High and Ultra High Efficiency Furnaces

[Edward]

Do many or any members here have a high efficiency furnace or one of the so called Ultra-High Efficiency furnaces?

The HVAC industry is absolutely booming and going crazy right now. Now they have wireless thermostats (T-Stats) that can be installed that let you play with your furnace over your smart phone with an App. Some of these T-Stats can be registered with the manufacturer and then if it has a problem or a failure within the furnace system (or A/C) it will automatically send your HVAC company that installed it a text or email letting them know that your equipment is having a problem. Many times, the company will know about the problem and even what it is before the customer even realizes it.

I deal with these systems almost daily now. People seem to like them. Do any members here have such a system or TStat?

Do you like it? do you think it's really useful? If so, why? What is appealing about it to you? The more I have been learning about these systems and how to set them up, debug them and show the customer how to download updates and so forth...the more that I personally dislike them! Some of these TStats can even play music for you, and some have that Alexia computer girl that you can talk to. Technologically impressive I suppose, but again, why? Why would anyone actually want one of these systems?

I went to a training class for one of these systems this morning, and the factory rep took a lot of the vagueness out of the system and taught me some things which will be valuabe in my work, and he also let us in on some things that are coming but not here yety about them. Like, they are working on them being able for the customer to put up pictures from their phone onto the background of the TStat display. You an have a picture of your dog up there or your child or whatever. Another thing that is here already and just coming out is...a built in motion sensor in your TStat. If it doesn't sense any activity from people in the room for a period of time, it will put the furnace or A/C system into a setback mode and lower the temperature setting automatically. Would that appeal to anyone here?

I think it's stupid, it scares me and no way would I ever install such a TStat on my system. It is a frustration waiting to happen. Say the Tstat is in the living room...you and your wife are in the den or family room watching a movie. The motion sensor times out and sets the furnace temp down to 60 degrees. Soon your wife says, I'm getting chilly go check the TStat. So you walk into the living room and approach the TStat, it senses you before you get to it and turns the heat back up to an occupied setting. You look at the TStat, it seems normal. You go back and continue watching the movie...and it shuts down again...After that happens a few times the wife is going to say call someone to fix it. Then you get charged for someone to come out and tell you it's operating normally, that's how it is...

It's the stupidest thing I've ever seen in my life. Even if you go into the settings and turn off the motion sensor...what makes you think that it could not be turned on remotely since it is always online with your wifi? I think it is an intrusion just waiting to be abused.

He told us some other stuff that is coming too, but I dunno if we're supposed to talk about that stuff, lol.

What do you all think about this sort of stuff coming into the marketplace now?

 

[jasonc]

Do many or any members here have a high efficiency furnace or one of the so called Ultra-High Efficiency furnaces?

The HVAC industry is absolutely booming and going crazy right now. Now they have wireless thermostats (T-Stats) that can be installed that let you play with your furnace over your smart phone with an App. Some of these T-Stats can be registered with the manufacturer and then if it has a problem or a failure within the furnace system (or A/C) it will automatically send your HVAC company that installed it a text or email letting them know that your equipment is having a problem. Many times, the company will know about the problem and even what it is before the customer even realizes it.

I deal with these systems almost daily now. People seem to like them. Do any members here have such a system or TStat?

Do you like it? do you think it's really useful? If so, why? What is appealing about it to you? The more I have been learning about these systems and how to set them up, debug them and show the customer how to download updates and so forth...the more that I personally dislike them! Some of these TStats can even play music for you, and some have that Alexia computer girl that you can talk to. Technologically impressive I suppose, but again, why? Why would anyone actually want one of these systems?

I went to a training class for one of these systems this morning, and the factory rep took a lot of the vagueness out of the system and taught me some things which will be valuabe in my work, and he also let us in on some things that are coming but not here yety about them. Like, they are working on them being able for the customer to put up pictures from their phone onto the background of the TStat display. You an have a picture of your dog up there or your child or whatever. Another thing that is here already and just coming out is...a built in motion sensor in your TStat. If it doesn't sense any activity from people in the room for a period of time, it will put the furnace or A/C system into a setback mode and lower the temperature setting automatically. Would that appeal to anyone here?

I think it's stupid, it scares me and no way would I ever install such a TStat on my system. It is a frustration waiting to happen. Say the Tstat is in the living room...you and your wife are in the den or family room watching a movie. The motion sensor times out and sets the furnace temp down to 60 degrees. Soon your wife says, I'm getting chilly go check the TStat. So you walk into the living room and approach the TStat, it senses you before you get to it and turns the heat back up to an occupied setting. You look at the TStat, it seems normal. You go back and continue watching the movie...and it shuts down again...After that happens a few times the wife is going to say call someone to fix it. Then you get charged for someone to come out and tell you it's operating normally, that's how it is...

It's the stupidest thing I've ever seen in my life. Even if you go into the settings and turn off the motion sensor...what makes you think that it could not be turned on remotely since it is always online with your wifi? I think it is an intrusion just waiting to be abused.

He told us some other stuff that is coming too, but I dunno if we're supposed to talk about that stuff, lol.

What do you all think about this sort of stuff coming into the marketplace now?

You wouldnt like electric cars .push button shifting where you aren't engaging gears nor giving it gas.try a dead battery and you want to push that off the road .not happening .

I have had to align cars with the engine running to move it forward and back ,and turn the wheel.

 

[Edward]

You wouldnt like electric cars .push button shifting where you aren't engaging gears nor giving it gas.try a dead battery and you want to push that off the road .not happening .

I have had to align cars with the engine running to move it forward and back ,and turn the wheel.

Lol, I hear ya' Brother! I think the technology of what they're doing is impressive, but I just know in the core of my being that it is all Deep State based and intended to be intrusive and abused and that scares me about it. Motion sensors inside your house that is also on the internet constantly...I said something like that in that class and he said well all you have to do is turn it off (the motion sensor) in the Tstat settings...I said, oh ok but inside I was thinking yeah right like that will stop them!

Geez about a month or two ago I lost my phone. I had the insurance for it and they approved the claim, but said they don't have that model anymore so will send me an upgraded phone better than that one. I said ok and it arrived the next day! (wow!) but when I was setting it up, it asked me, Google wanted permission to turn my microphone on and off at will. I denied that permission. All of a sudden when I tried to use Google maps to GPS navigate around town (I have to, new to the area and have to find my way to customers houses), it would make an annoying chime sound every 60 seconds and a popup on the screen said to make Google GPS work right to turn on the microphone permission! ...and I'm tryoing to drive and chime chime and popups on the navigation scrteen which blocked my view of most of the map...they were trying to force me to let Google listen to me and stiuff. Oh that made me mad! And it is potentially dangerous to block the map on me while I am driving.

We went round and round about that. They tried to say tough for awhile so I said well then this replacement phone in unacceptable, take it back I paid fopr that insurance and do not want that so called upgrade phone.

It will never stop until Jesus comes back! They just keep pushing the spook stuff on us.
Boy oh boy, do I miss my old pager! L:ol.

Besides, wifi signals are bad for you and have been supposedly linked to cancer and tumors in people. Vids about it are all over youtube. I seen one vid where a guy had Alexia and it could control lights in his house and stuff....and in the video Alexia was turning lights on and off when He was telling her to shut them off and she was laughing at him! For real I think! I guess he could have staged the video, but somehow I dont think he did. This stuff is over the top!

 

[jasonc]

Lol, I hear ya' Brother! I think the technology of what they're doing is impressive, but I just know in the core of my being that it is all Deep State based and intended to be intrusive and abused and that scares me about it. Motion sensors inside your house that is also on the internet constantly...I said something like that in that class and he said well all you have to do is turn it off (the motion sensor) in the Tstat settings...I said, oh ok but inside I was thinking yeah right like that will stop them!

Geez about a month or two ago I lost my phone. I had the insurance for it and they approved the claim, but said they don't have that model anymore so will send me an upgraded phone better than that one. I said ok and it arrived the next day! (wow!) but when I was setting it up, it asked me, Google wanted permission to turn my microphone on and off at will. I denied that permission. All of a sudden when I tried to use Google maps to GPS navigate around town (I have to, new to the area and have to find my way to customers houses), it would make an annoying chime sound every 60 seconds and a popup on the screen said to make Google GPS work right to turn on the microphone permission! ...and I'm tryoing to drive and chime chime and popups on the navigation scrteen which blocked my view of most of the map...they were trying to force me to let Google listen to me and stiuff. Oh that made me mad! And it is potentially dangerous to block the map on me while I am driving.

We went round and round about that. They tried to say tough for awhile so I said well then this replacement phone in unacceptable, take it back I paid fopr that insurance and do not want that so called upgrade phone.

It will never stop until Jesus comes back! They just keep pushing the spook stuff on us.
Boy oh boy, do I miss my old pager! L:ol.

Besides, wifi signals are bad for you and have been supposedly linked to cancer and tumors in people. Vids about it are all over youtube. I seen one vid where a guy had Alexia and it could control lights in his house and stuff....and in the video Alexia was turning lights on and off when He was telling her to shut them off and she was laughing at him! For real I think! I guess he could have staged the video, but somehow I dont think he did. This stuff is over the top!

If they are ,as they cant penetrate my car outside my house in the driveway then so would be the local radio station that is miles away who I can lick up 60 miles away.

Please I'm not an radio guy but I do know the basics of electricity.am power cab fry you .so can FM,if you are that close.

 

[Michael74]

All of a sudden when I tried to use Google maps to GPS navigate around town!

I like to use a dedicated a GPS device in the vehicle. A voice tells me when to turn right at the next intersection.

I do use Google maps when I am at home though. To plan trips. I like that they have photos at street level. You check out the roads, landmarks near turns, and even whether there are things like a left turn signal at intersections to make turning easier.

 

[JohnDB]

The biggest portion of anyone's power and/or gas bill is generated by the air handler. (Furnace-air conditioner).

It consumes more juice than any other appliance in your home.

Regulating it to shut down seems efficient...but it really isn't. It takes time for a house to heat up or cool down. Ice cold walls but warm air...is still cold.

Better insulation in a home does a lot more than anything else.

I used to have one of the electronic tstats. It got confused every so often and had to be reset to factory settings. It was a pain.

And to be perfectly honest...I don't want to think about the heat/ac all that much. I got other things to worry about.

 

[Edward]

The biggest portion of anyone's power and/or gas bill is generated by the air handler. (Furnace-air conditioner).

It consumes more juice than any other appliance in your home.

Regulating it to shut down seems efficient...but it really isn't. It takes time for a house to heat up or cool down. Ice cold walls but warm air...is still cold.

Better insulation in a home does a lot more than anything else.

I used to have one of the electronic t stats. It got confused every so often and had to be reset to factory settings. It was a pain.

And to be perfectly honest...I don't want to think about the heat/ac all that much. I got other things to worry about.

That is true but these new variable speed blower motors that they are coming with now only pull about an 1.5 to 2 amps so they are cheaper to run, however...when it comes time to replace it you're looking at easily 500 bucks or more just for the motor. That guy from the class last Thursday told us that the regular type motors (PSC motors) are going to be going away in the marketplace so there will be no 100 dollar motor change outs any more. It takes special test equipment to diagnose these new variable speed motors (ECM motors) too. I have it but I don't know any homeowners who do.

As for the motion sensor shutting down the equipment, the default temp is sets back to is 60 degrees for heating and 80 deg for A/C. I'm not sure if these temps are adjustable or not yet, I would think they are but you never know.

Insulation is very expensive! I had a couple insulation outfits come give my house an evaluation and estimate for upgrading the insulation, and I don't think I am going to be hiring anyone else to do it so that will be a slow process for me, lol. I wanted to insulate the roofline of my attic so I can use the space (825 sq ft) but they both said they can't because of the old knob and tube wiring. So that's on my list too.

 

[Edward]

I used to have one of the electronic tstats. It got confused every so often and had to be reset to factory settings. It was a pain.

That is what it usually is when I get called out on one of these new tstats that does everything except make coffee. Or it has to be updated. They do not have the bugs worked out of these tstats yet. I am going to put up a new energy star rated tstat along with my furnace change out next week so I can get that rebate too, but after that it comes back down and a normal stat goes back up, lol.

That Carrier Infinity touch screen tstat is very problematic. I get those calls a lot! more so than any regular tstat.

 

[Edward]

I like to use a dedicated a GPS device in the vehicle. A voice tells me when to turn right at the next intersection.

I do use Google maps when I am at home though. To plan trips. I like that they have photos at street level. You check out the roads, landmarks near turns, and even whether there are things like a left turn signal at intersections to make turning easier.

I like Google maps. I do have a dedicated GPS too but it's old and needs updated and it wont update, I tried.

 

[Michael74]

Several studies indicated that real world savings from programmable thermostats are negligible. They work fine in unoccupied test homes. In the real world, people get cold when their walls are cold. Infrared light from walls does help to keep people warm. Many people wake up shivering at night, and turn the heat back on. A lot of people just can't sleep in a cold room. Especially the elderly.

Insulation along with an efficient HVAC system consistently produce savings. They just work, and people are comfortable.

 

[Michael74]

I like Google maps. I do have a dedicated GPS too but it's old and needs updated and it wont update, I tried.

If I remember right, Amazon sent me a new one for about $100 a couple of years ago.

Still, if Google works for you, that's fine too. I just like the voice telling me where to turn. A nice back up for the route I map out in advance from Google.