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[__ Science __ ] A very long Wednesday... Young Earth and Old Universe Creationism reconciled?

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I just watched this and thought it might be a blessing to some people...

Very interesting. I don't know much, but it sounds feasible, except for some questions I have about it. It sounds like a Big Expansion vs Big Bang. Big Bangers extrapolate the expansion in reverse to a singularity instead of starting at some already expanded state. Since Earth is the center, time is moving very rapidly compared to some point at the edge, due to all the cumulative gravity of the whole universe. However, I have a question about that. For some places inside of galaxies very far away near the edge, would it then appear like the universe was old there also, since gravity is strong in those places? In addition to that, if you were located near the center of the Milky Way, would it appear the universe was much younger, since the collective gravity of the galaxy center is much greater than on Earth? Then perhaps a person there would not be able to see light from distant stars? This theory has lots of ramifications.
TD:)
 
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Big Bangers extrapolate the expansion in reverse to a singularity instead of starting at some already expanded state.
TD:)
The calculation for the age of the universe is really rather simple.
Gravity ( a very weak force,by the way) has no effect whatsoever on the calculation.
Since Earth is the center, time is moving very rapidly compared to some point at the edge, due to all the cumulative gravity of the whole universe.
Is the earth at the center of the universe?
What is your source of that information. Is there a website I can go to?

Does gravity affect time? Time has no mass to be effected by gravity so how could it be effected?
Again, do you have a source I could check out?
 
I just watched this and thought it might be a blessing to some people...
This Physicist makes the fundamental error of assuming that the 1st chapter of Genesis is "cosmology" rather than the genealogy of the heavens and the earth which introduces the story of creation which begins at Gen 2:4.
I am not able to comment on his physics because I am ignorant in that area.
IMO, He should likewise not comment on the alleged "cosmology" of the Bible as if he were reading a physics text book.
 
The calculation for the age of the universe is really rather simple.
Gravity ( a very weak force,by the way) has no effect whatsoever on the calculation.

Is the earth at the center of the universe?
What is your source of that information. Is there a website I can go to?

Does gravity affect time? Time has no mass to be effected by gravity so how could it be effected?
Again, do you have a source I could check out?

Jim, did you not understand that I was referring to the video? In it he clearly states that the Earth is near the center. So I point to the video as the source of my statement, if you are interested in watching it.

In the video he is clear about how gravity affects time. Anyone familiar with Einstein's General Relativity equation and subsequent experiments no longer question it, as it is accepted as fact in the scientific community. So your statement about how simple to calculate the age of the universe lacks knowledge. You should watch the video carefully to see how he tries to resolve that issue.
TD:)
 
In it he clearly states that the Earth is near the center.
Yeah. That makes sense to me since everything seems to be moving away. But this stuff is a bit challenging for me.
So your statement about how simple to calculate the age of the universe lacks knowledge.
Yet people like Prof. Michio Kaku (also PhD Physicist) and many many others say it's rather simple because of the red shift of the light of stars as they move away.
So, while this guy has his theory, so do others who do not agree.

It was the discovery of the red shift that should have put an end to evolution which took for granted an infinitely old, static state, universe. When it was discovered that the universe was only about 14 billion years old, the evolutionists had to reinvent evolution because 18 billion years is not long enough for evolution to have occurred.

I also object to using the scriptures as a science book. It is not a science book or a history book. It is God's self revelation to mankind.

Using scripture for science is a misuse of scripture, IMO.
 
I don't think I would have appreciated what was said in the movie in the OP if I had not watched "The Principle". There are some amazing findings in recent cosmology that Christians are unaware of and atheists are very troubled by!

 
Jim, did you not understand that I was referring to the video? In it he clearly states that the Earth is near the center.

Science doesn't claim that, at all. Expansion of space is uniform, such that all points move away from one another, and there is no "center" (as the theory of expansion goes)

In the video he is clear about how gravity affects time. Anyone familiar with Einstein's General Relativity equation and subsequent experiments no longer question it, as it is accepted as fact in the scientific community.

To be clear, extreme gravity affects space, not time directly. The speed at which we travel will affect time relative to us, but only if our speed is so extreme as to be measurable in terms of a fraction of the speed of light.

So in theory, we could approach the 'gravity well' around Jupiter, and travel more quickly than the vehicle is moving. We have yet to exploit this phenomenon, and send our probes around such large bodies to accelerate due to simple gravity; i.e. Newtonian physics.
 
. When it was discovered that the universe was only about 14 billion years old, the evolutionists had to reinvent evolution because 18 billion years is not long enough for evolution to have occurred.

.

The current consensus within the scientific community is that life on Earth has evolved within 4 billion years, with most of that time taken up by single cell organisms. Once life got past that, it got knocked down and almost out repeatedly, with strong indications that 20 million years is plenty of time for very substantial evolution to occur.
Thought since things found in the mid 90's has changed a LOT!
 
The current consensus within the scientific community is that life on Earth has evolved within 4 billion years, with most of that time taken up by single cell organisms. Once life got past that, it got knocked down and almost out repeatedly, with strong indications that 20 million years is plenty of time for very substantial evolution to occur.
Thought since things found in the mid 90's has changed a LOT!

OK... At the risk of cracking open the proverbial can of worms then ;-)

 
Expansion of space is uniform, such that all points move away from one another, and there is no "center" (as the theory of expansion goes)
I read that galaxies furthest away from the Earth in all directions show to be young and "equidistant" from the Earth (13B light years). It appears that Earth is the center. But if your theory is correct, then every galaxy will appear at the center. Can you please explain that?
TD:)
 
I don't think I would have appreciated what was said in the movie in the OP if I had not watched "The Principle". There are some amazing findings in recent cosmology that Christians are unaware of and atheists are very troubled by!
NDC, did you see this movie? I'm looking at reviews and haven't found anything yet that made me want to see it. I found a spoiler that wasn't alerted as a spoiler: "the Earth IS NOT MOVING. All the Universe is, but not us. Zero speed through absolute space. Earth at the Center of it all!" I wonder if you can tell me how they resolve the problem of the earth not moving as opposed to celestial math.
TD:)
 
Using scripture for science is a misuse of scripture, IMO.

The word/definition of “Science” has as its root “natural theology”. Some universities still calling their ‘science’ departments “natural theology”. To a Christian scientist, the study of God through nature (his creation) still is natural theology. And as Paul points out, you can learn things about the attributes of God through observing His creation.
 
NDC, did you see this movie? I'm looking at reviews and haven't found anything yet that made me want to see it. I found a spoiler that wasn't alerted as a spoiler: "the Earth IS NOT MOVING. All the Universe is, but not us. Zero speed through absolute space. Earth at the Center of it all!" I wonder if you can tell me how they resolve the problem of the earth not moving as opposed to celestial math.
TD:)

I used to try to persuade people on forums of my point of view - now I just share what I have come across and let whoever agree or disagree. I have a first degree in life sciences and have looked into origins in some depth for the last 30 years or so. I found the information in "The Principle" pretty compelling... Full movie below:-

 
I read that galaxies furthest away from the Earth in all directions show to be young and "equidistant" from the Earth (13B light years). It appears that Earth is the center. But if your theory is correct, then every galaxy will appear at the center. Can you please explain that?
TD:)

Yes, that much is easy. Per theory, we have a "horizon," beyond which light simply hasn't had enough time to reach us. This distance will be the same in all directions.

This phenomenon has nothing whatsoever to do with any (supposed) "boundary" to our Universe, which is a matter that does not have strong consensus. So the currently acceptable terms are 'observable Universe,' or, less favored, 'known Universe.'

But those galaxies at the edge of our horizon are seen only via their light which has been traveling for 13BY to get here for us to be able to see it, so they're not young anymore, and may not even still exist. Anything we can observe of them will be from the time when galaxy formation was a new thing, so that is the sense in which we see them as 'young.'

BTW I'm not saying I believe this or any other scientific theory; I'm just comparing it to the claims in the thread for reference, and as a point of interest. It seems an appropriate purpose for this section of the website, and finding common ground between Faith and science is a worthwhile pursuit, IMHO. Where there truly is conflict, I'll go with God's revelation every time, without flinching!

What truly concerns me is when people claim "we can science anything;" to me that is either 666, or paving the way for it. We are NOT complete apart from God. Maintaining that humility is one primary way to keep from being fooled in such a grand way. Humility is also how Christ defeated our enemies.
 
The word/definition of “Science” has as its root “natural theology”. Some universities still calling their ‘science’ departments “natural theology”. To a Christian scientist, the study of God through nature (his creation) still is natural theology. And as Paul points out, you can learn things about the attributes of God through observing His creation.

Are you a member of the Church of Christ, scientist?
 

Ok, thanks. I think it might help things generally to have a sense of where folks are coming from. Myself, I have deliberately aligned myself with no denomination but have sought God. Who has brought me into a belief system taught by the EO (Eastern Orthodox)

I laugh at myself about this. All that time I thought it was 'just me and Jesus,' and He was showing me the most ancient Faith!
 
Ok, thanks. I think it might help things generally to have a sense of where folks are coming from. Myself, I have deliberately aligned myself with no denomination but have sought God. Who has brought me into a belief system taught by the EO (Eastern Orthodox)

I laugh at myself about this. All that time I thought it was 'just me and Jesus,' and He was showing me the most ancient Faith!
If you mentioned Eastern Orthodox to most of my fellow local church members you’d get a blank stare, not knowing much about it one way or the other.

Bottom line is I’m pretty familiar with both current physical science and the Scripture and there’s no conflict between them. Take the age of the heavens, for example. Scripture says they are old (ancient). Sounds about right to me.

Psalm 68:32-33 O kingdoms of the earth, sing to God;sing praise to the Lord, Selah to the one who rides in the highest heavens of old.
 
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