When Does Immortality Begin?

Discussion in 'Theology' started by wondering, Nov 25, 2017.

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  1. wondering

    wondering Member

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    Definition of immortality
    : the quality or state of being immortal:
    : unending existence:
    : lasting fame


    When do we become immortal...
    Immediately after death,
    or when we receive our glorified body at the resurrection at the end of time.
     
  2. whatgoeshere?

    whatgoeshere? Member

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    Matthew 25:46.
    We are of God from the beginning. Genesis 1. All that exists is created from God. God is immortal, and we made in the image and likeness of that eternal spirit, our souls, are too. And the dust returneth to the earth as it was, And the spirit returneth to God who gave it. Ecclesiastes 12:7
     
  3. Papa Zoom

    Papa Zoom Staff Member Moderator

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    I'm of the opinion that it's when we are glorified at the resurrection. Until then, we decay. At least in the physical sense it's true. Not sure about the soul but that seems a different question
     
  4. chessman

    chessman Member

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    The bodies of His brothers are raised in Christ and become immortal at the resurrection. The soul, however, has Eternal Life now, which is why we are raised in Christ.

    So also it has been written [in Gen 2:7], “The first man, Adam, became a living soul”. The Last Adam became a life-giving spirit. But the spiritual body is not first— but the natural body, then the spiritual. The first man was from earth, made-of-dust. The second Man is from heaven. Such as was the one made-of-dust— such ones also are the ones made-of-dust. And such as is the heavenly One— such ones also are the heavenly ones. Now I say this, brothers: that flesh and blood are not able to inherit the kingdom of God, nor does decay inherit undecayability. Behold, I tell you a mystery: we will not all fall-asleep. But we will all be changed— For this decayable body must put-on undecayability, and this mortal body must put on immortality. But thanks be to God, the One giving us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
    1 Corinthians 15:45-48,50-51,53,57 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=1 Corinthians 15:45-48,50-51,53,57&version=DLNT


    But the soul of everyone believing in Him will never die. Ever! We have Eternal Life, though the body dies.

    Jesus said to her, “ I am the resurrection and the life. The one believing in Me— even though he dies, he will live. And everyone living and believing in Me will never die, ever. Do you believe this?” She says to Him, “Yes, Lord. I have believed that You are the Christ, the Son of God, the One coming into the world”.
    John 11:25-27 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=John 11:25-27&version=DLNT

    The thing having been born of the flesh is flesh, and the thing having been born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You all must be born again’— the wind blows where it wants, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know from where it comes, and where it is going. So is everyone having been born of the Spirit”. And just as Moses lifted-up the serpent in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up in order that everyone putting-faith in Him may have eternal life.
    John 3:6-8,14-15 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=John 3:6-8,14-15&version=DLNT
     
  5. wondering

    wondering Member

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    Thanks.

    A thought came to me that we're immortal from birth since the soul and spirit never die.
    Or does immortal only refer to the body??;
     
  6. wondering

    wondering Member

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    Thanks PZ
    So you believe immorrtality refers to the body...
    So at the resurrection....ok
     
  7. Papa Zoom

    Papa Zoom Staff Member Moderator

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    also I'm not sure what happens when we die - do our souls sleep? or do we go into the presence of Jesus? Not sure. I'm working on that one. I had it settled once but the question keeps returning so I guess it wasn't really settled after all. :lol
     
  8. wondering

    wondering Member

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    I can't believe in soul sleep.
    Some in the OT believed in this.
    I do feel this was taken care of in the NT.

    To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.
    This very day you will be with Me in paradise.

    I question if we go directly to heaven, or have to wait for the resurrection in Abraham's Bossom.
    I tend toward heaven because Jesus tore the veil to the holy of holies. He opened the gates...
     
  9. wondering

    wondering Member

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    Thanks chessman.
    I like your first paragraph. Very concise and easy.

    You bring up a good point.
    Our soul and spirit are already immortal...
    So it must refer to the resurrection. Otherwise we could say we're immortal now and that would be wrong.
     
  10. whatgoeshere?

    whatgoeshere? Member

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    I can see how it could seem comlicated when I recall the scriptures that talk about fear the one that can destroy the body and soul in Hell. While there is that other scripture that was posted in this thread about how the body returns to dust. And the soul to the father from whence it came.

    I'm thinking "the body" that is referred to in such cases is the glorified body that we also later read about in those scriptures that talk about the rapture.
    Thinking too about Jesus when he was resurrected from death and left tht tomb. When people that knew Jesus prior to his crucifixion saw him renewed, resurrected, they did not recognize him.
    If he looked exactly like their beloved friend and teacher prior to death, how could that be? Unless he was in the body he told Mary Magdalene she could not hug because he'd not yet returned to his father. A glorified body. A body that only seems to be part of this material plain. But is in fact an illusion manifest by the spirit at work.
    I'm reaching there but that is my thought as to how the glorified would come to be.
     
  11. wondering

    wondering Member

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    Good point re the rapture. When we receive our glorified body's all at one time....together.

    And, of course, you're right about Jesus' glorified body and the non-recognition..
    Till He broke the bread!

    Luke...The Road to Emmaus.
     
  12. Allen Wynne

    Allen Wynne Member

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    Christian:
    Yes
    Immortality is eternal life.
    Eternal life begins when one becomes born again.
    A person becomes one with the Holy Spirit of God.
    You then recognize the presence of God in your life.
    You know for sure that Jesus is God and that he is with you.
    Some day you will die and go through a change.
    But change is good.
    God promises us that it is good.
    God promises that he will make things better forever.
    It is the born again believer that believes this and looks forward to it.

    Isaiah 40:31;
    "but those who hope in the LORD will renew their strength. They will soar on wings like eagles; they will run and not grow weary, they will walk and not be faint."

    I see this as a time and times in our lives as born again believers.
    We get saved and we are full of life, of our new life with Jesus.

    Then we run, we learn and grow and serve, but we don't grow weary.
    Then as the end comes in this body, we walk but we never grow faint because our faith in God won't let us.

    Then a time comes for change.
    We don't know what happens, but if we are believers in Jesus Christ, then we know it is good, and we look forward to it.
    It is a continuation of eternal life, it is immortality because God says so.
     
  13. wondering

    wondering Member

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    Thanks Allen
    So you believe immortality begins at the born again experience because Jesus gives us the spark of eternal life. And, who dies not born again certainly does not go to life, but to eternal death.

    Lovely post. It makes me want to praise God.
     
  14. Allen Wynne

    Allen Wynne Member

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    Christian:
    Yes
    I hope so...
     
  15. Allen Wynne

    Allen Wynne Member

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    Christian:
    Yes
    Eternal life is not offered to anyone in any religion, per se...
    Hindus believe they are recreated over and over until they perfect themselves and become part of God, the whole...whatever that means...
    No other religion offers anything except Christianity.
    We are given a Savior who Claims to be the God of the Universe that created everything.
    He promises us eternal life if we believe he has died for our sins, as God cannot live with sin and we are unable to overcome sin on our own.
     
  16. wondering

    wondering Member

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    Part of God...that idea that God is in everything and when we die we become a part of the universe and in this way, we become a part of God.

    I like Jesus better!!
    Christianity holds the truth, not just part of it.
     
  17. PeterJens

    PeterJens Member

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    To be immortal, is to not die.
    The 2nd death is the final death.
    But up to that point, all who have life have the potential to never die.
    So we have immortality until it is taken away.
    In fiction immortality means we cannot be destroyed or killed.
    God does not promise to make us indestructable, but to bring us into His fellowship and
    write us in His book of life, and to forgive us of our sins so we will not suffer the 2nd death.

    So we never get immortality in the fictional sense, but communion with God, and to dwell in His
    presence for eternity. At that time there is no injustice or sin. It does not describe if there is cellular
    death, or the ability to stub ones toe, but we have no reason to believe things will be so radically
    different than the world we currently live in, with the simple laws of physics.

    So eternal life begins with our communion with God in Christ and never ends, Amen.
     
  18. Allen Wynne

    Allen Wynne Member

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    wow, your interpretation of eternal life is certainly different
    never heard it before
     
  19. PeterJens

    PeterJens Member

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    I am repackaging ideas with different labels.
    I had a long discussion with believers about eternal life, is life in communion with Christ, but if one breaks
    this communion, one no longer has eternal life.

    Another way of expressing this is when you get on a bus to ride to a distant destination, you are still on
    that bus until you get off it, which can happen at any point through the journey.
    So in Christ we have eternal life, which is communion with Christ, but we can lose it.
    It is the fundamental nature of this relationship that it is chosen and free, maintained and dependant.

    But for some this idea creates insecurity and the idea they are earning this status, and to even suggest
    one can walk away for them is evil heresy. The problem is their consciences are condemning them
    constantly and they have this guilt that says they are not worthy or accepted by Christ, so feel they have
    actually walked away already, and need the security to stay reassured it is true.

    For me their problem is unbelief pure and simple. They do not trust God will honour His word and they
    are safe walking with Him. They want the promise to be independent of their behaviour which is by its
    nature easy believism, and buying a ticket that cannot be refuted, even though the person continually refutes
    it in their life. They go on and on about how insecure one must be without this security, when actually they
    do not know Christ so need their doctrines to manufacture acceptance, when they know they are in sin and
    slavery with no apparent way out. If love has touched ones heart, the light had dawned, but until then any
    mechanism is better than none.
     
  20. wondering

    wondering Member

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    Hi Peter

    I thought you were agreeing with Allen Wynne .
    He believes you're saying something different...
    Am I wrong?
     

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