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Bible Study Is belief a work?

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John 6:29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent."

We see that belief is in fact a WORK and we can not be saved by the works of man....only GOD!

Ephesians 2:8 "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,"

It seems our Lord is telling us it is...how do you view 'the work of God?' Is Jesus saying belief is a work of God in the life of a sinner? I've been looking into the Greek meaning of the work 'faith' and found that it is translated as 'faithfulness.' 'Faithfulness' in it's root form, 'faith' is listed as a gift of the Holy Spirit, any thoughts?
 
Christ also tells us to take up our crosses, to leave all our old lives behind and to follow Him or we have no part in Him.

We don't save ourselves, but we do receive the promise of God when we accept and follow Christ.
 
Jason said:
John 6:29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent."
  • John 10:25 Jesus answered them, " I told you, and you do not believe; the works that I do in My Father's name, these testify of Me. 26 "But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep. 27 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28 and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand. NASU w/emphasis supplied
Just because a person calls him/herself a "christian" does not mean they believe
according to the word of God. A mental assent is not enough. Belief, repentance,
and faith is/are God's work in each and every child God receives into His family.

Jason said:
Ephesians 2:8 "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,"

It seems our Lord is telling us it is...how do you view 'the work of God?' Is Jesus saying belief is a work of God in the life of a sinner? I've been looking into the Greek meaning of the work 'faith' and found that it is translated as 'faithfulness.' 'Faithfulness' in it's root form, 'faith' is listed as a gift of the Holy Spirit, any thoughts?
  • Isaiah 64:8 But now, O LORD, You are our Father,
    We are the clay, and You our potter;
    And all of us are the work of Your hand
    . NASU
Belief, faith, grace is/are all a 'gift' from God. As said by Isaiah,
we are the work of Your hand.

DIME Ministries, while we are bidden to take up our cross, we learn that this
is not something we are able to do. In repentance, faith and belief, God will work
this cross-bearing in and through us, as the CLAY in the hands of the potter,
all according to His 'good pleasure'.
  • Philippians 2:13 for it is God who is at work in you, both to will
    and to work for His good pleasure
    . NASU
......Restin
 
Restin said:
DIME Ministries, while we are bidden to take up our cross, we learn that this
is not something we are able to do. In repentance, faith and belief, God will work
this cross-bearing in and through us, as the CLAY in the hands of the potter,
all according to His 'good pleasure'.
  • Philippians 2:13 for it is God who is at work in you, both to will
    and to work for His good pleasure
    . NASU
......Restin
So you are suggesting that God commands us to do something that is impossible?

Why does God not command us to not drink a glass of water while standing in the middle of the sun?
 
Jason wrote:
We see that belief is in fact a WORK and we can not be saved by the works of man....only GOD!
Add to that as well, baptism is the work of God (Colossians 2:12) and not our work as many like to teach. Then again, didn't Jesus say something about faith and baptism (Mark 16:16). :o
 
DIME Ministries said:
Restin said:
DIME Ministries, while we are bidden to take up our cross, we learn that this
is not something we are able to do. In repentance, faith and belief, God will work
this cross-bearing in and through us, as the CLAY in the hands of the potter,
all according to His 'good pleasure'.
  • Philippians 2:13 for it is God who is at work in you, both to will
    and to work for His good pleasure
    . NASU
......Restin
So you are suggesting that God commands us to do something that is impossible?

And just what is "impossible" exactly?
 
Adams son said:
And just what is "impossible" exactly?
My point is that why would God command us to do something if He alone is the One responsible for it getting done.

That would be contradictory to His nature.
 
DIME Ministries said:
[quote="Adams son":54a45]And just what is "impossible" exactly?
My point is that why would God command us to do something if He alone is the One responsible for it getting done.

That would be contradictory to His nature.[/quote:54a45]

He alone is responsible for getting what done? What is it exactly that is impossible for us to do?
 
Adams son said:
He alone is responsible for getting what done? What is it exactly that is impossible for us to do?
OK, we aren't on the same page here.

I think that Jason is saying that God is the sole reason we are saved and that our salvation is predetermined. I disagree with this based upon many factors, the main being Scripture, with logic behind that.

If our salvation is determined, then why would Peter command the people to "repent and be baptized" in order to receive for forgivenss of sins and to receive the Holy Spirit?

That would be instructing them to do something that they are incapable of doing.
 
One repents when they are set free.

Only those who are of God HEAR God, see John 6 if you don't believe me. Jesus tells us with His own words yet folks deny, deny, deny. You can't hear God's word unless you are of God...Jesus said it.
 
That intrepretation of that single passage contradicts the rest of the teaching in the Bible, so we must reject it in favor of a more clear teaching.
 
DIME Ministries said:
That intrepretation of that single passage contradicts the rest of the teaching in the Bible, so we must reject it in favor of a more clear teaching.

You believe the Bible to teach otherwise?

John 1:12-13 born (again) not by man's will, but God's

John 3:3-8 flesh begets flesh -Spirit begets Spirit wind/Spirit blows
where it will

Titus 3:5 according to his mercy - washing of regeneration

1 Peter 1:3 Begotten according to God's mercy

1 Peter 1:23 Born of incorruptible seed by Word of God

1 John 5:4 Born of God

Deuteronomy 30:6 Lord himself circumcises our hearts

Ezekiel 36:26-27 The Lord gives anew heart and enables by his Spirit

Galatians 6:15 Nothing we can do avails - only becoming a new creature

Ephesians 2:10 We are created unto good works

2 Corinthians 5:17-18 We are new creations - old passed, new come

John 5:21 The Son quickens whom he will

Ephesians 2:1,5 Quickened who were dead

Colossians 2:13 dead in sins; quickened by Christ

Matthew 11:25-27 hid from wise - revealed to whom Christ will

Luke 10:21 same as above

Matthew 13:10-11 Given to some to understand - others are hardened.

Luke 8:10 same as above

Matthew 16:15-17 flesh and blood did not reveal -special blessedness

John 6:37 all the Father gives shall come

John 6:44 No man can come except the Father draw him; and Christ will
raise up

John 6:45 everyone who has learned (been disciple) from the Father
comes

John 6:64 Jesus knew from the beginning

John 6:65 no man can come

1 Corinthians 2:14 natural man cannot know spiritual things

Ephesians 1:17-18 God gives spirit of wisdom - eyes of the understanding
enlightened.

Acts 5:31 Jesus gives repentance to Israel

Acts 11:18 God has also granted repentance to the Gentiles

Acts 13:48 As many as were ordained to eternal life believed

Acts 16:14 The Lord opened Lydia's heart

Acts 18:27 believed through grace

Ephesians 2:8-9 faith a gift of god

Philippians 1:29 it is given to us to believe

2 Timothy 2:25-26 God may give repentance to the acknowledging of the
truth! Previously captive to devil at his will Romans 1:6-7 the called of
Jesus Christ = beloved of God

Romans 8:30 predestinated then called then justified then glorified

Romans 9:23-24 prepared for glory, then called.

1 Corinthians 1:1 called to be an apostle by God's will

1 Corinthians 1:9 called by God the faithful

1 Corinthians 1:23-31 not may wise, etc.

Galatians 1:15-16 Paul called when it please God

Ephesians 4:4 Those in the body called in hope

2 Timothy 1:9 called according to his purpose and grace

Hebrews 9:15 called; receive the inheritance

Jude 1 sanctified - persevered - called

1 Peter 1:15 calling - holy

1 Peter 2:9 called from darkness to light

1 Peter 5:10 called to eternal glory

2 Peter 1:3 given us all things ... hat called

Revelations 17:14 those with Christ are called, chosen, faithful

Isaiah 55:11 God's word accomplishes what he pleases

John 3:27 nothing received except from heaven

John 17:2 gave eternal life to as many as thou hast given

Romans 9:16 not of him that willeth or runneth

1 Corinthians 3:6-7 it is God who gives increase

1 Corinthians 4:7 who makes you to differ? cannot glory!

Philippians 2:12-13 God works in you both to will and to do

James 1:18 of his own will begat he us

1 John 5:20 Son of God gave us understanding

John 17:6 Christ manifested himself to those the Father gave him out
of the world.

2 Timothy 3:15; Hebrews 4:12-13; Hebrews 10:16; Hebrews 12:2;
Hebrews 13:21

God Controls "Nature"

"Thus saith the Lord, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar: The Lord of Hosts is His name" (Jeremiah 31:35)

"By the breath of God frost is given: and the breadth of the waters is straitened. Also by watering he wearieth the thick cloud: he scattereth his bright cloud: And it is turned about by His counsels: that they may do whatsoever He commandeth them upon the face of the whole world in the earth. He causeth it to come, whether for correction, or for His land, or for mercy" (Job 37:10-13)

"For yet seven days, and I will cause it to rain upon the earth forty days and forty nights; and every living substance that I have made will I destroy from off the face of the earth". (Genesis 7:4)

God determines the length of your life

"All the days ordained (set apart) for me were written in your book before one of them came to be"
(Psalm 139"16)

"Is there not an appointed time to man upon earth? Are not his days also like the days of an hireling?" (Job 7:1)

"Man that is born of a woman is of few days, and full of trouble...Seeing his days are determenied, the number of his months are with thee, thou hast appointed his boundes that he cannot pass" (Job 14:1, 5)

God controls your steps

"A man's heart deviseth his way: but the Lord directeth his steps" (Proverbs 16:9)

Gods control in regards to our hearts

Above when Solomon said "A mans heart deviseth his way, but the Lord directeth his steps", it must be noted the this verse cannot have been meant as a blanket statement over every single affair in our lives, (at least in regards to the heart that is). For upon my studies concerning the extent of Gods control in the affairs of men, I realized that the Bible explicitly teaches that God also has control of the heart. Sometimes it is not the man's heart who divises his way. Sometimes it is God who divises the ways of the mans heart and then He also controls mans steps on top of that.

"And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall the , and shall make her desolate and , and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil His will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled." (Revelation 17:16-17)

"And the Lord said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: But I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go" (Exodus 4:21)

"And I will give them an heart to know me, that I am the Lord: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God: For they shall be my people, for they shall return unto me with their whole heart" (Jeremiah 24:6-7)

"But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people" (Jeremiah 31:33)

"And a certain woman named Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, which worshipped God, heard us: whose heart the Lord opened, that she attended unto those things which were spoken of Paul" (Acts 16:14)

God controls all things

"In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purposes of Him who worketh all things after the counsel of His own will"
(Ephesians 1:11)

Consider:
1. Who takes the initiative in working our salvation?
2. How are we brought to faith? Does the Lord use people as His instruments to accomplish His purpose?
3. Who determines where the gospel will be preached? Will everyone hear it before Christ returns?
4. What is true and living faith?
5. If the case of unbelief lies in man, why can we not say that the cause of faith also lies in man?
6. Define the terms 'predestination' and 'election.' (http://www.bible.crosswalk.com)
7. Are we free to live the way we want? Can we choose? Keeping in mind we are dead in our sin.
8. Why do some accept God and others do not if we as people are all equal in our sin?
9. Why pray to God for the salvation of a lost soul if it's up to that lost person?

Even when Jesus himself makes a statement so clear as to say, 'you cannot hear God because you are not of God' you still deny the teaching for your tradition. But as Jesus also tells us in the same passage, John6:60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it? 61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you? 62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before? 63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. 64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him. 65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
 
DIME Ministries said:
[quote="Adams son":f415f]He alone is responsible for getting what done? What is it exactly that is impossible for us to do?
OK, we aren't on the same page here.

I think that Jason is saying that God is the sole reason we are saved and that our salvation is predetermined. I disagree with this based upon many factors, the main being Scripture, with logic behind that.

If our salvation is determined, then why would Peter command the people to "repent and be baptized" in order to receive for forgivenss of sins and to receive the Holy Spirit?

That would be instructing them to do something that they are incapable of doing.[/quote:f415f]

Ah I see. Yes, it seems that Calvinists, who love to serve that particular creedal idol, very often cannot see the forest for the trees.
 
Believing, the work of God

Jason said:
Even when Jesus himself makes a statement so clear as to say, 'you cannot hear God because you are not of God' you still deny the teaching for your tradition. But as Jesus also tells us in the same passage, John6:60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it? 61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you? 62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before? 63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. 64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him. 65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
Jason, Appreciate all the verses you gave. Sometime ago I did some
research on ignorance, which includes blindness. Many people are full of
unbelief, basically because of their ignorance. That is why God is the judge
and not man. Paul talks about his ignorance in 1 Timothy 1:13.
Similarly, The scripture speaks of being 'blind'.

Unbelief, ignorance, blindness are different aspects of a similar condition.
I read the Bible through completely several times, not understanding that the
scriptures was talking about ME, when talking about being full of unbelief,
ignorant, blind, etc. I always pinned those qualities on "those" who did not
read, study the Bible. Now God has given me to see that this is ME in the flesh!
  • Isaiah 42:16 "I will lead the blind by a way they do not know,
    In paths they do not know I will guide them. I will make darkness
    into light before them And rugged places into plains. These are the things
    I will do, And I will not leave them undone."

    John 9:41 Jesus said to them, " If you were blind, you would have no sin;
    but since you say, ' We see,' your sin remains
    .

    Acts 3:17 "And now, brethren, I know that you acted in ignorance,
    just as your rulers did also. 18 "But the things which God
    announced beforehand by the mouth of all the prophets, that His Christ
    would suffer, He has thus fulfilled
    .

    Romans 8:7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God;
    for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able
    to do so, 8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

    Luke 23:33 When they came to the place called The Skull, there they
    crucified Him and the criminals, one on the right and the other on the left.
    34 But Jesus was saying, " Father, forgive them; for they do not know
    what they are doing
    ."

    Revelation 3:17-18 'Because you say, " I am rich, and have become
    wealthy, and have need of nothing," and you do not know that you
    are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked,

    Hosea 5:15 I will go away and return to My place Until they
    acknowledge their guilt and seek My face; In their affliction they will
    earnestly seek Me
    .

    NASU, w/emphasis supplied
Conclusion:
In the flesh my acknowledgement, and confession is that I am full of 'unbelief'.
In the spirit, God is the judge. Thus, my prayer is like the father's plea
mentioned in Mark 9:24 I do believe; help my unbelief.

.......Restin
 
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