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He's Right Though

HeIsRisen2018

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I basically forgot pretty much everything I learned in high school because I don't need it. All I needed was basic English and math skills. Some of school was fun don't get me wrong, but it shouldn't be mandatory past elementary school. If you want to go to college it's probably a good idea but you don't need to know very much on simple jobs so why a high school diploma is required a lot of the time is beyond me. :shrug




 

Who Me

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While we are young we learn easily, going back to school while also supporting a family is really hard work.
The well paid jobs all require knowledge and proof that the applicant can learn and apply themselves.
Shop work, warehousework, unskilled labouring jobs will likely always be there but as online and computer ability becomes the norm these jobs will become scarse

It is far better to learn as a child/teenager then to try as an adult.
 

JohnDB

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Also...
The math skills...I use those on a daily basis as an electrician... including algebra, polar addition, quadratic equation, quadrants, and trigonometry.
Then I use grammar and spelling and writing skills to effectively communicate with others about specifications and code compliance.

History is important too. It gives me some background information about what I will find when I find something unique to get working again.

On top of all this...
My education in highschool taught me how to teach myself and gave me the logic skills needed to research any topic I wanted to study and know more about. (Including theological studies)

Then there were the interpersonal relationship skills that are developed during this time. (Obviously many didn't learn anything in this area)

So...to say that everything I did there was a waste of time...not happening. I learned and learned how to learn.
 
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HeIsRisen2018

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Also...
The math skills...I use those on a daily basis as an electrician... including algebra, polar addition, quadratic equation, quadrants, and trigonometry.
Then I use grammar and spelling and writing skills to effectively communicate with others about specifications and code compliance.

History is important too. It gives me some background information about what I will find when I find something unique to get working again.

On top of all this...
My education in highschool taught me how to teach myself and gave me the logic skills needed to research any topic I wanted to study and know more about. (Including theological studies)

Then there were the interpersonal relationship skills that are developed during this time. (Obviously many didn't learn anything in this area)

So...to say that everything I did there was a waste of time...not happening. I learned and learned how to learn.


Since I was on an IEP, I was never even offered higher math skills, and there's such thing like a calculator and the Internet to look up what I don't know.



I'm never actually going to need to know that much if I ever get a job. I never went to college and I'm currently on SSI and I'm getting on with my life just fine as it isn't hurting me any. I just wasn't college material anyways.
 

Luminous_Rose

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I used to think that I wouldn't use most of what I learned, but there are those times I have used stuff from school.

I will probably use a lot of it to homeschool my kids. It has come in handy if someone has needed help with their homework.

Most of the math I haven't used. On a day by day basis, elementary level math is what I use (adding, subtracting, multiplying, dividing, basic word problems) to calculate a monthly budget or what the better buy in the grocery store is. Once in a while I need a little geometry (building our own chicken coop, constructing a garden bed, etc.)

So far most algebra and geometry I have learned has gone unused.

I still use what I learned in music class. I use what I learned in English to write. Science knowledge can help like don't ever mix bleach and ammonia together or vinegar and baking soda can make some less harmful scrubbing bubbles. Not to mention it helps with cooking and gardening, too!

I think I have used more psychology than history =P

Maybe a lot of it depends on lifestyles and professions, too. I would imagine had I worked in computers then that hardware/software/programming class would have been more useful today.

College isn't for everyone, but don't let that limit you! Many CEO's never finished college. There are certificate programs out there that can land you a good job.
 

Christ the King

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I use those on a daily basis as an electrician
I like Thomas Edison but im an even bigger fan of Nikola Tesla, one of my favourite scientists. Grandfathers of electricity you could say about those 2.

What are your thoughts on off-grid solar power systems for homes these days?
Has technology and prices made it worth considering yet?
 

JohnDB

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College degrees are just one way to advance yourself in the workforce above the low level employees.
They aren't the only way.
Right now skilled trades are making as much as or more than your college graduates.

The difference being that working in the skilled trades is temporary due to the physical limitations your body will have as you age. But if a person plays it smart, they can move into the less physical aspects of the skilled trades and work up to retirement age.

Others see a need going unfulfilled in the world and seek to fill that need and charge for the product/service. Creating jobs and a salary along the way. Some, like Bill Gates, have created an empire from this perception. Others that I have met, have created a great small business... like a glass retail company that sells automotive glass. (Car and truck windows break) and all the automotive repair shops buy from him because of the same day delivery of the glass.

And all these "successful" people without education continue to learn and grow but just not in a formal education format.
 

JohnDB

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I like Thomas Edison but im an even bigger fan of Nikola Tesla, one of my favourite scientists. Grandfathers of electricity you could say about those 2.

What are your thoughts on off-grid solar power systems for homes these days?
Has technology and prices made it worth considering yet?
No.
The "break even" point is still at 20 years.
Financially they are not feasible. But codes and permits to build your building often require these so the industry is advancing...but it just doesn't pay. Even solar farms and wind farms require a huge infusion of tax dollars to get constructed. Same thing with Electric cars. Not a single one of those "green alternatives" are financially feasible without tax dollars making them work out financially.

Even nuclear energy is very expensive way to generate power. The radioactive isotopes required to generate the power are the most expensive minerals in the planet costing in the billions of dollars per ounce.

Oil, natural gas, hydroelectric, and coal are the cheapest way still to generate power.
 

Christ the King

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No.
The "break even" point is still at 20 years.
Financially they are not feasible.
Ye that is the noise going around

Even nuclear energy is very expensive way to generate power. The radioactive isotopes required to generate the power are the most expensive minerals in the planet costing in the billions of dollars per ounce.
Im pretty sure Australia mines that stuff they should at least consider nuclear power but their afraid. What is it, uranium, plutonium, Australia mines it and sells it to everyone else.

We have old coal power stations that need to be either refitted or rebuilt. But our state government is so overwhelmed by "climate change" that he closed old coal stations which was our reserve supply. Now in the summer we have to deal with "brownouts", scheduled blackouts, cos we haven't got enough power. Fools

I think hydro requires heaps of flowing water like Niagara otherwise the power needed to pump water uphill doesn't make it very cheap either i think. Stralia is a dry country, flowing water is not in abundance here
 
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WIP

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I basically forgot pretty much everything I learned in high school because I don't need it. All I needed was basic English and math skills. Some of school was fun don't get me wrong, but it shouldn't be mandatory past elementary school. If you want to go to college it's probably a good idea but you don't need to know very much on simple jobs so why a high school diploma is required a lot of the time is beyond me. :shrug




I used to think this too but from my own experience in life it was surprising how many times something I learned in high school or even grade school suddenly appeared to help me along my life's journey. Don't underestimate what you learn in school or out of school. It's not forgotten. It is blended and mixed with everything else you learn in and out of school to give you a rounded out level of knowledge and be part of who you are. You also pick up learning skills (how to learn) in the process that also help you later in life.
 

WIP

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The "break even" point is still at 20 years.
Does this take into consideration maintenance costs and/or electric rate increases or is it just the break even point for the initial investment at current electric rates?

Twenty years ago when I looked into it for my home I calculated it would take about 30 years or more just to recoup the initial investment. Of course, at that time I did not project the price increase in electricity from $.07 / kWh to $.105 / kWh within 10 years. I think the installation costs are lower today too, but that could be due to tax incentives. I suppose the technology has also improved in the last 20 years so that too has an impact on the ROI.

Location can also be a huge factor. I'm in central MN and the efficiency of the systems are not as good as they are in places like Arizona. We have more cloudy days, snow that can pile up on the collectors, and the low sun angle for about half the year.
 

JohnDB

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Ye that is the noise going around



Im pretty sure Australia mines that stuff they should at least consider nuclear power but their afraid. What is it, uranium, plutonium, Australia mines it and sells it to everyone else.

We have old coal power stations that need to be either refitted or rebuilt. But our state government is so overwhelmed by "climate change" that he closed old coal stations which was our reserve supply. Now in the summer we have to deal with "brownouts", scheduled blackouts, cos we haven't got enough power. Fools

I think hydro requires heaps of flowing water like Niagara otherwise the power needed to pump water uphill doesn't make it very cheap either i think. Stralia is a dry country, flowing water is not in abundance here
Uranium is usually "mined" by drilling a shaft and then pumping boric acid into the ground and then pumping the pregnant solution back out.
This solution is then processed to remove the uranium...and then refined a bit more.

Then the uranium 238 is blended with a bit of uranium 239 (from a breeder type reactor) and then layered over selenium rods.

This is just one rod... generally speaking you need a couple dozen of these rods for fission to occur which then heats absolutely pure water into steam which in turn heats more less pure water (usually river water or well water) into steam to turn a turbine.

The maintenance on nuclear power is astronomically high. And reactors can not be turned off or turned on with a switch.
So backup safety systems are usually 3 deep in every system. Even with these safety systems massive disasters have caused several instances of last ditch efforts to stop things from becoming even worse disasters.

In Chernobyl they pumped concrete into spaces under the reactor core to keep it from burning through the bedrock.

In a few instances they pumped unfiltered seawater (for lack of any other water supply) into the system to try to cool things down.
Seawater creates hydrochloric acid which will destroy all seals and plumbing. The reactor cannot be salvaged when this happens.

Nuclear power on submarines and aircraft carriers is really a misnomer of sorts. Yes they produce electricity from these...but the reactors are sealed and fueled in such a way that when they "refuel" them they actually are taking the plutonium out and putting uranium in. The plutonium is used in bombs and satellites to do various things.

Again...super high maintenance and risk. Also "spent" rods are highly radioactive with very few places to send this waste and the unfiltered water that they must sit in.
 

JohnDB

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Does this take into consideration maintenance costs and/or electric rate increases or is it just the break even point for the initial investment at current electric rates?

Twenty years ago when I looked into it for my home I calculated it would take about 30 years or more just to recoup the initial investment. Of course, at that time I did not project the price increase in electricity from $.07 / kWh to $.105 / kWh within 10 years. I think the installation costs are lower today too, but that could be due to tax incentives. I suppose the technology has also improved in the last 20 years so that too has an impact on the ROI.

Location can also be a huge factor. I'm in central MN and the efficiency of the systems are not as good as they are in places like Arizona. We have more cloudy days, snow that can pile up on the collectors, and the low sun angle for about half the year.
In Minnesota there's no way Solar power would ever be profitable enough to generate sufficient power to bother with installing it.

Now wind power might actually work well enough for remote locations on a farm to perform various tasks (like pumping water or electricity generation) to make it feasible.

Things to remember are that it's best to be a "do it yourself" project from low cost materials. (Alternators bought at junkyards, marine batteries bought reconditioned, spare wood, steel, or aluminum laying about suitable for construction)
In Minnesota this system can and will pay off inside the five year mark for investment.. including the maintenance.

But again, it's the "knowing how", spare time, and cost of running power from existing supplies that determine the feasibility. You will have maintenance to perform on a windmill. Times to turn it "on or off" will be required to keep it from destroying itself.
 

HeIsRisen2018

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Math, science, and writing skills can help people to get a good job. That's the main attraction.


I can see how math and writing skills could help with that, but science to me is just fun. How can that help with getting a job? When do you use science? (On an ordinary job.)



I used to think this too but from my own experience in life it was surprising how many times something I learned in high school or even grade school suddenly appeared to help me along my life's journey. Don't underestimate what you learn in school or out of school. It's not forgotten. It is blended and mixed with everything else you learn in and out of school to give you a rounded out level of knowledge and be part of who you are. You also pick up learning skills (how to learn) in the process that also help you later in life.



Trust me, it's forgotten. I deliberately made a point of deleting things that absolutely had no interest to me and that I'll never use anyways in life so it wouldn't be clogging up my brain with things that I actually care about and will use in my lifetime.
 

Christ the King

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Uranium is usually "mined" by drilling a shaft and then pumping boric acid into the ground and then pumping the pregnant solution back out.
This solution is then processed to remove the uranium...and then refined a bit more.

Then the uranium 238 is blended with a bit of uranium 239 (from a breeder type reactor) and then layered over selenium rods.

This is just one rod... generally speaking you need a couple dozen of these rods for fission to occur which then heats absolutely pure water into steam which in turn heats more less pure water (usually river water or well water) into steam to turn a turbine.

The maintenance on nuclear power is astronomically high. And reactors can not be turned off or turned on with a switch.
So backup safety systems are usually 3 deep in every system. Even with these safety systems massive disasters have caused several instances of last ditch efforts to stop things from becoming even worse disasters.

In Chernobyl they pumped concrete into spaces under the reactor core to keep it from burning through the bedrock.

In a few instances they pumped unfiltered seawater (for lack of any other water supply) into the system to try to cool things down.
Seawater creates hydrochloric acid which will destroy all seals and plumbing. The reactor cannot be salvaged when this happens.

Nuclear power on submarines and aircraft carriers is really a misnomer of sorts. Yes they produce electricity from these...but the reactors are sealed and fueled in such a way that when they "refuel" them they actually are taking the plutonium out and putting uranium in. The plutonium is used in bombs and satellites to do various things.

Again...super high maintenance and risk. Also "spent" rods are highly radioactive with very few places to send this waste and the unfiltered water that they must sit in.
On second thought the Aussies should leave nuclear energy to the professionals cos they are likely to screw up probs... LoL...
I shouldn't say that but, we have a decent engineering background really and are capable of undertaking such a project if it was backed...

How about Tesla's claim that he could send power anywhere like we can send our phone and internet signals today? The smartest electrical guy I know thinks he was wrong about its potential. Do u agree or did Tesla know something that we still dont today?

Tesla did spend some time out west working on that technology. The financiers pulled the plug on him and the project was never completed. The genius inventor lacked a business, financial and economic understanding unfortunately. The government took all his work when he died so there is an air of mystery around Mr Tesla's work, his an intriguing scientist.

He has many curious quotes, one says that free power will never be allowed to enter the market.

Another famous quote I like came from Albert Einstein when asked how it felt to be the smartest man on earth he replied by saying he didn't know, to ask Nikola Tesla.

That's a profound statement I think. I try and picture the reaction of the reporter who asked him this... Like ummm ok then... LoL
 

JohnDB

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On second thought the Aussies should leave nuclear energy to the professionals cos they are likely to screw up probs... LoL...
I shouldn't say that but, we have a decent engineering background really and are capable of undertaking such a project if it was backed...

How about Tesla's claim that he could send power anywhere like we can send our phone and internet signals today? The smartest electrical guy I know thinks he was wrong about its potential. Do u agree or did Tesla know something that we still dont today?

Tesla did spend some time out west working on that technology. The financiers pulled the plug on him and the project was never completed. The genius inventor lacked a business, financial and economic understanding unfortunately. The government took all his work when he died so there is an air of mystery around Mr Tesla's work, his an intriguing scientist.

He has many curious quotes, one says that free power will never be allowed to enter the market.

Another famous quote I like came from Albert Einstein when asked how it felt to be the smartest man on earth he replied by saying he didn't know, to ask Nikola Tesla.

That's a profound statement I think. I try and picture the reaction of the reporter who asked him this... Like ummm ok then... LoL
Tesla was a smart guy when it came to electricity...but the truth was that he was more interested in frequencies than anything else...he just applied his knowledge of frequencies to electricity and solved a huge number of issues all at once.

His theories about sending electricity through the air? It scares people to death when it starts arcing about...it never would work.

But low frequencies to high frequencies can do a lot of things...resonant frequencies can tear things up or gradually add power. All a matter of determining what you want to do.

A simple, low power, low frequency generator can destroy a bridge if left alone long enough. (Drill motor would work)
Harmonics in circuitry destroys things like you wouldn't believe... especially electronics.

The thing about Tesla being silenced is that he was Russian...and after WWII the Cold War had begun.
 

Christ the King

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The thing about Tesla being silenced is that he was Russian...and after WWII the Cold War had begun.
Nikola Tesla was Serbian and died before the end of WW2 in America.
I don't think he was silenced. He made poor financial decisions after introducing AC power and could never really attracted much interest from investors after that. He lacked the business intuition that someone like Thomas Edison had and wasn't publishing books

What some people think is that his work, that became the property of the USA when he died, was withheld from the public. No one knows weather it's true or not apart from the government i guess.

A simple, low power, low frequency generator can destroy a bridge if left alone long enough. (Drill motor would work)
True, ive seen what resonant frequencies can do

His theories about sending electricity through the air? It scares people to death when it starts arcing about...it never would work.
It wouldn't work based on our understanding. Some people think he was onto something that we have yet to learn about. I don't know.

I know that our AC power supply is very much the same as it was when it was introduced. Electronics on the other hand has developed a lot in the last 20 years and doesn't look like reaching it's full potential for quite a while.

As with most service trades, electrician is a safe career for a young guy to peruse
 

Michael74

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I can see how math and writing skills could help with that, but science to me is just fun. How can that help with getting a job? When do you use science? (On an ordinary job.)
Science is useful in skilled trades. Hydraulics, pneumatic equipment, electricity, etc... all require a basic understanding of science. Supervisors at industrial plants need to understand the basic processes of how things are made at their plant.

If all someone wants to do is sweep the floor, they don't need to understand science. If they want a job where they make a bit of money, they should pay attention in their science classes. The more you know, the better your chances of getting a promotion.
 

JohnDB

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Science is useful in skilled trades. Hydraulics, pneumatic equipment, electricity, etc... all require a basic understanding of science. Supervisors at industrial plants need to understand the basic processes of how things are made at their plant.

If all someone wants to do is sweep the floor, they don't need to understand science. If they want a job where they make a bit of money, they should pay attention in their science classes. The more you know, the better your chances of getting a promotion.
Carpenters don't need an exorbitant amount of math...fractions and angles is about as far as they go.

Tin Knockers (HVAC) guys don't use a ton of math either. Square feet/cubic feet usually is as complicated as they get.

Plumbing/pipefitting.... same thing. Pressure and rise is all they use too... even the ones welding.

I'm not sure about guys hanging drywall...they don't speak a lot of English.

Painters are usually too drunk to do much figuring.
 
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