Sanhedrin Performs Rare Biblical Commandment Not Seen For 2,000 Years

[jocor]

And then we have the pseudo Jews. Those believers who think they alone know the intricacies of Judaism, and how Judaism should be practiced in the Christian churches. People who will argue about calendars and minutes on the clock and days of the week and laws and yada yada yada.

Obeying Yahweh's laws is NOT practicing Judaism.

The disciples celebrated Pentecost after becoming believers. Do you? If so, how do you know when it is without a knowledge of Yahweh's calendar telling us so?

The law is a trap, set to reveal sin in us. But when it catches it's victims, do they even know what it is? Or do they just fight to their deaths?

Yes, it reveals sin, not as a trap, but as a holy, just and good tool to show us our need for Yeshua and to drive us to him.

 

[smaller]

Obeying Yahweh's laws is NOT practicing Judaism.

The sin dwelling in the flesh of people, the evil present with them NEVER follow the laws. It's not even possible.

Yes, it reveals sin, not as a trap, but as a holy, just and good tool to show us our need for Yeshua and to drive us to him.

The need of Gods Mercy in Christ remains because of the reality of indwelling sin and evil present with us. This places us under the perpetual need of His Mercy, sorely needed, always.

There is no such animal as obedient indwelling sin or obedient evil present. It's a religious fantasy.

 

[jocor]

The sin dwelling in the flesh of people, the evil present with them NEVER follow the laws. It's not even possible.

I agree, but the Spirit filled believer can (Romans 6:12-22). Sin has no dominion over us.

The need of Gods Mercy in Christ remains because of the reality of indwelling sin and evil present with us. This places us under the perpetual need of His Mercy, sorely needed, always.

My point exactly. The law tells the NC believer that they have sinned. We then go to Yeshua for mercy, forgiveness and cleansing. Without the law telling us we have sinned, we would not know it. That is the tragic result of abolishing the law.

There is no such animal as obedient indwelling sin or obedient evil present. It's a religious fantasy.

I agree. That does not mean the Spirit cannot cause the NC believe to be victorious over sin.

 

[smaller]

I agree, but the Spirit filled believer can (Romans 6:12-22). Sin has no dominion over us.

Reigning over sin indwelling the flesh and evil present with us is a far far cry from claiming they are obedient or lawful because that never happened and never will happen.

 

[jocor]

Reigning over sin indwelling the flesh and evil present with us is a far far cry from claiming they are obedient or lawful because that never happened and never will happen.

I don't claim sin and evil are obedient or lawful. I claim the we can be obedient and lawful. Is it too hard for you to not steal because sin and evil in you cannot obey that law?

 

[smaller]

I don't claim sin and evil are obedient or lawful. I claim the we can be obedient and lawful. Is it too hard for you to not steal because sin and evil in you cannot obey that law?

I hope you see the futility of such, above.

Evil comes from within. Just because it doesn't show up on the outside doesn't make the presence of evil or sin dwelling in the flesh legally obedient. Jesus knows what goes in inside, so nobody is fooling anyone in these regards. Matt. 5:28, Matt. 15:19-20 and Mark 7:21-23

That's also why I discount what blinded Israel of the flesh does, such as in this thread. Same reason.

 

[jocor]

I hope you see the futility of such, above.

Evil comes from within. Just because it doesn't show up on the outside doesn't make the presence of evil or sin dwelling in the flesh legally obedient. Jesus knows what goes in inside, so nobody is fooling anyone in these regards. Matt. 5:28, Matt. 15:19-20 and Mark 7:21-23

That's also why I discount what blinded Israel of the flesh does, such as in this thread. Same reason.

No, I don't see the futility. Are you saying we can outwardly not steal, but inwardly we cannot? If so, I disagree. Anyone who has the mind of the Messiah and the indwelling Holy Spirit can avoid stealing inwardly and outwardly.

What do you mean by "legally obedient"? Give me an example of what that looks like.

 

[smaller]

No, I don't see the futility. Are you saying we can outwardly not steal, but inwardly we cannot? If so, I disagree. Anyone who has the mind of the Messiah and the indwelling Holy Spirit can avoid stealing inwardly and outwardly.

What do you mean by "legally obedient"? Give me an example of what that looks like.

Romans 13:8-10. Still doesn't mean sin indwelling or evil present does it. Whatever transpires with us we always remain sinners with this very factual against the Spirit, contrary to the Spirit state of the flesh. Gal. 5:17.

 

[jocor]

That was not helpful at all since you didn't answer my questions.

Romans 13:8-10. Still doesn't mean sin indwelling or evil present does it.

Does what? Cause us to obey the law? Of course not. The Holy Spirit causes us to obey the law even though sin or evil may dwell in us (Ezekiel 36:27).

Whatever transpires with us we always remain sinners with this very factual against the Spirit, contrary to the Spirit state of the flesh. Gal. 5:17.

You took that out of context.

Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
​

Even though the flesh is contrary to the Spirit, if we walk in the Spirit, the contrary flesh is powerless.

Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
​

Your belief may be true of believer's who do not walk in the Spirit, but it is not true of those who do.

Also, now that we are washed and justified through Yeshua, we should not identify ourselves as sinners. We are not sinners who occasionally do right, but saints who occasionally sin.

 

[smaller]

That was not helpful at all since you didn't answer my questions.

Does what? Cause us to obey the law? Of course not. The Holy Spirit causes us to obey the law even though sin or evil may dwell in us (Ezekiel 36:27).

The Spirit does what the Spirit does. It is not made "illegal." It can't be made "illegal." We may "act" externally in "accord" with the Spirit, but if we don't the Spirit didn't change. IN any case of sights whatever action is in accord externally STILL transpires in flesh, with it's built in sin and evil present, which is factually against and contrary to the Spirit in any cases of sights just as Gal. 5:17 shows us.

You took that out of context.

Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
​

Even though the flesh is contrary to the Spirit, if we walk in the Spirit, the contrary flesh is powerless.

IF the flesh was, as you say, made powerless, then there is no "active" case of it being against and contrary to the Spirit. But that is never the case. The flesh IS contrary to the Spirit and against the Spirit, period.

The unfortunate observation here is that the flesh does LIE to believers when they read the statements of fact. Believers read "ye shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh" and they quite entirely falsely think there is no lust in the flesh. Again, not the case. The contrary/against the Spirit state of the flesh is active and it is always this way.

Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
​

Your belief may be true of believer's who do not walk in the Spirit, but it is not true of those who do.

Also, now that we are washed and justified through Yeshua, we should not identify ourselves as sinners. We are not sinners who occasionally do right, but saints who occasionally sin.

There is no state of the flesh where it is ever sinless. Sin "dwells" in the flesh and evil is present with us. This is a perpetual state of the flesh. Paul identified himself as a sinner, active case, present tense in 1 Tim. 1:15. So did John in 1 John 1:8, even saying if we say we "have," present tense, NO SIN, we are not in truth. We have sin because sin dwells in our flesh and evil is present with us. It is not a 'sometimes' situation whatsoever. It's the basis of why we NEED our Savior and His Mercy, always.

 

[JLB]

The Holy Spirit causes us to obey the law even though sin or evil may dwell in us (Ezekiel 36:27).

But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. Galatians 5:18


The Holy Spirit does not lead us to keep the works of the law of Moses.



JLB

 

[smaller]

But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. Galatians 5:18

The Holy Spirit does not lead us to keep the works of the law of Moses.

JLB

Evil present and sin dwelling in the flesh remains under the law and remains quite solidly condemned under the law. The determinations of the law stands in opposition to these workings, regardless. This is also how and why Paul saw and perceived his own flesh as dead, because of the presence of sin dwelling in it and evil present with him. He had to account that factor on a daily basis.

Romans 8:10
And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Both of these are statements of fact. It's not a "one or the other" situation.

When we observe the 'actions' of the opening post what might we see? The actions of people who are factually DEAD in their sins.

Ephesians 2:1
And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

How are they quickened? By the Spirit of Christ, in belief of Him as their Savior. They might do any number of various works in their minds wherein they think they are serving God. None of it would be true without Christ.

And if it were with and in Christ, they probably wouldn't waste their time with religious ritualism to start with.

 

[jocor]

IF the flesh was, as you say, made powerless, then there is no "active" case of it being against and contrary to the Spirit. But that is never the case. The flesh IS contrary to the Spirit and against the Spirit, period.

The unfortunate observation here is that the flesh does LIE to believers when they read the statements of fact. Believers read "ye shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh" and they quite entirely falsely think there is no lust in the flesh. Again, not the case. The contrary/against the Spirit state of the flesh is active and it is always this way.

I agree the flesh is always active, but its actions are powerless when we walk in the Spirit. If we don't walk in the Spirit, the flesh strengthens.

Paul identified himself as a sinner, active case, present tense in 1 Tim. 1:15.

In context, Paul was addressing his old man when he persecuted believers (vs 13). Because of his former behavior, he became the chief of sinners and continues to hold that title until a greater sinner comes along. However, as a saint of Yeshua, he is no longer a sinner.

So did John in 1 John 1:8, even saying if we say we "have," present tense, NO SIN, we are not in truth. We have sin because sin dwells in our flesh and evil is present with us. It is not a 'sometimes' situation whatsoever. It's the basis of why we NEED our Savior and His Mercy, always.

Having sin does not make a believer a "sinner" as used in the context of Scripture. In Yahweh's eyes, when a sinner repents and believes, he is made righteous through faith (Romans 5:19). A sinner is someone who practices sin as a lifestyle.

 

[jocor]

But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. Galatians 5:18


The Holy Spirit does not lead us to keep the works of the law of Moses.



JLB

"not under the law" does not mean "don't have to obey the law". It means we are not under its condemnation. In context, we are not under its condemnation when we walk in the Spirit.

 

[JLB]

"not under the law" does not mean "don't have to obey the law". It means we are not under its condemnation. In context, we are not under its condemnation when we walk in the Spirit.

It means what it says, But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. Galatians 5:18

Not under obligation to the law of Moses.

Not under the law, period.

You added the word condemnation.

The Holy Spirit does not lead us to keep the works of the law, since that law was abolished in His flesh.

The Covenant Maker became flesh, and when His flesh died, so did the law of commandments contained in ordinances that was added.

The Covenant Maker - Then the Angel of the Lord came up from Gilgal to Bochim, and said: “I led you up from Egypt and brought you to the land of which I swore to your fathers; and I said, ‘I will never break My covenant with you. 2 And you shall make no covenant with the inhabitants of this land; you shall tear down their altars.’ But you have not obeyed My voice. Why have you done this? Judges 2:1-2

14 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, 15 having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.
Ephesians 2:14-16

The law of Moses was abolished in His flesh.



JLB

 

[jocor]

It means what it says, But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. Galatians 5:18

Not under obligation to the law of Moses.

Not under the law, period.

You added the word condemnation.

And you add "of Moses". The fact that the same author (Paul) tells us the law has "been established (stands) through faith" (Rom 3:31) proves it doesn't mean its been abolished or that we don't have to obey it.

The Holy Spirit does not lead us to keep the works of the law, since that law was abolished in His flesh.

Please harmonize your words with Ezekiel 36:26-27:

A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.​

The Covenant Maker became flesh, and when His flesh died, so did the law of commandments contained in ordinances that was added.

The Covenant maker was Almighty Yahweh (Yeshua's Father):

Deu 18:15 The LORD (YHWH) thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me; unto him ye shall hearken;
Deu 18:16 According to all that thou desiredst of the LORD (YHWH) thy God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD (YHWH) my God, neither let me see this great fire any more, that I die not.
Deu 18:17 And the LORD (YHWH) said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken.
Deu 18:18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.​

The "YHWH" of verse 16 is the Covenant maker. He would eventually raise up Yeshua as the prophesied Prophet. Yahweh has inherent immortality. He cannot die. His Son, however, did die, but did not abolish the law (Mt 5:17-19).

14 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, 15 having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.
Ephesians 2:14-16

The law of Moses was abolished in His flesh.

We have been through this before. Suffice it to say, this passage is not talking about Yahweh's holy law, but about man made laws (dogma) that caused a hatred (enmity) between Jews and Gentiles.