Bible Study Defining and understanding biblical words and terms.

[JLB]

I believe there is willful sin that blatantly defies the commands of God like Adam did and written about in Hebrews 10:26, 27 and then there are sins that others say is sin, but yet not sin in the eyes of God like StoveBolts pointed out in #54.

I agree with this, of course.



JLB

 

[JLB]

I understand.

It seems to me Jesus is giving us a commandment that if our brother sins against us, we are to go to him.
What if you don't tell him, and he moves away and you lose contact? Wouldn't you be sinning for not doing what our Lord commanded us?

How would you show repentance in this case, and would your salvation be at stake?

I guess you can keep discussing the things that Jesus didn’t say, so that your point can be made.


Again, As I said, to wondering, n my opening statement in response to her very specific question...

Great question!

Personally, I would tend to agree with you, based on some clarification and additional scriptural support.


However, I would like to address your question head on and at face value, by referring to the words of the Lord Jesus Christ, in context with this subject of His sheep becoming lost, or separated from Him.

• if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother.

We see that Jesus was referring to sin, and one brother sinned against another.


We can speculate on many different things and try to apply them to a scenario of our choosing, but are we really after the truth, when doing this?


Jesus absolutely said to tell the brother his fault so he can be restored; reconciled back to God.


In the end, if the brother doesn’t repent, he will be lost.

If he doesn’t repent.

Will the spirit of God keep dealing with the wayward brother in hopes of getting him to repent, and return to God, even if he moves away from the community where the incident happened?

Yes, but the outcome is still the same, if he doesn’t repent, he will be lost.


JLB

 

[JLB]

What if you don't tell him, and he moves away and you lose contact? Wouldn't you be sinning for not doing what our Lord commanded us?

How would you show repentance in this case, and would your salvation be at stake?

We sin when we disobey God.

The rest of the context, if we keep reading Matthew 18, deals with the other side of the proverbial coin, which is the attitude of the brother who was sinned against.

• Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?’ And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him.“So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother his trespasses.”

Then Peter came to Him and said, “Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times?”
Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven. Therefore the kingdom of heaven is like a certain king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants. And when he had begun to settle accounts, one was brought to him who owed him ten thousand talents. But as he was not able to pay, his master commanded that he be sold, with his wife and children and all that he had, and that payment be made. The servant therefore fell down before him, saying, ‘Master, have patience with me, and I will pay you all.’ Then the master of that servant was moved with compassion, released him, and forgave him the debt.
“But that servant went out and found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred denarii; and he laid hands on him and took him by the throat, saying, ‘Pay me what you owe!’ So his fellow servant fell down at his feet and begged him, saying, ‘Have patience with me, and I will pay you all.’ And he would not, but went and threw him into prison till he should pay the debt. So when his fellow servants saw what had been done, they were very grieved, and came and told their master all that had been done. Then his master, after he had called him, said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you begged me. Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?’ And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him.
“So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother his trespasses.”
Matthew 18:21-35





JLB

 

[JLB]

I DO see a difference between sinning
and
living a life of sin.

I think we all do.


Again, I prefaced my original answer with this -


Personally, I would tend to agree with you, based on some clarification and additional scriptural support.


However, I would like to address your question head on and at face value, by referring to the words of the Lord Jesus Christ, in context with this subject of His sheep becoming lost, or separated from Him.


Again, I believe our perspective toward sin, even one sin against a brother, is different than that of the Lord.


I wanted to show His perspective on your question.


IOW, I didn’t want to water down His words with my perspective.


I wanted to answer your very important question with His words, directly, and not my perspective of what His words may or may not mean through the filter of our modern culture and mindset.




JLB

 

[stovebolts]

I guess you can keep discussing the things that Jesus didn’t say, so that your point can be made.


Again, As I said, to wondering, n my opening statement in response to her very specific question...

• if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother.

We see that Jesus was referring to sin, and one brother sinned against another.


We can speculate on many different things and try to apply them to a scenario of our choosing, but are we really after the truth, when doing this?


Jesus absolutely said to tell the brother his fault so he can be restored; reconciled back to God.


In the end, if the brother doesn’t repent, he will be lost.

If he doesn’t repent.

Will the spirit of God keep dealing with the wayward brother in hopes of getting him to repent, and return to God, even if he moves away from the community where the incident happened?

Yes, but the outcome is still the same, if he doesn’t repent, he will be lost.


JLB

The point I was trying to make is that not everyone knows Gods word and can accuse another of sin which is not a sin in Gods eyes. In addition, God handles willful sin differently than he does sin committed in ignorance.

By no means was I undermining the words of Jesus let alone refute what you have written.

But let's go back to Gods word. If your brother sins against you, you are commanded to go to that brother. In other words, if your brother sins against you, you are not to ignore that sin. God has called us to action and our faith is not passive.

When our brother sins against us, if we do not go to him, we fall into sin ourselves by disobeying Gods commandment to us.

 

[JLB]

The point I was trying to make is that not everyone knows Gods word and can accuse another of sin which is not a sin in Gods eyes. In addition, God handles willful sin differently than he does sin committed in ignorance.

By no means was I undermining the words of Jesus let alone refute what you have written.

But let's go back to Gods word. If your brother sins against you, you are commanded to go to that brother. In other words, if your brother sins against you, you are not to ignore that sin. God has called us to action and our faith is not passive.

When our brother sins against us, if we do not go to him, we fall into sin ourselves by disobeying Gods commandment to us.

Can we move all these discussions to my thread about led by the Spirit, please.


I was hoping to keep this a thread where we could define and understand biblical words and terms.


Thanks, JLB

 

[GodsGrace]

I think we all do.


Again, I prefaced my original answer with this -


Personally, I would tend to agree with you, based on some clarification and additional scriptural support.


However, I would like to address your question head on and at face value, by referring to the words of the Lord Jesus Christ, in context with this subject of His sheep becoming lost, or separated from Him.


Again, I believe our perspective toward sin, even one sin against a brother, is different than that of the Lord.


I wanted to show His perspective on your question.


IOW, I didn’t want to water down His words with my perspective.


I wanted to answer your very important question with His words, directly, and not my perspective of what His words may or may not mean through the filter of our modern culture and mindset.


JLB

I'm just getting a little confused in what we're discussing.
In the one teaching of Jesus,,,we're to go to a brother that is sinning or has sinned against US, personally to one of us.

This would cover the going to the brother..
although I do believe we could FORGIVE our brother even if we cannot go to him,,,as for_his_glory his glory brought up. Or because the other does not care to speak to us...we still forgive.

But now we've gone on to discussing OUR sin against GOD.

Am I correct? Have we changed the discussion?

 

[for_his_glory]

Paul uses this same principal when writing to Timothy. Saul was zealous for the Lord and persecuted Christ believing he was doing Gods will. He repented when the truth was revealed to him.... And the rest is history.

Just like Paul, many do things not understanding that they are sinning against God and then you have others that say you are sinning by their own judgements of what they think sin is.

If one sins against us as we know it is truly sin in the eyes of God according to His commands then we need to tell them of their sin as we should have already forgiven them instantly. If they do not listen to you or that of other witnesses then just let them be.

We should be quick to tell them of their fault right at that moment, but we don't always do that or maybe not given the right opportunity to do so in light of surrounding circumstances that does not provide the privacy we need to talk with them. Even if we do not talk with them we know that we have forgiven them and that is obedience to God. If they were to move away before we talk with them, then all we can do is pray the Holy Spirit would bring conviction to them and they would reconcile before God.

 

[JLB]

I'm just getting a little confused in what we're discussing.
In the one teaching of Jesus,,,we're to go to a brother that is sinning or has sinned against US, personally to one of us.

This would cover the going to the brother..
although I do believe we could FORGIVE our brother even if we cannot go to him,,,as for_his_glory his glory brought up. Or because the other does not care to speak to us...we still forgive.

But now we've gone on to discussing OUR sin against GOD.

Am I correct? Have we changed the discussion?

I have several posts to make but am waiting for one of the Mods to move this to an appropriate thread.

Hopefully all the past discussions will be moved so this thread can remain a place to define and understand biblical words and terms.



JLB

 

[for_his_glory]

I have several posts to make but am waiting for one of the Mods to move this to an appropriate thread.

Hopefully all the past discussions will be moved so this thread can remain a place to define and understand biblical words and terms.



JLB

Being that this is part of your original thread we would have to sort through each reply and move each post one by one which would take a lot of time. It might be better if you just start a new thread on this subject apart from your other one on being led by the Spirit.

 

[JLB]

Being that this is part of your original thread we would have to sort through each reply and move each post one by one which would take a lot of time. It might be better if you just start a new thread on this subject apart from your other one on being led by the Spirit.

I did, but would you move all the posts that are not defining and understanding biblical words and terms, to that thread.


I really wanted this to be a clean thread that is dedicated to the topic.



JLB

 

[GodsGrace]

I did, but would you move all the posts that are not defining and understanding biblical words and terms, to that thread.


I really wanted this to be a clean thread that is dedicated to the topic.



JLB

I agree.
The DEFINITION thread should be "clean",,,as you said.

 

[WalterandDebbie]

Jesus gave us the key to being fruitful:

But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty. Matthew 13:23


I am starting this thread, in hopes of bringing some clarification and understanding to some of our discussions that concern foundational doctrines of the Church, that Christ taught to His disciples, who in turn taught to their generation, that are written for us in the New Testament.

Key biblical words and phrases that were used by our Lord, and the writers of the New Testament, may have a different meaning than their modern day counterparts, used today.


There is no need for endless debate over simple, basic biblical words and terms, that degrade into unhealthy dialogue between Christians.


In addition I hope to see these definitions, that should be widely agreed upon by staff and participants, added to the new Statement of Faith (glossary of biblical words) that is being developed, when the TOS is complete.


Having unity and harmony concerning biblical words and terms is the beginning to having unity and harmony concerning sound biblical doctrine, for it is the words that make up the doctrine.


Misunderstand the words and we will misunderstand the doctrine.

• till we all come to the unity of the faith

• that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine,

And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head—Christ— from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share, causes growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love. Ephesians 4:11-16


Here are just a few of the biblical words and terms that I hope to see us define and understand as a community, for the purpose of unity and growth in this body of believers, as well as those that the Lord will bring here in the coming months and years.


Love
Believe
Faith
Salvation
Eternal life (now & then)
Lost
Found
Gospel
Repent
Grace


Inherit the kingdom
The faith
The love of God
The truth
The doctrine of Christ (the doctrine)
Son of God (three aspects)


Hopefully others, including staff will add to this list.


Paul said, I know in part, but we have the mind of Christ.




Blessings to all,


JLB

Amen, while reading the above, I understand that the scriptures must be rightly divided to each context of its subject matter to get the correct understanding.

And as we are becoming Christians should also learn to speak the same thing as Jesus spoke and did in words and deeds, What you all say about that ? because he says to take my yoke upon yourself and learn of me.

Jesus said, if you abide in me, and my words in you, ye shall ask what you will and he will grant it unto you, according to his will of course,

Sometimes I my study I can ask amiss, and I ask the Lord to help me, once I have repented of something which is not wright in his sight.

 

[JLB]

I'm just getting a little confused in what we're discussing.
In the one teaching of Jesus,,,we're to go to a brother that is sinning or has sinned against US, personally to one of us.

This would cover the going to the brother..
although I do believe we could FORGIVE our brother even if we cannot go to him,,,as for_his_glory his glory brought up. Or because the other does not care to speak to us...we still forgive.

But now we've gone on to discussing OUR sin against GOD.

Am I correct? Have we changed the discussion?

I had hoped to continue this discussion in the thread I started, to keep this thread clean, but it looks like John has locked it, and removed me from being able to access it.


I haven’t changed the discussion, but others may have.


When a brother sins against another brother, he must repent, or be in danger of remaining lost.


In some cases it may be another brother who goes after the wayward brother.

In other cases he may have to “come to himself” and repent.

• But when he came to himself, he said,...

“But when he came to himself, he said, ‘How many of my father’s hired servants have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger! I will arise and go to my father, and will say to him, “Father, I have sinned against heaven and before you, and I am no longer worthy to be called your son. Make me like one of your hired servants.” Luke 15:17-19


Humbling ourself and repenting is how a Christian who becomes lost, is reconciled back to God.



JLB

 

[JLB]

And as we are becoming Christians should also learn to speak the same thing as Jesus spoke and did in words and deeds, What you all say about that ? because he says to take my yoke upon yourself and learn of me.

Yes. Amen.

The doctrine of Christ is what we all should be teaching and speaking so that “we all speak the same things”.


Now I plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. 1 Corinthians 1:10



Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9


When we teach doctrine that is not the doctrine of Christ, we are in danger of no longer having God.


Very Sobering.



JLB

 

[for_his_glory]

I did, but would you move all the posts that are not defining and understanding biblical words and terms, to that thread.


I really wanted this to be a clean thread that is dedicated to the topic.



JLB

What is the title of your new thread and where can it be found.

 

[JLB]

What is the title of your new thread and where can it be found.

It was called the Lost Sheep, but John locked it and kicked me off of it.


JLB

 

[for_his_glory]

The OP is about defining and understanding the meaning of words found in scripture. One word can take on different meanings for how it is written in scripture. Please present your word with a Hebrew/Greek definition as this is not intended to be a discussion, but words we can add to the glossary.

I apologize for my part of the discussions, but will not move them to another thread as requested to do so as we all have been discussing things and to time consuming to move all of them.

 

[JLB]

This clearly states that the devil is Jesus

I think this is a typo... right?