Eternal Security or Once Saved Always Saved; Is It Scriptural?

[Royff]

Eternal Security or Once Saved Always Saved; Is It Scriptural?

What does it mean to be saved? It means its in Christ that we live move and have our being, its in the body of Christ that we live, once ejected from that body there is no longer life, but death. As long as we remain in the body of Christ we are saved, now the question is can we be ejected form that security in Christ and be lost. Let’s let Jesus the Christ answer that most important once and for all:

“I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.” [Rev 3:15-16]

The people the Lord is sending this warning to are not pagans and unbelievers, but the saved, those in His body. These people are secured, they are saved, there is no more secured place then in the body of Christ. But look at the warning the Lord sends to the now saved. Jesus said He will spue them out of their once secured place of salvation. Though they were once saved, they can lose that salvation. What the false doctrine of once saved always is, is a license to live in sin.

That’s my take on it; what’s yours?

 

[ezra]

your opening a BIG CAN OF WORMS watch the fireworks

 

[reba]

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[WIP]

I have moved this thread to the appropriate forum and and unlocked it.
Royff

 

[civilwarbuff]

your opening a BIG CAN OF WORMS watch the fireworks

Pull up a chair....

 

[WinterPuma]

How refreshing. A topic never discussed before.

Source:John 3:16"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

John 4:10 Jesus answered and said to her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is who says to you, 'Give Me a drink,' you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water."

Romans 5:15 "But the free gift is not like the transgression. For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many."

Romans 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord."

Romans 8:32 "He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him over for us all, how will He not also with Him freely give us all things?"

2 Corinthians 9:15 "Thanks be to God for His indescribable gift!

Ephesians 2:8 "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;"

2 Timothy 3:16-17 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

Numbers 23:19
19 God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?

“As regards the gospel, they are enemies for your sake. But as regards election, they are beloved for the sake of their forefathers. For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.”- Romans 11:28-29


Eternal security is found in our being eternally saved by faith through the sacrifice of Christ Jesus.

 

[chessman]

now the question is can we be ejected form that security in Christ and be lost. Let’s let Jesus the Christ answer that most important once and for all:

What makes you think being spewed out of the mouth of Christ is symbolic of lose of salvation?

Shouldn’t we let Jesus answer what it meant to be “spewed out of His mouth”? Which, BTW, water in a mouth is not a body part of Christ.

I rebuke and discipline all whom I love. Therefore be zealous, and repent.​

Revelation 3:19 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Revelation 3:19&version=DLNT

What do you think??? Rebuke/discipline OR loss of salvation?

 

[reba]

Is blaspheme forgivable?

 

[FreeGrace]

Eternal Security or Once Saved Always Saved; Is It Scriptural?

What does it mean to be saved? It means its in Christ that we live move and have our being, its in the body of Christ that we live, once ejected from that body there is no longer life, but death. As long as we remain in the body of Christ we are saved, now the question is can we be ejected form that security in Christ and be lost. Let’s let Jesus the Christ answer that most important once and for all:

“I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.” [Rev 3:15-16]

The people the Lord is sending this warning to are not pagans and unbelievers, but the saved, those in His body. These people are secured, they are saved, there is no more secured place then in the body of Christ. But look at the warning the Lord sends to the now saved. Jesus said He will spue them out of their once secured place of salvation. Though they were once saved, they can lose that salvation. What the false doctrine of once saved always is, is a license to live in sin.

That’s my take on it; what’s yours?

What Jesus said in Rev 3 is obviously a figure of speech. Not literal. And figures of speech can mean most anything. What it clearly doesn't say is that He will remove salvation from those who are lukewarm. So we shouldn't assume what isn't clearly said.

But, this is what was very clearly said, regarding salvation, or having eternal security.
John 10:28-29
28 I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.

29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand.

So, in v.28a, Jesus says recipients of eternal life shall never perish. Not arguable. That statement alone refutes any notion of losing salvation.

But not only that, in v.28b and v.29 Jesus emphasizes that those who are in His and the Father's hand (metaphor for security) cannot be removed.

Add to that the fact that there are NO verses about anyone having the power (ability) to remove themselves from God's hand, only strengthens the fact that once a person is saved, meaning has been given the free gift of eternal life, they shall never perish.

But there's more. Back in John 5:24 and 6:47 Jesus very plainly stated that those who believe possess (have) eternal life.

That has to mean they have it the MOMENT they have believed, if Jesus' words are to be believed. Add to that fact that there are NO verses about anyone receiving the free gift of eternal life any specified time following belief in Christ.

Therefore, the MOMENT one believes in Christ for salvation, they possess (have) eternal life. That makes them a recipient of eternal life the MOMENT they believe, and Jesus was clear: those He gives eternal life shall never perish.

 

[FreeGrace]

Is blaspheme forgivable?

Context and to whom provides the answer.

 

[reba]

Context and to whom provides the answer.

SPLANE

 

[Eugene]

Is blaspheme forgivable?

Can someone born of God sin? Do we really have the new nature of Christ that God will not judge?
1Jn_3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
1Jn_5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

Joh 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

 

[Jim Parker]

Though they were once saved, they can lose that salvation. What the false doctrine of once saved always is, is a license to live in sin.

 

[ezra]

Is blaspheme forgivable?

that would depend on what is being called blaspheme and can it be forgiven

 

[FreeGrace]

SPLANE

The context I was referring to is found in Mark 3:
28 Truly I tell you, people can be forgiven all their sins and every slander they utter,
29 but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; they are guilty of an eternal sin.”

This context is the same as found in Matt 12:31-32.
31 And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.

32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

What I notice here is that those who blaspheme (speak a word against the Son of Man) will be forgiven.

So, the context for blaspheme not being forgivable is when it is directed at the Holy Spirit.

Further, the context for Jesus' words was about those who actually witnessed the miracles of Jesus yet believed He performed them by the power of Beelzebub. Matt 12:24 - But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, “It is only by Beelzebul, the prince of demons, that this fellow drives out demons.”

So, only those who saw the miracles of Jesus and attributed them to the prince of demons rather than the Holy Spirit couldn't be forgiven their blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

iow, this cannot occur today, since Jesus isn't in the flesh driving out demons today.

 

[FreeGrace]

Can someone born of God sin? Do we really have the new nature of Christ that God will not judge?
1Jn_3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
1Jn_5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

Joh 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

I believe these verses, along with 1 John 3:9 refer to our new nature that cannot sin. But our original nature, the sin nature, continues to sin.

So the challenge for the believer is to live from the new nature, by 'putting to death' our sin nature.

 

[FreeGrace]

Royff said:
Though they were once saved, they can lose that salvation. What the false doctrine of once saved always is, is a license to live in sin.

Please address post #9 and show how any of the verses quoted don't teach eternal security.

Thanks.

 

[ezra]

{
Royff said:
Though they were once saved, they can lose that salvation. What the false doctrine of once saved always is, is a license to live in sin.} it does appear to be that way and many will lean on that. BUTTTTT the true eternal security will teach it is not a license to sin. i am not going to advocate either side can or can not. what i will advocate is that we can know that we may know 1 John 5:13 romans 8: 39 nothing shall separate us from the Love of God paul wrote i know in whom i have believed 2 Timothy 1:12 yes there is a security in our salvation and yes we can know ..that i can bank on and not bounce amen

 

[Douglas Summers]

Is blaspheme forgivable?

Hi Reba, Yes, blaspheme can be forgiven. Blaspheme is the taking of God's name in vain by speech, writing or destroying what God has sanctified (made Holy). Saul was a blasphemer. He persecuted Jesus and His followers and even tried to get them to blaspheme God (Acts 26:9-18)...He was forgiven along with many others. The only act of blaspheme that will not be forgiven is to see the work of Christ by the Holy Spirit as a witness, but assign it to Satan...will not be forgiven...now or forever These would have to be people who know of Christ but hate Christ (Mark 3:22-30). Blaspheme in ignorance can be forgiven. But God will decide this...not man. (1 Tim. 1:12-14)
In His Mercy and Eternal Grace
Douglas Summers

 

[civilwarbuff]