Who was the Man of Sin, the Son of Perdition?

Discussion in 'Preterism Discussions' started by Dan00, Dec 27, 2013.

  1. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    2Ki 18:9 And it came to pass in the fourth year of king Hezekiah, which was the seventh year of Hoshea son of Elah king of Israel, that Shalmaneser king of Assyria came up against Samaria, and besieged it.
    2Ki 18:10 And at the end of three years they took it: even in the sixth year of Hezekiah, that is the ninth year of Hoshea king of Israel, Samaria was taken.
    2Ki 18:11 And the king of Assyria did carry away Israel unto Assyria, and put them in Halah and in Habor by the river of Gozan, and in the cities of the Medes:
    2Ki 18:12 Because they obeyed not the voice of the LORD their God, but transgressed
     
  2. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    2Ki 24:8 Jehoiachin was eighteen years old when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem three months. And his mother's name was Nehushta, the daughter of Elnathan of Jerusalem.
    2Ki 24:9 And he did that which was evil in the sight of the LORD, according to all that his father had done.
    2Ki 24:10 At that time the servants of Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon came up against Jerusalem, and the city was besieged.
     
  3. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    Here we are Eugene a mod and an admin about as of topic as it gets... :neutral

    Some times these threads have a life of their own...

    Sheesh and Edward was kind to start another thread...:shame
     
  4. Deborah13

    Deborah13 Member

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    BUT....
    Sometimes it seems that to get to the answer in the OP one has to wander through the scriptures before the answer becomes clear or even partially clear.
     
    reba likes this.
  5. reba

    reba Staff Member Administrator

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    O i like that :) :sohappy
     
  6. JLB

    JLB Member

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    The reason the answer to the OP has not been found is:

    The man of sin will be revealed in his own time.

    The man of sin has a set time of his own when he will be revealed.

    3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. 5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 2 Thessalonians 2:3-6

    If he has a time when he will be revealed, then his name will be known to all, at that time.

    Here is one fact the we do know about this man of sin, who goes to the Temple of God and proclaims himself as God.

    He will be destroyed by Jesus Christ Himself when he returns, by the brightness of His Coming.

    8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:8

    The scriptures teach us:

    • the man of sin will be revealed, in his own time.
    • the man of sin will be destroyed by Jesus Christ Himself, at His coming.

    JLB
     
  7. Deborah13

    Deborah13 Member

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    I understand this phrase "in his own time" to mean that in the Lord's plan there is a time for this revealing. That the Lord is in control of this revealing.
    Saul was Saul until "his time" came in the Lord's plan for him to be converted to Paul, to bring in the gentiles.
     
  8. JLB

    JLB Member

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    Yes.

    The phrase is also clear about stating, in "his own" time.

    Meaning there is a specific time that God has set aside for this man of sin to be revealed, as well as destroyed, by Jesus Christ, at His Coming.


    JLB
     
  9. DaveRC

    DaveRC Member

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    The Zealots murdered thousands of priests and the high priests installed their own high priest during the first Jewish-Roman war. This is the event that put an end to the Old Covenant Jewish age.

    Also, the Zealots used the Temple as one of their last defenses against the Roman sacking of Jerusalem.

    And the Romans worshipped and sacrificed to Caesar and Aquila in the Temple`s sanctuary too.

    The Antichrist is a boogieman dreamt up by futurists and premillennialists that has no scriptural basis whatsoever. Its a fairy tale like the Rapture.

    Daniel 7:17-27 & 2 Thessalonians 1:1-9 assuredly proves it.
     
  10. JLB

    JLB Member

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    Please write the scripture that "proves" whatever claim you are making.


    Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. 5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12


    These verse's prove that the man of sin, the false messiah, the lawless one, AKA the antichrist, will be revealed in his own time.
    • And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 2 Thessalonians 2:6

    These verse's prove that the man of sin, the false messiah, the lawless one, AKA the antichrist, will be revealed by going to the Temple and proclaiming himself as God.
    • Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. 2 Thessalonians 2:3-4

    These verse's prove that the man of sin, the false messiah, the lawless one, AKA the antichrist, will be destroyed by Jesus Christ Himself, when He returns in power and glory, to gather His people at the resurrection/rapture, at His coming.

    Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. 5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8



    These are events that we are looking forward to.





    JLB
     
  11. DaveRC

    DaveRC Member

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    The Little Horn is placed during the time of Rome in Daniel 7:17-28, this figure or figures persecute the church namely the saints.

    There is no doubt this passage is speaking about the church because it certainly not speaking about Old Covenant Israel during the days of Rome.

    And again, who is Christ COMING to provide relief of their tribulation and persecutions in 2 Thessalonians 1:1-9? The church of Thessalonica! Could you please point out where this church is today?

    Audience relevance is your friend.
     
  12. JLB

    JLB Member

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    Jesus Christ is coming to gather all the saints at the resurrection/rapture, and destroy the antichrist.

    Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. 5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8


    The resurrection/rapture is one event whereby all the Church will be caught up unto Him, at His coming.

    15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.

    ....we who are alive and remain in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air shall be caught up together with them ...


    All the Church will be caught up together [gathered] unto Him, at His coming, not just the Church at Thessalonica.

    20 But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive. 23 But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ’s at His coming. 24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 1 Corinthians 15:20-24


    Context and rightly dividing the word of God is your friend.



    JLB
     
  13. DaveRC

    DaveRC Member

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    The Rapture is a false doctrine proven by numerous passages such as Ephesians 3:21; John 6:39-40,44; John 17:15,20; 1 Corinthians 15:50; etc.

    Also 2 Thessalonians 1:1-9, whose is Christ COMING to provide relief for?

    The church!

    And again, whose is going to live through and survive the little horn that reigns during the fourth kingdom of Daniel 7:17-28, namely Rome?

    The church!
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2017
  14. Douglas Summers

    Douglas Summers Member

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    Antichrist in Scripture in 1 John 4:1-3 is explained, it is denying that Christ is God, to represent the Father.(John chapter 8). John says there are many Antichrist. The man of sin is an Antichrist by rejecting that Christ is from God, and that He is God. (John 1:1-5). He is an Antichrist, the man of sin. And while the man of sin is not called the Antichrist in Scripture, The man of sin is referred to (by Johns definition) as "The Antichrist" that is one of the beast in Revelation by scholars and teachers.
     
  15. DaveRC

    DaveRC Member

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    There is no antichrist, but there is the beast, the sixth king (or Caesar) of Rome who was responsible for one of the worst and most monstrous persecutions of the church in history.

    His beard was fiery red, unusual and rare for a Roman. His non-Christian contemporaries and enemies even labelled him "the beast".

    And his suicide by a sharp instrument to the neck almost ended the Roman Empire forever. But it miraculously survived its civil war to live for another few hundred years.

    Do you want to know how long the sixth Caesar of Rome persecuted the church? Approximately 3.5 years! From A.D. 64-68!
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2017
  16. Douglas Summers

    Douglas Summers Member

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    Strange Fire?
     
  17. AirDancer

    AirDancer Member

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    The fiery red beard might not have been common for a Roman to have, but even by the time of the sixth king of Rome, Vikings/Celts were known in Rome, and some of them were quite red headed. Some remained in Rome and in the general area. So, genetically speaking, a red beard wasn't entirely out of the question.
     
  18. ezrider

    ezrider Member

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    The Little Horn of Daniel 7 is Jesus Christ. The Horn of David.
     
  19. DaveRC

    DaveRC Member

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    Fair again, just sharing some unusual physical attributes of Nero Caesar. Monstrous vile man.
     
  20. DaveRC

    DaveRC Member

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    ?????
     

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