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SOUL SLEEP - TRUE/FALSE

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PART TWO

Theory of Soul-Sleep

Another theory that is rather prevalent is "soul-sleep." It is the theory that between physical death and the resurrection the soul lapses into a state of sleep, of unconsciousness. It is rather striking that a man in my own congregation once believed that. I think he was a child of God, but shortly before he died he called me and, instead of taking hold of the comfort of the house of many mansions and of the house of God, he wanted to argue with me about soul-sleep. He was dying: in fact, he did not live more than two hours after that. I told him, "Brother, one thing I'll tell you: it won't be long before you will find out that you are mistaken. That's all. I don't want to argue with you about it; within a few hours you'll find out surely that you're wrong."

There are still people in the Reformed churches who cling to the idea of soul-sleep. They believe that after death the soul falls asleep and enters into a state of unconsciousness. They claim to have proof--scriptural proof. For proof they call attention to the fact that the Bible, both in the Old and New Testaments, calls death a "sleep." Moreover, they point to certain saints who died and were called back to the present life, and they argue that the souls of those people were asleep in the state of death. Lazarus was sleeping, the Lord says, and the Lord was going to wake him up (John 11:11). The daughter of Jairus too is said to have been sleeping (Luke 8:52). All of these passages, and especially the Scriptures that speak of death as a sleep, those who believe in soul-sleep quote as proof for their position.

Now. in the first place, I maintain that the soul cannot sleep. The body sleeps. But the soul is always wide awake. In fact, I find that my soul is often so wide awake that I solve all kinds of problems while my body sleeps. I have sometimes made entire sermons in my sleep. I have made a theme and divisions for a sermon in my sleep, and when I awakened, I found that the correct theme and divisions are exactly what I had worked out while sleeping. When I was in school, I sometimes struggled with a very difficult mathematical problem in trigonometry or calculus late into the night, and when I finally fell asleep I solved the problem in my sleep. I assure you that the soul never sleeps The fact that we dream is proof that the soul does not sleep.

The body, however, does sleep. Sleep is physical. A study of those passages in which Scripture speaks of death as a sleep will reveal that in every instance the reference is to the body. Oh. yes, death is a sleep as far as the body is concerned. The body is laid asleep in the grave with a view to the resurrection, whether for the wicked or the righteous. The body shall be awakened at the time of the resurrection. In that sense death is a sleep. Physical death is the temporary sleep of the body in the grave until the Lord wakes up the body. But the soul does not sleep.

As far as Lazarus and the daughter of Jairus are concerned, there is no support for soul-sleep in those passages of Scripture at all. I think that there was a special provision made for Lazarus, for the daughter of Jairus, for the young man of Nain, and for others who were called back to this present life. A special provision was made, so that we can say of Lazarus that he slept, and of the daughter of Jairus that she slept. And of all those whom the Lord called back to this present life it can be said that they slept. It is in fact impossible to think that Lazarus first went to heaven and then was called back to this wicked world into the body of this death; or that the young man of Nain was called back from glory into the present state of corruption; and likewise the daughter of Jairus. Oh, no! I think, indeed, that in those cases their souls remained unconscious until the Lord called them back into the present life. But no support can be found in these miraculous resurrections for a common sleep of the soul after death.
Scriptural view of the Intermediate State

In the first place, the Bible tells us that there is a house of many mansions. If you will study the Scriptures, you will find that that house of many mansions is not to be identified with the new creation, but is certainly the state of the saints and of Christ immediately after death. Christ went, immediately after death, into the state of the house of many mansions. And He tells us, "Whither I go, thou canst not follow me now.... And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also" (John 14:2). In chapter 5 of II Corinthians we are told that if the earthly house of this tabernacle is dissolved, we have a building of God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. We have this building of God immediately after the house of this present tabemacle is dissolved. There is nothing in between. We have a house of God not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. That is not a temporary body. That is not a body that will come at the resurrection. No! That is the state of the saints immediately after death in the house of God with Christ.

The apostle Paul says it will be far better for him to die and pass on, for then he will be with Christ (Philippians. 1:21-23). He will be with Christ immediately after death. As I already quoted, Christ's promise to the penitent thief was, "Today thou shalt be with me in paradise." Today! That means, in the first place, that the death of believers cannot be generalized into the death of every man. What happens in the death of believers is not only that the body is separated from the soul, but also that the outward man is separated from the inward man, the new man from the old man. The old man is earthy. The old man is sinful. The old man is corrupt and defiled. The new man is heavenly, holy, and immortal. Immortality characterizes the new man. And therefore the words of Jesus Christ apply here: "He that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: and whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?" (John 11:25.26). That is immortality beyond physical death. Besides, I emphasize that the passing into glory is immediate. Immediate! When I die, I hope to be with Christ. I look forward to glory when I die. That is my personal testimony to you tonight. That is my hope. And that longing for heaven, beloved, shall not have to wait for its realization even one moment.

<SNIP>

Secondly, there is Christ. Christ! Our eldest brother who died for us, who loved us even unto death, and bore for us all the wrath of God, that we might have everlasting life in Him. I long to see Him. I will see Him! Oh, not just to knock on His door to ask Him whether I may come in, but to see Him forevermore! To fellowship with Him. To enjoy His presence.

Finally, in heaven there is the perfect fellowship of the saints. The saints! All the saints that have gone before us in the absence of the body, from Adam to the present moment and to the moment when the Lord shall take the last elect into heavenly glory. That whole throng of saints will be in heaven, and all shall glorify the God of our salvation in perfection, each with his own song, expressing his own theme, and in his own voice, in one grand harmony. That will be glory, beloved!

Although Scripture certainly comforts us with the assurance of immediate glory of the house of many mansions that is the intermediate state, it nevertheless always fixes our eye upon the final end of all things. The intermediate state is not the final end, neither for us nor for the saints who have gone before us into heaven. We and they together must still wait and look for the final coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and the final rest. That is the perfect object of our hope. Then, when the whole church of the elect shall have been gathered in the new heavens and the new earth, and when the tabernacle of God shall be with men forever, then our hope shall be realized. Until that time they and we, in heaven and on earth, must wait and long for the coming of the day of Jesus Christ, our Lord. "He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus" (Revelation. 22:20).
Because he was lecturing to a Dutch Reformed audience, and He was a pastor of a Dutch Reformed church, he made several references to their theology

I do hope that this clear and logical lecture with Scripture references is edifying to all
 
PART ONE
Here is an excerpt from an excellent lecture by Herman Hokesema, Dutch Reformed theologian and pastor, It is good to notice that he states that the logical outcome of such a belief is the doctrine of Universalism, and that Universalism is of two different sorts: absolute universalism and hypothetical universalism, And that is the essence of the argument of those who oppose the doctrine of soul sleep..........

"the logical outcome of such a belief" --- what belief ?? what connection does Hokesema's ideas have with my post ?

"the essence of the argument of those who oppose the doctrine of soul sleep" --- what argument? for or against soul sleep? who are "those who oppose" the doctrine of soul sleep ? and, last for now, can any doctrine, for or against soul sleep, either cause or prevent soul sleep ?
 
.......
Now. in the first place, I maintain that the soul cannot sleep. The body sleeps. But the soul is always wide awake. In fact, I find that my soul is often so wide awake that I solve all kinds of problems while my body sleeps. I have sometimes made entire sermons in my sleep. I have made a theme and divisions for a sermon in my sleep, and when I awakened, I found that the correct theme and divisions are exactly what I had worked out while sleeping. When I was in school, I sometimes struggled with a very difficult mathematical problem in trigonometry or calculus late into the night, and when I finally fell asleep I solved the problem in my sleep. I assure you that the soul never sleeps The fact that we dream is proof that the soul does not sleep....​

You can maintain that the soul doesn't sleep, but that doesn't prove that the soul doesn't sleep.

I think that in Scripture King David proclaimed that Yhvh taught him while he slept,
and I think that in the N.T. it is proclaimed (or just stated plainly if you prefer) that Yhvh teaches us in our spirit, which then later as He permits we grasp or begin to grasp with our minds and with words.

I don't know if Yhvh taught King David while he slept in his spirit, or soul, or mind - perhaps Scripture clarifies this in Hebrew somewhere very clearly.

But also, remember King David, I think , or Job, said somewhere that the dead do not do anything - they dead do not praise the Lord from the grave, etc .... .... which would seem to indicate that the soul of those whose bodies are in the grave are generally NOT doing exactly what Scripture says they are not doing - anything.

That's just a general view at the moment..... an 'opinion' for those readers who have been looking for 'opinions' :) ...
 
"the logical outcome of such a belief" --- what belief ?? what connection does Hokesema's ideas have with my post ?

"the essence of the argument of those who oppose the doctrine of soul sleep" --- what argument? for or against soul sleep? who are "those who oppose" the doctrine of soul sleep ? and, last for now, can any doctrine, for or against soul sleep, either cause or prevent soul sleep ?

Since the thread is about soul sleep, and since I responded to the post of another regarding soul sleep, then the antecedent of "such a belief" is the doctrine of soul sleep.

No one can cause nor can any prevent something that does not exist in Scriptures. That is a small part of his argument.
 
You can maintain that the soul doesn't sleep, but that doesn't prove that the soul doesn't sleep.

I think that in Scripture King David proclaimed that Yhvh taught him while he slept,
and I think that in the N.T. it is proclaimed (or just stated plainly if you prefer) that Yhvh teaches us in our spirit, which then later as He permits we grasp or begin to grasp with our minds and with words.

I don't know if Yhvh taught King David while he slept in his spirit, or soul, or mind - perhaps Scripture clarifies this in Hebrew somewhere very clearly.

But also, remember King David, I think , or Job, said somewhere that the dead do not do anything - they dead do not praise the Lord from the grave, etc .... .... which would seem to indicate that the soul of those whose bodies are in the grave are generally NOT doing exactly what Scripture says they are not doing - anything.

That's just a general view at the moment..... an 'opinion' for those readers who have been looking for 'opinions' :) ...

You can maintain that pigs don't fly with wings, but that does not prove that they actually can fly. (Look out below!!!)

Please re read the parts of the lecture, and mouse over the hyper links to see the supporting Scriptures. THEN discuss the reasons from Scripture where you believe the professor and pastor are wrong.
 
Since the thread is about soul sleep, and since I responded to the post of another regarding soul sleep, then the antecedent of "such a belief" is the doctrine of soul sleep.

No one can cause nor can any prevent something that does not exist in Scriptures. That is a small part of his argument.

Since you quoted my post in your post, I thought perhaps you saw some connection there between my post that you quoted and the stuff you quoted from someone else. I didn't see and still don't see what connection you think there is between my post and yours.
You're statement about one thing is somewhat vague and inaccurate > "No one can cause nor can prevent something that does not exist in Scriptures."
.... Look around today, and see if there's not a lot that isn't in Scripture, like television and movies and rockets for a few examples.....
(if you meant soul sleep, that's not what you said)
 
You can maintain that pigs don't fly with wings, but that does not prove that they actually can fly. (Look out below!!!)

Please re read the parts of the lecture, and mouse over the hyper links to see the supporting Scriptures. THEN discuss the reasons from Scripture where you believe the professor and pastor are wrong.

You didn't answer the question nor address the issue. You said that you maintain that the soul doesn't sleep. So what? You cannot prove it.

Who said I believe the professor and pastor are wrong ? I saw only or mainly a discussion of universalism , which is quite bluntly a non-subject for me - I don't care if they believe in universalism or not. It doesn't matter in the least to me. (as far as I can gather briefly, universalism is like calvinism, or rcccatholicism, or mormonism, or buddhism --- subjects without merit or substance enough to even be considered a topic of conversation for more than a few moments in passing if needed.
 
You didn't answer the question nor address the issue. You said that you maintain that the soul doesn't sleep. So what? You cannot prove it.

Yes, we can demonstrate that the soul does not sleep after death. These verses teach that for:
(1) Unbelievers:
  • In Hades are conscious and in torment (Luke 16:23 ESV);
  • Are “under punishment [after death] until the day of judgment” (2 Peter 2:9 ESV);
(2) Believers:
  • Are immediately in Paradise at death (Luke 23:43 ESV);
  • Long for a heavenly dwelling (2 Cor. 5:2 ESV);
  • Are away from the body [at death] and are at home with the Lord (2 Cor. 5:8 ESV);
  • Deaths are gain (Phil. 1:21) and they depart at death to “be with Christ” (Phil. 1:23);
  • Are martyred souls who “cried out with a loud voice, ‘O Sovereign Lord . . .” (Rev. 6:9-11). They were conscious after death so that they could speak to the Lord.
3d-red-star-small.png
Believers will be like Christ after their physical death (see passages such as Rom. 8:29; 1 Cor. 15:49; Phil. 3:21; 1 John 3:2).

3d-red-star-small.png
They will be with Him (eg John 14:3; 2 Cor. 5:8; Phil. 1:23; Col. 3:4; 1 Thess. 3:18; 4:17, etc.).

3d-red-star-small.png
They will share Christ’s glory (Rom. 8:18, 30; 2 Cor. 3:18; 4:17, etc.);

3d-red-star-small.png
They will share Christ’s reign (2 Tim. 2:12; Rev. 2:26-27; etc.).

3d-red-star-small.png
As children of God, in that intermediate state, we will enjoy perfect fellowship with Christ (see Rev. 21:3,7).

3d-red-star-small.png
We will be worshipping Him (Rev. 7:15; 22:3) and be before His face (Matt. 5:8; 1 Cor. 13:12, etc.) [verses from Spencer 2005, pp. 438-441].
Dr. Robert Morey (2006) provides these verses as “the primary NT texts that refute soul sleep”: Matt. 22:23-33; Lk. 16:19-31; Lk. 23:43; Acts 7:59; 2 Cor. 5:1-10; Phil 1:21-25; Heb. 12:18-24.

See also Robert Morey’s interaction with a soul sleep promoter, Jacob Prasch, ‘A Surprise Encounter’ (30 October 2007).

There is ample evidence from Scripture to demonstrate that soul sleep is not a biblical doctrine. It is taught by the JWs, Christadelphians, SDAs, and is now seeping into the evangelical church - but without scriptural foundation.
Works consulted

Morey, R. 2006. "Jacob Prasch's soul sleep heresy exposed!", Faith Defenders, 3 November, available from: http://www.faithdefenders.com/ministry/deskof/drmorey/Jacob Prasch and Soul Sleep.htm (Accessed 1 October 2007).

Spencer, S. R. 2005, "Last Things, Doctrine of", in Kevin J. Vanhoozer (gen. ed.), Dictionary for Theological Interpretation of the Bible, 438-441. London: SPCK/Baker Academic.​
 
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You can maintain that the soul doesn't sleep, but that doesn't prove that the soul doesn't sleep.

What properties do you ascribe to our soul? Would you agree that it is the seat of our will and our mind, or is it something else?

If you believe in soul sleep then can you imagine a reason why our mind needs to sleep? You see, our physical body needs sleep so that it can rest, and during that time, our brain is active dreaming, and that is reason why the soul does not sleep. We even have a phrase that describes a similar state during our waking hours; it is called "day dreaming". So I am sure that you are aware of both night dreams as well as day dreams.

I think that in Scripture King David proclaimed that Yhvh taught him while he slept,
and I think that in the N.T. it is proclaimed (or just stated plainly if you prefer) that Yhvh teaches us in our spirit, which then later as He permits we grasp or begin to grasp with our minds and with words.

I don't know if Yhvh taught King David while he slept in his spirit, or soul, or mind - perhaps Scripture clarifies this in Hebrew somewhere very clearly.
.

This is speculation. What you are describing are "visions". You should know that such things happened to Ellen White, the founder of the SDA church, and the way that Joe Smith received his knowledge about the Book of Mormon being scripture.

Perhaps is the operational word here, You gotta back up that with Scripture

But also, remember King David, I think , or Job, said somewhere that the dead do not do anything - they dead do not praise the Lord from the grave, etc .... .... which would seem to indicate that the soul of those whose bodies are in the grave are generally NOT doing exactly what Scripture says they are not doing - anything.

That's just a general view at the moment..... an 'opinion' for those readers who have been looking for 'opinions' :) ...

So while you are berating me for not answering an unspecified question of yours, you go off on a tangent, and speculate, having so Scripture to support your guess. Would that be accurate?
 
You didn't answer the question nor address the issue. You said that you maintain that the soul doesn't sleep. So what? You cannot prove it.

In order to maintain the fantasy of "soul sleep" you need to establish, using Scripture what constitutes our soul. After you have described that then you have to first make a definition and distinction of soul sleep, and tell why it is different from the sleep we give to our physical bodies. Third, you have to explain the purpose of having our soul go to sleep at death

{quote] Who said I believe the professor and pastor are wrong ? I saw only or mainly a discussion of universalism , which is quite bluntly a non-subject for me - I don't care if they believe in universalism or not. It doesn't matter in the least to me. (as far as I can gather briefly, universalism is like calvinism, or rcccatholicism, or mormonism, or buddhism --- subjects without merit or substance enough to even be considered a topic of conversation for more than a few moments in passing if needed.[/QUOTE]

Do you understand the connection between "soul sleep" and universalism? I think not, so I shall explain.

While this might not come about in the discussion, the frequently unstated purpose of "soul sleep" is to provide a "second chance" to those who are not saved when they die. The people who promote this "second chance" are usually people who despair at the idea of only one chance to get to heaven, that is by faith in Jesus Christ alone. They reason that while some stubborn people are not initially saved, that having a "second chance" would allow the unrepentant person an opportunity to repent, and thus enter heaven, better late than never.

This sort of doctrine sounds lovey-dovey and "all in love" it is really an assault on the Atonement of Jesus. Essentially it says that the Atonement, done only once at Calvary is insufficient to save some, so there has to be a second chance; hence "soul sleep". Many people believing this also believe that there is no "third chance" at going to heaven. The title of this sort of universalism is "hypothetical universalism".

The other type of universalism states that all of humanity, including Joseph Stalin, Adolph Hitler and Osama Ben Laden will also go to heaven. This is really the biggest affront to the Atonement because it essentially says that what Jesus did on the Cross was not necessary for any one to be saved.

Because in both types of universalism, the body is dead, there must be a place for the soul. Therefore, they invented the belief that the soul takes a nap, and will be awake at some future, unknown date. Understand?

Your comparisons of universalism and Buddhism is inaccurate because the Buddhists preach reincarnation, based upon works.
Your comparisons of universalism and Mormonism is close. They do believe in a universal heaven, but they the special people who get married in the Temple will be gods and wives.
Your comparisons of universalism and the RCC is inaccurate because while some are saved in the church, too many depend upon their works, attending masses, etc,
Your comparisons of universalism with the Calvinists and Arminians is inaccurate because while most of the members of each group are saved, they bicker at HOW one is saved.

I sincerely hope that this post helps you to to learn more. My body is tired, so it has to sleep.
 
Yes, we can demonstrate that the soul does not sleep after death. These verses teach that for:
(1) Unbelievers:
  • In Hades are conscious and in torment (Luke 16:23 ESV);
  • Are “under punishment [after death] until the day of judgment” (2 Peter 2:9 ESV);
(2) Believers:
  • Are immediately in Paradise at death (Luke 23:43 ESV);
  • Long for a heavenly dwelling (2 Cor. 5:2 ESV);
  • Are away from the body [at death] and are at home with the Lord (2 Cor. 5:8 ESV);
  • Deaths are gain (Phil. 1:21) and they depart at death to “be with Christ” (Phil. 1:23);
  • Are martyred souls who “cried out with a loud voice, ‘O Sovereign Lord . . .” (Rev. 6:9-11). They were conscious after death so that they could speak to the Lord.
3d-red-star-small.png
Believers will be like Christ after their physical death (see passages such as Rom. 8:29; 1 Cor. 15:49; Phil. 3:21; 1 John 3:2).

3d-red-star-small.png
They will be with Him (eg John 14:3; 2 Cor. 5:8; Phil. 1:23; Col. 3:4; 1 Thess. 3:18; 4:17, etc.).

3d-red-star-small.png
They will share Christ’s glory (Rom. 8:18, 30; 2 Cor. 3:18; 4:17, etc.);

3d-red-star-small.png
They will share Christ’s reign (2 Tim. 2:12; Rev. 2:26-27; etc.).

3d-red-star-small.png
As children of God, in that intermediate state, we will enjoy perfect fellowship with Christ (see Rev. 21:3,7).

3d-red-star-small.png
We will be worshipping Him (Rev. 7:15; 22:3) and be before His face (Matt. 5:8; 1 Cor. 13:12, etc.) [verses from Spencer 2005, pp. 438-441].
Dr. Robert Morey (2006) provides these verses as “the primary NT texts that refute soul sleep”: Matt. 22:23-33; Lk. 16:19-31; Lk. 23:43; Acts 7:59; 2 Cor. 5:1-10; Phil 1:21-25; Heb. 12:18-24.

See also Robert Morey’s interaction with a soul sleep promoter, Jacob Prasch, ‘A Surprise Encounter’ (30 October 2007).

There is ample evidence from Scripture to demonstrate that soul sleep is not a biblical doctrine. It is taught by the JWs, Christadelphians, SDAs, and is now seeping into the evangelical church - but without scriptural foundation.
Works consulted

Morey, R. 2006. "Jacob Prasch's soul sleep heresy exposed!", Faith Defenders, 3 November, available from: http://www.faithdefenders.com/ministry/deskof/drmorey/Jacob Prasch and Soul Sleep.htm (Accessed 1 October 2007).

Spencer, S. R. 2005, "Last Things, Doctrine of", in Kevin J. Vanhoozer (gen. ed.), Dictionary for Theological Interpretation of the Bible, 438-441. London: SPCK/Baker Academic.​


Thank you for this scripture and information packed post.


JLB
 
Thanks, JLB. Are those Scriptures going to make any difference on your view of soul sleep?

I don't believe in soul sleep.

Luke 16 is clear, as well 2 Corinthians 5.

Most scriptures that are used to justify the soul sleep doctrine are a reference to the body the sleeps in the dust.


JLB
 
I don't believe in soul sleep.

Luke 16 is clear, as well 2 Corinthians 5.

Most scriptures that are used to justify the soul sleep doctrine are a reference to the body the sleeps in the dust.
JLB

These are nothing more than your assertions. You have not provided exegetical evidence from Luke 16 or 2 Corinthians 5 to refute the evidence I have provided. Do you not want to get into the exegetical evidence? Assertions prove nothing except to provide your opinion. That gets our discussion nowhere.
 
These are nothing more than your assertions. You have not provided exegetical evidence from Luke 16 or 2 Corinthians 5 to refute the evidence I have provided. Do you not want to get into the exegetical evidence? Assertions prove nothing except to provide your opinion. That gets our discussion nowhere.


Do you believe in soul sleep?


JLB
 
Do you believe in soul sleep?

JLB

Don't you read what I write? If you read what I wrote above at #68, you would not be asking this question. Why didn't you note the content of what I wrote at #68?

Of course I don't believe in soul sleep because it is not a biblical teaching and I've provided evidence in this thread. I'm amazed that you ask this kind of question of me.
 
Don't you read what I write? If you read what I wrote above at #68, you would not be asking this question. Why didn't you note the content of what I wrote at #68?

Of course I don't believe in soul sleep because it is not a biblical teaching and I've provided evidence in this thread. I'm amazed that you ask this kind of question of me.


I read what you wrote.

But you also wrote -

These are nothing more than your assertions. You have not provided exegetical evidence from Luke 16 or 2 Corinthians 5 to refute the evidence I have provided. Do you not want to get into the exegetical evidence? Assertions prove nothing except to provide your opinion. That gets our discussion nowhere.

This statement seems to be a little double minded from what you wrote in your post, which is why I asked.

I simply read what Jesus and Paul wrote about the after life and that was clear to me.

I just simply believed what they wrote like a little child.

I don't need to get into exegetical evidence, which will lead to having to depend upon someones opinion about some Greek tense, and how certain words should be interpreted...


Thanks JLB
 
I read what you wrote.

But you also wrote -

This statement seems to be a little double minded from what you wrote in your post, which is why I asked.

I simply read what Jesus and Paul wrote about the after life and that was clear to me.

I just simply believed what they wrote like a little child.

I don't need to get into exegetical evidence, which will lead to having to depend upon someones opinion about some Greek tense, and how certain words should be interpreted...

Thanks JLB

Don't you believe that exegesis of a biblical text is necessary? How do you arrive at an understanding of any verse or paragraph in OT or NT without understanding the grammar, including the meaning of words?

Do you understand what an assertion is?
 
Don't you believe that exegesis of a biblical text is necessary? How do you arrive at an understanding of any verse or paragraph in OT or NT without understanding the grammar, including the meaning of words?

Do you understand what an assertion is?


22 So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham's bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 24 Then he cried and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.' 25 But Abraham said, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented.


I read what Jesus said here and I believe what He said.
 
22 So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham's bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 24 Then he cried and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.' 25 But Abraham said, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented.

I read what Jesus said here and I believe what He said.

So do I believe what it says and the points are that at death:
  1. Both the unbeliever and believer are having a conscious experience;
  2. They are not asleep.
  3. The believer is in Abraham's bosom;
  4. The unbeliever is in Hades;
  5. The unbeliever is experiencing torment in Hades.
  6. There is no soul sleep here.
So you quote a section of Scripture to try to support your doctrine of soul sleep, but it doesn't teach that at all.
 
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