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JLB discusses speaking in tongues

Randy

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Let’s walk through this line upon line.


And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. John 20:22



At this point, did they have the Spirit of Christ in them?




JLB
On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you.

But very truly I tell you, it is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.

Acts 2 the meaning
Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. This promise belongs to you and to your children and to all who are far off, to all whom the Lord our God will call to Himself.”

The Spirit came on Cornelius while Peter was speaking. Clearly Cornelius had not yet received the Spirit of Christ before that event.

While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. 45 The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles. 46 For they heard them speaking in tongues and praising God.

The speaking in tongues was outward signs given not the importance. The importance was Christ in them as in a new creation.
 

JLB

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On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you.

But very truly I tell you, it is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.

Acts 2 the meaning
Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. This promise belongs to you and to your children and to all who are far off, to all whom the Lord our God will call to Himself.”

The Spirit came on Cornelius while Peter was speaking. Clearly Cornelius had not yet received the Spirit of Christ before that event.

While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. 45 The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles. 46 For they heard them speaking in tongues and praising God.

The speaking in tongues was outward signs given not the importance. The importance was Christ in them as in a new creation.


Let me know when your ready to answer my question?



And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. John 20:22



At this point, did they have the Spirit of Christ in them?





JLB
 

StoveBolts

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Why would Paul ask this, if we automatically were baptized with the Holy Spirit when we believed?


Can a person be baptized with the Holy Spirit before they are born again?




JLB
I understand this is not directed toward me, but I felt compelled to respond if that is ok with you.

When I read the stories that surround the passages you quote, I see each of them as an individual story on how God was moving in their lives.

In Jewish thought, I AM can mean, "I will be who you need me to be". Please note, it does not mean God will be who we want him to be and there is a big difference that is hopefully obvious but if not, I can explain in greater detail at another time.

According to many passages, including Romans 12, God has given us each a different measure of faith, and Paul reminds us of the grace God has granted him.

Not every conversion looks like Pauls conversion. I was not blinded, not did scales fall off my eyes when I came out of the baptismal, and I suspect the same is true for you and many others.

Because we each have different gifts and talents, God will move in our lives differently. God will be who we need him to be in a given circumstance, and we don't all share the same circumstance. As a result, we will experience things differently because God is working differently in each of our lives.

When we try to narrow down God to a set of narrowed down axioms and expect everyone to be uniform in every detail, it can get really messy. Some say you have to be baptized, some say you have to speak in tongues, and even some say you need to pick up deadly snakes.

As each of us are a member of the Body of Christ, that is, The Church, we each have different experiences which shape our views because God is working differently in each of our lives.
 

Randy

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Let me know when your ready to answer my question?



And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. John 20:22



At this point, did they have the Spirit of Christ in them?





JLB
To me.
On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you.

A prescription was not given by the Apostles for those born of God to seek another baptism from God.

Randy
 

JLB

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I understand this is not directed toward me, but I felt compelled to respond if that is ok with you.

When I read the stories that surround the passages you quote, I see each of them as an individual story on how God was moving in their lives.

In Jewish thought, I AM can mean, "I will be who you need me to be". Please note, it does not mean God will be who we want him to be and there is a big difference that is hopefully obvious but if not, I can explain in greater detail at another time.

According to many passages, including Romans 12, God has given us each a different measure of faith, and Paul reminds us of the grace God has granted him.

Not every conversion looks like Pauls conversion. I was not blinded, not did scales fall off my eyes when I came out of the baptismal, and I suspect the same is true for you and many others.

Because we each have different gifts and talents, God will move in our lives differently. God will be who we need him to be in a given circumstance, and we don't all share the same circumstance. As a result, we will experience things differently because God is working differently in each of our lives.

When we try to narrow down God to a set of narrowed down axioms and expect everyone to be uniform in every detail, it can get really messy. Some say you have to be baptized, some say you have to speak in tongues, and even some say you need to pick up deadly snakes.

As each of us are a member of the Body of Christ, that is, The Church, we each have different experiences which shape our views because God is working differently in each of our lives.

Thank goodness we have the New Testament and the words of Jesus and His Apostles that left us a testimony of things that are the truth.


The truth is something that is unchanging.

It is something that many people, especially those who are liberal minded, tend to write off as outdated, and unable to keep up with the ever changing progressive culture that we live in.


While I agree with some of what you are saying, I don’t agree that Gods plan for us is different for each person when it comes to salvation, baptism or the teachings of Christ.


We all are called to obey the truth, and walk in the truth, which is how unity is achieved.


Here is what Jesus said those who believe, will have as signs that follow or testify or give evidence to validate the authenticity of their believing.



He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; they will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.” Mark 16:16-18


Maybe like Paul we won’t ever have the need to shake off a deadly poisonous snake that bit us.


Maybe we won’t ever have the opportunity to be poisoned and be miraculously saved from death.


My main point is make people aware that there is the Baptism of the Holy Spirit that is available for all of God’s children, and is referred to as the promise of the Father.


And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” Acts 1:4-5


The baptism with the Holy Spirit is for all believers.





JLB
 

StoveBolts

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Thank goodness we have the New Testament and the words of Jesus and His Apostles that left us a testimony of things that are the truth.


The truth is something that is unchanging.

It is something that many people, especially those who are liberal-minded, tend to write off as outdated, and unable to keep up with the ever changing progressive culture that we live in.


While I agree with some of what you are saying, I don’t agree that Gods plan for us is different for each person when it comes to salvation, baptism or the teachings of Christ.


We all are called to obey the truth and walk in the truth, which is how unity is achieved.


Here is what Jesus said those who believe, will have as signs that follow or testify or give evidence to validate the authenticity of their believing.



He who believes and is baptized will be saved, but he who does not believe will be condemned. And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name, they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; they will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.” Mark 16:16-18


Maybe like Paul, we won’t ever have the need to shake off a deadly poisonous snake that bit us.


Maybe we won’t ever have the opportunity to be poisoned and be miraculously saved from death.


My main point is to make people aware that there is the Baptism of the Holy Spirit that is available for all of God’s children and is referred to as the promise of the Father.


And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” Acts 1:4-5


The baptism with the Holy Spirit is for all believers.





JLB
I can't say I disagree with anything you've written.
My point was simply this.

We all have a different measure of faith given to us by our Abba Father just as we have all been granted a gift according to the grace each of us has been given. Please read Romans 12:3-8

God will be who we need him to be. He is our shepherd.

Some will speak in tongues, others will not. Some will receive the Holy Spirit prior to baptism while others will receive the Holy Spirit during their baptism. Still, yet, others will receive the Holy Spirit after their baptism.

God will be God and He has had His Word recorded for our benefit. Each piece of scripture that you have posted has a story behind it. When we narrow Gods word down to simple text, we lose the narrative and sometimes, we create our own narrative.

I understand that you and I think differently because we see things differently. Each of us has Christ in us and how that happened is unique to each of us because we each have a different story and depending on our story, the biblical narrative will have a pull on our spirit where the story resonates and speaks to us. This often is where we become obedient to Gods word where it's applicable to us because each of us struggles with different sins in different areas of our life.

Where we. Go awry is when we detach the text from the story.

In part, the way I comprehend unity is like this. Unity is understanding that Christ is in us and our brothers. It's about understanding we each have a different measure of faith given us as well as grace granted us. To whome little is given, little is expected. To him who has been given much, much is expected.
 
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dianegcook

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Just my thoughts on tongues.
I did 't read all the posts, so excuse me, if it has been repeated.

First..
John 6:44
No man can come to Me, except the Father which hath sent Me, draw him....
I believe the Spirit draws them...
You have the Spirit, because it convicts you.

The Pentecostal tongues....
Notice in Acts 2:6
Every man heard them speak in his own language.
No need for an interpreter ....down to the very dialect, southern slang, Yankee, British...

The unknown tongue...
1Cor.14:2
For He that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not to men, but unto God..
1Cor.14:5
For greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret ...

Needs an interpreter....unlike the Pentecostal tongues...

1Cor.14:13
Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret.
1Cor.14:16-18
Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say, Amen, seeing He understandeth not what thou sayest?
If you go to Mexico, preaching, and speaking English, those whom do not speak English , will not understand you.
Paul knew many languages.

1Cor.14:21
In the law it is written, with men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people...

1Cor.14:28
But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church...

Now..This will be Pentecostal tongue..
Mark 13:11
When they deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither premeditate ...but what so ever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye, for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Spirit.

Luke 21:12-15
Delivered up for My Name's SAKE..
Shall turn to you for a Testimony..
Settle it therefore in your hearts, not to meditate,before ye answer:
For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which ALL your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist...

My belief, if anyone cares, lol.
 

JLB

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We all have a different measure of faith given to us by our Abba Father just as we have all been granted a gift according to the grace each of us has been given. Please read Romans 12:3-8

God will be who we need him to be. He is our shepherd.

Some will speak in tongues, others will not. Some will receive the Holy Spirit prior to baptism while others will receive the Holy Spirit during their baptism. Still, yet, others will receive the Holy Spirit after their baptism.

Ok.

I see your point.

Hopefully you can see mine.


Do you believe that God has called some to be baptized into Christ by the Spirit, while others are called to be baptized in water, while still others are called to be baptized with the Holy Spirit?


I don’t.


I see that the Promise of the Father, the baptism with the Holy Spirit, is for all, not just some.


For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” Acts 2:39


The three baptisms are for all of the Church.


Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea, all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, 1 Corinthians 10:1-2


  • all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea,

JLB
 

StoveBolts

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Ok.

I see your point.

Hopefully you can see mine.


Do you believe that God has called some to be baptized into Christ by the Spirit, while others are called to be baptized in water, while still others are called to be baptized with the Holy Spirit?


I don’t.


I see that the Promise of the Father, the baptism with the Holy Spirit, is for all, not just some.


For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” Acts 2:39


The three baptisms are for all of the Church.


Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea, all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, 1 Corinthians 10:1-2


  • all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea,
JLB
I don't limit the Holy Spirit... Not to say you are, but others do.

And yes, I understand what you have been saying.
Ephesians 4:5-6 King James Version (KJV)
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
 
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Nathan12

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We need the power of the Holy Spirit to do this.
The indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit implies that His power is always there.

TITUS 2
11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
 

JLB

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The indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit implies that His power is always there.

TITUS 2
11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

This is the result of being filled, baptized with the Holy Spirit.


So Jesus said to them again, “Peace to you! As the Father has sent Me, I also send you.” And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. John 20:22


Here the disciples received the Holy Spirit.


Afterward, they were filled with the Holy Spirit.


And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. Acts 2:4





JLB
 

JLB

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I don't limit the Holy Spirit... Not to say you are, but others do.

And yes, I understand what you have been saying.
Ephesians 4:5-6 King James Version (KJV)
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

If a person rejects the baptism with the Holy Spirit, isn’t that limiting the work of the Holy Spirit?


I guess I don’t really understand what you mean by your remark -
“I don’t limit the Holy Spirit”.


It seems you are saying there isn’t a baptism with the Holy Spirit.


These three are one.


I have shared many times about the three baptism’s.


Here are two mentioned by Jesus in one verse.



for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” Acts 1:5


Both of these come after we are born again, and baptized into Christ by the Holy Spirit. (1 Corinthians 12:13)



JLB
 

ezra

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just out of curiosty what would you say about those who have never spoke in tongues ? do they have the power ? next was ahnds laid on you for you to get the Holy Spirit .

what advanatge is there to speaking in tongues vs those who have never . like a buddy mine at work said pentecostals had more jesus in them than the baptist . which in not true .. you have as much jesus and as much spirit as you want
 

StoveBolts

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If a person rejects the baptism with the Holy Spirit, isn’t that limiting the work of the Holy Spirit?


I guess I don’t really understand what you mean by your remark -
“I don’t limit the Holy Spirit”.


It seems you are saying there isn’t a baptism with the Holy Spirit.


These three are one.


I have shared many times about the three baptism’s.


Here are two mentioned by Jesus in one verse.



for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” Acts 1:5


Both of these come after we are born again, and baptized into Christ by the Holy Spirit. (1 Corinthians 12:13)



JLB
Odd, I wonder why you hear me saying something I don't believe...
Was it something I didn't say that you were expecting me to say? What would you want to hear so you wouldn't misunderstand me better?
 
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JLB

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what advanatge is there to speaking in tongues vs those who have never .

Building yourself up on your most holy faith.



JLB
 

JLB

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Odd, I wonder why you hear me saying something I don't believe...

I just asked a question.


I honestly don’t know what you believe or don’t believe.



JLB
 

JLB

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Odd, I wonder why you hear me saying something I don't believe...
Was it something I didn't say that you were expecting me to say? What would you want to hear so you wouldn't misunderstand me better?

You have watched my post what I believe with the scriptures, yet you never comment one way or another.


Maybe now would be the time for you to openly express what you believe.


Let’s start by a simple question and hopefully you will just give a simple answer.


Do you believe their are 3 distinct baptisms?


for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.” Acts 1:5




JLB
 

ezra

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Building yourself up on your most holy faith.



JLB
not what the Bible says it does say praying in the Holy ghost which i dont see as tongues
 

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