Bible Study Obeying the Lord Jesus Christ is legalism?

[JLB]

I agree, but it also says we are created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. It is by obedience to God that the works we do are the works of the Lord who works through us as we let the light of Christ shine through us. Good works are connected to salvation through faith that is God's free gift of grace, but many try to work for something that is already free.

You explain that well.

You certainly have a way with words.


Paul says it this way -

And let our people also learn to maintain good works, to meet urgent needs, that they may not be unfruitful. Titus 3:14


Jesus says unfruitful branches get “taken away” from Him, and fruitful branches get pruned so they are even more fruitful.





JLB

 

[JLB]

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that we need to be disciples of Jesus...a disciple follows His teacher.

That would be going pretty far.

Are you sure you are not being a little extreme?






JLB

 

[GodsGrace]

That would be going pretty far.

Are you sure you are not being a little extreme?






JLB

You better be kidding!

 

[WIP]

Remember JLB, you stated in your opening post that this would not be a debate but only sharing what we believe. Also, we currently have a restriction regarding the OSAS/OSNAS debate and this thread drools with this topic. Countering others views is debating.

This goes for all of us.

 

[JLB]

You better be kidding!

Of course I’m kidding.

Obviously we are to submit to Jesus Christ as Lord in which we follow Him as disciples to obey His teaching and commandments.

He empowers us with His Spirit, His grace to do this very thing.


Amen.


JLB

 

[GodsGrace]

Of course I’m kidding.

Obviously we are to submit to Jesus Christ as Lord in which we follow Him as disciples to obey His teaching and commandments.

He empowers us with His Spirit, His grace to do this very thing.


Amen.


JLB

 

[stovebolts]

Righteousness is secured only by obeying God.

Amen,
Luke 6:46-49 NKJV
Build on the Rock
46 “But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say? 47 Whoever comes to Me, and hears My sayings and does them, I will show you whom he is like: 48 He is like a man building a house, who dug deep and laid the foundation on the rock. And when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently against that house, and could not shake it, for it was [j]founded on the rock. 49 But he who heard and did nothing is like a man who built a house on the earth without a foundation, against which the stream beat vehemently; and immediately it [k]fell. And the ruin of that house was great.”

 

[stovebolts]

This is sobering...

Jesus says,
Luke 12:47-48 NKJV
47 And that servant who knew his master’s will, and did not prepare himself or do according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48 But he who did not know, yet committed things deserving of stripes, shall be beaten with few. For everyone to whom much is given, from him much will be required; and to whom much has been committed, of him they will ask the more.

 

[JLB]

This is sobering...

Jesus says,
Luke 12:47-48 NKJV
47 And that servant who knew his master’s will, and did not prepare himself or do according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48 But he who did not know, yet committed things deserving of stripes, shall be beaten with few. For everyone to whom much is given, from him much will be required; and to whom much has been committed, of him they will ask the more.

Very Sobering.

 

[JLB]

Remember JLB, you stated in your opening post that this would not be a debate but only sharing what we believe. Also, we currently have a restriction regarding the OSAS/OSNAS debate and this thread drools with this topic. Countering others views is debating.

This goes for all of us.

Ok.

 

[for_his_glory]

You explain that well.

You certainly have a way with words.


Paul says it this way -

And let our people also learn to maintain good works, to meet urgent needs, that they may not be unfruitful. Titus 3:14


Jesus says unfruitful branches get “taken away” from Him, and fruitful branches get pruned so they are even more fruitful.





JLB

Thank you for the complement. I guess it's just the author in me, LOL.

Rotten branches have to be pruned from the tree in order for it to grow and become fruitful. It's like when I prune my trees in the fall they produce more beautiful in the spring.

 

[WalterandDebbie]

And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him, Hebrews 5:9


Some people claim that obeying the Lord Jesus Christ is legalism.


What do you guys believe?



JLB




PS: Please, this is not a debate. Just state your answer and please include a scripture.

We believe that # 2 would be our answer according to: Obeying the Lord is how we are saved, and how we remain in Christ. Ephesians 2:8

Love always, Walter

 

[JLB]

We believe that # 1and 2 would be our answer according to: Yes it’s legalism. We are saved by grace. Romans 3:31,

Obeying the Lord is how we are saved. Ephesians 2:8

Love always, Walter

Maybe you could explain how obeying the Lord is legalism, so I can understand what you mean.


Thanks JLB

 

[GodsGrace]

This is sobering...

Jesus says,
Luke 12:47-48 NKJV
47 And that servant who knew his master’s will, and did not prepare himself or do according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48 But he who did not know, yet committed things deserving of stripes, shall be beaten with few. For everyone to whom much is given, from him much will be required; and to whom much has been committed, of him they will ask the more.

But how does one explain verse 48?
I've been taught that if we don't know something is a sin...then it's not counted to us as sin...

In verse 48 of Luke 12, Jesus says that those that do not know receive FEW STRIPES.

This verse is used to support purgatory.

Any thoughts?

 

[WalterandDebbie]

Maybe you could explain how obeying the Lord is legalism, so I can understand what you mean.


Thanks JLB

Definition of legalism: From Bing search:
NOUN

1. excessive adherence to law or formula.
   "this petty legalism encouraged more to flee"
   • theology
     dependence on moral law rather than on personal religious faith.
     "stress obedience apart from faith and you produce legalism"

Ok! JLB, I must say that from the above definition, I must have misunderstood: Maybe you could explain how obeying the Lord is legalism, so I can understand what you mean.

I can see why you said that now, It was my thinking that it meant: Yes it’s legalism. We are saved by grace, But NO it is not saying that at all, I'm sorry,

So, # 2 is our answer

Love always, Walter

 

[daninthelionsden]

I'd stop at IT IS NECESSARY.
But many like to tack on the love part...which is not wrong; it just puts a condition on the obedience and I don't think there should be any condition.

If someone is mad at God, for whatever reason, is it then OK to go out and party hardy or does one still obey God knowing that this feeling will soon pass and in the meantime has fallen out of the grace of God. Must that person wait to FEEL the love for God in order to begin obeying Him again?

Jesus said IF YOU LOVE ME YOU WILL OBEY MY COMMANDMENTS...
What kind of love?
The kind we feel at the moment or the kind that is deep down and creates the core of our being?

If it's the second kind of love,,,then we obey God even if we're mad at Him and feel no emotion of love at all.

I think I need to read The Four Loves by C.S. Lewis again.

 

[WalterandDebbie]

Definition of legalism: From Bing search:
NOUN

1. excessive adherence to law or formula.
   "this petty legalism encouraged more to flee"
   • theology
     dependence on moral law rather than on personal religious faith.
     "stress obedience apart from faith and you produce legalism"

Ok! JLB, I must say that from the above definition, I must have misunder tood , Maybe you could explain how obeying the Lord is legalism, so I can understand what you mean.

I can see why you said that now, It was my thinking that it meant: Yes it’s legalism. We are saved by grace, But NO it is not saying that at all, I'm sorry,

So, # 2 is our answer

Love always, Walter

I just could not explain the statement that JLB said: Maybe you could explain how obeying the Lord is legalism, so I can understand what you mean.

After heeding to my first answer.

Walter

 

[GodsGrace]

I think I need to read The Four Loves by C.S. Lewis again.

Maybe I will too.
I love how he writes.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him, Hebrews 5:9


Some people claim that obeying the Lord Jesus Christ is legalism.


What do you guys believe?



JLB




PS: Please, this is not a debate. Just state your answer and please include a scripture.

I think this view has already been stated with scriptural suport, but I think we should follow Jesus out of love.

On the other hand though, I thing there's more to it then just that. Jesus said once to the crowd following Him "why do you call me 'Lord, Lord' and not do as I say? Luke 6:46. In either case I'm not sure how much of our salvation is dependent on being obedient or whether it's out of Love for Jesus and God, as well as out of respect of their authority and will in our lives.

Honestly I don't understand the issue with legalism. We all need mercy and grace, but following Jesus as best we can should be a considered a good thing. Why is it denounced as legalistic as if the term makes obedience a bad thing?

 

[JLB]

Ok! JLB, I must say that from the above definition, I must have misunder tood , Maybe you could explain how obeying the Lord is legalism, so I can understand what you mean.

I don’t believe obeying the Lord is legalism.

I gave it as a possible answer, because some folks believe that it is.


Thanks for your input.

You always seem to have good thought provoking threads.

You are also very kind, in the way you relate.

Your a good example for all of us to follow.

God bless you.



JLB