What's new
  • Do not use Chrome Incognito when registering as it freezes the registration page.
  • Guest, Random Acts of Kindness week starts February 11 and culminates with the Random Acts Of Kindness Day on February the 17th. Find out more to be a part of this fantastic day! -->Lucian Hodoboc's Blog and Random Acts of Kindess Blog
  • Guest, Join Papa Zoom today for some uplifting biblical encouragement! --> Daily Verses
  • No longer will OSAS vx OSNAS be allowed to be debated, argued, or discussed in theology forum. Too much time is required to monitor and rescources used to debate this subject which hasn't been definitively decided in 3,000 years.

Bible Study Mary's Choice

Status
Not open for further replies.

wondering

Supporter
Joined
Dec 26, 2015
Messages
11,596
Gender
Female
Did Mary choose to become the Mother of the Son of God
or was she predestined to become Jesus' mother?

The answer could be based on whatever you deem to be important.
I'd say that the main answer is in Luke 1:26-38
 
Joined
Feb 4, 2018
Messages
2,237
Gender
Male
Mary and Joseph went to Bethlehem because Joseph (Mary too) were of the house AND line of David. I think the two genealogies were explained by Mary in the early church and that is ultimately how they got into the two gospels. Joseph and Mary were not simple unaware village dwellers. They knew that they were direct descendent of King David. Mary's response is that if intelligence and a deep knowing of God.
 
Joined
Sep 30, 2014
Messages
1,897
Gender
Female
God chose her.

John 15:16 You did not choose me, but I chose you and appointed you to go and bear fruit - fruit that will last.

Now, Jesus was speaking to believers in him..................but Mary was chosen to bear the ultimate fruit that will last (her Son/God's Son)
 

HeIsRisen2018

Summer Rose (Methodist and New J.C Hammer lol)
Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2017
Messages
10,501
Gender
Female
Well,.. my understanding from the story is simply this. God had already chosen Mary to bring Jesus into the world. However, I don't believe that the angel Gabriel had left Mary's side until she replied with something like; "Let it be done according to your word." So that leads me to believe that Mary had a free choice to say no. If she had, I'm sure that God would have chosen somebody else but since the Lord already knows everything He knew that she was going to agree to raise Jesus as her own and at the same time be honored to. Another thing is that since God never tries to interfere with free will, I really don't believe that He would impregnate her against her own will. That would be contradicting Himself and He never does that and I bet that He has a real problem with people that do. (you know what I mean)
 

HeIsRisen2018

Summer Rose (Methodist and New J.C Hammer lol)
Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2017
Messages
10,501
Gender
Female
The birth death and Resurrection of Christ was not by chance.



Agreed. As I stated before. God has a plan for everything and He already was well aware of what Mary's answer would be. I was just simply stating that I believe that that doesn't mean that she didn't have a free choice. God specifically forcing Mary to be Jesus' mother would be just like forcing the rest of the world to follow Him which He does not. We were all given the free choice to follow Him and if Mary really didn't want to be the one to do it I think He would have chosen another woman to be His mother but like I said. He already knew that she wanted to.
 
Joined
Sep 30, 2014
Messages
1,897
Gender
Female
Jeremiah 17:10 "I the Lord search the heart and examine the mind, to reward a man according to his conduct, according to what his deeds deserve."

So God wanted the perfect candidate for bringing his child into the world. This is why he chose her
She says is Luke 1:38 "I am the Lord's servant" Her heart was humble.
 
Joined
Jun 1, 2015
Messages
2,515
Christian
Yes
Jeremiah 17:10 "I the Lord search the heart and examine the mind, to reward a man according to his conduct, according to what his deeds deserve."

So God wanted the perfect candidate for bringing his child into the world. This is why he chose her
She says is Luke 1:38 "I am the Lord's servant" Her heart was humble.
That and the fact that her linage was that through the Davidic Royal Heritage.
 

HeIsRisen2018

Summer Rose (Methodist and New J.C Hammer lol)
Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2017
Messages
10,501
Gender
Female
That and the fact that her linage was that through the Davidic Royal Heritage.


Hmm...that's funny. I don't remember anything about that being in the Bible. :confusedOf course since maybe that part has no to little importance in serving to the story that Jesus was considered royal (king of kings) even before He was conceived, I might have simply forgotten that part.
 
R

Runner

Guest
I would say neither. To say Mary was predestined would minimize her exceptional goodness and render senseless the angel's statement that she had "found favor" with God. To say that she had a choice would render senseless the angel's statement "And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son, and you shall name Him Jesus." He didn't say, "If you agree." My understanding has always been that God determined, on the basis of her lineage and the life she had led to that point, that she was the most worthy candidate to bear His Son ("found favor") and, through the angel, informed her of what would take place ("you will ... you shall"). Given the circumstances (a pious Jewish woman confronted by an angel of God), the concept of "choice" really doesn't fit. It's inconceivable (is that a pun?) that in those circumstances Mary would have said "Well, maybe, but give me a couple of days to think about it." When she said "may it be done to me according to your word," she was not agreeing but simply saying something in the nature of "thy will be done" or "amen."
 

wondering

Supporter
Joined
Dec 26, 2015
Messages
11,596
Gender
Female
I have to agree with those that said that Mary was chosen.
In Luke 1:31 the Angel Gabriel, who was the angel that brought all the important messages from God, told Mary that she was to bear a son and even told her what she would name Him,,,Jesus. As Runner said, she was not given a choice.

So how does free will fit into this?
That would go to what Runner and Christ_empowered stated. God knew she would say yes. He prepared her and she, by her own free will, lived a life pleasing to God, and He chose her to be the mother of the Son.

Her lineage was also very important since the Messiah had to come from the line of David. As per Douglas Summers statement.

LovethroughDove in post 8 also made interesting comments.

At the end of it all, I'd have to say that God chose Mary, prepared her for her role, and she also willingly said yes to Angel Gabriel.

God certainly works in mysterious ways.

Luke 1:38 shows us that we are to say yes to God, and to allow Him to use us as He might. 1:39 "Mary arose and went with haste"...how often do we put off what God would want us to do?
 

HeIsRisen2018

Summer Rose (Methodist and New J.C Hammer lol)
Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2017
Messages
10,501
Gender
Female
many are called, few are chosen.

I think God selected Mary before she was even born, personally.



That would make sense. God has numbered every hair upon our heads. I would bet anything that He knows all of our destinies since He really knows all and sees all.
 

Allen Wynne

Member
Joined
Nov 23, 2012
Messages
12,406
Gender
Male
Hmm...that's funny. I don't remember anything about that being in the Bible. :confusedOf course since maybe that part has no to little importance in serving to the story that Jesus was considered royal (king of kings) even before He was conceived, I might have simply forgotten that part.
Every word in the Bible is important.
Don't skip any of it.
You will grow in your knowledge and wisdom and faith by reading all of it all the time.
 

HeIsRisen2018

Summer Rose (Methodist and New J.C Hammer lol)
Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2017
Messages
10,501
Gender
Female
I'm sorry but I must disagree with you on that one. A lot of things that happened in the Bible (like not being able to eat pork and getting tattoos) serve no real purpose today. The fact that Jesus humbled Himself as a human baby and died on the cross for our sins and then rose again three years later is a lot more important than what His mother's heritage line was imho.
 
R

Runner

Guest
So how does free will fit into this?
That would go to what Runner and @Christ_empowered stated. God knew she would say yes. He prepared her and she, by her own free will, lived a life pleasing to God, and He chose her to be the mother of the Son.
I think that's basically right. God's foreknowledge as to the kind of life that Mary would lead and that she would be the vessel to bear his son is not really a free will issue - or at least it's no bigger issue in Mary's case that in any other case where God has foreknowledge of our decisions. William Lane Craig has written extensively on the free will problem. It's a can of worms, but I don't think God's foreknowledge makes Mary's decisions throughout her life any less free. She voluntarily led a life so exemplary that she "found favor" with God, and this should not be minimized. I have no problem with anyone who chooses to "venerate" Mary, so long as the term is not a code word for "worship." As I've said previously, I don't think there was any issue of her "saying yes" as though God were offering her a choice. If you are a believer and God says "You will do this" or "This will happen," I don't believe that the concept of "choice" enters into it. She was simply chosen.
 

HeIsRisen2018

Summer Rose (Methodist and New J.C Hammer lol)
Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2017
Messages
10,501
Gender
Female
I think that's basically right. God's foreknowledge as to the kind of life that Mary would lead and that she would be the vessel to bear his son is not really a free will issue - or at least it's no bigger issue in Mary's case that in any other case where God has foreknowledge of our decisions. William Lane Craig has written extensively on the free will problem. It's a can of worms, but I don't think God's foreknowledge makes Mary's decisions throughout her life any less free. She voluntarily led a life so exemplary that she "found favor" with God, and this should not be minimized. I have no problem with anyone who chooses to "venerate" Mary, so long as the term is not a code word for "worship." As I've said previously, I don't think there was any issue of her "saying yes" as though God were offering her a choice. If you are a believer and God says "You will do this" or "This will happen," I don't believe that the concept of "choice" enters into it. She was simply chosen.





But what if she was too scared to? What if she didn't want to give birth to Jesus? I really don't think that God would put all that pressure on one person. Then again, that's just my opinion. A woman should never be forced into pregnancy whether or not it's a regular child or the Son of God.
 

wondering

Supporter
Joined
Dec 26, 2015
Messages
11,596
Gender
Female
I think that's basically right. God's foreknowledge as to the kind of life that Mary would lead and that she would be the vessel to bear his son is not really a free will issue - or at least it's no bigger issue in Mary's case that in any other case where God has foreknowledge of our decisions. William Lane Craig has written extensively on the free will problem. It's a can of worms, but I don't think God's foreknowledge makes Mary's decisions throughout her life any less free. She voluntarily led a life so exemplary that she "found favor" with God, and this should not be minimized. I have no problem with anyone who chooses to "venerate" Mary, so long as the term is not a code word for "worship." As I've said previously, I don't think there was any issue of her "saying yes" as though God were offering her a choice. If you are a believer and God says "You will do this" or "This will happen," I don't believe that the concept of "choice" enters into it. She was simply chosen.
I think it's important to note here that God's foreknowledge of an event, does not cause that event to happen.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Help Support this site

Total amount
$737.00
Goal
$5,020.00
Top