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[_ Old Earth _] Evidence

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Featherbop

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Creation or evolution?

Really, which one is there really evidence of?

Or perhaps there is evidence of both?

Basically Having a complex world seems to be evidence of God.
But some things seem to support evolution sometimes.
Not often, just sometimes.

Only one side can be true. Of course.
I'd like unbiased facts.


_____

Can someone give me GOOD evidence of evolution please?

I'm not just talking about atheists, but christians too.
I know everyone sees evidence of both sides, I need opinions from both.

Thanks.
 
The thing is I don't think its evolution vs. creation.

...but I do think it is evolution vs. the Bible or any other religion that has an account of the beginning of the world.

Evolution doesn't disprove a god, but its implications are defintely at odds with the Bible, the Quran, etc...
 
Just to nitpick, many forms of complexity are in fact opposed to the idea of creationism.

A good example would be the human genetic code and internal structure. We are fabulously complex, but that complexity is exactly what you would not expect as the mark of deliberate creation. An engineer will generally attempt to make a design as simple as possible, if possible using single components (organs, in this case) to do multiple things.

The massive overcomplexity of the human genetic code and the jumbled mess of our internal wiring and structure is in fact more indicative of a haphazard evolution than straight design.

Our eyes, for example, are wired backwards, creating a blindspot where our nerves coalesce in our retina. We swallow and breathe through the same opening, leading to choking.
-And alternative designs do exist. -Squid have eyes wired the 'correct' way, giving no blind spot. Snakes, for example, cannot choke.

Why are those innovations stuck in their 'family tree' and not imported into ours?



-The problem with 'intelligent design' is that, if true, it is obviously not indicative of intelligence. God is a poor engineer.
 
Just to nitpick, many forms of complexity are in fact opposed to the idea of creationism.
Click to expand...

Not really. Nothing can really be opposed to an intangible and unknown god. Evolution as a process can be the work of such a god in some way. And concepts of perfection (as in a perfect design of life) may be just our concepts and not the stuff that this intangible god concerns himself with.

If you don't characterize god in human terms (such as kind, just, wise), he can be anything and not be at odds with science.

What good is such a concept of God? Probably none, but that doesn't put to end our wonder.
 
The fact remains; if he is the creator, he has made some enormous errors in the creation of complex life and ourselves. Either the god-equivalent of a cowboy builder was hired to sort it out while he was having a beer, or he is a bit of an idiot.
 
victorhadin said:
The fact remains; if he is the creator, he has made some enormous errors in the creation of complex life and ourselves. Either the god-equivalent of a cowboy builder was hired to sort it out while he was having a beer, or he is a bit of an idiot.
Click to expand...

It's only an error if it isn't intentional...and that's not determinable.
 
Snakes, for example, cannot choke.
Click to expand...

Snakes die all the time when they try to eat prey that's too big or hard to consume. Horned prey usually does them in the most.
 
If they cannot get it into the gullet, that remains a possibility, yes. It remains a better system than the current human shared-duct.
 
Vitor Hadin: Wait, are you trying to say that because some things are extremely complex that they aren't built with the most effieciency, therefore meaning that they probabvly weren't divinely created?

If that what you said, its makes no sense.

God made no errors. He maybe didn't design the way you think best....



Is evolution just speaking of species and creatures and their changing forms. But if there is no God, what about the law that matter cannot be created nor destroyed? If God didn't create the universe, how could everything come to be in the first place? I'm confused about how that would work?

Well, so far I don't see good evidence of evolution.

Got anything better?
 
Well, so far I don't see good evidence of evolution.
Click to expand...

Why don't you take some biology classes if you're really interested?

Evolution is a fact in animal development, and no religious groups contest it there. It just becomes controversial when science includes man in the animal kingdom.
 
Can you explain what you mean by "evolution is a fact in animal development"?

Well, menkind are not animals of course.

If evolution were true how come there aren't like other humanoid creatures along with homo sapiens?

Does evolution really claim that the world and everything in it came by by some mistake and was created by mistake and chance and randomness?

If thats what evolution claims, that iditness :lol:
 
droopfeather said:
We are animals...smarter ones, but animals nonetheless.
Click to expand...



Based on what?
Click to expand...

Well, it's a human-made classification so it's kinda a silly argument.

We are mammals, and that's a type of animal.

We share 98% of our DNA with chimps. We give off and sense pheremones to attract mates. We hunt and eat animals. We do everything an animal does...
 
Are not the same elements found in clay are also the make up of our bodies?

It doesn't mean I want to be a vase tomorrow.....?.
 
98% is not good enough. It has to be 100%.

A jellyfish is Like 98% water, and a cloud is 98% water.
Their not related though.
 
droopfeather said:
98% is not good enough. It has to be 100%.

A jellyfish is Like 98% water, and a cloud is 98% water.
Their not related though.
Click to expand...

They are related. All physical things are.

100% would make you a chimp. :lol:

98% exact DNA instruction code is not the same as 98% the same elemental composition.
 
Of course 100% would me be a chimp. I might have worsded that poorly....

Anyway that 2% is what physically seperates human from animals.

The rest of the difference lies in mind. Humans have a mind unlike animals do. You can't deny that. But I have a hunch you might try anyway.... :roll: .

But there is a difference is 2%, and that does indeed seperate chimp from man.
 
droopfeather said:
Of course 100% would me be a chimp. I might have worsded that poorly....

Anyway that 2% is what physically seperates human from animals.

The rest of the difference lies in mind. Humans have a mind unlike animals do. You can't deny that. But I have a hunch you might try anyway.... :roll: .

But there is a difference is 2%, and that does indeed seperate chimp from man.
Click to expand...

Intelligence is what separates us. We are already classfied with them as far as science is concerned as primates.

Eek-eek!!! :)
 
I wasn't just talking about intelligence. there is more.

Well, if science classifies humans that way, then science is a idit :lol:
 
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