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Daniel 8 Goat vs Ram

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Tomg

Member
Hello,

there are some blogs and articles that mention Daniel 8 is the next event on the timeline. I am not sure about when the rapture occurs.

foursignposts.com

kjvbible.org/daniel.html


The simplified timeline would be

Daniel 8 goat vs ram

Tribulation (between 3,5 and 7 years)
- 2 witnesses, 7 seals, 7 trumpets, 7 viales of wrath, Mystery Babylon, 144000 Sealed, Mark of the Beast, Antichrist

Armageddon and 2nd coming of Christ

Rev. 16/16, Rev. 19/ 11-21

Millennium
Rev. 20/ 1-6

Gog and Magog
Rev. 20/ 7-10

Last Judgment
Rev. 20/ 11-15

Eternity
Rev. 21 - 22/5


I posted this also on christianforums.com, but it seems almost no one believes goat vs ram is coming around the corner.

Thoughts and comments are welcome,

Tom
 
Hi Tomg. I'll take a stab at this even though I'm not sure yet as to what you're seeking. Please allow me to start by stating my understanding of the goat/ram.

In Daniels Time there was two horns of a ram; Medo-Persia, and one was larger than the other, or having the more power, and that became Persia. The goat representing Alexander of Greece coming upon the scene.

We also read of little horns in Daniel Chapters Seven and Eight that are different. The one of Chapter will be the future Antichrist or man of sin, and Chapter Eight will be the False Prophet. Are we still on the same page? Thanks. :wave
 
Hello,

there are some blogs and articles that mention Daniel 8 is the next event on the timeline. I am not sure about when the rapture occurs.

foursignposts.com

kjvbible.org/daniel.html


The simplified timeline would be

Daniel 8 goat vs ram

Tribulation (between 3,5 and 7 years)
- 2 witnesses, 7 seals, 7 trumpets, 7 viales of wrath, Mystery Babylon, 144000 Sealed, Mark of the Beast, Antichrist

Armageddon and 2nd coming of Christ

Rev. 16/16, Rev. 19/ 11-21

Millennium
Rev. 20/ 1-6

Gog and Magog
Rev. 20/ 7-10

Last Judgment
Rev. 20/ 11-15


Gotta throw my two cents in here, this should be judgments. There is a difference between the GWTJ in Rev 20:11-12 and the resurrection to damnation in Rev 20:13-15. Two different resurrections.

Eternity
Rev. 21 - 22/5


I posted this also on christianforums.com, but it seems almost no one believes goat vs ram is coming around the corner.

Thoughts and comments are welcome,

Tom
 
Hello Eugene,

some say the land of Medo-Persia is modern Iran and the event goat vs ram means another war in middle-east coming soon.
This is also explained in the blog foursignposts.com, because Daniel 8/5 the "goat came from the west on the face of the whole earth, and touched not the ground" which would indicate modern warfare.


Hello John 8:32,

there are several resurrections, maybe this is the last one. Would be another topic.


Greetings,
TomG
 
Resurrection for me is as simple as the Words of our Lord

Joh_6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
Joh_6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh_6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh_6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh_11:24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.
Joh_12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
 
Resurrection for me is as simple as the Words of our Lord

Joh_6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
Joh_6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh_6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh_6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh_11:24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.
Joh_12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

At least two (actually three).
 
Hi Tomg. I'll take a stab at this even though I'm not sure yet as to what you're seeking. Please allow me to start by stating my understanding of the goat/ram.

In Daniels Time there was two horns of a ram; Medo-Persia, and one was larger than the other, or having the more power, and that became Persia. The goat representing Alexander of Greece coming upon the scene.

We also read of little horns in Daniel Chapters Seven and Eight that are different. The one of Chapter will be the future Antichrist or man of sin, and Chapter Eight will be the False Prophet. Are we still on the same page? Thanks. :wave

This is very correct.

Dan 8:8 Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.

Alexander died at age 33 in his prime. The four horns were his generals, Lysimichus, Cassander, Seleucus and Ptolmey. As time progressed the Seleucids (Syria) and the Ptolmeys (Egypt) became the major players.

Dan 8:9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.
Dan 8:10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.
Dan 8:11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.
Dan 8:12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

Antiochus IV Epiphanes (Epidimes)

Dan 8:13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?
Dan 8:14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

2300 evenings and mornings, 1150 days. Originally, the Temple was desolate for 1150 days (from 167 BC to 164 BC) until it was cleansed at the tiem of Judas Machabees. This is a type, just as Dan 11:

Dan 11:19 Then he shall turn his face toward the fort of his own land: but he shall stumble and fall, and not be found.
Dan 11:20 Then shall stand up in his estate a raiser of taxes in the glory of the kingdom: but within few days he shall be destroyed, neither in anger, nor in battle.
Dan 11:21 And in his estate shall stand up a vile person, to whom they shall not give the honour of the kingdom: but he shall come in peaceably, and obtain the kingdom by flatteries.
Dan 11:22 And with the arms of a flood shall they be overflown from before him, and shall be broken; yea, also the prince of the covenant.
Dan 11:23 And after the league made with him he shall work deceitfully: for he shall come up, and shall become strong with a small people.
Dan 11:24 He shall enter peaceably even upon the fattest places of the province; and he shall do that which his fathers have not done, nor his fathers' fathers; he shall scatter among them the prey, and spoil, and riches: yea, and he shall forecast his devices against the strong holds, even for a time.
Dan 11:25 And he shall stir up his power and his courage against the king of the south with a great army; and the king of the south shall be stirred up to battle with a very great and mighty army; but he shall not stand: for they shall forecast devices against him.
Dan 11:26 Yea, they that feed of the portion of his meat shall destroy him, and his army shall overflow: and many shall fall down slain.
Dan 11:27 And both these kings' hearts shall be to do mischief, and they shall speak lies at one table; but it shall not prosper: for yet the end shall be at the time appointed.
Dan 11:28 Then shall he return into his land with great riches; and his heart shall be against the holy covenant; and he shall do exploits, and return to his own land.
Dan 11:29 At the time appointed he shall return, and come toward the south; but it shall not be as the former, or as the latter.
Dan 11:30 For the ships of Chittim shall come against him: therefore he shall be grieved, and return, and have indignation against the holy covenant: so shall he do; he shall even return, and have intelligence with them that forsake the holy covenant.
Dan 11:31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.

Note the parallel between verses 19 -31 and Adolf Hitler. Hitler was a shadowy type but not the fulfillment.

verse 19: Antiochus III and Kaiser Wilhem
verse 20: Heliodorus (the tax collector) and the Weimar Republic
verse 21: Antiochus IV and Hitler
Verses 22-28: Great successes for Antiochus IV and Hitler
Verse 29: No joy in Egypt for Antiochus and Hitler began suffering defeats
verses 30-31: Abomination od Desolation and Hitler's abominable treatment of Jewry.

Now as I said this is only a shadowy type and not the final fulfillment, so it is not perfect. In the future, we will see the fulfillment...

Mat 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
 
Here is a summary from the blog foursignposts.com, this is what I am trying to tell you:



The Four Signposts: A Summary

BY Mark Davidson on July 15 2012

The Four Signposts are four sets of events which will occur, one after the other, prior to the Tribulation or Rapture.
These events are derived from the Biblical prophecies of the four beasts in Daniel 7:1-27, the ram and goat in Daniel 8:1-26, and the four horsemen in Revelation 6:1-8. The fulfillment of these events identified in prophecy, have been, and will continue to be, reported as news stories in the Middle East.

In my book, Hidden In Plain Sight, I go into detail of why these three prophecies qualify as identifying the Four Signposts. These three prophecies all share three things in common:
1) They are all applicable to, and will be fulfilled in, modern-day end times just prior to the Tribulation;
2) They all describe the nations involved in, the actions of these nations, and the societal conditions of the geographical areas involved, during the times just immediately prior to the appearance of Antichrist;
3) They all describe the same set of events, just from different perspectives.

The First Signpost includes the lion with wings that is forced to stand upright and its heart replaced, and the first horseman that rides a white horse. The democratizing of the nation of Iraq and the career of its former leader Saddam Hussein, are the news events that fulfilled these prophecies.

The Second Signpost includes the bear that is higher on one side, the ram with two long horns, and the second horseman that rides the red horse. The struggle going on right now in Iran, if this interpretation of prophecy is true, will see the Supreme Leader of Iran reduced from top leader to second leader. Following the resolution of that situation, the great war will begin, where Iran invades many countries and causes chaos across much of the Middle East.

The Third Signpost includes the four-headed leopard, the goat with the one great horn, and the third horseman who rides the black horse. The news events to fulfill this signpost are still completely in our future. It will include a four-nation confederacy taking back the conquests of Iran, and ending Iran in the form that it currently exists. Due to the probable cut off of oil, food will be available but will be very expensive. We do see today some events setting up the Third Signpost. In addition to food price hikes we have seen in the last few years, the governments of Turkey, Egypt and Syria are becoming Islamist. This situation is required for fulfillment of the Third Signpost.

Finally, the Fourth Signpost includes the terrible ten-horned beast, the little horn on one of the four horns of the goat, and the fourth horseman who rides the green horse. The news events to fulfill this signpost are even further in our future. It starts at the end of the Third Signpost where the great new nation that covers much of the Middle East fragments into four pieces. The man who is to be Antichrist will arise out of one of these four new nations, take it over, conquer two others, and have the fourth submit to him. The remainder of the Islamic realm then will also submit to him. At this point, the seven-year Tribulation is imminent.

These Four Signposts are warnings to God’s Church. By watching these Signposts, we may know – as our world goes through each week, month, and year – what season of God’s plan we are in during these end times prior to the Tribulation. These news events will be truly terrible due to their causing economic and mental anguish among the populations of the world due to the cutoff of oil. Islam may be seen as gaining the upper hand and western civilization as being on the decline. But these events, instead of being continual bad news, can be seen instead as fulfillment of detailed and absolute prophecy that must be fulfilled in order for God’s promises to come to fruition.


 
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