear of things is the only thread to keep them Sober for 8 years. It only takes enough buttons to be pushed though before their fear, and strength of the flesh crumbles and right back to being a Alcoholic.

Even through our own soul (Thinking) we can't please God, because what we see as Good, is often not the will of the Lord or the plan of God. Some ministry's open a food pantry because it seemed good to their thinking (soul-flesh) and soon end up bankrupt trying to keep the thing running. If it's God, if it's Spirit, then it works. Their good deed though is not counted for anything because it was not the Lord's direction for them.

So, George, even things blatant good, or evil. Even things that are good, but not the plan of God, appear to me to be works of what we want, and what our flesh wants as opposed to God's plan. All of it is filthy rags and count for nothing. Our flesh, our wants, our desires if not in line with God, end up a big zero.

So my view is looking at any desire of our flesh, ending up a big failure. I believe we can choose good as in not to steal, yet unless completely renewed by the Word and following the Spirit of God, though we don't steal, there is 10 other things that will bring us down.

That is how I see it.

God bless George.

Mike.

Not sure what you are saying? You say its complex and then its not complex As Paul wrote neglecting the body is of no value against the indulgence of the flesh. Fat or skinny has NOTHING to do with this issue. Self-control is not a matter of the will of man, but a fruit of the Spirit. No man can take credit for anything as it relates to godliness, unless it has been wrought through him by the Spirit of God. The flesh give the false allusion to man that he has the ability to work righteousness, but that is to deny the scriptures. NO! nothing profits but the Spirit of God, working righteousness through the believer. It is grace alone (the Spirit of Grace) that empowers us over the flesh. Mans will is a false premise and is not shown in the scriptures as that which brings true Godliness. Not trying to be rude brother but just trying to point to the truth in a clear and confident way.

 

[George Muller]

Ro 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Ro 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

Ro 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. {to be carnally...: Gr. the minding of the flesh} {to be spiritually...: Gr. the minding of the Spirit}
Ro 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. {the carnal...: Gr. the minding of the flesh }
Ro 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

2Co 5:16 ¶ Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more.

Ga 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. {ye...: or, fulfil not}
Ga 5:17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
Ga 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Ga 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. {affections: or, passions}
Ga 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

1Pe 1:24 ¶ For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: {For: or, For that}

I could go on but I do not see how anyone could be so confused as to claim some value in the flesh of man?


Joh 9:41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

All those who seek to judge the sin in others flesh are in fact in the flesh themselves, as it is written '' FOR WITH WHAT JUDGMENT YE JUDGE, IT WILL BE METE BACK TO YOU"

 

[Sinthesis]

The term 'flesh' can mean different things depending on context.

 

[Deborah13]

Many seem to be confused about this biblical term, but what the word represents is the "natural" man, born unto this world. (as the Lord said) For that which is born of the flesh "is Flesh". Now religion has attempted to confuse this by some doctrines that promote a false understanding of the term? Many would claim there is a good part of the natural man (acceptable to God) and then a "sinful nature" in natural man. This is a complete error. "NOTHING GOOD LIVES IN THE FLESH" Until a believer becomes as Paul described as one who has "NO CONFIDENCE IN THE FLESH" and only trust in the Spirit of God, working righteousness through faith and love from the spirit, that believer is what the scriptures call "carnal". They are not "spiritual".

So are you saying that natural man can do nothing that God says is good? That man is totally depraved and can doing nothing that God sees as good?

Or are you saying that the good things that natural man does are not counted by God as righteousness works?

I see that God says, that the good things that man does are good, but that his reward is in this life. That his reward is honor among men and to his own ego. The good he and others think of him. In other words his reward is temporal, not eternal.
God says that natural man can love his family and care for his family, God says things are good things BUT his reward is in this temporal life.

Just the very name God gave to one of the trees in the garden speaks to this. The tree of the KNOWLEDGE of good and evil. Man has this knowledge and man can choose. If natural man always chose to do evil, this world would be in a lot worse shape than it is.

So the only other option is that if the natural man does something good, it is because God made him do it. ????

 

[JCitoL]

depending on its location in the Scripture, the biblical term "flesh" has two main meanings:

- the human body which the true Lord God has made as a good creation (very typical examples for this are Genesis 2:24-25 and 1 Corinthians 6:19)

and

- the negative side of the human mind which is not created by the true Lord God, but it is a product of the spiritual/religious iniquity which the unrighteous believers/clerics do (very typical examples for this are Romans 5:12-14 and Galatians 5:19-21)

Blessings

 

[George Muller]

depending on its location in the Scripture, the biblical term "flesh" has two main meanings:

- the human body which the true Lord God has made as a good creation (very typical examples for this are Genesis 2:24-25 and 1 Corinthians 6:19)

and

- the negative side of the human mind which is not created by the true Lord God, but it is a product of the spiritual/religious iniquity which the unrighteous believers/clerics do (very typical examples for this are Romans 5:12-14 and Galatians 5:19-21)

Blessings

Well there is not a "positive" side to the flesh of any man, only negative and this is proven in the scriptures as Paul and the other New Testament writers make clear. It is the natural man, since Adam that has no righteous ability in their flesh. None, no not one.

 

[George Muller]

Many seem to be confused about this biblical term, but what the word represents is the "natural" man, born unto this world. (as the Lord said) For that which is born of the flesh "is Flesh". Now religion has attempted to confuse this by some doctrines that promote a false understanding of the term? Many would claim there is a good part of the natural man (acceptable to God) and then a "sinful nature" in natural man. This is a complete error. "NOTHING GOOD LIVES IN THE FLESH" Until a believer becomes as Paul described as one who has "NO CONFIDENCE IN THE FLESH" and only trust in the Spirit of God, working righteousness through faith and love from the spirit, that believer is what the scriptures call "carnal". They are not "spiritual".

So are you saying that natural man can do nothing that God says is good? That man is totally depraved and can doing nothing that God sees as good?

Or are you saying that the good things that natural man does are not counted by God as righteousness works?

I see that God says, that the good things that man does are good, but that his reward is in this life. That his reward is honor among men and to his own ego. The good he and others think of him. In other words his reward is temporal, not eternal.
God says that natural man can love his family and care for his family, God says things are good things BUT his reward is in this temporal life.

Just the very name God gave to one of the trees in the garden speaks to this. The tree of the KNOWLEDGE of good and evil. Man has this knowledge and man can choose. If natural man always chose to do evil, this world would be in a lot worse shape than it is.

So the only other option is that if the natural man does something good, it is because God made him do it. ????

Hello Deborah 13, I don't think I said that man can "do" nothing good , but be sure no righteousness is worked by mans flesh, but only through the Spirit of God. As far as the tree, that is the issue. For when man ate from that tree, sin became a part of his whole being, and this is known as the flesh. Sin is so much a part of man, that the worse sinners are those who "think" they have overcome their flesh and look to judge others according to the flesh, and God had to condemn all flesh and has accounted that even that good we sometimes see, is not and cannot be accepted before Him as righteousness. Consider Paul, the greatest of law-keepers who through the Holy Spirit came to the truth that all Christians should come to understand? "I KNOW NOTHING GOOD LIVES IN ME, THAT IS IN MY FLESH" His confidence was ONLY IN THE SPIRIT OF GOD, working true righteousness through him. This is the point of this thread, that at the Cross we must all admit that our flesh must be judged with Our Beloved Lord. This is the "narrow" way through the Cross. Here we become fools and weak and become as Paul who had NO CONFIDENCE IN THE FLESH. BLESSINGS

 

[JCitoL]

Well there is not a "positive" side to the flesh of any man, only negative and this is proven in the scriptures as Paul and the other New Testament writers make clear. It is the natural man, since Adam that has no righteous ability in their flesh. None, no not one.

Genesis 1:27-31 "God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him(i.e. the true God has created the human righteous as an user of the universe); male and female created he them..... And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very(i.e. completely) good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day."

Ecclesiastes 7:29 "Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they(i.e. but eve, adam and many others) have sought out many inventions(i.e. many spiritual/religious iniquities)."

here is how the humans were not unrighteous/bad at the beginning, but became such after, because the devil misled them to follow the occultism/esotericism and thus the system of spiritual/religious iniquity(a.k.a. the "sin") entered into the world and the vitiation(a.k.a. the "death") affected many people by it (for reference: read Romans 5:12-14), and so the negative side of the human mind(a.k.a. the "flesh") appeared in many humans

Blessings

 

[Deborah13]

Many seem to be confused about this biblical term, but what the word represents is the "natural" man, born unto this world. (as the Lord said) For that which is born of the flesh "is Flesh". Now religion has attempted to confuse this by some doctrines that promote a false understanding of the term? Many would claim there is a good part of the natural man (acceptable to God) and then a "sinful nature" in natural man. This is a complete error. "NOTHING GOOD LIVES IN THE FLESH" Until a believer becomes as Paul described as one who has "NO CONFIDENCE IN THE FLESH" and only trust in the Spirit of God, working righteousness through faith and love from the spirit, that believer is what the scriptures call "carnal". They are not "spiritual".

So are you saying that natural man can do nothing that God says is good? That man is totally depraved and can doing nothing that God sees as good?

Or are you saying that the good things that natural man does are not counted by God as righteousness works?

I see that God says, that the good things that man does are good, but that his reward is in this life. That his reward is honor among men and to his own ego. The good he and others think of him. In other words his reward is temporal, not eternal.
God says that natural man can love his family and care for his family, God says things are good things BUT his reward is in this temporal life.

Just the very name God gave to one of the trees in the garden speaks to this. The tree of the KNOWLEDGE of good and evil. Man has this knowledge and man can choose. If natural man always chose to do evil, this world would be in a lot worse shape than it is.

So the only other option is that if the natural man does something good, it is because God made him do it. ????

Hello Deborah 13, I don't think I said that man can "do" nothing good , but be sure no righteousness is worked by mans flesh, but only through the Spirit of God. As far as the tree, that is the issue. For when man ate from that tree, sin became a part of his whole being, and this is known as the flesh. Sin is so much a part of man, that the worse sinners are those who "think" they have overcome their flesh and look to judge others according to the flesh, and God had to condemn all flesh and has accounted that even that good we sometimes see, is not and cannot be accepted before Him as righteousness. Consider Paul, the greatest of law-keepers who through the Holy Spirit came to the truth that all Christians should come to understand? "I KNOW NOTHING GOOD LIVES IN ME, THAT IS IN MY FLESH" His confidence was ONLY IN THE SPIRIT OF GOD, working true righteousness through him. This is the point of this thread, that at the Cross we must all admit that our flesh must be judged with Our Beloved Lord. This is the "narrow" way through the Cross. Here we become fools and weak and become as Paul who had NO CONFIDENCE IN THE FLESH. BLESSINGS

This I agree with.
When is someone is guilty of falling from grace?
I see this scripture is speaking of when one believes that their own performance can saved them. Salvation is by grace, through faith alone, not by works (any kind of works). What do we believe through faith? That Jesus did all that needs to be done for our salvation. There is nothing we can add to it. His work was a perfect work.
God in His mercy and grace, through Jesus, reconciled Himself to the world. We are to be reconciled to Him, through faith in Christ.

This is the Gospel (the good news). People know they are sinners, God said He made all men to know this. The Gospel of Grace is such good news for man.

Romans 1:18-19
“For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewedit unto them”

God has revealed = past tense God hath shewed = past tense

 

[George Muller]

Many seem to be confused about this biblical term, but what the word represents is the "natural" man, born unto this world. (as the Lord said) For that which is born of the flesh "is Flesh". Now religion has attempted to confuse this by some doctrines that promote a false understanding of the term? Many would claim there is a good part of the natural man (acceptable to God) and then a "sinful nature" in natural man. This is a complete error. "NOTHING GOOD LIVES IN THE FLESH" Until a believer becomes as Paul described as one who has "NO CONFIDENCE IN THE FLESH" and only trust in the Spirit of God, working righteousness through faith and love from the spirit, that believer is what the scriptures call "carnal". They are not "spiritual".

So are you saying that natural man can do nothing that God says is good? That man is totally depraved and can doing nothing that God sees as good?

Or are you saying that the good things that natural man does are not counted by God as righteousness works?

I see that God says, that the good things that man does are good, but that his reward is in this life. That his reward is honor among men and to his own ego. The good he and others think of him. In other words his reward is temporal, not eternal.
God says that natural man can love his family and care for his family, God says things are good things BUT his reward is in this temporal life.

Just the very name God gave to one of the trees in the garden speaks to this. The tree of the KNOWLEDGE of good and evil. Man has this knowledge and man can choose. If natural man always chose to do evil, this world would be in a lot worse shape than it is.

So the only other option is that if the natural man does something good, it is because God made him do it. ????

Hello Deborah 13, I don't think I said that man can "do" nothing good , but be sure no righteousness is worked by mans flesh, but only through the Spirit of God. As far as the tree, that is the issue. For when man ate from that tree, sin became a part of his whole being, and this is known as the flesh. Sin is so much a part of man, that the worse sinners are those who "think" they have overcome their flesh and look to judge others according to the flesh, and God had to condemn all flesh and has accounted that even that good we sometimes see, is not and cannot be accepted before Him as righteousness. Consider Paul, the greatest of law-keepers who through the Holy Spirit came to the truth that all Christians should come to understand? "I KNOW NOTHING GOOD LIVES IN ME, THAT IS IN MY FLESH" His confidence was ONLY IN THE SPIRIT OF GOD, working true righteousness through him. This is the point of this thread, that at the Cross we must all admit that our flesh must be judged with Our Beloved Lord. This is the "narrow" way through the Cross. Here we become fools and weak and become as Paul who had NO CONFIDENCE IN THE FLESH. BLESSINGS

This I agree with.
When is someone is guilty of falling from grace?
I see this scripture is speaking of when one believes that their own performance can saved them. Salvation is by grace, through faith alone, not by works (any kind of works). What do we believe through faith? That Jesus did all that needs to be done for our salvation. There is nothing we can add to it. His work was a perfect work.
God in His mercy and grace, through Jesus, reconciled Himself to the world. We are to be reconciled to Him, through faith in Christ.

This is the Gospel (the good news). People know they are sinners, God said He made all men to know this. The Gospel of Grace is such good news for man.

Romans 1:18-19
“For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewedit unto them”

God has revealed = past tense God hath shewed = past tense

Here Paul speaks of those who "know the law" who hold the truth in unrighteousness, for NO ONE WHO REALLY hears the law or really seeks to keep its standard can not see the need for Christ, apart from the blinding power of satan as the scriptures declare.
Not all know they are "sinners" nor do many accept the true condition of all flesh as the scriptures describe, in this hypocricy would not be among any Christain group. and
Yes to fall from grace is to seek to justify the flesh by the law, those who look to the law to justify are in fact in the "flesh" it cannot be any other way, thus we have Paul over and over speaking in terms of those who have confidence in the flesh and those who have no confidence but worship God in Spirit and truth. I know this bothers some, but the truth is rather clear to those who are willing to admit the truth about themselves. I "know" that only Gods Spirit can work any good thing in and from me, I know my battle is always related to my own flesh. Thus I make it my daily concern to intentionally trust and walk in the Spirit. In this place "sin" is no issue at all, it has no power and my flesh is put to "sleep" as it where.

 

[George Muller]

Genesis 1:27-31 "God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him(i.e. the true God has created the human righteous as an user of the universe); male and female created he them..... And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very(i.e. completely) good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day."

You do understand how man fell and became enslaved to sin through the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

 

[Deborah13]

“For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewedit unto them”

Not all know they are "sinners"

19“For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewedit unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

You know, I would think, Kirk Cameron, he does a show where he and a friend go out on city streets and speak to strangers. They ask them simple questions. One would be, have you always done what is right? Have you ever done anything that is wrong? 99.9% of the time, anyone taking the conversation seriously at all, will say that they have done things that were wrong. How do they know? God gave man a conscious, and even made man aware of His existence.

So when the Gospel message is presented, man can know that he has sinned, against God and needs a Savior. God's Word speaks to man because God created man.

 

[George Muller]

“For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewedit unto them”

Not all know they are "sinners"

19“For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewedit unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

You know, I would think, Kirk Cameron, he does a show where he and a friend go out on city streets and speak to strangers. They ask them simple questions. One would be, have you always done what is right? Have you ever done anything that is wrong? 99.9% of the time, anyone taking the conversation seriously at all, will say that they have done things that were wrong. How do they know? God gave man a conscious, and even made man aware of His existence.

So when the Gospel message is presented, man can know that he has sinned, against God and needs a Savior. God's Word speaks to man because God created man.

I have also watched that some, and its really not hard to make some feel guilty, guilt does not save, faith saves. Man at the fall, became ashamed and tried to cover the same of his flesh. Now some are humble enough to admit their need for Christ, some will admit their sin to a certain degree but not admit their need for Christ. If one looks at your passage in context it is clear that those "who hold the truth in unrighteousness" are those who know the law. The gentiles had no knowledge nor did they hold the truth.

Ro 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them. ( see then that Paul is speaking of those who know the law)

He continues:
Ro 2:1 ¶ Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things.
2 But we are sure that the judgment of God is according to truth against them which commit such things.
3 And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God? (again he speaks to those who know the law)


Ro 2:12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
17 ¶ Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God,

These passages are to those who know the law and is not addressing the gentiles as having the ability to "know God" or the ability to understand they are sinners . These scriptures are not speaking of all men, but to those who know the law.

 

[farouk]

Part of the difficulty is that some modern translations have chosed to render SARX (King James: flesh) as 'sinful nature'. The problem with this is that the Lord Jesus' flesh is mentioned, but it's not possible to ascribe a sinful nature to Him, so it can't be rendered thus in such instances. Also, Romans 8 is hard to translate if SARX is rendered 'sinful nature'.

Blessings.

 

[Deborah13]

If one looks at your passage in context it is clear that those "who hold the truth in unrighteousness" are those who know the law. The gentiles had no knowledge nor did they hold the truth.

If you read in context, I think you will see that Paul was speaking of the gentiles, that did not have the law.

Verse 13
13 Now I would not have you ignorant, brethren, that oftentimes I purposed to come unto you, (but was let hitherto,) that I might have some fruit among you also, even as among other Gentiles.

The pagan were aware that there was a God. The description of what they did with this knowledge is recorded in these verses.

 

[JCitoL]

Genesis 1:27-31 "God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him(i.e. the true God has created the human righteous as an user of the universe); male and female created he them..... And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very(i.e. completely) good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day."

You do understand how man fell and became enslaved to sin through the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

the devil seduced them making them to follow/practise occultism/esotericism, because the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" is exactly such to the humans, so they began to follow/practise the creed which these days is known as "yoga/meditation", and thus the so called "third eye" appeared both in eve and adam("the eyes of them both were opened") whereby/whereat they began to perceive the sex and the other physical sense activities amiss as shameful and sinful("and they knew that they were naked"), whence they found occult/esoteric knowledge("fig leaves") and made themselves human(666) religion/spirituality("aprons") in order to cover their shame

Blessings