Death and the Hope of Heaven

[farouk]

Death for the believer is distinctly different from what it is for the unbeliever. For us, it isn't something to be feared or shunned, for we know death is but the shadowed threshold to the palace of God.
( Billy Graham)

"I desire to depart and be with Christ, which is better by far."
(Philippians 1:23)

Are you looking forward to that day when you will go to be with Christ, "which is better by far"?

[MENTION=96768]Maedchen[/MENTION]:

"My Father's house on high
Home of my soul, how near
At times to faith far-seeing eye
The golden gates appear!

Ah! Then my spirit pants
To reach the land I love,
The bright inheritance of saints,
Jerusalem above!"

Blessings.

 

[Brother Mike]

You know, in the book of Job it is made clear that God allowed Satan to take away from Job everything that was dear to him. So the children were included.
My own trust in God's love and compassion makes me believe, that God gave those children of Job a death without pain ( the house collapsed, so death may have come instantly). So these children did not suffer, but were transferred from earthly life to the wonderful life in heaven, "which is better by far"(Philippians 1:23).

I am impressed, I have been teaching faith now for about ........ It's been that long.... wow... Your humbleness means your teachable. Now really ask God to reveal to you what I am about to type. Ask God for help with this, have him show you. I can't cause the increase, but our Great Father can.

You know, in the book of Job it is made clear

Clear by who? See, if God did allow or give permission to Satan to murder those kids, then you can't trust God. If you say you do then your deceiving yourself, You no more trust and give your kids to me if I had had some Children murdered.

1Jn_4:20 If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?

If you could not trust me who murders children whom you have seen, then you can't trust and have full confidence in God whom you have not seen. That is scripture!!!

What is the clear understanding then? Does God really send a crazed monster to murder the Children of a man that obeys him?

Deu_30:19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

God said, if you choose to be blessed if you choose life, then your seed lives. Job's Children did not live, they were killed by Satan. So any issue Job had would have had to be Job's choice because God certainly does not change.

It is clear???

Let's examine what was really said and what went down between God and Satan. No scripture can ever contradict another scripture. That is a big problem with the book of Job because believers read it as if it's in it's own little world apart from everything else God said and did. It's not in it's own world, and God never changes.

Job was the only person to serve God and have the enemy destroy all he had. Everyone else that served God was blessed. There is a lesson here to learn then and that is to find out why Job was different.

When great men of faith did wrong such as David, we see the judgment of God and the enemy come in. Same with Balaam, same with Moses who hit the rock, same with Solomon, we see a direct connection between what the man did, and the consequences that followed.

Because believers are not taught a very important principle, they miss what Job did. This principle is hammered over and over throughout the Word of God, and yet it gets missed.

Let's look at the conversation.

Job 1:9 Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought?
Job 1:10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
Job 1:11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face.

We have two spiritual beings here. God has been watching Satan, and Satan has been trying to get through that Hedge around Job. This is How Satan found out about the hedge. For Satan to get through that hedge and get Job's stuff, Satan needs a place and right to do so.

Eph_4:27 Neither give place to the devil.

Satan has the nerve to tell God to put "HIS" hands on Job. God, you destroy him.............

God's response is toward Satan's request that God harm Job. God certainly would not do that, and Satan can't even tell the truth, so we know God is not listening to him or buying into his junk. God already had seen what had happened.

Joh_8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

Satan could not tell the truth to save his life, Jesus told us there is ZERO truth in him. It's amazing that believers see the devil operate throughout the bible lying through his teeth to Eve, To Jesus in the desert, and yet for some odd reason they believe Satan is in his Sunday's best when he is speaking to God about Job. Not a chance, Satan is lying to God and spinning what happened. Job because wealthy by obeying God, not God making Job wealthy first. Satan is the spin master and God is not buying into it.

Put your hands on Him God, and He will curse you to your face............

God responds...............

Job 1:12 And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.

Behold just means look and pay attention dummy. There is no permissive Hebrew verb here at all, and it was God's response to Satan telling God to hurt Job.

Why would God say that though? Pay attention dummy, Job is in your power.

Job is no longer in God's power, but Satan's power. How can that be?

Do not give place to the devil!!!!!! What had Job done?

Job 1:5 And it was so, when the days of their feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.

Satan tells God, that if God puts his hands on Job, then Job will Curse God to his face..................

Curse God, Curse God, Curse God, Curse God, Curse God...................................

What did Joby continually say about his own children......... They may have cursed God............ Job will curse God, The Kids might curse God.

What happens in Job's mind if you curse God? You die.................

So Job sacrificed an animal out of fear of loosing his kids, fear they might have cursed God. FEAR OF LOSS.

Fear of loss is not trusting God. Satan's whole theme to Job was about Cursing God and why Satan told God that if God hurt Job then Satan figured He had put enough in Job for Job to curse Him.

Job had a fear his kids might curse God. Job had a fear he might curse God if things went wrong. FEAR.

What was the first thing Satan had destroyed?

Job 1:13 And there was a day when his sons and his daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother's house:

This is where it started. What did Job fear on those days they were eating and drinking? Job feared his Kids might be cursing God in their hearts.

Job 1:14 And there came a messenger unto Job, and said, The oxen were plowing, and the asses feeding beside them:
Job 1:15 And the Sabeans fell upon them, and took them away; yea, they have slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.

Job lost it all in one day, the day his kids gathered to eat and drink, the days Job feared the most.


FEAR NOT!!!
62 verses found, 62 matches

Genesis 7 verses found 7 matches
Exodus 1 verse found 1 match
Deuteronomy 4 verses found 4 matches
Joshua 2 verses found 2 matches
Judges 3 verses found 3 matches
Ruth 1 verse found 1 match
1 Samuel 4 verses found 4 matches
2 Samuel 2 verses found 2 matches
1 Kings 1 verse found 1 match
2 Kings 3 verses found 3 matches
1 Chronicles 1 verse found 1 match
2 Chronicles 1 verse found 1 match
Psalms 2 verses found 2 matches
Isaiah 8 verses found 8 matches
Jeremiah 2 verses found 2 matches
Lamentations 1 verse found 1 match
Daniel 2 verses found 2 matches
Joel 1 verse found 1 match
Zechariah 1 verse found 1 match
Malachi 1 verse found 1 match
Matthew 3 verses found 3 matches
Luke 8 verses found 8 matches
John 1 verse found 1 match
Acts 1 verse found 1 match
Revelation 1 verse found 1 match

Be not afraid:
26 verses found, 28 matches

Deuteronomy 1 verse found 1 match
Joshua 2 verses found 2 matches
1 Samuel 1 verse found 1 match
2 Kings 2 verses found 2 matches
2 Chronicles 2 verses found 2 matches
Proverbs 1 verse found 1 match
Isaiah 3 verses found 3 matches
Jeremiah 3 verses found 4 matches
Ezekiel 1 verse found 2 matches
Joel 1 verse found 1 match
Matthew 3 verses found 3 matches
Mark 2 verses found 2 matches
Luke 1 verse found 1 match
John 1 verse found 1 match
Acts 1 verse found 1 match
1 Peter 1 verse found 1 match

Be of good courage:
6 verses found, 6 matches

2 Samuel 1 verse found 1 match
1 Chronicles 1 verse found 1 match
Ezra 1 verse found 1 match
Psalms 2 verses found 2 matches
Isaiah 1 verse found 1 match

Job's Wife......... Satan's theme and entrance.

Job_2:9 Then said his wife unto him, Dost thou still retain thine integrity? curse God, and die.

God had no purpose in destroying Job.


Job 2:3 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou movedst (continue to entice) me against him, to destroy him without cause.

God said it was what? Without cause................. God had nothing to do with it, had no purpose for it. How believers miss God saying this is just amazing.

Job tells us what happened to him.......

Job 3:25 For the thing which I greatly feared is come upon me, and that which I was afraid of is come unto me.

It is clear??? ya, it's very clear. Our Father in heaven does not murder children, does not destroy those that obey and serve him. It's when we don't do what God says, then that is where the problems come in.

Mike.

 

[Maedchen]

[MENTION=841]StoveBolts[/MENTION]:

Dear brother,

thank you so much for sharing your personal view and feelings.
As I have read several posts of you in which you often mentioned your family, especially your children, I know that your concerns are never selfish, but rather very much on behalf of your loved ones.

You wrote,

"However, having all of my tears wiped away (I have many) and being in a place of no more sorrow, no more suffering is a place I long for.. a place I think we are tasked with creating here on earth "Your kingdom come, your will be done on earth as it is in heaven". But I know this is a never ending task and a task that produces thorns even when we try our hardest. Still, I am not at the place Paul was quiet yet. I'm not ready to throw in the towel and through all the pain and sorrow, life is still good. It's not perfect, but it's still good."

I admire your inner strength, which enables you to call life still good, in spite of your "many tears", your "pain and sorrow".

Even more, you focus rather on the work you want to get done in your life, than the disappointments:

"So I am torn. I do so crave to have my tears wiped away, but I crave the time with my family even more. There is work that is left un-done that I pray for, and I would like to see them answered before I die."

As others have also expressed that kind of view, it seems the best way to choose. Maybe it is crucial to accept pain and sorrow as inevitable, thus allowing them to coexist while trying to make our life meaningful.

But what, if a person's hands are bound, in so far as there is nothing he could accomplish or get done, because of circumstances. What if the there is no way to use life meaningfully at all, because every single action is being prevented and stopped?
Maybe under those circumstances some could admit that death is "better by far", don't you think so ?

May God bless you and your dear family.
Your testimony in your shared thoughts above is very much encouraging, and I think not only for me.
Maedchen

 

[Maedchen]

[MENTION=7377]Brother Mike[/MENTION]:

Dear brother, I was not aware of all this.
I am very sorry for having made you upset.
And I understand your reasoning. Thank you for so much effort you put into explaining here.
I hope you can forgive me.
Maedchen

 

[Maedchen]

[MENTION=41474]farouk[/MENTION] :

Thank you, dear farouk.
Those are such nice verses.
I treasure them.
May God bless you.
Maedchen

 

[Brother Mike]

Dear brother, I was not aware of all this.
I am very sorry for having made you upset.
And I understand your reasoning. Thank you for so much effort you put into explaining here.
I hope you can forgive me.
Maedchen

The only thing that upsets me is when Religion and man's ideas make our good God who sent Jesus to die for us out to be a Monster. It robs peoples faith in God it can destroy family's. I was never upset at you, I only want the best for you. If we ever think God is the cause, God is allowing, then you can have no faith in God to pull you through.

I am not just speaking to be talking about stuff I don't know about.

I was the Father who was told that even after all their attempts to treat my son of this rare cancer, that there was nothing they could do. My son never responded to treatment, and just got sicker and sicker every single day.

It was sudden, as the wife just took him in for a low grade fever. In 8 days after I get the call from Chicago Memorial Hospital for children that my son would not live through the night.

You see, there is why we have to compare scriptures and ask God to show us. Show us just how good he is. I certainly did not figure Job out because I am smart, I sought God and wondered how can God be so Good and have Job's kids murdered. I spent months looking, and just did not take mans word on anything.

Back to my son.

I got that evil report, but Heb 11:3 says that by faith the elders obtained a good report. My son was suppose to be dead that night or best by morning, nothing they could do, and he never got better.

Now everything I told you about God and told others is on the line. It's real easy to tell people about faith and trusting God and bla, bla, bla when the sun is shinning and the birds are chirping. The real deal comes when your told there is no hope, that is what separates those that trust God from those that don't.

I never budged, as soon as I hung up the phone, I just said thank you Father that you said with long life you will satisfy my son. I am not moved, I am not going to cry, I am going to be full of joy and peace.

You see, this is the point where believers break down, loose hope, start crying and begging God. Fear comes into them and they act on it with tears. If you really believe God is going to move on your behalf then you would have joy and no concerns.

How can you tell someone is Believing God? Full of joy, full of peace and no matter what the circumstances, they are not moved.

I laid down that night, and all I heard running through my mind is that the call is coming, your son is dead. We are to cast out every thought that exalts itself against the Word of God and praising God is a good way to do that to keep your mind quite. I did that until I fell asleep, I was not moving, my God would never let me down.

That next morning I did get a call, it was from my wife who was with my son in Chicago.

She tells me they have to keep my son all day long??????????????????????????

What?????????????

She was just besides herself and I could not fully understand what she was saying. Then she said it. Our son has to be tested all day because they did a bone marrow from the hip and another spinal tap and could not find one cancer cell in his body. The doctors were stumped, because just 7 hours ago they said he would be dead.

People have came to late to tell me God murdered Job's children or even had anything to do with it. I have been in that hard place, and God performed his word, it did not return void.

Something else I know about God, what He did for me, he will do for you and greater things than what I experienced will happen for those that stay firmly on his Word, unmoving. All the glory, all the glory be to our good, good God.

It would upset me to see you go through pain and suffering at the hands of the enemy not knowing just who you made Lord and was fooled by mans thinking and ideas about God. That upsets me to see my brothers and sisters loose children and their lives when they don't have to. God is not respecter of persons, He does not love me or my child any less than someone else's.

God is a respecter of those that trust and have faith in him though.

Mike.

 

[Maedchen]

[MENTION=7377]Brother Mike[/MENTION]:

Dear brother,

thank you for this touching and overwhelming testimony about God's faithfulness to you as a true believer!
I have read your edifying 'story' before in a thread about gambling, in a conversation with "Rose". Still it made me once more turn to God and thank Him for His love.

Thank you for taking the time to defend your faith in God's Goodness.
May He always guide you.
Maedchen

 

[Brother Mike]

Dear brother,

thank you for this touching and overwhelming testimony about God's faithfulness to you as a true believer!
I have read your edifying 'story' before in a thread about gambling, in a conversation with "Rose". Still it made me once more turn to God and thank Him for His love.

Then you would understand why I would never think that God had anything to do with harming Job, or his Children. I have met lots of wonderful Christians who have believed God out of circumstances as worse of far worse than mine and Their Father in Heaven came through from them (Though why God likes to wait until the last seconds, is something I will have to discuss with him in Heaven. )

It's like someone saying, Maedchen is just such a thief. If it's not bolted down or moving, she will steal it. Let's say I have known you for years and I know for a fact you would not even steal second base playing baseball, let alone someone else's belongings.

Even if the person claims the have proof you stole, knowing you I would not believe it for a second and would rather believe they are getting their story wrong or accusing you falsely. Same with God, it's my Father and if someone says he made them sick, Picked someone to die that did no wrong, Murdered Job's kids, then even without proof I boldly say, "NOT MY FATHER, YOU GOT THE WRONG INFORMATION"

Sovereign God in the Christian World means God Does what he wants, to who he wants, when He wants despite what he said.

That is why I shudder when I hear someone mention "Sovereign God" Sovereign is not even in the bible, just made up by those that blame God and pin evil on Him.

I don't mind using the term Sovereign God as long as it's used properly. Sovereign God means that God spoke correctly the first time and Word so perfect that it applies to everyone and will be right for everyone who believes. If you sin, our Sovereign God said repent and I'll forgive, if your sick, our sovereign God showed by example the Lord Jesus who went and healed all the sick and oppressed, never turning anyone down. Sovereign God means what God said is right and light to us for everything we might face in this life. His perfect Word that works for anyone that will believe.

If Satan made some deal with God, or moved God to allow him to hurt Job then God can be tempted with evil. James tells us that God can not be tempted with evil and does not tempt any man with evil.

Both scriptures can't be right and you have to dismiss many things God said if someone was to think God gave Satan any permission or planed to harm Job in anyway. We don't pick and choose what we want to believe, as believers we better believe everything God said. If God can't be tempted with evil then God never made any deal with the devil to test Job. It would have to be something else we need to understand. Believers don't value the Word of God enough to know there can never be any contradictions. No respect for the Word of God and it's sad.

Jas 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

Let no man say what?

peirazō
Thayer Definition:
1) to try whether a thing can be done
1a) to attempt, endeavour
2) to try, make trial of, test: for the purpose of ascertaining his quantity, or what he thinks, or how he will behave himself
2a) in a good sense
2b) in a bad sense, to test one maliciously, craftily to put to the proof his feelings or judgments
2d1) of God: to inflict evils upon one in order to prove his character and the steadfastness of his faith

Let no man say what?

I might be old fashioned but Murdering Children, stealing everything a man has and making the man sick is EVIL............... James said let no man say that of God.

Mike.

 

[iLOVE]

Good people pass away;the godly often die before their time. But no one seems to care or wonder why. No one seems to understand that God is protecting them from the evil to come.<SUP class=versenum> </SUP>For those who follow godly paths will rest in peace when they die. (Isaiah 57:1-2 NLT).

How tragic it seems when promising young Christian men or women are cut off "before their time." Even more painful is the sudden death of a child, before there was ever the opportunity for him or her to grow up at all. Yet, the Christian believer can be confident that such events do not occur before God's time, for He "worketh all things after the counsel of His own will" (Ephesians 1:11). We know that God loves us, because He sent His own beloved Son to die for us. Therefore "we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to His purpose" (Romans 8:28).

It may well be that God has allowed the righteous to perish and the merciful to be taken away, in order to spare them from "the evil to come," either increasing tribulation in the world, or perhaps the further growth of incipient sin in their own lives. It may be that their "untimely" departure "to be with Christ; which is far better" (Philippians 1:23) will be used of God to lead others to Christ and salvation. It also should give their loved ones greater incentive to learn more of God's word and its gracious promises, as well as to forsake sin in their own lives. In those situations where death seems to have been hastened because of zeal for the Lord, their loved ones can rejoice that the martyr's "crown of life" (Revelation 2:10) is awaiting them.

Other reasons may exist which we cannot understand now, "For who hath known the mind of the Lord?" (Romans 11:34). But we do know that a sparrow "shall not fall on the ground without your Father" (Matthew 10:29).

 

[Vaccine]

But we do know that a sparrow "shall not fall on the ground without your Father" (Matthew 10:29).

Amen! Matthew 10:29 is what I was trying to express.

Genesis 4:1 -“With the help of the Lord I have brought forth a man.” I think that's true for every woman in the world.To me it means everytime someone dies, God is losing a child as well.

 

[stovebolts]

But what, if a person's hands are bound, in so far as there is nothing he could accomplish or get done, because of circumstances. What if the there is no way to use life meaningfully at all, because every single action is being prevented and stopped?
Maybe under those circumstances some could admit that death is "better by far", don't you think so ?

Hello Maedchen,
I have to say that I enjoy your demeanor as well as your ability to connect. Your a breath of fresh air to read.

In thinking about what's quoted above, I'm reminded of a time when I was in that very situation so please know that my response comes from my own experience. By saying this, I'm not saying that my situation fits the situation of others, so I want what I write to be open ended and accepted by those intended for, and if it doesn't resonate for others, then I would encourage them to continue looking for somebody with an experience that closer resembles their own to which they can draw strength or encouragement from.

There was a time in my life with great darkness which stirred an awakening in me which motivates me to this day. But in that darkness, my hands were bound. Not only were they bound, but when I sought to do good with my hands, it was falsely interpreted as creating evil and used against me unjustly, sometimes I believe purposely. I was in a place that everything I did was wrong, regardless of what it was and everything that held meaing in my life was slowly being stripped away as a band aid being slowly pulled up, tearing each hair follicle out one by one and exposing, even adding to the wound to which it covered.

It took me to a place that I felt like I was in a small, narrow dark box; I was afraid to move, afraid speak, afraid of others and afraid of myself. What I desired, and all that I cared for was being torn from me.

I have a tattoo that many have no idea of it's meaning. It was a reminder to me of what truly mattered and helped keep me focused. It is a tattoo of the grim reaper clothed in purple who is pulling the cowl from his face, exposing his anger, exposing his rage. In his hand is a scale and in one basket are two sparrows surrounded by clouds. One sparrow is within the basket on it's back, wings bent in helplessness while the other sparrow is flying in, not knowing it is trapped, but wanting to be near none the less. In the other basket is a Chinese symbol for death, and it is surrounded by bold violent flames as it cuts through the clouds.

The scales are tipped in favor of the two precious sparrows representing that life is more precious than destruction... more precious than death. It was a reminder that though our dreams may be crushed, we should never let them go. We may have to alter our dreams and at the time, we may not even know how to alter our view of those dreams, but we can never let our hope be stolen from us. Jesus says to fear him who can take our soul, and my experience relates those words as if to say, don't let anyone ever steal your hope regardless of how small, how narrow or how dark that box becomes. Your dreams my get crushed and things may not be the way you wanted them to be... and they may never be... but never let go of that piece of hope even when it turns into a small dull amber and you can see it smoldering before your very eyes. As important, continue to do what is good and what is right to the best you know how. It does't have to be perfect, it just has to be done the best you can muster at the time. For me, it was about taking my anger and using it for good, and not destruction.

The tattoo was over 20 years ago and just this summer I recall a calm feeling that came over me and I looked around and said, "Thank you Lord, I am complete". I have always contemplated how Jeremiah could praise the Lord with so much sincerity in the book of Lamentations when everything he cherished.. everything he knew was being destroyed around him. Perhaps he was able to see into the far distance... perhaps he saw Christ. I don't really know, but he was a man of great strengths and of great hope.

That was well over 20 years ago

 

[Maedchen]

[MENTION=96494]Vaccine[/MENTION] :
Dear brother,

I must admit that I first did not understand your statement below.

Genesis 4:1 -“With the help of the Lord I have brought forth a man.” I think that's true for every woman in the world.To me it means everytime someone dies, God is losing a child as well.

As I thought about it longer, it became more clear to me. Is it your statement that God so much loves us humans (,who are only alive because He enabled us to live), that the death of one person is hurting Him like a father losing His child?
If that is true, then John 3:16 comes to my mind, which is also a statement of God's love for us. It is written that God gave His only Son for us in love, which means that He sacrificed His dearest One for us. That must have hurt Him so enormously. So very deeply. - And according to your statement, God also is hurt by every death of anyone of us, because He sees us as children. We are almost as dear to Him as His only Son, Jesus.
That is such a huge expression of love!
And how much more so, when considering that He is willing to accept us forever into His Kingdom in spite of our sinful attitudes and our ungratefulness in so many aspects.
What a nice thought, dear brother Vaccine!

Also I thought a lot about your other reply:

My wife has many health problems and longs to be with Christ. Me and our kids is the only thing that keeps her going. I know she is in pain everyday but she is still a good mother and wife. She really struggles with wanting to die. Some days are better than others, but we pray and take it one day at a time.

May I say that I adore your wife's braveness. What a powerful testimony she gives about perseverance with God's help!
And what an exemplary family you are, as you pray together and keep her and all of you moving on one day at a time.
I really wanted to write that earlier, but I didn't find the right words for it. I couldn't find them yet, but I need to tell you that your witness is quite overwhelming. Thank you for sharing it with us, and please excuse my delayed reply.

I will keep your family in my prayers, especially your dear wife.
Jesus must be so very proud of her, and of you all!
May He guide you, dear brother.
Maedchen

 

[stovebolts]

I must admit that I first did not understand your statement below.

I did not understand it at all, and didn't ponder it long enough. But you have brought out something very beautiful from [MENTION=96494]Vaccine[/MENTION] that has touched me in profound ways.

Thank you to the both of you.

 

[Maedchen]

[MENTION=841]StoveBolts[/MENTION] :

Dear brother Steve,

actually I pondered about your reply intensively. And to be honest I did not know if I should dare to answer. That is why my reply below consists mainly out of questions. I hope you don't mind.
You understood my question correctly, and I think you understand me.

I am so very glad that you are able to say "Thank you Lord, I am complete". After all you went through, you are now victorious.

"I was in a place that everything I did was wrong, regardless of what it was and everything that held meaing in my life was slowly being stripped away as a band aid being slowly pulled up, tearing each hair follicle out one by one and exposing, even adding to the wound to which it covered."

I wished you wouldn't have had to experience that. Your pain was horrible. I just can't say more, but please know that I am able to feel what you wrote.

"It took me to a place that I felt like I was in a small, narrow dark box; I was afraid to move, afraid speak, afraid of others and afraid of myself. What I desired, and all that I cared for was being torn from me."

How could you keep hope? How have you been able to find a little straw to cling to? When the narrow dark box became even more narrow by time, how could you keep any strength?
I really would like to know. It is important to me.

"I have a tattoo that many have no idea of it's meaning. It was a reminder to me of what truly mattered and helped keep me focused. It is a tattoo of the grim reaper clothed in purple who is pulling the cowl from his face, exposing his anger, exposing his rage. In his hand is a scale and in one basket are two sparrows surrounded by clouds. One sparrow is within the basket on it's back, wings bent in helplessness while the other sparrow is flying in, not knowing it is trapped, but wanting to be near none the less. In the other basket is a Chinese symbol for death, and it is surrounded by bold violent flames as it cuts through the clouds."

The description of your tattoo reminds me of a person that I fear. The face you describe is real. His rage is real, too.
Please, could you tell me, dear brother, if the little sparrow on its back is already dead?

"The scales are tipped in favor of the two precious sparrows representing that life is more precious than destruction... more precious than death."

Do both sparrows live on, or just one? I need to know.

"It was a reminder that though our dreams may be crushed, we should never let them go. We may have to alter our dreams and at the time, we may not even know how to alter our view of those dreams, but we can never let our hope be stolen from us. Jesus says to fear him who can take our soul, and my experience relates those words as if to say, don't let anyone ever steal your hope regardless of how small, how narrow or how dark that box becomes. Your dreams my get crushed and things may not be the way you wanted them to be... and they may never be... but never let go of that piece of hope even when it turns into a small dull amber and you can see it smoldering before your very eyes."

How? Through prayer? What can make someone stop to steal the hope?
What if there really is no hope anymore? How did you find a little piece of remaining hope? (I am sorry for asking so much, but I would so much like to know. Only if you want to reveal, of course. If not, please just ignore me.)

"I have always contemplated how Jeremiah could praise the Lord with so much sincerity in the book of Lamentations when everything he cherished.. everything he knew was being destroyed around him. Perhaps he was able to see into the far distance... perhaps he saw Christ. I don't really know, but he was a man of great strengths and of great hope."

So Jeremiah stood firm, praising God instead of giving up.
Just like you, dear brother Steve.
I wished to be like him and you.

Thank you so very much. Yes, you do encourage very much with your open testimony. And it also gives strength, hopefully for many more than just me.

United in prayer, also for your dear family.
Maedchen

 

[farouk]

[MENTION=841]StoveBolts[/MENTION] :

Dear brother Steve,

actually I pondered about your reply intensively. And to be honest I did not know if I should dare to answer. That is why my reply below consists mainly out of questions. I hope you don't mind.
You understood my question correctly, and I think you understand me.

I am so very glad that you are able to say "Thank you Lord, I am complete". After all you went through, you are now victorious.


I wished you wouldn't have had to experience that. Your pain was horrible. I just can't say more, but please know that I am able to feel what you wrote.



How could you keep hope? How have you been able to find a little straw to cling to? When the narrow dark box became even more narrow by time, how could you keep any strength?
I really would like to know. It is important to me.



The description of your tattoo reminds me of a person that I fear. The face you describe is real. His rage is real, too.
Please, could you tell me, dear brother, if the little sparrow on its back is already dead?

"The scales are tipped in favor of the two precious sparrows representing that life is more precious than destruction... more precious than death."

Do both sparrows live on, or just one? I need to know.

"It was a reminder that though our dreams may be crushed, we should never let them go. We may have to alter our dreams and at the time, we may not even know how to alter our view of those dreams, but we can never let our hope be stolen from us. Jesus says to fear him who can take our soul, and my experience relates those words as if to say, don't let anyone ever steal your hope regardless of how small, how narrow or how dark that box becomes. Your dreams my get crushed and things may not be the way you wanted them to be... and they may never be... but never let go of that piece of hope even when it turns into a small dull amber and you can see it smoldering before your very eyes."

How? Through prayer? What can make someone stop to steal the hope?
What if there really is no hope anymore? How did you find a little piece of remaining hope? (I am sorry for asking so much, but I would so much like to know. Only if you want to reveal, of course. If not, please just ignore me.)

"I have always contemplated how Jeremiah could praise the Lord with so much sincerity in the book of Lamentations when everything he cherished.. everything he knew was being destroyed around him. Perhaps he was able to see into the far distance... perhaps he saw Christ. I don't really know, but he was a man of great strengths and of great hope."

So Jeremiah stood firm, praising God instead of giving up.
Just like you, dear brother Steve.
I wished to be like him and you.

Thank you so very much. Yes, you do encourage very much with your open testimony. And it also gives strength, hopefully for many more than just me.

United in prayer, also for your dear family.
Maedchen

Hi Ms [MENTION=96768]Maedchen[/MENTION]:

This is a very interesting exchange. And you see just how meaningful a person's tattoo design can be: sometimes in relation to his or her personal experience of trial and suffering, sometimes principally with a view to encouraging faith related conversations.

I don't know whether you would empathize about this aspect from having any tattoos of your own — and in any case there is another thread where these are more directly in focus — but I'm hoping you agree that this is all rather meaningful.

Blessings.

 

[Maedchen]

[MENTION=41474]farouk[/MENTION] :

Hello, dear brother farouk,

I really hoped that you would read about brother Steve's tattoo. I knew that you would delight in it.
Yes, I certainly agree that a tattoo can be very meaningful.
Brother Steve's is the best example, right?

May God bless you.
Maedchen

 

[farouk]

@farouk :

Hello, dear brother farouk,

I really hoped that you would read about brother Steve's tattoo. I knew that you would delight in it.
Yes, I certainly agree that a tattoo can be very meaningful.
Brother Steve's is the best example, right?

May God bless you.
Maedchen

Thank-you Ms @Maedchen .

You make a very clear and valid point.

Does it, and the medium's sheer broader potential for clear expression and inked communication of joy in hope, delight you, too?

Blessings, f

 

[stovebolts]

Dear brother Steve,

You know, we have a thread in our little hidden "Mod forum" called, "Steve sightings". This post will surely be added to it :toofunny StoveBolts came from the Camaro shown in my Avatar. It was a hunk of junk my dad used to call a pile of stove bolts lol! But since you asked, my name is Jeff

Anyway, I hope that my story does not shake you, but I will try to answer your questions as discreetly, and honestly as I can.

How could you keep hope? How have you been able to find a little straw to cling to? When the narrow dark box became even more narrow by time, how could you keep any strength?
I really would like to know. It is important to me.

When I was 16 my life was a wreck. I put a gun to my head as tears poured down my face when I heard God say, "Don't do it, I have something I want you to see. Hold on, I want you to see how this turns out" and although I couldn't see, I knew he was talking about a time in the far distance. Thus, I am complete. Anyway, those words echo'd in my mind. It was the only words I could find any hope in, yet when I was in my mid 20's in that small dark box, God's voice had such a strong impact on me, I had nothing else to cling to.

The description of your tattoo reminds me of a person that I fear. The face you describe is real. His rage is real, too.
Please, could you tell me, dear brother, if the little sparrow on its back is already dead?

I lost my first born, which was my precious daughter when she was but 4 months old. I was brought up in orphanages and foster homes until the 4th grade. I was placed in Juvenile then Group homes from 13 to 15 and one thing you learn is to protect your feelings and experience showed me that you didn't get attached to anyone because when you did, they got ripped away from you as I moved from foster home to foster home. When my daughter was born, she was my salvation and for the first time, I experienced what real love was like. I remember looking into her eyes and thinking, "She will never hurt me" and this started drawing me back to God. When she died, I hated God and withdrew.

But to your question of the sparrow on her back, no, she is not dead and I was able to find her and send her a Christmas card two years ago. We have visited each other many times and talk on the phone often. She has some disabilities, but she is my most precious daughter and I love her.

Do both sparrows live on, or just one? I need to know.

I am now a proud grandfather and she called me just yesterday to wish me a belated happy birthday. I was able to make contact with her when she was 16. I received a precious Fathers day card from her this year that touched me deeply knowing it was from her heart.

How? Through prayer? What can make someone stop to steal the hope?
What if there really is no hope anymore? How did you find a little piece of remaining hope? (I am sorry for asking so much, but I would so much like to know. Only if you want to reveal, of course. If not, please just ignore me.)

How I wish my prayer life was deeper, and richer. I look to my wife with such awe in the faith she has with God as I still struggle in that area. When I was in that dark place in my life, all I could do is my best even when it was used against me. I knew what the truth was, and that through time the truth would show itself. I was tempted with revenge and my anger caused me to think of evil deeds to the point where I had to move from that city to stop myself from committing that which gave me nightmares, and that which I day dreamed about. I had to put myself in an environment where in a moment of weakness, I wouldn't be able to act upon my thoughts. I needed space to breath, and a space to start over.

I put my focus on doing what was right, and what was good. I couldn't control others, but I could control myself. I wanted to be a father more than anything else in the world, and that dream was shattered. All seemed lost. When I removed myself, I focused on being the best Dad that I could be for my daughters when we finally reunited. I wanted them to be proud of me and know I didn't abandon them. I could not do anything about the time that separated us, but I could control what I did between that time.

You know, through all those years of seperation, you dream on how something is going to be when your reunited. What you'll say, the things you'll do etc. It's amazing how when that day comes, your little bubble is popped with this sharp edge called reality lol. It's all good though lol.

So Jeremiah stood firm, praising God instead of giving up.
Just like you, dear brother Steve.
I wished to be like him and you.

Unlike Jeremiah, I did not praise God. I hated and despised God for years. Yet God was faithful and never left my side. His spirit kept wooing me back to him, almost chasing me at times. As far as being like me, I am arrogant at times and prideful and I need reminders of that on occasion to keep me in check, but thank you for your kind words.

 

[Vaccine]

[MENTION=96494]Vaccine[/MENTION] :
Dear brother,

I must admit that I first did not understand your statement below.

Genesis 4:1 -“With the help of the Lord I have brought forth a man.” I think that's true for every woman in the world.To me it means everytime someone dies, God is losing a child as well.

As I thought about it longer, it became more clear to me. Is it your statement that God so much loves us humans (,who are only alive because He enabled us to live), that the death of one person is hurting Him like a father losing His child?

[MENTION=96768]Maedchen[/MENTION] [MENTION=841]StoveBolts[/MENTION]
Thank you for your kind and encouraging words!

 

[farouk]

Hi [MENTION=841]StoveBolts[/MENTION]! Congrats. on becoming a grandfather! Now you have more work as a prayer warrior!