The "EVENTS" of salvation.

[Cygnus]

God saved us by sending His Son to die for our sins. Then calls us to believe in this.

I believe everyone already knows that. Perhaps you can weave it not the "event" of salvation. What comes before and after belief?

 

[Cygnus]

The CoC believes: HBRCB. (You can look it up.)

Is one saved before or after the second B? HBRCB

 

[JLB]

I believe the first step (or event) is hearing the gospel, Rom.10:14. Of course one today can simply pick up the Bible and read for himself.

I agree that hearing would be the first step.

• faith comes by hearing

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our report?” 17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Romans 10:16-17


I don't find where faith comes by reading.


JLB

 

[Nathan]

I believe everyone already knows that. Perhaps you can weave it not the "event" of salvation. What comes before and after belief?

Salvation isn't an event, it's a life.

Before salvation we are dead in our sins. Lifeless, unable to believe.

After being made alive, by being put into Christ who is life, then we are alive and can believe.

So before belief, we were dead in sins and then made alive in Christ. After belief, we continue in His life being transformed by the renewing of our mind.

 

[Cygnus]

I agree that hearing would be the first step.

Would that be part of "drawing"?
Does on have to be regenerated before they can hear considering were dead in our sins and transgressions and can't spiritually hear?

 

[Cygnus]

Salvation isn't an event, it's a life.

Before salvation we are dead in our sins. Lifeless, unable to believe.

After being made alive, by being put into Christ who is life, then we are alive and can believe.

So before belief, we were dead in sins and then made alive in Christ. After belief, we continue in His life being transformed by the renewing of our mind.

So, you have presented an order of events. It seems as if your first event is regeneration.....then belief.

 

[Nathan]

So, you have presented an order of events. It seems as if your first event is regeneration.....then belief.

Correct. We are made alive in Christ, and because of that we can believe. A dead person cannot believe.

 

[Gregg T]

I don't think the chronological order is out of the way. It is called the golden chain for a reason. Have you been glorified yet?

He marked out before, He called, He justified, He glorified - all aorist active indicative verbs

• aorist tense - punctiliar past tense
• active voice - subject does the action
• indicative mood - statement of fact, actual occurance

Yes, I have been glorified according to Rom 8:29-30, as are all those in Christ.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

It seems as if you have some sort of series parallel path....where God "drawing" a person has several inputs where one of them is a person being taught.

That's correct. From several stories, I know that God can reach people in a variety of ways.

 

[Gregg T]

I don't think the chronological order is out of the way. It is called the golden chain for a reason. Have you been glorified yet?

Also, calling it a golden chain does not make it a chain, a golden chain, or a chronological golden chain. None of the verbs in Rom 8:29-30 indicate chronological order; and all of which are punctiliar past tense except for 'to be' . Calling those verses a golden chain is a calvinistic / theologically determinist maneuver to poison the well.

 

[JLB]

Would that be part of "drawing"?
Does on have to be regenerated before they can hear considering were dead in our sins and transgressions and can't spiritually hear?

Please list the scripture you referring to.

 

[Cygnus]

He marked out before, He called, He justified, He glorified - all aorist active indicative verbs

• aorist tense - punctiliar past tense
• active voice - subject does the action
• indicative mood - statement of fact, actual occurance

Yes, I have been glorified according to Rom 8:29-30, as are all those in Christ.

Now you seem to be playing with concepts. Have you really been glorified?

 

[Cygnus]

That's correct. From several stories, I know that God can reach people in a variety of ways.

Yes He can.

 

[Gregg T]

Gregg T, thanks for the hard work but it really doesn't address what I was looking for. You posted a whole lot on baptism which has me ask the question......Tit 3:5 He saved us . . . by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,.......is that before or after belief?

"the washing" is a process culminating in 1. "regeneration" and 2. "qualitative renewal."

One believes [and confesses] the LORD during that process, before the subsequent regeneration and renewal take place.

This theological discussion should be interesting...what is the order of events in the process of salvation when it is applied to an individual?

What happens first? Belief or repentance? Regeneration or belief? Repentance or being filled with the Spirit?
I could throw out more salvation buzz terms..but I think you get the point. For example where does faith fit in? At what point are we washed by the blood of Christ?

Is the events of salvation linear or do some of the events happen at the same time?

belief > repentence > salvation, regeneration, being filled with the Spirit

 

[Cygnus]

One believes [and confesses] the LORD during that process, before the subsequent regeneration and renewal take place.

In the OP I asked....Is the events of salvation linear or do some of the events happen at the same time?...You seem to think some of the events happen at the same time. yes?

Currently my belief regeneration is the first event (when looked at linearly.) Before anything happens you need life. Dead maen can't believe or confess.

 

[Gregg T]

Now you seem to be playing with concepts. Have you really been glorified?

Really! My posts can be characterized by 'playing' and 'concepts.'

I quoted a Scripture which says that Christians are glorifed, myself being one of them.

I've also provided some well thought out in-depth substantial groundwork in my responses.

Perhaps you will also.

 

[Gregg T]

In the OP I asked....Is the events of salvation linear or do some of the events happen at the same time?...You seem to think some of the events happen at the same time. yes?

Currently my belief regeneration is the first event (when looked at linearly.) Before anything happens you need life. Dead maen can't believe or confess.

Yes, some at the same time.

Were Abraham, Moses, and David dead men when they believed and confessed?

 

[Nathan]

Yes, some at the same time.

Were Abraham, Moses, and David dead men when they believed and confessed?

Yep, they were.

You have to consider what 'dead' means. It means they were not believing in what God was doing before God did it. They were unknown, seperated, from what God had already decided was going to happen.

In each instance God had called/chosen them, set their lives in the order He wanted them in, promised to do things in the future with them - before any of them actually believed in it or confessed it.

Their belief/confession was a result of what God did, not a prerequisite for it.

 

[Edward]

Where would you put belief? Regeneration? Given the Holy Spirit?

That would be in the break down of redemption. Lessee, hearing, belief, confessing it and repenting...then baptism, then faith. That's steps to redemption. After that is justification, sanctification sprinkled with obedience and continued faith.

 

[billybalke]

I agree that hearing would be the first step.

• faith comes by hearing

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our report?” 17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Romans 10:16-17


I don't find where faith comes by reading.


JLB

Do you deny one can read his New Testament and understand what to do?