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Why do you believe?

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#41
He's a troll
He came here to stir up doubt for the rest of the church, and that's all he had intended to do.
I believe you're right old friend. If not, Logan wasn't biblically saved to begin with....
John 2:23 "Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did.
2:24 But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
2:25 And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man."


Actually this brings up a good point to discuss. In our churches, there are many folk who think their saved but are not. I believe there is a huge difference between those who want what Jesus can give them. They love the benefits, but not the Giver of the benefits. In other words, because of the wicked world that we live in and a kind of new evangelism these days that don't preach repentance from sin and a future of good works. Instead, they preach prosperity, they preach a luvy, duvy, warm and fuzzy life if a person simply believes in Jesus.

The prosperity preaching has, and is, deceiving folk to believe that they are saved when their not. It is my opinion that when someone hears all the gifts they can receive if they become a Christian, and they follow thru with a profession, this is not the Gospel that the Apostles wrote about. Before I post any Scripture, I need to make a simple statement. True Salvation is a commitment to the giver of the gifts. Salvation is all about Jesus Christ, not what He is able to give us as a believer.

Simply put. Salvation shifts the hearts longing, not for gifts, but for a loving close relationship with the gift giver, Jesus, and His Father.

Romans 8:32 "He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?"

2 Peter 1:2 "Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,
Confirm Your Calling and Election
1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust."

To conclude my thoughts, I'd just want to impress the thought that our Heavenly Father and His Son Jesus just love to give great gifts to their Believers who trust in them, not only for Salvation, and the greatest gift, eternal life, but to receive those "great and precious promises. If we are not careful, we will except God's gifts without acknowledging and loving the Giver. Remember the huge love affair we had with Jesus when we were saved? O my. How we thanked our Heavenly Father for allowing Jesus to die for our sins. O how we lovingly felt about Jesus Who endured the beatings and death on that cruel cross.

Lets not forget to remember where our future life is held, in the great big heart of Almighty God and His anointed One, Jesus.
 
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#42
Hello everyone, I am a recent christian turned agnostic [snip] but I would like to know why you believe what you believe?
Because it is true ... same reason as all of the other facts that I believe in my life. I believe that gravity draws me towards the earth because all of the empirical evidence of my life supports that belief and the mathematics taught in school are supported by my personal observations from reality.

I followed the opposite path from you. Raised an agnostic 'submarine christian' (surfacing twice a year to suffer through the social obligation of a mandatory Easter and Christmas service), I embraced atheism and full on nihilism when I became a gang member, arsonist and drug smuggler. Confronted with the irrefutable reality of the Creator God that had eluded me in so many pale secularized Easter and Christmas services, I had no choice but to acknowledge the irrefutable reality before me and to decide how I was going to respond to it.

Just as you have chosen to see and walk away, I chose to see and walk towards.
No regrets ... although, I eventually figured out that it was never my choice. He chose me when I had nothing to recommend me.
I believe because Scripture explains REALITY better than any other theory and is supported by all available experiential evidence.
I really admire the way the Bible doesn't blow smoke at you, but constantly tells it like it is.
 
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#43
Hi Paul, This is what you call the "just in case christian". They swear there ain't no heaven and pray there ain't no hell. But a born again believer is just that, Born Again! There is no doubt or hoping there is a God, but we walk in the assurance of His Spirit. The only thing that confuses a born again believer is, why others do not believe in God? With the witness of creation and it's wonderment as proof of His existence, that is purposely explained away by theories by the enemies of God.
I actually agree with you Douglas. This argument is a seed for the alleged logical process for agnostics to ponder (myself once being one). There are really two issues here...one is what John reveals and that is that if they went out from us they were never really one of us and the other is of course that which you have implied. If one is REALLY born of the Spirit they are a new creature. A GENUINE born again believer is just that...born again! They can no longer EVER deny God any more than a mere biological offspring can deny they have a parent who really exists (or existed in my case). They ARE a child of an actual alive and knowable parent (God).

They may have joined the club of Churchianity like the 5 unwise virgins, and even do or have done all the Church stuff, but their lamps were never filled.(filled with the Spirit) and they never trimmed their wicks (conformed to His image with humility and contrition) and Jesus never knew them. So I agree but the seed was meant for the OP-er to ponder that's all.
 

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#44
This forum is for nonChristians to seek answers from Christians. In keeping with that policy, post should address the OP. If members wish to discuss the topic, start a new thread in the appropriate forum.

Thank you.
 
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#45
This forum is for nonChristians to seek answers from Christians. In keeping with that policy, post should address the OP. If members wish to discuss the topic, start a new thread in the appropriate forum.

Thank you.
Wow! Thanks WIP, I had forgotten the intent of this forum. Following your instruction, I'll be especially aware of helping someone who might have a need in this area of their life. I wish I had known about this before I was saved because for ten years I was searching for Truth but had no where to find answers.
 
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#46
Hello everyone, I am a recent christian turned agnostic. (Please don't try to change my view points) but I would like to know why you believe what you believe? I personally let go of Christianity for many reasons, 1. because I am not intrested in following a god that has no business in helping me or trying to make me better, I have prayed,prayed, and prayed some more, but nothing not one speck of help from him. 2. I was happy when I was an unbeliever, and when I because a christian I was sad, depressed, anxiety ridden and ocd ridden all because if christianity, before this I was fine, but these past few months have been the worst of my life and after a year of faith, I am done. I have given up of the god of Christianity. 3. Too many rules, I have been troubled by soany rules in my life that I simply could not live without worrying about of I was sinning and I got sick of it ang gave it up. I still believe there could be a god, but that god is not knowable and not able to understand. I also do not believe in sin or salvation.
I believe because God promises that if I believe in Jesus that I will have enternal life see John 3:16 I always believed in God but he was never so important in my life but God changed me over the last few months. I read his word God showed me my wrongs he cleansed me of those wrongs now Im more joyful than ever and that's all thanks to Christ who died for my sins past present and future. now I don't know what God you were worshiping because whenever I ask God for help I don't think there's been one time where he hasn't helped me. you seem like you were trying to obey laws to be saved that's not how it works you cannot be saved by works only through Jesus he's the way and the truth and the life no one comes to the father except through him see John 14:6. May God help you and guide you I'll pray for you God bless.
 
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#47
Hello everyone, I am a recent christian turned agnostic. (Please don't try to change my view points) but I would like to know why you believe what you believe? I personally let go of Christianity for many reasons, 1. because I am not intrested in following a god that has no business in helping me or trying to make me better, I have prayed,prayed, and prayed some more, but nothing not one speck of help from him. 2. I was happy when I was an unbeliever, and when I because a christian I was sad, depressed, anxiety ridden and ocd ridden all because if christianity, before this I was fine, but these past few months have been the worst of my life and after a year of faith, I am done. I have given up of the god of Christianity. 3. Too many rules, I have been troubled by soany rules in my life that I simply could not live without worrying about of I was sinning and I got sick of it ang gave it up. I still believe there could be a god, but that god is not knowable and not able to understand. I also do not believe in sin or salvation.
Being a Christian and a born again believer are two different things. God called us to suffer with Him that we would also reign with him (2 Tim. 2:12). If the world did not love Christ, then (if you are born again) it will not love you either.(John 15:18-27) All the followers (born again believers) suffered just as Christ. Try preaching that Christ never expected the Church to tithe, but to give of a willing heart and see how the visible church treats you.(1 Cor. 16:1-3) try preaching to members of the visible church that are car salesmen that you should not con or cheat people when buying a car. Teach that the Bible does not condone homosexuality and see how many people shun you from the visible church. When I was born again, the church I worshiped at would celebrate Halloween. When I asked the lord to show me the Truth, I lost everything I owned, including my job, until I had nothing but Christ alone. A lot to witness to, but, if you joined a church to make worldly gain, then you have never seen man for what we are. The money spent on beautiful and expensive church buildings was not taught by Christ to the Church. I have been where you are at with being depressed, so was Paul (2 Cor. 12:7-10) (Romans 7:14-25). Study the Scriptures I gave you. The whole purpose of the law is to make us feel guilty before God. (Rom. 7:7-14) But the joy of salvation is in (Romans 8:1-4) You must be born again (John 3:1-21).

Christ in me.
Douglas Summers
 
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#48
Yes! Romans 8:9...one who is truly born from above can NEVER deny Christ, or who or what they are in HIM...no more than a cow can deny being cow. If they went out from us they were never one of us (regardless of a sinners prayer or a baptism). Anyone who joins the club can think they are a Christian...some think because mommy and daddy were they are also...some get caught up in the excitement of a crowd, or want to fit in with their group, some make the claim thinking this gets them out of hell...but the real question is...do they have the Spirit of Christ living in them? Thank you Douglas...the point was a good one.
 

JPPT1974

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#49
Being a Christian is not just that of going to church on Sunday. But living the Christian life. In our lives 24/7!
 
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#50
Being a Christian is not just that of going to church on Sunday. But living the Christian life. In our lives 24/7!
Those of us who are born-again Christians know this. It's a self-evident truth. I don't know why you are reminding us of this.

Oz
 
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#51
Hello everyone, I am a recent christian turned agnostic. (Please don't try to change my view points) but I would like to know why you believe what you believe? I personally let go of Christianity for many reasons, 1. because I am not intrested in following a god that has no business in helping me or trying to make me better, I have prayed,prayed, and prayed some more, but nothing not one speck of help from him. 2. I was happy when I was an unbeliever, and when I because a christian I was sad, depressed, anxiety ridden and ocd ridden all because if christianity, before this I was fine, but these past few months have been the worst of my life and after a year of faith, I am done. I have given up of the god of Christianity. 3. Too many rules, I have been troubled by soany rules in my life that I simply could not live without worrying about of I was sinning and I got sick of it ang gave it up. I still believe there could be a god, but that god is not knowable and not able to understand. I also do not believe in sin or salvation.
Hmm, Listen Pal, I'm 77 years old and have followed Jesus Christ as my Savior and Master since 1974 with evidence. I don't know what you thought was your point of Salvation, but it was a deception. You were not biblically saved and Spirit filled. If you were, your song would be completely different.

I'd be happy to lead you into the Salvation that really saves and gives you a song in the night.
 
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#52
I believe because Jesus had left the flock to find that one lost sheep...namely, me. When I was a nine year old child and loving the Lord, I saw Jesus, in all white, dressed as a shepherd. I thought someone was trying to play a trick on me to make me become highly religious. But as I looked around, I saw no one with a projector or acting suspiciously. Shortly afterwards, I became agnostics, got into drugs, and an enormous amount of unhealthy spirits came into my life. I was tormented by these spirits - both human and demon alike for 7 years before knowing that they were real. And at that time, I knew Jesus was real. This is how He had found me. I once heard the voice of my Father God. I have seen the Holy Spirit. And I have witnessed angels. In this, I tell the truth.
 
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#53
I believe because Jesus had left the flock to find that one lost sheep...namely, me. When I was a nine year old child and loving the Lord, I saw Jesus, in all white, dressed as a shepherd. I thought someone was trying to play a trick on me to make me become highly religious. But as I looked around, I saw no one with a projector or acting suspiciously. Shortly afterwards, I became agnostics, got into drugs, and an enormous amount of unhealthy spirits came into my life. I was tormented by these spirits - both human and demon alike for 7 years before knowing that they were real. And at that time, I knew Jesus was real. This is how He had found me. I once heard the voice of my Father God. I have seen the Holy Spirit. And I have witnessed angels. In this, I tell the truth.
I'm curious, what did the Holy Spirit look like?
 
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#54
I believe because Jesus had left the flock to find that one lost sheep...namely, me. When I was a nine year old child and loving the Lord, I saw Jesus, in all white, dressed as a shepherd. I thought someone was trying to play a trick on me to make me become highly religious. But as I looked around, I saw no one with a projector or acting suspiciously. Shortly afterwards, I became agnostics, got into drugs, and an enormous amount of unhealthy spirits came into my life. I was tormented by these spirits - both human and demon alike for 7 years before knowing that they were real. And at that time, I knew Jesus was real. This is how He had found me. I once heard the voice of my Father God. I have seen the Holy Spirit. And I have witnessed angels. In this, I tell the truth.
Very nice testimony. Some might not understand because it is written over and over"with their ears they don't hear, and with their eyes they don't see'. But you are bless because you do. You show an ability to discern sprits, but how can those who don't hear and see with their spiritual eyes understand? Still, thank you for the account.
 
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#55
I'm curious, what did the Holy Spirit look like?
Identifying the Holy Spirit

This is a photograph of the Holy Spirit descending like a dove as He did during the baptism of Jesus.



Here is a photograph of the Holy Spirit motionless.



Below is a painting of the Apostle Saint Andrew with the Holy Spirit upon Him.



The Halo is found in scripture as the Holy Spirit alighting and remaining upon Jesus.

The Spirit of God and the Spirit are both one and the same Holy Spirit.

Mathew 3:16. When He had been baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water, and behold, the heavens were opened to Him, and He saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting upon Him.

John 1:32. John testified saying, "I have seen the Spirit descending as a dove out of heaven, and He remained upon Him."

The center photograph above is of the Holy Spirit in His spirit body form.

Luke 3:22. And the Holy Spirit descended in bodily form like a dove upon Him, and a voice came from heaven which said, "You are My beloved Son; in You I am well pleased."

The Holy Spirit alighting and remaining upon Jesus appeared as a Halo.
 

WIP

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#58
This is a photograph of the Holy Spirit descending like a dove as He did during the baptism of Jesus.

Who took that photo?

Oops, should have read the rest of the thread. I see dirtfarmer already asked this question.
 

WIP

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#59
The Holy Spirit alighting and remaining upon Jesus appeared as a Halo.
I don't see a resemblance between a halo and a dove. Where is the Scripture that explains this?
Dove as defined by Merriam-Webster
  1. any of numerous pigeons; especially : a small wild pigeon

  2. a gentle woman or child

  3. one who takes a conciliatory attitude and advocates negotiations and compromise; especially : an opponent of war — compare hawk

Halo as defined by Merriam-Webster
  1. : a circle of light appearing to surround the sun or moon and resulting from refraction or reflection of light by ice particles in the atmosphere

  2. something resembling a halo: such asa : nimbusb : a region of space surrounding a galaxy that is sparsely populated with luminous objects (such as globular clusters) but is believed to contain a great deal of dark matterc : a differentiated zone surrounding a central zone or objectd or halo brace : an orthopedic device used to immobilize the head and neck (as to treat fracture of neck vertebrae) that consists of a metal band placed around the head and fastened to the skull usually with metal pins and that is attached by extensions to an inflexible vest

  3. the aura of glory, veneration, or sentiment surrounding an idealized person or thing
 
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#60
I believe in one GOD who made all that there is ! And has given me all I need !

GOD is Wonderful , Great, Best, and I can never thank GOD enough for all that we have................!

GOD has blessed me with so much......... Words can never explain how GREAT GOD is...............
 
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