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    There is salvation in no other, for there is not another name under heaven having been given among men, by which it behooves us to be saved."

What is a Christian?

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It's a label for supposed "good" folk.

I know folk that are not technically Christian because they didn't perform the rituals necessary to join but they are good folk effecting good in the world,i believe that this effect is what will pay their ticket to ride.
 
For the record I am technically Christian because my ma practiced that baptism ritual at birth.
 
The believers were first called "Christians at Antioch.

It was a derogatory term used by pagans and carried the meaning of "slaves of Christ."

But, in their reviling of believers, they got something right. A Christian is a "slave of Christ" or, more precisely, as Paul identified himself, a Bond servant of Christ." ( Rom 1:1, Gal 1:10, Tit 1:1)

The term "bondservant" comes from the law of Moses.(Ex 21:5-6 and Deut 15:16-17) It describes a person who voluntarily chooses to be the slave of another.

So, to be a Christian is to be a bond servant of Christ and that means to submit your life to obeying the will of Christ.

As the bond servant chose to serve his master forever because he loved him, so the Christian chooses to obey Christ forever our of his love for Christ.

iakov the fool
You define well JP. Indeed we are bonded slaves to Christ's call for Obedience and righteousness.
Romans 6:18
You have been set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness.

Remember freinds, slaves have no free will. We have no option to be not righteous, lest we be judged​
 
There are those on this site who believe that to be a Christian one simply must love the Lord with all their heart and love their neighbour as himself or herself. But is that true, is believing those two commandments all there is to it?

Such a simple notion can be rejected with a single question: Which Lord or which Christ is one to love? The biblical doctrine of Christ, the Mormon doctrine of Christ, the JW one?

Such a simple notion can also be rejected by considering Romans 10:9-10:

Rom 10:9 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. (ESV)

Here we have two conditions--(1) confessing that Jesus is Lord and (2) believing that God raised him from the dead.

Then, to consider what it means to "confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord," we look down to verse 13, we see, 'For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”' That is a quote from Joel 2:32a, "And it shall come to pass that everyone who calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved." Paul is quoting Joel, who said "that everyone who calls on the name of YHWH shall be saved". This means that not only are we to consider Jesus as Lord and Master, we are to confess him as God.

Just from these few verses alone then, we can see that there is much more to defining what it means to be a Christian than simply believing those two commandments.
It seems , from your post you wish to be saved , but you wish not to follow what Jesus taught.
I'm really disappointed you choose to underplay the vital importance of Love . If one truly wishes to know what Bible is, I would say it's Story of God's love and redemption.
Not one human who has not learned to love can be saved ( says not me ) but the Word :)
1 John 4:8 ►
Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.

John 10:30 ►

I and the Father are one."

John 15:9 ►

"As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Now remain in my love.

John 3:16 ►

For God so loved the world (humans) that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life

Luke 22: 37-40 & John 13:34

‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment.
And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’
All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”
"A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.

1 John 4:19
We love because God loved us first.

The question to you now Free is, do you think anyone who does not love can yet be saved ?
 
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It seems , from your post you wish to be saved , but you wish not to follow what Jesus taught.
I'm really disappointed you choose to underplay the vital importance of Love . If one truly wishes to know what Bible is, I would say it's Story of God's love and redemption.
Not one human who has not learned to love can be saved ( says not me ) but the Word :)
1 John 4:8 ►
Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.

John 10:30 ►

I and the Father are one."

John 15:9 ►

"As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Now remain in my love.

John 3:16 ►

For God so loved the world (humans) that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life

Luke 22: 37-40 & John 13:34

‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment.
And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’
All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”
"A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.

1 John 4:19
We love because God loved us first.

The question to you now Free is, do you think anyone who does not love can yet be saved ?
You have misunderstood my post.
 
There are those on this site who believe that to be a Christian one simply must love the Lord with all their heart and love their neighbour as himself or herself. But is that true, is believing those two commandments all there is to it?

Such a simple notion can be rejected with a single question: Which Lord or which Christ is one to love? The biblical doctrine of Christ, the Mormon doctrine of Christ, the JW one?

Such a simple notion can also be rejected by considering Romans 10:9-10:

Rom 10:9 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. (ESV)

Here we have two conditions--(1) confessing that Jesus is Lord and (2) believing that God raised him from the dead.

Then, to consider what it means to "confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord," we look down to verse 13, we see, 'For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”' That is a quote from Joel 2:32a, "And it shall come to pass that everyone who calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved." Paul is quoting Joel, who said "that everyone who calls on the name of YHWH shall be saved". This means that not only are we to consider Jesus as Lord and Master, we are to confess him as God.

Just from these few verses alone then, we can see that there is much more to defining what it means to be a Christian than simply believing those two commandments.
The two greatest commandments are that which all the laws and prophets rest on.

What does it mean, and what does it look like to love the Lord with all your strength?
It means we do that which our Father does as expresses through His Son. In other words, we walk as Jesus walked.
How about loving God with all our heart or pur Soul? The three both center and balance us. This is not simple, and it often goes against our will, and our earthly desires.

Furthermore, It is a given that if one loves the Lord with all their heart, strength and soul, that they have both accepted and Proclaimed Jesus as Lord.

We then get to love our neighbors as ourselves, which is the second greatest command. I would add that as we grow in Christ, our love for the Lord widens and by doing so, we learn to love ourselves the way God would have us, and this spills over to how we love our neighbor.

As Christian's, these two greatest commands are core to our belief and our walk with the Lord and it requires faith, because honestly, the Lord asks us to do some pretty tough things, like praying for our enemies etc. Without faith, we stagnate.

The passage in Romans 10:9-10 has 2 parts.
1. Confess the Lord.
2. Believe in your heart.

If you do not believe in your heart, then ones confession is mute. This agrees with John 3:16.

In summary, it's not about simply believing the two greatest commands, but it's about really believing them by trusting God, and living them out.
 
What is a Christian?
One who communes with God in Jesus.
Jesus talked about oneness, in heart, mind and agreement.
Paul carried this on and encouraged all the disciples to agree like this.

On a forum of believers, some claimed this was not Gods intention, yet
clearly this is exactly what Paul preached and Jesus asked us to aspire to.

I was thinking of how to focus guys in spiritual things, with one another.
I was struck by this idea. Listening, who do we love?

It is easy to say how others fail to meet us and support us or show interest in
us. But in a world were we dwell in our poverty rather than fill others with
richness, the world stays poor.

Jesus came to serve, to see and meet need. This was despite their hatred, anger
bitterness and rejection. The response did not change Him, He just went to those
who were open.

the one who received the seed that fell on good soil is the man who hears the word and understands it. He produces a crop, yielding a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown."
Matt 13:23
 
What is a Christian?
One who communes with God in Jesus.
Jesus talked about oneness, in heart, mind and agreement.
Paul carried this on and encouraged all the disciples to agree like this.

On a forum of believers, some claimed this was not Gods intention, yet
clearly this is exactly what Paul preached and Jesus asked us to aspire to.

I was thinking of how to focus guys in spiritual things, with one another.
I was struck by this idea. Listening, who do we love?

It is easy to say how others fail to meet us and support us or show interest in
us. But in a world were we dwell in our poverty rather than fill others with
richness, the world stays poor.

Jesus came to serve, to see and meet need. This was despite their hatred, anger
bitterness and rejection. The response did not change Him, He just went to those
who were open.

the one who received the seed that fell on good soil is the man who hears the word and understands it. He produces a crop, yielding a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown."
Matt 13:23
I like that. Thank you!
 
The two greatest commandments are that which all the laws and prophets rest on.

What does it mean, and what does it look like to love the Lord with all your strength?
It means we do that which our Father does as expresses through His Son. In other words, we walk as Jesus walked.
How about loving God with all our heart or pur Soul? The three both center and balance us. This is not simple, and it often goes against our will, and our earthly desires.

Furthermore, It is a given that if one loves the Lord with all their heart, strength and soul, that they have both accepted and Proclaimed Jesus as Lord.

We then get to love our neighbors as ourselves, which is the second greatest command. I would add that as we grow in Christ, our love for the Lord widens and by doing so, we learn to love ourselves the way God would have us, and this spills over to how we love our neighbor.

As Christian's, these two greatest commands are core to our belief and our walk with the Lord and it requires faith, because honestly, the Lord asks us to do some pretty tough things, like praying for our enemies etc. Without faith, we stagnate.

The passage in Romans 10:9-10 has 2 parts.
1. Confess the Lord.
2. Believe in your heart.

If you do not believe in your heart, then ones confession is mute. This agrees with John 3:16.

In summary, it's not about simply believing the two greatest commands, but it's about really believing them by trusting God, and living them out.
Aameen!
 
the one who received the seed that fell on good soil is the man who hears the word and understands it. He produces a crop, yielding a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown."
Matt 13:23
Well said. Just by nodding the head and claiming belief will not help. Jesus wonderfully explained in the seeds parable you quoted here PJ that it's only THAT seed which fell on good soil and produces a great crop ( works) is what Jesus would like . Well explained PJ :)
 
The two greatest commandments are that which all the laws and prophets rest on.

What does it mean, and what does it look like to love the Lord with all your strength?
It means we do that which our Father does as expresses through His Son. In other words, we walk as Jesus walked.
How about loving God with all our heart or pur Soul? The three both center and balance us. This is not simple, and it often goes against our will, and our earthly desires.

Furthermore, It is a given that if one loves the Lord with all their heart, strength and soul, that they have both accepted and Proclaimed Jesus as Lord.

We then get to love our neighbors as ourselves, which is the second greatest command. I would add that as we grow in Christ, our love for the Lord widens and by doing so, we learn to love ourselves the way God would have us, and this spills over to how we love our neighbor.

As Christian's, these two greatest commands are core to our belief and our walk with the Lord and it requires faith, because honestly, the Lord asks us to do some pretty tough things, like praying for our enemies etc. Without faith, we stagnate.
The issue is that most of this commits the fallacy of begging the question. Who the Lord is, is what is important. We simply cannot say it is good enough to love the Lord when one's idea of the Lord is inconsistent with the biblical revelation of who he is.

1Co 8:5 For although there may be so-called gods in heaven or on earth—as indeed there are many “gods” and many “lords”—
1Co 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist. (ESV)

Paul is here contrasting the many so-called "lords" with the one Lord. The problem with just believing all we need to do is believe those two commandments, is that it makes us no different than the Jews.

The passage in Romans 10:9-10 has 2 parts.
1. Confess the Lord.
2. Believe in your heart.

If you do not believe in your heart, then ones confession is mute. This agrees with John 3:16.

In summary, it's not about simply believing the two greatest commands, but it's about really believing them by trusting God, and living them out.
Of course the confession and belief work together. The point is rather, in whom is one confessing? As the OP shows, Paul links confessing Jesus as Lord with confessing him as YHWH, in verse 13.

When we look at John 3:16, we have to consider what it means to "believe in him". Verse 18 gives us a clue:

Joh 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. (ESV)

And, of course, John 1 provides us with the same:

Joh 1:12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, (ESV)

It is believing "in his name," in the name of Jesus, which is the basis of the confession Paul mentions in Romans 8. What "name" refers to is:

"Expressing the sum of the qualities which mark the nature or character of a person. To believe in the name of Jesus Christ the Son of God, is to accept as true the revelation contained in that title." (Vincent's Word Studies)

To "believe in the name" of Jesus then, is to believe in all that the Bible reveals him to be. This then leads back to everything. Salvation is dependent on confessing Jesus as Lord, which according to Paul is confessing him as YHWH, which is consistent with what John says in John 1:1-18.

This is why we cannot and must not say that to be a Christian one simply must love the Lord with all their heart and love their neighbour as himself or herself. That is simply not what the Bible says. This is why we can and must say that cults such as Mormons and JWs are not and cannot be Christians. They deny the most central reality of Scripture.

To claim they are Christian because they "love the Lord," is to deny the Great Commission, to be unloving by letting them die in their sin. Sure, they "love the Lord," but when contrasted with the biblical revelation of Christ, their "Lord" is one of the so-called "lords" mentioned by Paul--a lord of their own making.
 
The issue is that most of this commits the fallacy of begging the question. Who the Lord is, is what is important. We simply cannot say it is good enough to love the Lord when one's idea of the Lord is inconsistent with the biblical revelation of who he is.

1Co 8:5 For although there may be so-called gods in heaven or on earth—as indeed there are many “gods” and many “lords”—
1Co 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist. (ESV)

Paul is here contrasting the many so-called "lords" with the one Lord. The problem with just believing all we need to do is believe those two commandments, is that it makes us no different than the Jews.


Of course the confession and belief work together. The point is rather, in whom is one confessing? As the OP shows, Paul links confessing Jesus as Lord with confessing him as YHWH, in verse 13.

When we look at John 3:16, we have to consider what it means to "believe in him". Verse 18 gives us a clue:

Joh 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. (ESV)

And, of course, John 1 provides us with the same:

Joh 1:12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, (ESV)

It is believing "in his name," in the name of Jesus, which is the basis of the confession Paul mentions in Romans 8. What "name" refers to is:

"Expressing the sum of the qualities which mark the nature or character of a person. To believe in the name of Jesus Christ the Son of God, is to accept as true the revelation contained in that title." (Vincent's Word Studies)

To "believe in the name" of Jesus then, is to believe in all that the Bible reveals him to be. This then leads back to everything. Salvation is dependent on confessing Jesus as Lord, which according to Paul is confessing him as YHWH, which is consistent with what John says in John 1:1-18.

This is why we cannot and must not say that to be a Christian one simply must love the Lord with all their heart and love their neighbour as himself or herself. That is simply not what the Bible says. This is why we can and must say that cults such as Mormons and JWs are not and cannot be Christians. They deny the most central reality of Scripture.

To claim they are Christian because they "love the Lord," is to deny the Great Commission, to be unloving by letting them die in their sin. Sure, they "love the Lord," but when contrasted with the biblical revelation of Christ, their "Lord" is one of the so-called "lords" mentioned by Paul--a lord of their own making.
Kudos, that was a very well thought out response. I say this in all honesty, I respect the work you have done on this, and I find myself in agreement with many of your points, but I disagree with many of your conclusions.

If what you bring up were the only things to consider, I may find myself in agreement with you. However, I believe the pallet is much broader and more needs to be taken into consideration.

As an example, if one goes to the Mormon church, does that make him a mormon any more than somebody who goes to a "christian" church makes them a Christian?

1 Timothy tells us there are 2 types of sin. One done in ignorance and another willfully. Scripture also states that a teacher will be judged more harshly than the student. Keeping these two passages in mind, I think it's safe to say that yes, there are followers of Christ in both the Mormon church as well as the JW church.

Does this mean I am accepting their doctrine as correct? Certainly not. I am positive you and I would agree with every error they hold. But their doctrine is not in dispute here because no church and no doctrine makes anyone a Christian.

Please, dont misunderstand me. I am not upholding the doctrines of the Mormons or the JW.

What I am saying, is there are good people who love and serve the Lord, our Lord who were taught in error. God knows their heart, and he will be judge.

Does this mean we accept their errors? Certainly not. We discuss those errors in a respectful way because we know change is never easy. Growing up in error seems right, and to find out what you've been taught your whole life is a shift... and for some a scary one, especially if they have friends and family still in error.
 
Further yet, it is the Holy Spirit that leads us to the Son, and the Son who leads us to the Father. I think it can be said that anywhere along that process is a "Christian?"
 
Kudos, that was a very well thought out response. I say this in all honesty, I respect the work you have done on this, and I find myself in agreement with many of your points, but I disagree with many of your conclusions.

If what you bring up were the only things to consider, I may find myself in agreement with you. However, I believe the pallet is much broader and more needs to be taken into consideration.

As an example, if one goes to the Mormon church, does that make him a mormon any more than somebody who goes to a "christian" church makes them a Christian?

1 Timothy tells us there are 2 types of sin. One done in ignorance and another willfully. Scripture also states that a teacher will be judged more harshly than the student. Keeping these two passages in mind, I think it's safe to say that yes, there are followers of Christ in both the Mormon church as well as the JW church.

Does this mean I am accepting their doctrine as correct? Certainly not. I am positive you and I would agree with every error they hold. But their doctrine is not in dispute here because no church and no doctrine makes anyone a Christian.

Please, dont misunderstand me. I am not upholding the doctrines of the Mormons or the JW.

What I am saying, is there are good people who love and serve the Lord, our Lord who were taught in error. God knows their heart, and he will be judge.

Does this mean we accept their errors? Certainly not. We discuss those errors in a respectful way because we know change is never easy. Growing up in error seems right, and to find out what you've been taught your whole life is a shift... and for some a scary one, especially if they have friends and family still in error.
Amen. Judging others (whatever they may believe in ) is extremely dangerous for us Christians . Jesus warns us in Matthew 7: 1-2 about that :
“Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."
It's crazy risky to judge
 
Judging. The sad thing is in faith is we often speak quicker than we listen or know.

Movements happen for a real reason, and people find blessing because a need is met.
The believers who attend such fellowships do often because the Lord has called them.

A few instances. People trusting God for miracles, to demonstrate His love for people,
yet the theology of the believers is rather odd in terms of how they are going and communing
in Jesus.

Giving for blessing, where truly God does bless when the people give from a good heart.
Yet equally some squander and miss-appropriate such gifts. A teacher may teach heresy and
miss-use their office, yet the office still is blessed.

The power of the light and truth, exposing sin and problems, will be shown, and His gospel
will overthrow all the works of the enemy, so we just need to shine like a light, and all things
will resolve. The danger is when bitterness and hurt get involved, rather than seeing Gods
grace and love working through everything we do, Amen. Power and money, greed, envy,
sin is always our battle, yet in Christ we have the victory.
 
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