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[_ Old Earth _] summary of the creation theory

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SyntaxVorlon

Guest
I'm afraid I have to disagree with you on several points. Creationism, at least what evolution proponents argue against, is based specifically on a literal interpretation of Genesis.
Also it is not a theory, it is a speculation. There is no evidence backing this speculation, there is no scientific reason to believe this god fellow exists at all, the only arguments that are actually given for the existence of god are circular ones. It is in no way a scientific theory.
 

Featherbop

Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2003
Messages
1,444
Well, I don't consider it theory, speculation or whatever, I consider it fact.

Literal interpretation of Geneisis, I don't know.
And you can say theres no evidence for anything you want to. Just because you don't see the evidence or have the proof doesn't mean it isn't real.

Also, this was interesting:

...there is no scientific reason to believe this god fellow exists at all...
If you are using science to find God, thats like trying to find dry land under the sea.

Ah, nevermind the rest, it doesn't mean anything to me this stuff coming from an atheist.
 

Barbarian

Member
Joined
Jun 5, 2003
Messages
27,315
Gender
Male
Christian
Yes
Perhaps you could show us some evidence for creationism. Usually, when challenged, creationists merely try to criticize evolutionary theory.

I would surely like to see some of this evidence.

Go for it.
 
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SyntaxVorlon

Guest
Featherbop said:
Well, I don't consider it theory, speculation or whatever, I consider it fact.

Literal interpretation of Geneisis, I don't know.
And you can say theres no evidence for anything you want to. Just because you don't see the evidence or have the proof doesn't mean it isn't real.
Irony, thy name is bop.
Facts can be substantiated, if you don't want to use the definitions provided by the english language then I don't know what you hope to gain from a debate.
What evidence is that?
Also, this was interesting:

[quote:b38de]...there is no scientific reason to believe this god fellow exists at all...
If you are using science to find God, thats like trying to find dry land under the sea.
[/quote:b38de]What are you basing this assertion on?
Ah, nevermind the rest, it doesn't mean anything to me this stuff coming from an atheist.
This is what we call close-minded. I am open to any objective evidence you can provide on any subject.
 

Featherbop

Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2003
Messages
1,444
Barbarian: From my "theory" the fact that The universe is here is evidence is enough.

This was more of a joke topic anyway.

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Sintax: I'm not closeminded at all. You're more closemindede than most closeminded people.

craetionism and God, and whatnot is already proven to me. It doesn't have to be proven to all people to make it true.

Before people knew that the earth was shpererical, noone believed it. But it was still true ,and proven.

If you believe you can find God using science, what are you basing your assertion on?
 
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SyntaxVorlon

Guest
Featherbop said:
Sintax: I'm not closeminded at all. You're more closemindede than most closeminded people.

craetionism and God, and whatnot is already proven to me. It doesn't have to be proven to all people to make it true.
Please stop calling me that.
It ought to be provable to all people, you have given no evidence supporting your belief aside from your assertion that people who support the BBT and Descent by Natural Selection.
Before people knew that the earth was shpererical, noone believed it. But it was still true ,and proven.
Yes by going against Dogmatic law supported by the bible. People found the earth to be round by basing it on observational evidence. Your analogy is without value unless you can provide physical evidence without citing circular reasoning. (ie not the bible)
If you believe you can find God using science, what are you basing your assertion on?
You are asserting that the belief in god is reasonable to an open minded person. You have yet to provide ANY evidence in support of this. An open minded person would be willing to weigh any assertion based on what evidence is presented by definition.
You are asserting that your lack of evidence of god's existence is based on the inability of science to make any observations of god. While at the same time you are asserting that it is still reasonable to claim the existence of god, then it can also be said that because invisible pink unicorns can exist while not being observed by science it is still reasonable to claim their existence.
Is it reasonable to claim the existence of invisible pink unicorns?
 

Featherbop

Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2003
Messages
1,444
God is provable to all people. But if they don't look in the right places, what do you expect them to find?

I'm not going to anartica to look for warm weather.

___

To a truly openminded person, God's existance and what He has done and does do would be very apparent. I have always been very openminded from the beginning. much more than my family. I was taught evolution in public schools, it was forced teaching. No way to question anything.

I finally broke away, and took a look for truth. I see God's work in the firmament and the universe and our world. Its proven. The burden of proof that you cannot carry to convince me otherwise is upon you.

Really, you are very predictable with how you react to arguements for God's existance. You reply to everything with: "slippery slope fallacy" "illogical conclusion" "no evidence to support that idea" .

You refuse to be openminded. I have much more fun with you when I don't take this seriously. It's a fun little game. but anyway...

If you want God to crash your tea party and say "I'm here, follow me please!" you are going further from reality.

I need evidence to believe things as you say you do. I need evidence of no God to believe it. I haven't ever gotten a solid answer as to why God is illgical or God can't possibly exist.

Show me evidence of the non-existance of God?

____

Now, ah the ol' pink unicorns type arguement.

Its illogically formed arguement.

Just like "harold the teapot creator of the universe" arguement.

First of all, there is no reason to assume that pink unicorns exist. God has no comparison to this.

Come with a legitimate arguement, and we'll talk.
 
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reznwerks

Guest
Featherbop said:
Well, I don't consider it theory, speculation or whatever, I consider it fact.

quote]
------------
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but not their own facts.
 
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reznwerks

Guest
Featherbop said:
Barbarian: From my "theory" the fact that The universe is here is evidence is enough.
-----------------------
Thats not YOUR theory, thats the atheists conclusion.The universe is here, it exists and we may never know the origins of it. I guess the arguement is settled.
 
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reznwerks

Guest
evidence

Featherbop said:
God is provable to all people. But if they don't look in the right places, what do you expect them to find?

IS ASKING FOR SOME CONSISTANT EVIDENCE TOO MUCH? HOW ABOUT SOME COMMUNICATION THAT MORE THAN ONE PERSON CAN ATTEST TO AT ANY ONE TIME?AFTER ALL GOD IS LOOKING FOR A RELATIONSHIP WITH US ISN'T HE? IT SHOULD'NT BE SO HARD IF IT'S TRUE.

I'm not going to anartica to look for warm weather.
WOULD YOU CONSIDER STICKING YOUR HEAD IN A WARM OVEN EVIDENCE OF THE TROPICS?

___

To a truly openminded person, God's existance and what He has done and does do would be very apparent. I have always been very openminded from the beginning. much more than my family. I was taught evolution in public schools, it was forced teaching. No way to question anything.

EVERYTHING IS QUESTIONABLE. IF YOU ARE TRULY OPENMINDED YOU WILL LOOK AT EVERY SITE I POSTED ELSEWHERE ON THIS SUBJECT.

I finally broke away, and took a look for truth. I see God's work in the firmament and the universe and our world. Its proven. The burden of proof that you cannot carry to convince me otherwise is upon you.

YOU DID NOT FIND TRUTH YOU CAME TO YOUR OWN CONCLUSIONS WITHOUT EVIDENCE. IF YOU WERE UNABLE TO ACCEPT THE EVIDENCE AS SHOWN YOU DISMISSED IT AS WRONG. THAT IS NOT OPENMINDEDNESS.

Really, you are very predictable with how you react to arguements for God's existance. You reply to everything with: "slippery slope fallacy" "illogical conclusion" "no evidence to support that idea" .

PROVE HIM WRONG. JUST THE EVIDENCE PLEASE.

You refuse to be openminded. I have much more fun with you when I don't take this seriously. It's a fun little game. but anyway...

I THINK WE'VE PUT THAT CLAIM TO REST AND SHOWN THE ERROR AND HOW IT IS YOU THAT IS NOT OPENMINDED.

If you want God to crash your tea party and say "I'm here, follow me please!" you are going further from reality.

WHY IS THAT?

I need evidence to believe things as you say you do. I need evidence of no God to believe it. I haven't ever gotten a solid answer as to why God is illgical or God can't possibly exist.

AGAIN YOU ASK TO PROVE A NEGATIVE. YOU HAVE ASSUMED THAT BECAUSE A GOD CANNOT BE PROVEN TO NOT EXIST THEN BY DEFAULT A GOD DOES EXIST. THE SAME CLAIM CAN BE MADE ABOUT ANY CHARACTER INCLUDING SANTA. SOMEWHERE IN THE GREAT BEYOND A BEING KNOWN AS SANTA MAY EXIST AND YOU CAN'T PROVE OTHERWISE. BY DEFAULT MAKING THE CLAIM THAT SANTA EXISTS MAKES PERFECT SENSE IN YOUR WORLD.

Show me evidence of the non-existance of God?
I REFER YOU TO THE ABOVE.

____

Now, ah the ol' pink unicorns type arguement.

YOU JUST HAVE TO BELIEVE, YOU JUST HAVE TO BELIEVE, BELIEVE,ETC.
IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE YOU DON'T HAVE THE SPIRIT OF PINK UNICORNS IN YOU.

quote]
 
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SyntaxVorlon

Guest
Featherbop said:
God is provable to all people. But if they don't look in the right places, what do you expect them to find?

I'm not going to anartica to look for warm weather.
Put your money where your mouth is.
___

To a truly openminded person, God's existance and what He has done and does do would be very apparent. I have always been very openminded from the beginning. much more than my family. I was taught evolution in public schools, it was forced teaching. No way to question anything.
Ah, so Openminded = anyone who thinks the same way as featherbop.
Good to hear you remained vigilant at school, you started out with no understanding or knowledge, and by god you kept it that way.
I finally broke away, and took a look for truth. I see God's work in the firmament and the universe and our world. Its proven. The burden of proof that you cannot carry to convince me otherwise is upon you.
WRONG, the burden of proof is upon whoever MAKES a claim. Atheists don't claim anything. YOU are claiming that god exists, you say it's proven that he exists. I repeat, give this proof or give me money.
Really, you are very predictable with how you react to arguements for God's existance. You reply to everything with: "slippery slope fallacy" "illogical conclusion" "no evidence to support that idea" .
Yes it's very predictable that anyone criticising an argument for god would point out fallacies of clarity or relevance to whoever is arguing. However it is also a sound criticism that you present a proof without said fallacies and not complain when people show that you have no argument.
You refuse to be openminded. I have much more fun with you when I don't take this seriously. It's a fun little game. but anyway...
I refuse to be convinced by nothing. You're doing a great job in providing that. I have fun taking it seriously.:biggrin
If you want God to crash your tea party and say "I'm here, follow me please!" you are going further from reality.
I haven't ever been to a tea party. This is true, but you claim there to be a proof, PROVIDE IT.
I need evidence to believe things as you say you do. I need evidence of no God to believe it. I haven't ever gotten a solid answer as to why God is illgical or God can't possibly exist.
It is unreasonable to demand proof of a negative. Basic logic.
Why god is illogical? Well here it goes:
1: A great deal is known about the universe, how it formed, how it works, what forces act within it.
2: With this knowledge science has several models and theories that fit the evidence to suggest how life the universe and everything got to where it is today.
3: In none of these theories is a deity required for the existence of the universe.
4: Theists believe in the existence of a prime force that is intelligent and caring.
5: Theists believe the existence of this prime force is necessary and required.
6: No logical argument is given for this belief.
7: Therefore, to believe in the existence of some prime intelligent and loving force with no evidence or necessity is a leap in logic.
Show me evidence of the non-existance of God?

____

Now, ah the ol' pink unicorns type arguement.

Its illogically formed arguement.

Just like "harold the teapot creator of the universe" arguement.

First of all, there is no reason to assume that pink unicorns exist. God has no comparison to this.

Come with a legitimate arguement, and we'll talk.
Show my why it can be assumed that god exists and you'll have a sound argument here. Otherwise the pink unicorns will steal your underwear.
 

Featherbop

Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2003
Messages
1,444
Reznwerks: No, you still don't get it. Go ask someone how the ways you can find God. And be openminded :lol: well, you have to have a mind in the first place.

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Syntax: ON THIS FORUM THE BURDEN OF PROOFN IS ON YOU.

If I ever go to an atheist forum, the burden of proof switches to me. Do not cintinue with this arguement.

Athesits claim that there is no God. They can't prove, they can't give evidence of it. You are making the opposite claim as me.

The burden is on you. I would say its on reznwerks too, but Hes got something wrong in the attic.

If you want proof that God exists, You have to get it personally. I could show you the door, but you'd have to walk through it. If you refuse, you're are just blowing smoke. And you are blowing smoke, because you won't see anything, that isn't cientific, seeable with your eyes, etc.

You are missing the things not made of matter. Even little things.

___

I also refuse to be convinced by nothing also. Which I have that amount of evidence form you. It really is quite fun, this little game. :biggrin

___

If it is unreasonable to be asked to provide proof of a negative, then it is also unreasonable to believe in a negative which cannot be proven. A fallacy of atheism, that I believe Veritas pointed out in another topic, that atheism affirms a negative.

___

It is reasonable for God to exist, because it is logical that things have to be made by someone. It is illogical that nothing makes something.

Pink unicorns is a thing made up after humans were created. Comparing pink unicorns to god has no reason to do so.

___

also, syntax, you said you would not accept the Bible in any way as evidence from it? Then you are blowing smoke, you are closeminded. If you won't consider all options, that is closeminded.

good day, and have fun.
 
W

Wertbag

Guest
I can already see where this is heading, the age old claim of the Christians, you must believe unconditionally in God before you can have him prove himself to you. Pray with the belief already there and your brain will make you feel complete, same things that Muslims, Jews, Buddists, hindus etc do. All claim the feeling, all claim they are correct, but all must believe first. Its this kind of belief without proof that can convince people of human sacrifice or suicide bombing, if only those people thought for themselves.

If God wants us all to know him then it would be very easy for him to do so. But the claim is that He would burn us all in hell because he won't talk to us? Its one of the things that really gets me about the Christian belief is the injustice of it all, God will let billions burn in hell forever, women, children, the good and the bad, all punished the same, all for the same time, and yet He is meant to be fair and just? The whole basis of the idea is wrong. There is no way that it can be considered just for good people who never hurt their fellow man should burn in hell along side Hitler, Charles Manson and Ghangis Khan.

As for affirming a negative, that is fine when it comes to beliefs and idealogys. I believe there are no pink unicorns. I'm affirming a negative, and its impossible to prove that they don't exist as we all know pink unicorns are invisible to humans. Some things you have to take on belief, just because its a negative does not invalidate the idea by itself. There are many negatives, Jews don't believe Jesus was the son of God, Muslims don't believe in reincarnation and Athiests don't believe in God. A negative can be correct. Everyone has negative beliefs as well as positives, I'm sure you yourself would say other religions are incorrect, its a belief you have that is a negative, but it too maybe correct.
 

Featherbop

Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2003
Messages
1,444
Wertbag: First of all many of your claims aren't true.

God will make people burn in hell forever even children? Not as far as my knowledge goes.

God deosn't in ways speak to people? Sorry, nope.

Wertbag, get a Bible and study it. You are claiming odd things, that don't apply to the Bible.

Are you under 10 years old?
___

Now, as for affirming a negative. I meant affirming that something that you've never seen, felt, etc, does not exist.

Its not neccesarily untrue, but its more logical for an person of no belief in God to be an agnostic, rather than athiest.

Agnostics say, simply, They don't know.

Atheists say they do not believe in God.

since it has not been proven that, it is not logical to believe that.

That is only one fallacy of atheism.
 
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Wertbag

Guest
God will make people burn in hell forever even children? Not as far as my knowledge goes.
Depends which Christian branch you belong to, each have their own beliefs. My aunty had a still born baby, our local church refused to bury it saying that as it hadn't been baptised it was an unclean spirit (sin nature?). Talk about kicking her while shes down. She was able to move to another church who were alot more caring and get the baby buried.
It may not be your particular belief, but its certainly held by some Christians.


God deosn't in ways speak to people? Sorry, nope.
I've been agnostic for years, and any proof or contact with a diety would have answered numerous questions, but it didn't happen. I tried prayer when I was young and nothing. Its back to the old claim that you have to have complete belief before God will speak to you.

Wertbag, get a Bible and study it. You are claiming odd things, that don't apply to the Bible.
I've hardly mentioned the Bible at all. Mainly that there is no justice according to it, and that appears to be true from what I'm being told by the Christians on here. Works count for nothing, therefore being a good person doesn't get you into heaven, and being bad can be repented.
Of course the Bible being the inspired word of god is another sticking point with unbelievers, its a big claim and also unproven.

Are you under 10 years old?
Don't be insulting.

Atheists say they do not believe in God.
since it has not been proven that, it is not logical to believe that.
Its possible to be a partial atheist, disbelief in the christian god is what most mean, as most of the people in the western world have no contact with the eastern religions and no idea what islam is based on.
Like anything in life you make an informed decision based on the evidence at hand. The churches can't agree on what the word of god is, the bible is in many versions with arguements still raging over the meanings, there are no miracles seen which match the ones claimed in the past, there are no reliable visits by supernatural beings in modern days, there are several stories of the Bible that simply don't make sense. All sorts of reasons that people can say not just that a god doesn't exist but in most cases specifically that the christian idea of god is incorrect.
 
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SyntaxVorlon

Guest
Featherbop said:
Reznwerks: No, you still don't get it. Go ask someone how the ways you can find God. And be openminded :lol: well, you have to have a mind in the first place.

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Syntax: ON THIS FORUM THE BURDEN OF PROOFN IS ON YOU.

If I ever go to an atheist forum, the burden of proof switches to me. Do not cintinue with this arguement.
Wrong, it doesn't matter if it's a christian forum, atheist form, or logical positivist forum. Burden of proof is ALWAYS on the back of the person making a positive(note: posit) claim.
Athesits claim that there is no God. They can't prove, they can't give evidence of it. You are making the opposite claim as me.

The burden is on you. I would say its on reznwerks too, but Hes got something wrong in the attic.
It is unreasonable to attempt to make or ask for proof of a negative claim. This is basic logic. For Example: no one can prove that unicorns don't exist.
Furthermore we aren't making a claim we are responding to your claim that a god does exist, specifically a male god who hands out tablets on mountain tops. We don't believe in anything, and it is the claim that god exists that must be supported.
If you want proof that God exists, You have to get it personally. I could show you the door, but you'd have to walk through it. If you refuse, you're are just blowing smoke. And you are blowing smoke, because you won't see anything, that isn't cientific, seeable with your eyes, etc.
Is...that...a reference to the matrix........concession accepted.
You are missing the things not made of matter. Even little things.
Right, now you are claiming the existence of something nonmaterial. Where are you getting the evidence for this?
___

I also refuse to be convinced by nothing also. Which I have that amount of evidence form you. It really is quite fun, this little game. :biggrin

___

If it is unreasonable to be asked to provide proof of a negative, then it is also unreasonable to believe in a negative which cannot be proven. A fallacy of atheism, that I believe Veritas pointed out in another topic, that atheism affirms a negative.
We don't believe a negative. We don't believe anything. 0 is not a negative. While it is a negative to claim the nonexistence of god, it is NOT a negative to claim no belief in any god.
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It is reasonable for God to exist, because it is logical that things have to be made by someone. It is illogical that nothing makes something.

Pink unicorns is a thing made up after humans were created. Comparing pink unicorns to god has no reason to do so.
Circular logic, the only way it is possible to claim that the universe requires is a creator is to assume god and visa versa.
___

also, syntax, you said you would not accept the Bible in any way as evidence from it? Then you are blowing smoke, you are closeminded. If you won't consider all options, that is closeminded.

good day, and have fun.
No, I won't accept the bible as evidence because it is BASED on a belief in god and can't be used to prove the existence of something it assumes. This is the definition of circular logic.

Seriously bop, circular logic = teh bad. Stop using it.
Your argument has to conclude with the existence of god, and can't assume it at any point except for the conclusion.
 

Featherbop

Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2003
Messages
1,444
I understand that I'm a poor debater. I don't have much experiance, I know... anyway, your ability to make an arguement more convincing has no bearing on its truth and validity.

___

And sorry, syntax, the burden of proof is still on you. You will try to no end to divert that point. When an atheist is in christian territiory, by his own will, he/she knows that they are the ones trying to convince the denzins of that area. If I came to an atheist forum, then I get the burden. Simple logic :lol:

___

You ask me to prove God physically, scientifically, etc, and know its not possible, and I ask you to prove that God doesn't exist. It is already a fact that He exists, and more, I have my proof. But since I can't transfer it to you, I am unable to help you.

its a useless debate, I'm done with that one for now.

___

Yes, that was a matrix reference.

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I am claiming that nonmaterial things exist yes. Thoughts, feeelings, emotions, most things contained in a human life.

I know, processes of matter, what a cop out. Its proven non-matter things exist, deal with it.

___

To believe in the existance of God is a positive.

to believe there is no God is a negative.

There is no zero. Makes you think.....

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I did not believe in God before believing the universe was created by Him. You just want me to have a circular arguement, and you'll put words in my mouth and change what I'm saying to make it appear so.

Stop.

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sintax, let me ask you something: If God showed Himself to you(physical manifistation) and told you certain things i.e. homosexual relations are wrong for example. What would you do? Would you believe in Him, or not?

_____________________________________________________________

Wertbag: Sorry to hear that. How evil, thats a good example of how relgions, and relgious nuts screw up our world.

I'm sure those kind of people will always exist, just try staying away from them. But those actions/ beliefs, many don't apply to me, so you've got no arguement against me if thats what you were trying to do.

As for contacting God: Your story sure sounded like you were diligent. :roll:

To my knowledge, one doesn't have to believe in God to be contacted by Him in some way. I've heard of stories where atheists were changed after having supernatural expaeriances. Maybe you could look some up sometime.

You didn't neccesarily mention "Bible" but you convinced me that you were talking about it. :lol:

I do not believe in atheists, just agnostics. But no idea of God has ever been proven, and it won't for a little while.

The Bible will not make sense to unbelievers. The stories, the meanings, lots of it.

Unbelievers don't even usaully sound like they want any relgion to be true at all. They seem like "Hey, its hopeless, its all nonsense."

Maybe its just me, but atheists are so unconvincing.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Featherbop said:
God is provable to all people. But if they don't look in the right places, what do you expect them to find?

I'm not going to anartica to look for warm weather.

___

To a truly openminded person, God's existance and what He has done and does do would be very apparent. I have always been very openminded from the beginning. much more than my family. I was taught evolution in public schools, it was forced teaching. No way to question anything.

I finally broke away, and took a look for truth. I see God's work in the firmament and the universe and our world. Its proven. The burden of proof that you cannot carry to convince me otherwise is upon you.

Really, you are very predictable with how you react to arguements for God's existance. You reply to everything with: "slippery slope fallacy" "illogical conclusion" "no evidence to support that idea" .

You refuse to be openminded. I have much more fun with you when I don't take this seriously. It's a fun little game. but anyway...

If you want God to crash your tea party and say "I'm here, follow me please!" you are going further from reality.

I need evidence to believe things as you say you do. I need evidence of no God to believe it. I haven't ever gotten a solid answer as to why God is illgical or God can't possibly exist.

Show me evidence of the non-existance of God?

____

Now, ah the ol' pink unicorns type arguement.

Its illogically formed arguement.

Just like "harold the teapot creator of the universe" arguement.

First of all, there is no reason to assume that pink unicorns exist. God has no comparison to this.

Come with a legitimate arguement, and we'll talk.
I like how in true christians style you say "God is provable, if you look in
the right places" then conveniently forget to mention where these fabled places are.(and please don't offer the Bible as a place to look, that's like saying Allah is provable if you read the Koran)
Gotta love that reasoning. Is that like when you ask
"How can I hear the word of God?" You get the non-answer answer
"Keep quiet and you just might"

Refuse to be open minded? Hey show me some "EVIDENCE" and I'll walk the Earth handing out the Good Book and spreading the Gospel, until then,
shouldn't you have to prove the existance of something rather than me prove it doesn't? Isn't that the basis behind the theory of "proof"?

Solid proof, how about no mention of Asia, Australia(and it's original inhabitants who've been there approx. 40,000 years) or The Americas or Incans, The Acrtic, Antarctica, Dinosaurs, all the religions that existed before it the list goes on, and now we might be able to add some life on
Mars(ironically a Greek god who extisted before yours).
Whereas your "proof" as you like to call it, was written by people who knew absolutely nothing about the Earth and its goings on, after all
it was less than 1000 years ago they thought they would was flat.
After all he Romans thought stars were sparks from chariot wheels.
As for illogical reason for God, how can there be one true God when
you've got Jesus, Allah, Buddha (and not just one) and of course
Lord Ganesha just to mention one Hindu God.
Can't all be right.
 
B

Blue-Lightning

Guest
Hey Realist, glad to have you. Let's set one thing straight for a moment though... you are not among dummies. Maybe you live among dummies, maybe you don't, I don't know, but a word to the wise: sit back, listen a little and get a feel for the board before you assume greater knowledge. You've got some pretty smart people here, some smarter than others, but there are quite a few really intelligent people - and it's not fun to have them dissect what you say into oblivion. So make sure you really, really think before you speak... err... type.

"God is provable, if you look in
the right places" then conveniently forget to mention where these fabled places are.(and please don't offer the Bible as a place to look, that's like saying Allah is provable if you read the Koran)
Oookay... let's knock out the arguments here and then we'll move on. Firstly, you have to look in the right places in order to determine if they truly exist. For example, I would not look for a barracuda in the Mississippii. So if you are interested in seeking the truth about the Deity (which I assume your not, but maybe you can surprise me), you should take a look into prayer research, historical accuracies of the bible, second law of thermodynamics and subsequant need for a creator outside the universe (an eternal universe contradicts its own laws), etc.

The reason that I accept the Bible as an accurate source are 1) its historical accuracy, 2) its unique genealogy system, 3) its unique monotheistic belief system within its context, 4) its strenuous criteria for text entry, and 5) validation of its truth within my life through miracles.

I do not accept the Koran because 1) its lack of respect towards all of humanity, 2) its historical inaccuracy, 3) its borrowed accounts, 4) its contradictions, and 5) its singular authorship, context, and historical creation.


Refuse to be open minded? Hey show me some "EVIDENCE" and I'll walk the Earth handing out the Good Book and spreading the Gospel...
Look into prayer research for starters.

Whereas your "proof" as you like to call it, was written by people who knew absolutely nothing about the Earth and its goings on, after all
it was less than 1000 years ago they thought they would was flat.
Who is "they?" Did you know that North American indians knew for quite some time that the earth was round? So who is "they?" If you're referring (ethnocentrically) to Europeans as "they," then please specify in the future... not everyone believed the world was flat in the world.

As for illogical reason for God, how can there be one true God when
you've got Jesus, Allah, Buddha (and not just one) and of course
Lord Ganesha just to mention one Hindu God.
Can't all be right.
That's like me asking what is the one star in our solar system and you answering, "Well, how can there be one star when we have all these solar bodies in the solar system? Can't all be stars?" It's an illogical argument.

Oh, and this little debate doesn't belong here in the evolution forum. It belongs in Christianity and Religions. You can discuss why belief in God is logically necessary there, but as for here, please stay on topic.

BL
 
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