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[_ Old Earth _] My own theories

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sethhman

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I have me own theories, hehehe
beware, very long sections!

The Atheist Test
The Theory of the evolution of the Coca Cola can.

BANG!
Billions of years ago, a big bang produced a large rock. As the rock cooled, sweet brown liquid formed on its surface. As time passed aluminum formed itself into a can, a lid, and a tab. Millions of years later, red and white paint fell from the sky, and formed itself into the words "Coca Cola... 12 fluid ounces."
Of course, my theory is an insult to your intellect, because you know that if the Coca Cola can is made, there must be a maker. If designed, there must be a designer. The alternative, that it happened by chance or accident, is to move into a an intellectual free zone.
The banana--the atheist's nightmare
Note that the banana:
1.Is shaped for human hand
2.Has non-slip surface
3.Has outward indicators of inward contents: Green-too early, Yellow-just right, Black-too late.
4.Has a tab for removal of wrapper
5.Is perforated on wrapper
6.Bio-degradable wrapper
7.Is shaped for human mouth
8.Has a point at top for ease of entry
9.Is pleasing to taste buds
10.Is curved towards the face to make eating process easy
To say that the banana happened by accident is even more unintelligent than to say that no one designed the Coca Cola can.

Test One
The person who thinks the Coca Cola can had to designer is:
A. Intelligent
B. A fool
C. Has an ulterior motive for denying the obvious

Did you know the eye has 40,000,000 nerve endings, the focusing muscles move an estimated 100,000 times a day, and the retina contains 137,000,000 light sensitive cells?
Charles Darwin said. "To suppose that the eye could have been formed by natural selection, seems I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree." If man cannot begin to make a human eye, how could anyone in his right mind think that eyes were formed by mere chance? In fact, man cannot make anything from nothing. We don't know how to do it. We can re-create, reform, develop...but we cannot create even one grain of sand from nothing. Yet, the eye is only a small part of the most sophisticated part of creation - the human body.
George Gallup, the famous statistician said, "I could prove God statistically; take the human body alone; the chance that all the functions of the individual would just happen, is a statistical monstrosity."
Albert Einstein said,
"Everyone who is seriously interested in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the universe -- a spirit vastly superior to man, and one in the face of which our modest powers must feel humble."
Test Two
Do you know of any building that didn't have a builder?
Yes No
Do you know of any painting that didn't have a painter?
Yes No
Do you know of any car that didn't have a maker?
Yes No
If you answered "Yes," for any of the above give details:
_______________________________________________
_______________________________________________

Could I convince you that I dropped 50 oranges onto the ground and they by chance fell into ten rows of five oranges? The logical conclusion is that someone with an intelligent mind put them there. The odds that ten oranges would fall by accident into a straight line are mind boggling, let alone ten rows of five.
Test Three
From the atom the universe is there order?
Yes No
Did it happen by accident or must there have been an intelligent mind?
Yes No
What are the odds of 50 oranges falling by chance into ten rows of five oranges?
_______________________________________

The declaration, "There is no God," is what is known as an absolute statement. For an absolute statement to be true, I must have absolute knowledge. Here is another absolute statement: "There is no gold in China."
Test Four
What do I need to have for that statement to be true?
No Knowledge of China
Partial knowledge of China.
Absolute knowledge of China.
Absolute knowledge of China is the correct answer. For the statement to be true, I must know that there is no gold in China, or the statement is incorrect. To say, "There is no God," and to be correct in the statement, I must be omniscient. I must know how many hairs are upon every head, every thought of every human heart, every detail of history, every atom within every rock...nothing is hidden from my eyes...I know the intimate details of the secret love-life of the fleas on the back of the black cat of Napoleon's great grandmother. To make the absolute statement, "There is no God," I must have absolute knowledge that there isn't one.

Let's say that this circle represents all the knowledge in the entire universe, and let's assume that you have an incredible 1% of all that knowledge. Is it possible, that in the knowledge that haven't come across, there is a ample evidence to prove that God does indeed exist? If you are reasonable, you will have to say, "Having the limited knowledge I have at present, I believe that there is no God." In other words, you don't know if God exists, so you are not an "atheist," you are what is commonly know as an "agnostic." You are like a man that looks at a building, and doesn't know if there was a builder.
Test Five
The man who sees a building and doesn't know if there was a building is:
Intelligent
A fool
Has an ulterior motive

Perhaps you have the questions that you hold back from faith. First, almost every question you have about suffering humanity etc., can be adequately answered. Second, we have faith in plenty of things we don't understand. Did you understand the mechanics of television before you turned it on? Probably not. You took a step of faith, turned it on, and after it worked, understanding the mechanics wasn't that important. We accept that there are unseen television waves right in front of our eyes. We can't see them because they are invisible. For them to manifest, we need a receiver, then we can enjoy the experience of television. God is not flesh and blood. He is an eternal Spirit-immortal and invisible. Like the television waves, He cannot be experienced until the "receiver" is switched on. Here is something you will find hard to believe: Jesus said, "He who has My commandments and keeps them, he it is who loves me. And he who loves me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him" (John 14:21). Either that is true or it isn't. Jesus Christ says that He will manifest Himself to anyone who obeys Him. Approach the subject the same way you approached your first television set. Just take a small step of faith. If it works, enjoy it, if it doesn't, forget it.

Or have you an ulterior motive? Could it be that the "atheist" can't find God, for the same reason a thief can't find a policemen? Could it be that your love for sin is clouding your good judgement? If the Bible is true, and Jesus Christ has "abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the Gospel," then you owe it to yourself just to check it out. Here is how to do that:
Test Six
With a tender conscience, check this list of the Ten Commandments:
1. Have I always loved my Creator with all my heart, mind, soul, and strength?
Yes No
Have I made a god in my own image - a god to suit myself?
Yes No
Have I ever used God's name in vain?
Yes No
Have I kept the Sabbath holy?
Yes No
Have I always honored my parents implicitly?
Yes No
Have I murdered (God considers hatred as murder)?
Yes No
Have I committed adultery (includes premarital sex and lust)?
Yes No
Have I stolen (the value is irrelevant)
Yes No
Have I lied (including fibs & these questions)?
Yes No
Have I coveted (been greedy or materialistic)?
Yes No
If you have broken one Law, then you have sinned against God and therefore will "surely die," for the "wages of sin is death." We are all guilty of breaking the Commandments. Listen to the voice of your conscience, and let it remind you of some of the sins of the past. We are not perfect as we are commanded to be (Matthew 5:48), neither is our heart pure. On Judgement Day our transgressions will be evidence of our shame. Think of it: God has seen our every sin we have ever committed. We share our thought-life with Him. We are guilty of violating His Law a multitude of times, yet if we repent, God can forgive us because Jesus stepped into the courtroom 2,000 years ago and paid the fine for us.

1. Does God exist? Throughout history, in all cultures of the world, people have been convinced there is a God. Could one say with any sense of confidence that all those people have been mistaken? Billions of people, who represent diverse sociological, intellectual, emotional, educational makeups...all came to the same conclusion that there is a Creator, a God to be worshipped.

"Anthropological research has indicated that among the farthest and most remote primitive people today, there is a universal belief in God. And in the earliest histories and legends of people all around the world, the original concept was of one God, who was the Creator. An original high God seems once to have been in their consciousness even in those societies which are today polytheistic."3

2. Does God exist? The complexity of our planet points to a deliberate Designer who not only created our universe, but sustains it today. Many examples showing God's design could be given, possibly with no end. But here are a few:

The Earth...its size is perfect. The Earth's size and corresponding gravity holds a thin layer of mostly nitrogen and oxygen gases, only extending about 50 miles above the Earth's surface. If Earth were smaller, an atmosphere would be impossible, like the planet Mercury. If Earth were larger, its atmosphere would contain free hydrogen, like Jupiter.4 Earth is the only known planet equipped with an atmosphere of the right mixture of gases to sustain plant, animal and human life.

The Earth is located the right distance from the sun. Consider the temperature swings we encounter, roughly -30 degrees to +120 degrees. If the Earth were any further away from the sun, we would all freeze. Any closer and we would burn up. Even a fractional variance in the Earth's position to the sun would make life on Earth impossible. The Earth remains this perfect distance from the sun while it rotates around the sun at a speed of nearly 67,000 mph. It is also rotating on its axis, allowing the entire surface of the Earth to be properly warmed and cooled every day.

And our moon is the perfect size and distance from the Earth for its gravitational pull. The moon creates important ocean tides and movement so ocean waters do not stagnate, and yet it restrains our massive oceans from spilling over across the continents.5

Water...colorless, odorless and without taste, and yet no living thing can survive without it. Plants, animals and human beings consist mostly of water (about two-thirds of the human body is water). You'll see why the characteristics of water are uniquely suited to life:

It has an unusually high boiling point and freezing point. Water allows us to live in an environment of fluctuating temperature changes, while keeping our bodies a steady 98.6 degrees.

Water is a universal solvent. Take a full glass of water, add a cup of sugar, and nothing spills over the edge; the water simply absorbs the sugar. This property of water means that thousands of chemicals, minerals and nutrients can be carried throughout our bodies and into the smallest blood vessels.6

Water is also chemically inert. Without affecting the makeup of the substances it carries, water enables food, medicines and minerals to be absorbed and used by the body.

Water has a unique surface tension. Water in plants can therefore flow upward against gravity, bringing life-giving water and nutrients to the top of even the tallest trees.

Water freezes from the top down and floats, so fish can live in the winter.

Ninety-seven percent of the Earth's water is in the oceans. But on our Earth, there is a system designed which removes salt from the water and then distributes that water throughout the globe. Evaporation takes the ocean waters, leaving the salt, and forms clouds which are easily moved by the wind to disperse water over the land, for vegetation, animals and people. It is a system of purification and supply that sustains life on this planet, a system of recycled and reused water.7

The human brain...simultaneously processes an amazing amount of information. Your brain takes in all the colors and objects you see, the temperature around you, the pressure of your feet against the floor, the sounds around you, the dryness of your mouth, even the texture of this article in your hand. Your brain registers emotional responses, thoughts and memories. At the same time your brain keeps track of the ongoing functions of your body like your breathing pattern, eyelid movement, hunger and movement of the muscles in your hands.

The human brain processes more than a million messages a second.8 Your brain weighs the importance of all this data, filtering out the relatively unimportant. This screening function is what allows you to focus and operate effectively in your world. A brain that deals with more than a million pieces of information every second, while evaluating its importance and allowing you to act on the most pertinent information...can we say mere chance brought about such an astounding organ?

When NASA launches a shuttle mission, it is assumed a monkey didn't write the plan, but intelligent and knowledgeable minds. How does one explain the existence of the human brain? Only a mind more intelligent and knowledgeable than humanity could have created the human brain.

3. Does God exist? Mere "chance" is not an adequate explanation of creation. Imagine looking at Mount Rushmore, in which the likenesses of Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln and Theodore Roosevelt are carved. Could you ever believe that it came about by chance? Given infinite time, wind, rain and chance, it is still hard to believe something like that, tied to history, was randomly formed in the side of a mountain. Common sense tells us that people planned and skillfully carved those figures.

This article only touches on a few amazing aspects of our world: the Earth's position to the sun, some properties of water, one organ in the human body. Could any of these have come about by chance?

The distinguished astronomer Sir Frederick Hoyle showed how amino acids randomly coming together in a human cell is mathematically absurd. Sir Hoyle illustrated the weakness of "chance" with the following analogy. "What are the chances that a tornado might blow through a junkyard containing all the parts of a 747, accidentally assemble them into a plane, and leave it ready for take-off? The possibilities are so small as to be negligible even if a tornado were to blow through enough junkyards to fill the whole universe!"9

When one considers the intricacies of our life and universe, it is reasonable to think that an intelligent, loving Creator provided for everything we need for life. The Bible describes God as the author and sustainer of life.

4. Does God exist? Humankind's inherent sense of right and wrong cannot be biologically explained. There arises in all of us, of any culture, universal feelings of right and wrong. Even a thief gets upset and feels wronged when someone steals from him. If someone violently grabs a child from a family and rapes that child, there is an anger and revulsion and a rage to confront that act as evil, regardless of the culture. Where did we get this sense of wrongness? How do we explain a universal law in the conscience of all people that says murder for fun is wrong?

And in areas like courage, dying for a cause, love, dignity, duty and compassion, where did these come from? If people are merely products of physical evolution, "survival of the fittest," why do we sacrifice for each other? Where did we get this inner sense of right and wrong? Our conscience can best be explained by a loving Creator who cares about the decisions and harmony of humanity.

5. Does God exist? God not only has revealed Himself in what can be observed in nature, and in human life, but He has even more specifically shown Himself in the Bible. God's thoughts, personality, and attitudes can only be known if God chooses to reveal them. All else would be human speculation. We are at a loss if God does not wish to be known. But God wants us to know Him and has told us in the Bible all we need to know about His character and how to relate to Him. This makes the reliability of the Bible an important consideration.

Archaeological findings continue to confirm rather than refute the accuracy of the Bible. For example, an archeological find in northern Israel in August 1993 confirmed the existence of King David, author of many of the Psalms in the Bible.10 The Dead Sea Scrolls and other archaeological discoveries continue to substantiate the historical accuracy of the Bible.

The Bible was written over a 1500-year span, by 40 different authors, in different locations and on separate continents, written in three different languages, covering diverse subject matters at different points in history.11 Yet there is an astounding consistency in its message. Throughout the entire Bible the same message appears:

1. God created the world we live in, and created us specifically to have a relationship with Him.
2. He deeply loves us.
3. We have sinned and are under God's judgment, in need of His forgiveness.
4. God provided a way for our sins to be forgiven.
5. He asks us to receive His forgiveness and have a relationship with Him that will last eternally.

Along with this central script, the Bible specifically reveals God's character. Psalm 145 is a typical summary of God's personality, thoughts and feelings toward us. If you want to know God, here He is.

6. Does God exist? Unlike any other revelation of God, Jesus Christ is the clearest, most specific picture of God. Why Jesus? Look throughout the major world religions and you'll find that Buddha, Muhammad, Confucius and Moses all identified themselves as teachers or prophets. None of them ever claimed to be equal to God. Surprisingly, Jesus did. That is what sets Jesus apart from all the others. He said God exists and you're looking at Him. Though He talked about His Father in heaven, it was not from the position of separation, but of very close union, unique to all humankind. Jesus said that anyone who had seen Him had seen the Father, anyone who believed in Him, believed in the Father.

He said, "I am the light of the world, he who follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life."12 He claimed attributes belonging only to God: to be able to forgive people of their sin, free them from habits of sin, give people a more abundant life and give them eternal life in heaven. Unlike other teachers who focused people on their words, Jesus pointed people to himself. He did not say, "follow my words and you will find truth." He said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life, no one comes to the Father but through me."13

What proof did Jesus give for claiming to be divine? He did what people can't do. Jesus performed miracles. He healed people...blind, crippled, deaf, even raised a couple of people from the dead. He had power over objects...created food out of thin air, enough to feed crowds of several thousand people. He performed miracles over nature...walked on top of a lake, commanding a raging storm to stop for some friends. People everywhere followed Jesus, because He constantly met their needs, doing the miraculous. He said if you do not want to believe what I'm telling you, you should at least believe in me based on the miracles you're seeing.14

What did Jesus reveal about God's personality? What about God's thoughts, expectations and His feelings toward humankind? Jesus Christ showed God to be gentle, loving, aware of our self-centeredness and shortcomings, yet deeply wanting a relationship with us. Jesus revealed that although God views us as sinners, worthy of His punishment, His love for us ruled and God came up with a different plan. God would have His Son receive the punishment for our sin. And Jesus willingly accepted this plan.

Jesus was tortured with a whip of nine sharp-tipped ends. A "crown" of two-inch thorns was pressed into his head. Then they secured Him to a cross by pounding nails through His hands and feet into the wood. Given His other miracles, those nails didn't keep Him on the cross; His love for us did. Jesus died in our place so we could be forgiven. Of all the religions known to humanity, only through Jesus will you see God reaching toward humanity, providing a way for us to have a relationship with Him. Jesus proves a divine heart of love, meeting our needs, drawing us to Himself. Because of Jesus' death we can be forgiven, fully accepted by God and genuinely loved by God. God says, "I have loved you with an everlasting love, therefore I have continued my faithfulness to you."15 This is God, in action.

The most conclusive proof that Jesus is equal to God was Jesus' most closely scrutinized miracle - His own resurrection from the dead. Jesus said that three days after His burial He would come back to life. On the third day after His crucifixion, the almost two-ton boulder in front of His tomb was catapulted up a slope.16 The guard of well-trained Roman soldiers saw a blinding light and an angel. The tomb was empty, except for the burial clothes that had been wrapped around Jesus' body. Over the years, legal, historical and logical analysis has been applied to Jesus' resurrection and the most feasible conclusion still is that Jesus rose from the dead.

Does God exist? If you want to know, investigate Jesus Christ. We're told that "God so loved the world that He gave His only Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life."17

Do you want to begin a relationship with God and actually know you are accepted by Him?

This is your decision, no coercion here. But if you want to be forgiven by God and come into a relationship with Him, you can do so right now by asking Him to forgive you and come into your life. Jesus said, "Behold, I stand at the door [of your heart] and knock. He who hears my voice and opens the door, I will come into him [or her]."18 If you want to do this, but aren't sure how to put it into words, this may help: "Jesus, thank you for dying for my sins. You know my life and that I need to be forgiven. I ask you to forgive me right now and come into my life. Thank you that you want a relationship with me. Amen."

God views your relationship with Him as permanent. Referring to all those who believe in Him, Jesus Christ said of us, "I know them, and they follow me; and I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of my hand."19

So, does God exist? Looking at all these facts, one can conclude that a loving God does exist and can be known in an intimate, personal way.

Evolution flies in the face of the second LAW of thermodynamics which states that order tends toward disorder. Evolution says that the complex came from the simple and is constantly improving. If that were true it would be a major exception to the second law of thermodynamics.

Evolution does not even begin to deal with the origin of matter. It attempts to account for the origin of life, but as to where matter itself came from, it is strangely silent. The theory of evolution attempts to explain how the universe came to be as it is with the Big Bang theory. As to where did the matter came from that "banged so big" evolution does not even attempt to explain.

Just a couple of thoughts on the Big Bang. The law of conservation of angular momentum contradicts the Big Bang in a pretty Big way. For the layman (like me) this is the law that governs things like kids going around on a carousel. This is the law that says that pieces (the kids) flying off from a spinning object (the carousel) will be spinning in the same direction as the original object. If the Big Bang was the way it really all began then why does the sun spin clockwise and all nine planets spin counterclockwise?

Two planets (Venus and Uranus) revolve backwards. There are 60 known moons in our solar system. Of those 60, eleven of them are spinning retrograde (backwards). Four of those moons are travelling retrograde. Two planets have moons which are going in both directions at the same time! Dr. Kent E. Hovind says that God made it all work the way it does just to make the Big Bang look stupid.

Dr. Hovind also says that he believes in A Big Bang and quotes II Peter 2:10 ("But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a *GREAT NOISE*, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.") He says that there is going to be a Big Bang, but it comes at the end not at the beginning!

Frogs don't turn into princes. That's a fairy tale, yet it is taught as science, only it isn't a prince that performs the magic, it is time--billions and billions of years in the evolutionary fairy tale.

If you find a treasure chest in a sunken ship and it contains coins with dates on them, you may not be able to determine the exact date it sank, but you can tell what date it sank "after" by the date on the newest coin in the chest. It is the youngest coin that tells what you need to know, not the oldest coin. There are hundreds of ways to determine the age of the earth, but the same rule applies. It is the youngest coin in the chest that determines the date the ship sank, not the oldest.

Let's take a look at some of the "coins in our treasure chest." The population of the earth is one way to get an idea how old the earth is. In Jesus' day there were only 1/4 billion people on the earth, in 1800 there were one billion on the earth, in 1930 2 million, in 1962 3 billion, in 1977 4 billion, and in 1985 5 billion. Population grows exponentially as anyone can see. In fact it has been suggested that there are more people alive on the earth today than all those who have ever died! If man had been on the earth for millions of years there should be a lot more people here. The amount of people fits perfectly with what one would expect if the earth is only a few thousand years old as the Bible suggests, however.

The sun has been steadily shrinking at a rate of about 5 feet per hour for the last 300 years or so that it has been observed. Only 20 million years ago it would have been so big that it would have touched the earth. That would have made it pretty uncomfortable for any forms of life that were trying to evolve.

All astronomers know that comets lose material. They have an estimated lifespan of about 10,000 years. We still have comets. No problem for the creation theory.

Jupiter, Uranus, and Saturn are rapidly cooling off. If you take the rate of cooling and go backwards you don't have to go back too far until you have them molten. If you find a cup of coffee on the coffee table and it is still piping hot and you just know that coffee has been there for thousands of years you have a problem with your theory!

Saturn's rings are still expanding at a measurable rate. If you go backwards a few thousand years-no problem. If you take it back a few million you have a problem.

Our moon is getting farther away from the earth at a rate of about 2 inches a year. If you take it back only a few thousand years--no problem. If you take it back a couple of inches a year for a few million you have a big problem. Because of the inverse square law every time you take half the distance you get quadruple the attraction. A moon as close as it would have been if you went back in time as much as evolutionists would like us to in order to fit their theory would produce tides that would have completely covered the earth twice a day. (Dr. Hovind points out that you can only drown once a day.)

The surface of the moon collects dust from space like a windshield collects bugs. It does so at an easily calculable rate of about 1 inch every 10,000 years. Scientists in 1954 figured that the surface of the moon should have dust 54' deep because they "knew" that the moon has been around for 4.6 billion years. Probes showed that the dust was only 3/4 of an inch deep. On July 20th, 1969, when Neil Armstrong stepped out right after he said the famous one small step speech he said, "It's solid!" NASA must have been quite put out that Christians had secretly put together their own space program and went up there and vacuumed up all but about 6,000 years worth of dust to make their theories look bad!

Moon rocks brought back were dated using 8 different methods including uranium-lead and potassium-argon. All eight tests gave 8 vastly different dates so they just stated that the age of the rocks was what they "already knew" their age to be before they ever went up to get the rocks. I will cover the limitations and fallacies of these dating methods in an upcoming article (probably next Monday's).

The earth's magnetic field is weakening at a predictable rate. Taking that backward a few thousand years--no problem. Take it back a few million years and you have a big problem. The magnetic field would have been so strong that the moon would have been pulled into our orbit.

Because the rotation of the earth is slowing down an 11,000th of a second per day we add a second to our clocks every two and a half years. It is called leap second. We don't celebrate it and most people never even know it's being done, but it is. The earth used to be spinning faster and has been slowing down at a predictable rate ever since. If you go back 6-10 thousand years no problem, but if you take it backward a few million years it would have been spinning so fast that everything would have been blown off the face of the earth. Big problem for budding life forms who have hopes of evolving into something more complex.

The continents are eroding into the seas at a predictable rate. If the earth were only 14 million (not 4.6 billion) years old the earth would be flat and the seas filled in at today's erosion rate.

Salt is washing out of the earth's surface into the oceans at a predictable rate and the seas are getting saltier. The present levels of salt suggest an age of 4-13,000 years, not billions of years. The Mississippi river delta has 80,000 tons of sediment an hour washing into it south of New Orleans. The whole Gulf of Mexico would be filled in by now if the earth were only millions of years old as opposed to the evolutionist's idea that the earth is 4.6 billion years old.

Niagara Falls was eroding soil at the rate of between four and five feet per year before hydroelectric dams were built and the Canadians poured concrete to keep it from happening. It has eroded about 12 miles from where it all started. That could have easily been accomplished in a few thousand years. If it had been going on for millions of years it would have eaten its way clear back past Lake Erie.

Oil wells have been discovered that have 20,000 pounds per square inch of pressure in them under the earth's crust. Scientists admit that if that pressure had been there for millions of years the rock would have cracked and the pressure would have leaked out.

The oldest tree on earth is the Methuselah tree out in California. It is 4,300 years old. That just so happens to be about exactly the Biblical date for Noah's flood. Why, if the earth is billions of years old, are there no trees older than 4,300 years?
 
For something which is your 'own theory', it certainly seems significant in managing to encompass pretty much every commonly-cited creationist cut-and-paste argument in the book. :roll:
 
It may be, victor, but is not all of that good evidence of God and creation?

sethman: That was a good read. Yes, if the world did somehow come to by chance, it would be nowhere near as orderly, complex, complicated and fitting as it is, so the only logical conclusion is that the universe was created by an unfathomable intelligence. Atheism is truly an "intellectual free zone". I do think atheists have ulterior motives for believing the ridiculous. I have thought it may be fear, hate, or just plain not liking the idea of God.
 
...so i copied and pasted... does that mean that I cannot like them? I don't see them anywheres here...
 
Perhaps I am just a bit jaded. I have read most of those arguments before at one time or another, but usually separately. Having them in one big overwhelming cut-and-paste is a touch irritating, since it discourages me from responding to something so big (and to a stubborn bugger like me, that is torture).

It's nice to see that the old myths still abound, mind. One wonders how many creationists who cite it actually understand the 2nd law of thermodynamics, for example....
 
Featherbop said:
Atheism is truly an "intellectual free zone". I do think atheists have ulterior motives for believing the ridiculous. I have thought it may be fear, hate, or just plain not liking the idea of God.

Charmed, I'm sure, but you're wrong all the same. Considering the fallacies or even falsehoods expressed in a great many of these arguments (the sun-shrinking, 2nd law of thermodynamics and magnetic-field-weakening arguments are particular favourites), that is highly debateable.

And just to pre-empt the inevitable 'debunk them, then', -I will be all too happy to give it a go, if you just do me the simple courtesy of writing them in your own words.
 
Seth,

I didn't read them all - having read the first few I think I got the gist of it. But you're going to have to do better than copy and pasting. You're going to have to do better than citing analogies too. I've been there, done that.

Let me give you just one example of some of the problems.

1) "You" ask the question is it probable that if ten oranges fall out of a tree that five will land on the ground. My answer is no. I ask you is it probably that if an orange tree drops ten oranges every year for ten billion years that it five oranges will eventually land in a row and your answer is... probably yes.

I'm assuming your young, Seth and haven't really opened your eyes to the complexity of the the question of origins. What I can tell you about it is that there are major flaws in all the theories that I have ever heard. Understanding that, all I can do is accept God's Word, since it has been affirmed to me before, and understand that there have been and always will be conclusions made based on passing perceptions of fallible human beings.

BL
 
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