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Bible Study Spiritual Discernment

for_his_glory

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Yes the truth in the Bible has to be spiritually discerned. But the spirit cannot teach what people have not read and we are not to wait for the spirit to prompt us to read the bible.
As it is it is the word of God, it doesn't contain the word of God or become the word of God under the influence of the spirit.
I agree as God's Spirit is not going to prompt us to read the Bible. Those who hunger for Spiritual truth will seek the Holy Spirit as they hunger for the word.

2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
2 Timothy 2:16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

What is written in the Bible are the verbal inspired words of God as He instructed the Prophets and Apostles what to write. God is the living word as the Bible is God's word written down like a journal if you will, that we need to be reading and studying everyday by first praying and asking the Holy Spirit to teach us from within the Spiritual realm of God. The carnal mind cannot perceive the things of the Spirit as wisdom and understanding can only come by hearing and knowing the voice of the Holy Spirit who speaks to us, sometimes verbally or puts thoughts in our mind that we search out within the scriptures, 1 Corinthians 2:6-16.
 

Edward

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Second, God is spirit! So we don't hear an audible voice from the Lord. He can come across with enough power that it might sound audible to you, but the Lord is not walking in the flesh at this moment unless you mean He can use people like you or me, so He does not speak in sound waves. So we have to be seeking His voice. Paul said He took all thoughts captive to Jesus Christ.

Nope. Nope. Nope. I disagree with this here. It is incorrect. Where did you hear that spirits can not speak audibly in sound waves to man? What scripture is that? And what makes think that spirits have to be in the flesh at the moment they speak audibly to man?

I saw nothing or no one. He did not manifest. He was not in the flesh. I've had others try to tell me that I didn't hear the voice across the room but in my head. Like there's no difference between a thinking voice and an audible voice which is spoken!

You don't have to believe me and I'm not asking for your credit card number. But I know what I know. Because I was there. In that moment.

Are you suggesting that, this encounter which happened to me...was not the Lord? Not the Kingdom of God? Then what? Evil spirits deceiving Edward saying pray for your friend, pray fast he needs help!!! ??? Ummm, that's rather humorous Brother!

I totally agree with you that as a general rule, yes we should test all spirits. But I'm here to tell you that when the Lord walks into your room and speaks...it wont be necessary to test Him because He comes in power and love and it permeates every fiber of your being. You know who it is. I knew who it was. Maybe it's not the same with Angels or like if Abraham came to visit you or something like that so we'll test those guys, lol.

Hey I wonder if I hadn't questioned about what happened to make a Brother need help, but instead questioned HM. Who are You? ...If He would have still taken the warning tone with me?
 

Edward

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We need to test the spirits like the Bible says - see 1 John 4:1-3

We need to read the Bible with the Holy Spirit, and thereby listening to what He has to say to us!

If we don't practice listening to Him and what He has to say to us, then we start calling the lines of text in the Bible 'the word' instead of calling him 'the Word'!!

Isaiah explained this:

Is 28:12,13 He who said to them, "Here is rest, give rest to the weary," And, "Here is repose," but they would not listen. So the word of the Lord to them will be, "Order on order, order on order, Line on line, line on line, a little here, a little there" That they may go stumbling backward, be broken, snared and taken captive.
:

Heb 5:14 But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil.

Don't misunderstand me when I talk about His word. I call it the word or His word, but it isn't HIM. But, it did come from Him. And it is unlike any other book ever written on earth. Because it wasn't written on earth and that is proven.

He made that book special just by His nature it is. The book is not to be worshipped. But, wow man, it's kind of like a smart phone without batteries, lol. I guarantee you that all of your answers are in there. Except much of it is coded which requires divine intervention to release understanding to us! It's no good to you if you don't read it. So you probably shouldn't speak about it as if it is not in any way special book. It is. And there's a two key locking system on it. One key is held by man and used when he reads it. The 2nd key is when the Holy Spirit unlocks it for you.

It is a very special book. Yet I could stand on mine without feeling conviction also. Understand?
 

K2CHRIST

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Because it wasn't written on earth and that is proven.

It was written on earth!!!!

It was written by men who listened to Him and wrote like He told them to!

When we start calling the sacred writing the Word of God, when His name is called the Word of God then we start making it God instead of writings! That then is compounded by when we start saying or writing things like the Bible speaks about itself, because the Bible neither speaks nor are the writings a person to be referred to as a "self". Then we find where Christians are saying the Bible is alive, because we told them it was the word of God and it is written the word is alive and active.

You know, they have ever reason to be deceived into thinking the since we told them the Bible was written in heaven and not on earth, and we told them the Bible speaks, and we told them the Bible was a "self" so a person, and we told them the Bible was the Word of God and they read in the Bible that the Word is alive and they read that the Word was in the beginning with God and is God, so obviously based on what came through us, the Bible is God.

Oh we can go back and try to justify what we said by now saying that we don't think the Bible is the Christ, but we still keep calling the Bible "The Word of God" instead of Him. So why do we do that?

We are talking about discernment of spirit, and have we been testing the spirit as instructed by those who listened to Him and wrote down what He told them?

Now I pointed out a scriptures where Isaiah was actually quoting the Lord and He was saying that if we don't listen then the word of God to us would be the line upon line of text - The Bible the line upon line of text that some call the word of God. So can't we even read the Bible and see that we are not listening to Him like we should and that is the reason that we call the Bible the word of God instead of Him. We are doing just like the Lord told Isaiah and the Lord has proven to be correct in us!!

We need to seek Him more! We need to listen to Him more! We need to be honest at least with ourselves, don't we?

He speaks to me! Still, I confess I don't even listen to Him like I should. Oh, I hear Him talking to me every day and usually about a dozen times a day. Before writing this I had spent all afternoon watch games on tv and not listening to Him one bit. But after the games I got up, thanked Him and started listening to Him. He ask if I would write a bit more on this forum. So I did.

He wants His people to seek Him and His voice - so who tells us that the Bible is His voice? Who told us it was ok not to test the spirit? Who told us the Bible speaks? Who told us the Bible is a person so as to be called a "self"? In fact, who told us the Bible was not written on earth? It was! The Lord told people living on earth at the time to write down things!! So is was written on earth!

I was a retail manager when the Lord came into my life. One day I was thinking about making displays for summer, so I asked Him what He thought. He told me something like this "Karl, you could put air in a raft and hang it from the ceiling, but not many people look up. So Karl I want you to bring a message on earth."

He is soo weird sometimes, but from what He told me I understood that if people looked up He wouldn't need us giving a message to people hear on earth, but people don't tend to look up. So the Bible was written hear on earth as message!!
 

K2CHRIST

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Yes the truth in the Bible has to be spiritually discerned. But the spirit cannot teach what people have not read and we are not to wait for the spirit to prompt us to read the bible.
As it is it is the word of God, it doesn't contain the word of God or become the word of God under the influence of the spirit.

Of course the Spirit can teach people things that they have not read!! That is in fact what He does most of the time! Where do we think the writings came from - and who do we think God is?

Actually we should understand that the Spirit does not speak on His own initiative but as He hears He speaks. So the Spirit really acts like a living telephone line to the Lord Jesus Christ and He is the Teacher. Yet the teachings do come through the Holy Spirit speaking the words He gets from Jesus Christ to us. And to think that our Lord Jesus Christ can only teach things in the Bible just doesn't make sense at all.

I remember one day I was reading a book on the current theories on the cosmos and was having trouble understanding what the author was saying, so I decide to ask the Lord if He could help me figure out what the author of that book was talking about. He answer "Yes I can do that. I am not saying it is right but....." and He just started talking to me about the ideas the author had and made if clear to me. So God can even teach you what others are trying to get through to you, if you decide to ask Him for help with it. So how much more can He teach you about the things He wants you to know? I can even begin to tell you all the things He teaches me about. I can even begin to tell you how many times I was having to figure things out on my computer and asked Him for help. You know what - God knows how your computer works. ---- and everything else too.

We just don't talk to Him much and it shows in what we say and assume. Now He might not teach you everything, and there are certainly things that you can't understand anyway, but He will answer questions in the way they should be answered. So talk to Him about things. And considering this thread start talking to Him about discernment of spirits!

You want something He showed me about discernment of spirit that is important to understand. Look at the very first words that snake in the garden said and you will see the first thing Satan generally tries on you. So what were those first words from the serpent of old? The snake started by saying, "Did God really say?"

My friends the first thing that Satan tries to do is to get you to doubt that God really says things to you!! So consider, who told us that God doesn't say things to us concerning things other than the Bible? Of course the Lord is willing to talk to us about anything, but someone might have said to us "Did God really say" when we thought about asking Him for information on items other than the Bible.
 

Edward

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Oh we can go back and try to justify what we said by now saying that we don't think the Bible is the Christ, but we still keep calling the Bible "The Word of God" instead of Him. So why do we do that?
Because I tend to call Him Jesus and the Bible the Word to differentiate what I'm saying at the time.

You're straining at gnats trying to wrong what I have said by being a type of wordsmith and assigning meaning of my words to according to your own grammar technicalities that you may operate by but people, just don't talk in 100% agreement with regard to meanings and dialects. You sort of asked for clarification and when I give it you can't just tell me that, this is what you meant. When it wasnt.


The Bible is not God. I'm not saying it's God. I'm not saying it has a personality. I don't say don't seek Jesus seek the book. Come on Brother. What? I don't understand why you're taking me to task on what seems to be a small misunderstanding. We're usually in complete agreement with each others posts.

And the word was written in heaven. The book, not Jesus. Jesus wrote the book. Now whether or not he sat at a desk with a pen and did it, I do not know. But I do know that it was dictated to the people on earth who put the words down on scrolls to make the book. Jesus already knew what ia in the book before He gave to the writers. So you might as well say it was written in heaven.

There is entirely too much hidden things in the texts of scripture itself for it to have been contrived by man. That was book was dictated and every dot & tittle was given. Man can't write like that on their best day.

Again Brother, what makes you think that Spirits can not speak to man? Where did that come from? I have never heard that anywhere before.

And also...If that was not the Lord which spoke to me, then what spirit do you think accosted me that day that I did not test it? If it was not from God then it is against God, right? Ok so, why would an evil spirit come tell me to pray for a Brother in Christ to receive help? Or perhaps you think that I was having a hallucination? Hearing voices there, Edward?
Maybe, just maybe. Can't be too sure can we?

Oh waitaminute, but the Brother in Christ did need help. He did get help. He confirmed all of it for me. After I prayed for hi to get help and the strong presence of the Lord went away...I'm left sitting there curious to know what did happen and was my friend ok? SO I sent him a private message (on this forum here in fact, for he is a member here) and told him what happened to me and that I prayed for him to get help and all that. He did need help, he did get it but I don't really think I should go into further detail than that or give his name because, I don't know if he would appreciate that or not, so I'll play it safe. It was a close call though but he is ok.

So...that was an evil spirit because your doctrine says it can't happen like that for various reasons? Well I don't know what to tell you Brother. His ways and thoughts are above ours so one of is is not understanding something about the hows and ways of what happened that day. And certainly no offense meant Brother, but I happened to be there that day and attest to exactly what happened. So the man with experience is not at the mercy of the man with the doctrine. So I'm sorry if you don't believe me for any reason...

But, if you act now with a donation of 45 dollars you too can get the package of how you too can receive divine intervention in your time of needs. So get that credit card ready and call now!

Oh sorry, Sid Roth in the background, lol. I don't want your money.
 

Edward

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It was written on earth!!!!

It was written by men who listened to Him and wrote like He told them to!

You want to hear my testimony of when a friend bought me a new NIV bible and then a different showed me a lot of missing verses in it and then one day it was not an NIV any more but was suddenly a NKJV Bible?

There's three people (including myself) that can attest to the truth of this. And I'd be happy to put you into touch with either one of them if you wish. For verification. In the mouth of two or more witnesses the truth is established.

Yes. I've had lots of strange things happen to me. The Lord is Very Good. Some I asked for, other things He just does. But (as you know) the Lord always confirms it when He Blesses you.

And...you made a very good point...we have to actually believe that the Lord is talking to us when He does!
And He does more than people realize.

He has spoken to me audibly, inside of me, through oter people, through videos, through scripture, and through this forum board. I can't count how many times I've prayed and asked something, and the next time I check new posts, there's a thread on it and it speaks directly to me.

So Brothers & Sisters...Believe it that it is the Lord speaking to you! If you're not sure, then do what I do...Lord is that you?
 

K2CHRIST

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You want to hear my testimony of when a friend bought me a new NIV bible and then a different showed me a lot of missing verses in it and then one day it was not an NIV any more but was suddenly a NKJV Bible?

There's three people (including myself) that can attest to the truth of this. And I'd be happy to put you into touch with either one of them if you wish. For verification. In the mouth of two or more witnesses the truth is established.

Yes. I've had lots of strange things happen to me. The Lord is Very Good. Some I asked for, other things He just does. But (as you know) the Lord always confirms it when He Blesses you.

And...you made a very good point...we have to actually believe that the Lord is talking to us when He does!
And He does more than people realize.

He has spoken to me audibly, inside of me, through oter people, through videos, through scripture, and through this forum board. I can't count how many times I've prayed and asked something, and the next time I check new posts, there's a thread on it and it speaks directly to me.

So Brothers & Sisters...Believe it that it is the Lord speaking to you! If you're not sure, then do what I do...Lord is that you?

A few things from above:

First, Let me give you a testimony. The Lord asked me to open a Christian bookstore for Him. He didn't ask me through the Bible. He didn't ask me through friends. He didn't ask me through my friends. He asked me!! Him and I talk and I pick Him telling me words that come to me inside my spirit and He backed it up with incredible things. So let me give you the testimony.

I was working as a retail manager with a large well-know drug chain. Now I had been given an assignment by the drug chain and I had asked my Lord Jesus Christ if He would help me with it. He told me He would, but He didn't tell me then. He didn't tell me later. I was still waiting for Him when I decided I need to go in on my day off to get it done. So I had come to work, was sitting in the parking lot, and I talked to my Lord telling Him that I had to get this done. I reminded Him that He had promised me that He was going to help me, and told Him now was the time. He responded in words that I clearly heard in my spirit. They were not sound waves, so they were not audible!! They were Him talking to me through His Holy Spirit and to my spirit! Not sound waves. Not audible. Not the Bible. Not friends. It was Him, my Lord talking to me.

So when I specifically asked Him what I needed to do, He specifically responded saying, "Go home!"

Being a human, this kind of upset me. So I responded, "Lord, you want me to go home??"

He responded, "Go Home, you are quitting."

"I quitting!!", I responded, now very upset.

He answered, "Yes. Go Home you are quitting."

So when I say Him and I talk, I actually mean that Him and I talk! It's not the Bible, It is not my friend, but by Friend. It is not a feeling, it is His small voice talking to me in words!!

I started driving home thinking 'wow, He wants me to quit. I didn't like this. It was a good paying job with good benefits. What was I to do? I believe the Lord He is God, so I should go home and quit, like He told me. But I hadn't quit yet. I did however head towards home. It was a nice bright sunny day, but all I could see was the storm, spiritually speaking, that was in front of me if I did quit like He was telling me. So I came up with and idea. I would ask the Lord for confirmation, like putting out a fleece. I specifically asked Him. "Lord can you confirm what you are asking through my pastor, because this was a big ask of me. "

He responded, "Sure Karl, I can do that." - Again we talked, back and forth and in words from His Holy Spirit to my spirit!!!!

When I got home He had me call my pastor. His wife said that he would be home soon and to cover over in an hour, and so I did. We went up to a room he had upstairs and the pastor at my church and I talked. I told Him what I was hearing and asked what he thought about it. He told me about how the Lord had told Him to quit his job to open up the church that he had, and he had a job that was better than mine. So he felt that I needed to do what the Lord told me. My pastor knew the Lord like I knew the Lord. They talked. He heard his Lord Jesus Christ. He had quit a job as a VP in a corporation where he was making $80,000 a year and that was about 30 years ago. He had quit because he and His Lord talked. It was not his Bible. It was not some feeling. It was not his friends, but it was his Lord who told him to quit and open a church for Jesus Christ.

Now my Lord is God and He was about to show it. After my pastor told me his testimony and gave his advice that I do what I heard the Lord tell me - suddenly there was a lightning flash and powerful thunder shook the room. This quite literally happened.

Then just my Lord told me, "Karl, that is a sign your meeting is over. Tell pastor that he is needed downstairs." It was not the Bible. Not my friends. Not some feeling, but it was my Lord talking to me in words!

So I told the pastor what the Lord said, but as we started to go downstairs we noticed that it had started coming down hard outside. Instead of that sunny day I had a couple of hours ago, clouds had come over the mountain and we now had a storm. We went to the window to watch the down pour.

Right then a pickup truck pulled up in front of his house. This was weird because the truck had snow on it. That was very weird because it didn't snow where we were at. In the mountains, sure, but not where we lived. Still, it was coming down hard and I blurted out, "Maybe it's snowing". I soon as I said it I felt foolish, because it indeed never did snow where we were at. I had live there a dozen years and I never seen it snow. Yet my pastor, just as surprised said, "That is my daughter and she was just around the corner."

Yeah - it was snowing and hard. We went downstairs and opened the door and watched the snow coming down hard. I said 'goodbye', got in my car and started driving away. Then the Lord spoke to me again, saying, "Karl, isn't it beautiful driving into the storm?"

He is sooo weird. I was about to quit my good job. All I could see were clouds ahead, and He had caused it to snow as confirmation that it was Him, and all He has to say to me is, "Isn't it beautiful driving into the storm?"

The Bible didn't tells me that! My friends didn't tell me that! It was not an unction or felling, it was my Lord Jesus Christ talking to me in words from His Holy Spirit speaking to my spirit!!!
 

K2CHRIST

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"Continued testimony from above:

He didn't stop there though. He continued to do a bunch of other things just to make is perfectly clear that He was God. He asked me to take my son out for something to eat. On the say I told me son a parable that the Lord had given me about a ball of fire heading toward the earth. As I told my son this parable the Lord had told me a day earlier suddenly we saw a falling star. The timing was just weird, and I don't know what to make of it still, but it had to be Him.

Then He asked me to go spend the night at my mom's, which made very little sense to me, except that I guess I did want to tell her all that was going on that day. On the way there I ran out of gas on the freeway. The Lord had me buy a car in which the gas gage didn't work. So I depended on the Lord to tell me when I needed gas, because it always showed full. He was great at telling me when I needed gas, but that same night as all the rest I ran our of gas on the freeway. I was too far from the off ramp. So I ran on the side of the freeway with my gas can I kept in the car. It turned out that the side of the road still had snow on it! So not only was it beautiful watching the snow come down, but I was now running through it! I got to the bottom of the ramp, and went up to the first gas station for gas but the attendant said they were changing shifts and it would be 7 minutes. He didn't say 5 or 10 minutes, but 7 minutes. I was getting a bit tired of all this stuff. So I ran across the street to the other gas station.

I was getting gas in my can when a lady suddenly asked me rather bluntly, "Where is your car?"

I explain my car was on the freeway and that I was out of gas. She responds by tell me to get in her car. It was an order, said bluntly and boldly. I tried to tell her it was not far away, but she wouldn't take no for an answer. So I got in the car and she drove me to my car. On that ways she just starts telling me that the only reason that she is taking my back to my car was because she had talked to God and she told her that if He would fix her car she would help out people in need, because her car was always breaking down on her. He agreed and indeed did fix her car and she had not had problems since. So I got a testimony about talking to the Lord, His power to help, and I got preached to.

Frankly, I like it. I don't want to sound like the only fool believing in the Lord. It was nice to have a pastor that knew what it was like to quit a good job just because the Lord had told him. It was nice to meet a lady in the storm who when she had problems had turned to the Lord and made an agreement with Him to help others like me. Frankly, it is nice to know Him. So I was indeed going to quit my job!

It was actually the next day that He told me to go down the main street of our town and He told me that He wanted me to open up a Christian bookstore there. He told me the name of it, and I quit my job that day, and giving them a two weeks notice.

He changed my life. Since then, almost 20 years ago, I have been self employed. No longer do I report to anyone but my Lord. I opened and ran the bookstore for a couple of years, then He had me give it to a pastor and I thinking it is still going. As for me, I still sell books but online. As for Him and I, we still talk! He is not my Bible. He is my Friend. But I do not hear "audible words" because He talks to me by His Holy Spirit to my spirit. I have a couple of times hear Him speak to me so clear that I thought it was an audible voice, but it wasn't. God is spirit.
 

K2CHRIST

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So Brothers & Sisters...Believe it that it is the Lord speaking to you! If you're not sure, then do what I do...Lord is that you?

Now, back to discernment of spirits.

So what if you are not sure it is the Lord. What do you do? And let me add to the question and point out that we are instructed to test the spirits and to be wise! There are other spirit around and about. To think otherwise is just foolish.

In the testimony I gave above, I didn't mention about testing the spirit, but I did. I didn't have time, even in two posts, to cover all the conversations I had with Him at that time!! Seriously, if I was to write down every word that exchanges between Him and I everyday, I suppose the whole world couldn't contain the writings. You read something about that in the Bible, right?

Isaiah wrote - Is 30:21 "Your ears will hear a word behind you, “This is the way, walk in it,” whenever you turn to the right or to the left.

So how many times do you turn to the right or to the left everyday?

There is a false concept we wind up promoting and that is that God is not always with us! He always with us! You don't want to hear all we talk about, and neither do you want to hear all my wife has to say to me either, and thought she lives with me she is not always with me like my Lord. Still, He is not the only spirit around. So test the spirit like instructed.

1 Jn 4:1-3 "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God; and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world."

It is an easy and quick test -"Tell me Jesus Christ came in the flesh" - then listen.

So are we going to say who great we are at reading, studying, and knowing what's written in the Scripture, and even go so far as to say the Bible is the Word of God, thereby excluding Jesus as the Word of God, then not even apply what we read? That is just being a hypocrite. So apply what is written like the Lord tells you, or are you going to tell me your Lord matches up with the Bible and still not apply what is written?

Frankly, He once took me to that verse and told me to use it. I don't think I apply it as much as I should, but I do apply it, especially when I am "not sure" if what I am hearing if from the Lord.

I also realize the importance of practicing using my spiritual senses. The more I practice listening the better I get at being aware of what is going on around me - meaning I get better at figuring out what those dark forces I battle with are up to and better at figuring out what my Lord Jesus Christ is up to. So I hear from Him usually about a dozen times a day and sometimes I hear from angels that He sends to minister to me, and sometimes I figure out that I am under attack by those dark forces. You understand they are called "dark" forces because they like to hide in the dark places. They don't want you to know about them, but they are around. We understand that, right? There is a reason to discuss this topic, right? So test the spirit and practice using your spiritual sense, and don't get in a spirit of pride that tells you that you know it all so you don't have to test the spirit!

Heb 5:14 But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil.
 

for_his_glory

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There are times when I am not sure if it is the Holy Spirit or me speaking to myself. The Holy Spirit at times sends me on a journey through different scriptures until I finally know that He is telling me what I need to know. I like this as He makes me do the work sometimes, and other times He just simply tells me.
 

Edward

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It was not the Bible. Not my friends. Not some feeling, but it was my Lord talking to me in words!

You must have misunderstood something that I said to you because you keep harping on this as if I said it's only through the Bible or people that He speaks to me. That is incorrect. I merely listed the different ways that He has spoken to me. Not the only way. Ok?

The Lord speaks to me in words also. Inside of me. That is His still small voice. We have had many conversations like that. AND He has also spoken to me audibly that one time. In sound waves. Audibly.
 

K2CHRIST

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You must have misunderstood something that I said to you because you keep harping on this as if I said it's only through the Bible or people that He speaks to me. That is incorrect. I merely listed the different ways that He has spoken to me. Not the only way. Ok?

The Lord speaks to me in words also. Inside of me. That is His still small voice. We have had many conversations like that. AND He has also spoken to me audibly that one time. In sound waves. Audibly.

The Lord speaks to me in words also

What I am pointing out as incorrect is the "also" in the above statement!

The Lord communicates with us in many ways - but He speaks to us in words!!! - that small voice, which can sound audible if He chooses.

This thread is about discernment of spirits and there is a type of spirit, a religious spirit, which attempts to turn us away from the Lord by turning us to "religion". That "religious" spirit tries to trick us into believing God speaks to us through the things of God instead of through His Son via the Holy Spirit!

Of course that is not the only method the dark forces us. They might turn a person to drugs, sex, money, and so on... however for some people, the kind of person that might like to post on a Christian Forum, the method of attack is probably to be to turn them to things of God instead of the Son of God.

So they say the Bible speaks, as opposed to the Son speaks. If the Bible speaks it is alive. And if alive and the Word of God, it might be active because it is written the Word is alive and active. Then we have made an inanimate object a living being with the word of God - we have make an idol out of the Bible. That snake as bent the logic this way and that way and have us thinking the Scriptures give us eternal life, and we are communicating that to others, whether we realize it or not!!

So someone might think I am making a big deal out of nothing, but it is a big deal because we unknowingly come into agreement with evil spirit who influenced us. We unknowingly came into that agreement because we didn't take all thoughts captive to Jesus Christ, and we didn't seek Him like we should. So then our Lord has to point it out to us. He reproves those He loves.

Edward - I know you hear from the Lord speaking to you. I have read many things you have written and you are one of the people whose writings I really like, because you do hear from the Lord. Yet this is one of the things that needs to be discussed in a thread about discernment of spirit, because Satan is going to come at the believers. He is not going to keep you from our Lord Jesus Christ, but the dark forces are going to do what they can to mess us up. Failing to understand that it is our Lord Jesus Christ is the Word of God because He is who we are to go to for the words God personally has to say to us, wind up saying things like God speaks to us through the Bible. In doing that we lead people to the Bible for internal life, instead of to Jesus Christ for eternal life!

He once told me:

WE DON’T HAVE UNDERSTANDING BECAUSE WE DON’T READ THE BIBLE WITH UNDERSTANDING, BUT OUR UNDERSTANDING…. UNDERSTAND???

THE SCRIPTURES ARE RIGHT, BUT THEY ARE NOT RIGHTEOUS. THEY HAVE NO ABILITY TO ACT. THEY ARE NOT ALIVE, BUT THE WORD OF GOD IS ALIVE AND ACTIVE.

WE DON’T USE THE LORD TO PREACH THE SCRIPTURES; WE USE THE SCRIPTURES TO PREACH THE LORD!!

If we listen to Him He explains what I am talking about. We don't have understanding of the Bible without hearing Him, as Understanding, speaking to us personally. The Bible then does not speak to us!! He does!!

If we say the Bible speaks, then we are saying the Bible has the ability to take action and is thus alive and we now are preaching God as four persons (Father, Son, Spirit, and Holy Bible) That is a problem. We created an idol out of the Bible and wasn't that because of the effect of evil spirits in our lives.

If we say the Bible speaks "also" then we are now using the Lord and what He gave us to preach what he gave us "The Bible". There is no place in the Bible where is says to preach the Bible, but there is a place where is says to preach the Word. So if we call both Jesus Christ and the Bible "The Word" we have mislead other people into preaching the Bible instead of Jesus Christ! So people listening to us who should know better are now leading people to think that the knowing the Bible will give them eternal life. So even if we still know Him, our Lord Jesus Christ, we wind up raising up a generation who thinks, because of what we said and wrote, that they need to preach the Bible and that is hearing God speak to them.

So what happened before Jesus came that He had to tell the Jews: Jn 5:39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me;

They had teachers and those preaching in that time too. The Jews listened to their teachers and preachers, but they did not listen to Jesus Christ and His words. Was that not because they were at that time proclaiming the Scriptures were God speaking to them? I think so. How about you?
 

Edward

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They had teachers and those preaching in that time too. The Jews listened to their teachers and preachers, but they did not listen to Jesus Christ and His words. Was that not because they were at that time proclaiming the Scriptures were God speaking to them? I think so. How about you?

I think what the problem was, was that they had made it into a racket and were extorting money from the people. Jesus called them a bunch of hypocrites. Several times actually.
 

for_his_glory

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What I am pointing out as incorrect is the "also" in the above statement!

The Lord communicates with us in many ways - but He speaks to us in words!!! - that small voice, which can sound audible if He chooses.

This thread is about discernment of spirits and there is a type of spirit, a religious spirit, which attempts to turn us away from the Lord by turning us to "religion". That "religious" spirit tries to trick us into believing God speaks to us through the things of God instead of through His Son via the Holy Spirit!

Of course that is not the only method the dark forces us. They might turn a person to drugs, sex, money, and so on... however for some people, the kind of person that might like to post on a Christian Forum, the method of attack is probably to be to turn them to things of God instead of the Son of God.

So they say the Bible speaks, as opposed to the Son speaks. If the Bible speaks it is alive. And if alive and the Word of God, it might be active because it is written the Word is alive and active. Then we have made an inanimate object a living being with the word of God - we have make an idol out of the Bible. That snake as bent the logic this way and that way and have us thinking the Scriptures give us eternal life, and we are communicating that to others, whether we realize it or not!!

So someone might think I am making a big deal out of nothing, but it is a big deal because we unknowingly come into agreement with evil spirit who influenced us. We unknowingly came into that agreement because we didn't take all thoughts captive to Jesus Christ, and we didn't seek Him like we should. So then our Lord has to point it out to us. He reproves those He loves.

Edward - I know you hear from the Lord speaking to you. I have read many things you have written and you are one of the people whose writings I really like, because you do hear from the Lord. Yet this is one of the things that needs to be discussed in a thread about discernment of spirit, because Satan is going to come at the believers. He is not going to keep you from our Lord Jesus Christ, but the dark forces are going to do what they can to mess us up. Failing to understand that it is our Lord Jesus Christ is the Word of God because He is who we are to go to for the words God personally has to say to us, wind up saying things like God speaks to us through the Bible. In doing that we lead people to the Bible for internal life, instead of to Jesus Christ for eternal life!

He once told me:

WE DON’T HAVE UNDERSTANDING BECAUSE WE DON’T READ THE BIBLE WITH UNDERSTANDING, BUT OUR UNDERSTANDING…. UNDERSTAND???

THE SCRIPTURES ARE RIGHT, BUT THEY ARE NOT RIGHTEOUS. THEY HAVE NO ABILITY TO ACT. THEY ARE NOT ALIVE, BUT THE WORD OF GOD IS ALIVE AND ACTIVE.

WE DON’T USE THE LORD TO PREACH THE SCRIPTURES; WE USE THE SCRIPTURES TO PREACH THE LORD!!

If we listen to Him He explains what I am talking about. We don't have understanding of the Bible without hearing Him, as Understanding, speaking to us personally. The Bible then does not speak to us!! He does!!

If we say the Bible speaks, then we are saying the Bible has the ability to take action and is thus alive and we now are preaching God as four persons (Father, Son, Spirit, and Holy Bible) That is a problem. We created an idol out of the Bible and wasn't that because of the effect of evil spirits in our lives.

If we say the Bible speaks "also" then we are now using the Lord and what He gave us to preach what he gave us "The Bible". There is no place in the Bible where is says to preach the Bible, but there is a place where is says to preach the Word. So if we call both Jesus Christ and the Bible "The Word" we have mislead other people into preaching the Bible instead of Jesus Christ! So people listening to us who should know better are now leading people to think that the knowing the Bible will give them eternal life. So even if we still know Him, our Lord Jesus Christ, we wind up raising up a generation who thinks, because of what we said and wrote, that they need to preach the Bible and that is hearing God speak to them.

So what happened before Jesus came that He had to tell the Jews: Jn 5:39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me;

They had teachers and those preaching in that time too. The Jews listened to their teachers and preachers, but they did not listen to Jesus Christ and His words. Was that not because they were at that time proclaiming the Scriptures were God speaking to them? I think so. How about you?
I very seldom get an audible voice, but the Holy Spirit speaks to me by putting a word or thought in my mind and has me search the scriptures for my answer as then He confirms that of what He wanted me to search out.

I agree there is a spirit of religion as it's called Jezebel that can easily deceive those into believing a lie, but yet like Edward said, the Holy Spirit can speak to us in various ways. It's up to us to listen and to know it's the very Spirit of God speaking to us.
 

K2CHRIST

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I think what the problem was, was that they had made it into a racket and were extorting money from the people. Jesus called them a bunch of hypocrites. Several times actually.

That had nothing to do with them searching the Scripture for eternal life, like Jesus said they did! Perhaps they also searched the Scriptures for a way to make money also, but Jesus told them they searched the Scriptures thinking that in them they had eternal life. We know that only God can give us eternal life, so they felt the Scriptures were God and able to take action, and specifically the action to give them eternal life! When we start presenting the Scriptures as a being that can take action we promote that same thing!!

We say the Scriptures speak, and don't consider what we are saying. We are making the Scriptures a living being, specifically a god - an idol

And why was that happening? Remember that Jesus told the Pharisees that their father was the devil - so demonic influence! We need to test the spirit and we need take our thoughts to Jesus Christ and listen to Him and what He personally says to us personally, via the His Holy Spirit.
 

K2CHRIST

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I very seldom get an audible voice, but the Holy Spirit speaks to me by putting a word or thought in my mind and has me search the scriptures for my answer as then He confirms that of what He wanted me to search out.

I agree there is a spirit of religion as it's called Jezebel that can easily deceive those into believing a lie, but yet like Edward said, the Holy Spirit can speak to us in various ways. It's up to us to listen and to know it's the very Spirit of God speaking to us.

God can communicate with us in various ways!!

For example. The Lord can send the Holy Spirit to us with words that we can pick up on our spirit! We thus can hear Him speak! And we preach the Word of God!

He can also give us a dream, but the dream is not Him speaking to us, it is like Him making a movie for us to get across some information. Of course He could talk to us in the dream, but most dreams do not have Him talking to us. Still, we can talk to Him about those dreams and get answers, because we find the Word of God in our heart. The Lord once gave me a teaching on this.

He woke me up one morning with a vision, then He started speaking to me about the vision. In the vision I saw something like a chalk board with a diagram on it. It had "Dream" and an arrow to "Movie". It also had "Vision" with an arrow to "Painting". It had "Textbook" with an arrow to "Bible" It also had "Teacher" with an arrow to "The Lord" Then He talked to me about the vision.

He explained that if you see a movie you might get information about the producer of the movie but that doesn't mean you know the producer of the movie. He explained that if you saw a painting at an art gallery you might get information about the artist but that doesn't mean you know the artist. He then explained that if you pick up a text book and read you might get information from the author of the textbook, but that does not mean you know author. But if you talk to the Teacher and take His class you get to know the Lord personally.

Then He brought up king Nebuchadnezzar and how He gave Nebuchadnezzar a dream, but Nebuchadnezzar didn't know Him. Daniel knew Him and so Daniel got the interpretation from His voice because Daniel knew Him. Then the Lord brought up king Belshazzar and how he saw the vision of the hand and even the writing on the wall, but king Belshazzar didn't know Him. Daniel knew Him and listen to Him and got the interpretation of the writing.

Then He brought up the Pharisees who studied the Scriptures and kept to the traditions as they saw them, but they didn't know Him even though He stood in front of them in the flesh. Yet Anna and Simeon heard and knew Him even though He was He was just a child in the flesh.

Then He brought up His disciple and how they heard from Him and new Him as the Teacher. They listened to Him and they knew Him, the Word of God. So it was that He went over different ways that He communicates with people, but not all of them are Him speaking to them. Not all of them mean salvation to you. We are saved by faith and faith comes from hearing a word from Him, not from reading your Bible. So the Word of God we preach is found in your heart and perhaps on your lips, but it is not found on the ink of pages. That is from Him talking to others and asking those who did know Him to write down some things.

Yeah - there are many ways for Him to communicate with us, but faith comes from us hearing the words He speaks to us personally!! So are we really going to tell people the Bible speaks to us?

I read the Bible, but He speaks to me!

I get dreams at times, and He can speak to me about them!

I get visions and other impressions which often come from Him, but no matter who they are from He can speak to me about them!

He gave me the vision, then unlike king Belshazzar He spoke to me personally about it's meaning. He taught me. He teaches Me. We talk, and from those conversation I can tell people that they need to know Him personally!
 

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That had nothing to do with them searching the Scripture for eternal life, like Jesus said they did! Perhaps they also searched the Scriptures for a way to make money also, but Jesus told them they searched the Scriptures thinking that in them they had eternal life. We know that only God can give us eternal life, so they felt the Scriptures were God and able to take action, and specifically the action to give them eternal life! When we start presenting the Scriptures as a being that can take action we promote that same thing!!

We say the Scriptures speak, and don't consider what we are saying. We are making the Scriptures a living being, specifically a god - an idol

Perhaps they did. Well, we know they did and I think that you & I are probably more on the same page than we must sound like, lol. Maybe we should clarify just a wee bit for others benefit so no confusion is created.

I was not making the scriptures a god and understand it IS about relationship. He will speak to us. But I loke to emphasize that reading scripture is a very important thing for believers to do.

And you, you might be sounding like...reading scripture really doesn't matter one way or the other. But I don't think you're saying that at all. Mostly saying...don't idolize the scriptures. Am I right? And I agree with that or sure.

But if a non believer gets the desire to seek the Lord, or if a believer wants to draw closer to the Lord...what do they do? They reach for the scriptures. Any man can find God if he has the book and can read. It even teaches how to pray.

And we should remember that praying is important too and that, it is not a monologue. Prayer is a dialogue. So when you pray, it is good practice to pause at times and give the Lord a chance to speak, and listen for it. He WILL speak to you. Open your spirit to the presence of God and listen.

I've come to realize over time, that...reading scripture works the same way. Read a verse, pause, consider it, whats that mean Lord?, and listen. Read it again, listen, think about it, listen, meditate on it, listen...like that. Next verse. ;)
 

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Perhaps they did. Well, we know they did and I think that you & I are probably more on the same page than we must sound like, lol. Maybe we should clarify just a wee bit for others benefit so no confusion is created.

I was not making the scriptures a god and understand it IS about relationship. He will speak to us. But I loke to emphasize that reading scripture is a very important thing for believers to do.

And you, you might be sounding like...reading scripture really doesn't matter one way or the other. But I don't think you're saying that at all. Mostly saying...don't idolize the scriptures. Am I right? And I agree with that or sure.

But if a non believer gets the desire to seek the Lord, or if a believer wants to draw closer to the Lord...what do they do? They reach for the scriptures. Any man can find God if he has the book and can read. It even teaches how to pray.

And we should remember that praying is important too and that, it is not a monologue. Prayer is a dialogue. So when you pray, it is good practice to pause at times and give the Lord a chance to speak, and listen for it. He WILL speak to you. Open your spirit to the presence of God and listen.

I've come to realize over time, that...reading scripture works the same way. Read a verse, pause, consider it, whats that mean Lord?, and listen. Read it again, listen, think about it, listen, meditate on it, listen...like that. Next verse. ;)

Yeah - I have read enough of what your wrote to know you hear and know the Lord.

This thread was about discernment of spirit, and my remarks are in that context. Which it to say that evil spirit encourage us to make an idols! They can be pretty creative about how they go about influencing us, and since we do battle with the dark forces of this world, then they are working to influences us!! So How? How are they working to influences us in the wrong way?

If you have a desire for alcohol they are going to encourage you to drink and get drunk to mess you us. If you have a desire for money, they are going to get to seek that over seeking the Lord. So what if you have a desire to read the Bible? Are they not going to get you to make it about seeking the Bible instead of the Lord? Yeah - that is it.

So consider what is written and lets take a closer look at it:

But if a non believer gets the desire to seek the Lord, or if a believer wants to draw closer to the Lord...what do they do? They reach for the scriptures. Any man can find God if he has the book and can read. It even teaches how to pray.

If a non believer gets the desire to seek the Lord, can't they just seek Him and find Him???

He said He stands at the door and if anyone hears His voice and opens the door He will come into them and eat with them and them with Him (Rev 19:20)

So why don't we just tell them who have a desire to seek Him, to just seek Him and listen to Him? Who told us that would not work - that we actually have to point them to the Bible instead of Him so they can find Him? That is not according to the Bible, because it is not according to Him and what He said in the Bible!!

Now the first words I heard from Him were "Read Your Bible", so don't we think that if we get them to talk to Him, He will get them to read their Bible?

Indeed, according to what we say, we take people looking to find them and tell them to look to the Bible instead of Him!! That is making an idol out of their Bible! And it comes from a failure to believe that He is faithful to come into them when they hear His voice and open us to them!

The first thing that snake in the garden said was, "Did God really say?" The snake wants us to doubt what the Lord tells us. He tells us that He is there for us, and that if anyone hears His voice and open the door He will come into them - so who is causing us to doubt that?

I mean - If someone has a desire to find the Lord don't I just tell them that He is there knocking with His voice (like I read in the Bible) so all they have to do is hear His voice and open up to Him?

It works!! It helps with they start with things easy to believe for. The Lord had me work in a Christian healing ministry for five years. I applied that concept of turning them to Him and it worked!!!!!

Now we started with easy things, but I would have them seek the voice of the Lord and listen to Him, and it worked!

Again, we started with easy to believe things. We would have them pray little prayers like "Lord Jesus Christ, how do you feel about me?", and then we had them listen in their spirit and then tell us what they felt in their spirit. We sometimes would have them ask Him if they needed to forgive anyone, and listen to what came to them in their spirit. We then might have them seek Him for things harder to believe for, and as we went they would suddenly find that they and Him were talking to each other.
 

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a non believer gets the desire to seek the Lord, can't they just seek Him and find Him???

He said He stands at the door and if anyone hears His voice and opens the door He will come into them and eat with them and them with Him (Rev 19:20)

So why don't we just tell them who have a desire to seek Him, to just seek Him and listen to Him? Who told us that would not work - that we actually have to point them to the Bible instead of Him so they can find Him? That is not according to the Bible, because it is not according to Him and what He said in the Bible!!

And how does someone who does not know Jesus recognise his voice or begin to test what he is hearing?

Muslims deep in Islamic countries have dreams about Jesus, how do they find out about this person they have dreamt of?
By finding online church services and online bibles.

There is an economy I how God works and in that economy he uses Christians and the Bible to reach nonchristians.

There are many spiritual voices out there, but only the Bible validates the voice of the holy spirit.
 
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