Immigration Solution

[journeyman]

If everyone in the USA moved to South America and all South Americans moved to the USA the Hispanics would have better paying jobs.
And expats to S.A. could re-form unions in all the U.S. businesses that went south for cheaper labor.
This would cause former U.S. buinesses to scurry back north where the new North Americans had a nice taste of a better life and weren't going to work for peanuts anymore.
So us new South Americans could focus on tourism.
And the North Americans can have all the military might us South Americans left behind so they can defend the world against oppression.
Immigration problem solved.

 

[Who Me]

A far better solution would be for the wealth countries to work to improve the economic situation in the countries these migrants come from.

 

[Riven]

A far better solution would be for the wealth countries to work to improve the economic situation in the countries these migrants come from.

 

[hawkman]

A far better solution would be for the wealth countries to work to improve the economic situation in the countries these migrants come from.

Obama spoke in Africa and told them they all could not have a car and air conditioning , said the planet would boil over . He sure does spread the luv , LOL .
Money is sent to the country in need and the leaders build mansions with it , food is sent to the starving countries and the leaders put the food in warehouse to rot . Crazy stuff .

 

[Free]

One of the worst economic policies ever devised is that of simply giving money to countries that are impoverished. Giving money is the West's answer for everything and I think it's largely done to feed their self-righteousness and make them feel like they're doing so much good in the world. But it keeps people impoverished. There are no incentives for governments of impoverished nations to do better for their countries, since the money just comes rolling in, and even more when it's asked for.

There are likely two other main reasons why simply giving money doesn't help. First, some governments are corrupt and the leaders use the money for their own personal purposes. Second, some governments simply are inept and have no plan of how to make their countries better, so the money just gets squandered.

The way out of poverty is to employ people by setting up companies, large and small, and letting foreign companies set up businesses as well. But none of this will happen, or it will happen on too small of a scale to make a difference, as long as the West just gives money away for nothing, without conditions that require better use and accountability of that money. With all the money given over the last many decades, most impoverished countries likely should have become self-sufficient by now.

It's the equivalent of the welfare system that allows people to be on welfare indefinitely. Sure, some likely need to be on it indefinitely (for health reasons, etc.), but it's likely a very small fraction of those who are.

 

[journeyman]

A far better solution would be for the wealth countries to work to improve the economic situation in the countries these migrants come from.

Hello Who Me.
Actually, they need to unionize people. It would be a long hard fight, but that's the way it was in the USA under a century ago.

 

[Christ_empowered]

I dunno
Corrupt governments and or nations that lack proper infrastructure to use foreign aid appropriately…


What’s the point? Free makes valid points.

Having typed that I’m intrigued by pilot programs using universal basic income…

 

[jasonc]

Hello Who Me.
Actually, they need to unionize people. It would be a long hard fight, but that's the way it was in the USA under a century ago.

So in short business like my brother in law who started out on his own body shop after working for others and is known in the try county area should pay union wages with benefits to the likes of a govt job with a pension .

The costs of body work if the cost of a used car wasn't so high would only relegate the collectors to keeping older cars versus what some like I did .fix and older vehicle versus going into massive debt for those union employees.

I would be paying More on a car that won't last ten years then I do on my house ! I know a few that pay more on a car per month then I do with my mortgage.

I also do believe in right to work states ? Why because of the above with my bil and at times I might Not want to support the union backed politicians money or by vote.

I believe California killed or tried to gig working .I did that in Florida .it paid my bills for a while .

 

[jasonc]

Fdr even didn't believe in govt unions .

Imagine cops and fire medics striking .

In liberal states fireman oddly are mostly volunteers .in the five Burroughs it's that way ,but not in Florida as most counties have fire medics and some volunteers.

 

[Josef]

Hey All,
Interesting discussion. I agree that money alone does not help. Here are my recommendations.
1. Stop sending money. The hungry cannot eat money.
2. Solve the issues that prevent the hungry from having food.
A) Move them where the food is.
B) Teach them to grow and harvest their own food.
C) Give them an economic means to self-sustain their farming endeavors. Maybe food corporations such as Nabisco, and General Mills agree to buy their excess.
D) Every continent has to provide fair usable space for the group to develop. (Maybe not Antarctica. Although, global warming ???)
3. Set up people into groups willing to work together for the common good.
4. Have non-government nonprofit oversight teams that could be sent to develop these groups into farms. (Maybe senior citizen missionaries who have experience and can teach the how tos)
5. When a group of has reached a desirable level of sustainability, they then are required to set up the next group.

If something like this were set up, I believe people would get behind it. We would actually see the fruits of our labor. There is plenty of land left to farm. We should be using it. In fact, at the rate of the population growth, we will need the food. It would also be self-sustaining after the first round.

Is what we are doing now helping? Yes but not nearly enough.
Will something like this described ever happen? Probably not.
Would these solve world hunger? Again, probably not.
But it would help some.

Keep walking everybody.
May God bless,
Taz

 

[journeyman]

So in short business like my brother in law who started out on his own body shop after working for others and is known in the try county area should pay union wages with benefits to the likes of a govt job with a pension .

I never said that jasonc
I hope you're brother in law is doing well and is able to pay his employees a decent wage. That's all.

The costs of body work if the cost of a used car wasn't so high would only relegate the collectors to keeping older cars versus what some like I did .fix and older vehicle versus going into massive debt for those union employees.

Something is only worth what someone will pay for it. I love old car shows. I loved the days when anyone could change a spark pliug.

I would be paying More on a car that won't last ten years then I do on my house ! I know a few that pay more on a car per month then I do with my mortgage.

Yeah and dealerships make tons on inferior material. I wonder where George Baileys' life would have gone if he got in on the ground floor of plastics.

I also do believe in right to work states ? Why because of the above with my bil and at times I might Not want to support the union backed politicians money or by vote.

I believe California killed or tried to gig working .I did that in Florida .it paid my bills for a while .

Non union employees have benefitted from unions. You do understand Labor laws exist in the USA because of unfair working conditions right? You know why"a minium wage" needed to be made a law don't you?

 

[jasonc]

I never said that jasonc
I hope you're brother in law is doing well and is able to pay his employees a decent wage. That's all.

Something is only worth what someone will pay for it. I love old car shows. I loved the days when anyone could change a spark pliug.

Yeah and dealerships make tons on inferior material. I wonder where George Baileys' life would have gone if he got in on the ground floor of plastics.

Non union employees have benefitted from unions. You do understand Labor laws exist in the USA because of unfair working conditions right? You know why"a minium wage" needed to be made a law don't you?

Unless it's in the cases of when unions in states push that where one can't fix. Sidewalk ,Canada .

The guy was a certified carpenter and was fined .

Btw those laws came often when violence
See the sedation of the miners so much so that the state of west Virginia had to quell the union and shot them and this restored order.that isn't to say that the mining companies were innconcent .I see fl


Killing law agents not that the mining company was innocent is a type of revolution you ask for .

What is liveable .if Florida intiated and most shops even here have mechanics collecting welfare .I know becayse well the cost of living .

Labor to change a simple other tie rod both sides is 2 hours at 150 . Thats three hundred bucks .

Problem is that my state plays the game you don't like .why do you the union guys retire here? Cheaper.
Thus many like me move out to cheaper states ,ga,NC and other areas .

To survive here a unskilled hamburger flipper would need to make 50 grand a year .

That pushes costs up not down .that's my point .

I'm not in anyway a fan of the corporations but personally experience at work and the history of the union versus non union here has me doubting unions really care these days .

If I was a metal worker at the time of construction of a power plant I couldn't use the escalator as one has to be union


When the att worker striked the scabs got humiliatied for simply wanting to work .

Imagine the Internet ,then the phone system going down and you need the police or fireman . Should we make it illegal for the countries like Mexico to let American companies pay their citizens ?

I'm not into protectionism.i lost respect for gmc ,Chrysler ,am Italian company and that hasn't been American owned In decades .before 08 .it was spun off from Mercedes.befure that they had it for about a decade,before that renault.

Ford and GMC ,the later bailed out . In Japan they can't per law sell jap cars made by japenese here .so all of the Honda's etc are made in the u.s.

You can't say that about the so called American cars . I just dont see how giving more power to the state will change things .

I'm not fully anti union but most unions will push laws to force small business to close .

They fought Uber and door dash .

 

[journeyman]

Unless it's in the cases of when unions in states push that where one can't fix. Sidewalk ,Canada .

I want you to know I'm all for people working at a decent wage.
I started this thread as a joke. Move the whole country south to do what our fathers and grandfathers etc. did a few decade ago?
If it means that much to your people then let your people speak together.

West Virginia coal miners? That was like the Hebrews in slavery under Pharaoh. Only the miners got tired of cave ins so they started unionizing and got beaten and killed by their employer. And big business and government are very often in the same bed.

Union or non union makes no difference to me.

 

[Fastfredy0]

I like the idea of putting land mines along the southern border.

 

[7thMoon]

I like the idea of putting land mines along the southern border.

But it would be an act of total war.

 

[Fastfredy0]

But it would be an act of total war.

How is an act that is completely defensive, that only takes place on the land of a sovereign nation with that sovereign nation's permission an act of war? Rhetorical question.

 

[7thMoon]

How is an act that is completely defensive, that only takes place on the land of a sovereign nation with that sovereign nation's permission an act of war? Rhetorical question.

Do you want to be culpable for dead bodies?

 

[Fastfredy0]

Do you want to be culpable for dead bodies?

System we have now is culpable for dead bodies ... 100,000 a year to fentanyl. I figure my method would save lives and cost savings compared to other methods could be used to save more lives.
Aside: we both know this solution is not politically feasible.

 

[Who Me]

Obama spoke in Africa and told them they all could not have a car and air conditioning , said the planet would boil over . He sure does spread the luv , LOL .
Money is sent to the country in need and the leaders build mansions with it , food is sent to the starving countries and the leaders put the food in warehouse to rot . Crazy stuff .

Neither of those meets what I suggested.

A suggestion on how to improve a countries 3conomy would to negotiate a trade agreement that enabled that country to benefit from trade.
Any giving of aid to be 1, strictly monitored 2, used only at grass root level to improve infrastructure.

 

[Enlightenedtruth]

While I should keep my opinions to myself; this conversation is interesting. Throughout history the "wealthy countries" have taken anything they wanted from the "poor countries"; big business will exploit any opportunity to add to their own pennies. Right now it is my understanding most poor countries are in debt to the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund; and they barely make the "interest payments" on those debts.
While the leaders of those countries do keep themselves in extravagant comfort anytime "free money" is available; instead of trying to "trade" with this so called world economy by producing one or two food stuff's; they should work on making their own food supply self-sufficient, to support their own populations. Give a man a fish, he will eat for a day; teach a man to fish, and he will eat for a lifetime.