The history of baptism.

[for_his_glory]

One baptism "one Lord, one faith, one baptism", (Eph 4:5).

Matthew 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
Matthew 3:12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Hebrews 6:2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

There are three types of baptism taught in the Bible, water, spirit and fire. John 3:5 never mentions the word baptize, but says only by being born of water and spirit, which means water as living water, word of God, that no one can enter into the kingdom of God unless they are Spiritually renewed (born again) by the hearing of the word, which is Christ Jesus and by the Holy Spirit that came on them in the OT and indwells us in the NT. Many do read into the passage a preconceived idea or theology, but baptism is never mentioned in this verse. God's word is living water as described in John 4:4-26; 7:37-39; 12:44-50; Ephesians 5:26; 1 John 5:5-8; Jeremiah 17:13; Zechariah 14:8, 9; Rev 21:6-8; Ezekiel 47:22.

These are the three that John tells us believers in Jesus will go through. These three baptisms are a foundation of Christianity. OT bathing in water was to purify yourself of any unclean thing as I explained in post #16. This was a foreshadow of the three found in the NT as water in John the Baptist ministry was for remission of sins through repentance, "Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight." Spirit, regeneration made new again, and fire meaning we are empowered by the Holy Spirit for kingdom living as we have died to self and have risen with Christ that we seek those things from above where Christ sits at the right hand of the Father, Colossians 3:1-4. Spiritual empowerment is the divine energy God is willing to express in and through us and the divine authority needed to carry out the work God has called us to do, 1 Corinthians 15:58; Ephesians 2:10; Colossians 2:6.

 

[Mungo]

Matthew 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
Matthew 3:12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Hebrews 6:2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

There are three types of baptism taught in the Bible, water, spirit and fire. John 3:5 never mentions the word baptize, but says only by being born of water and spirit, which means water as living water, word of God, that no one can enter into the kingdom of God unless they are Spiritually renewed (born again) by the hearing of the word, which is Christ Jesus and by the Holy Spirit that came on them in the OT and indwells us in the NT. Many do read into the passage a preconceived idea or theology, but baptism is never mentioned in this verse. God's word is living water as described in John 4:4-26; 7:37-39; 12:44-50; Ephesians 5:26; 1 John 5:5-8; Jeremiah 17:13; Zechariah 14:8, 9; Rev 21:6-8; Ezekiel 47:22.

These are the three that John tells us believers in Jesus will go through. These three baptisms are a foundation of Christianity. OT bathing in water was to purify yourself of any unclean thing as I explained in post #16. This was a foreshadow of the three found in the NT as water in John the Baptist ministry was for remission of sins through repentance, "Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight." Spirit, regeneration made new again, and fire meaning we are empowered by the Holy Spirit for kingdom living as we have died to self and have risen with Christ that we seek those things from above where Christ sits at the right hand of the Father, Colossians 3:1-4. Spiritual empowerment is the divine energy God is willing to express in and through us and the divine authority needed to carry out the work God has called us to do, 1 Corinthians 15:58; Ephesians 2:10; Colossians 2:6.

"one Lord, one faith, one baptism", (Eph 4:5).

Do I believe scripture?
Or do I believe you?

 

[Episcopius]

Hebrews tells of a doctrine of BAPTISMS - plural.

Ephesians tells of one baptism.

Whatcha gonna do?

I was baptized as an infant (so they tell me). (Sprinkled)

After being saved at 19, I chose to be immersed.

A year later, I was baptized in the Holy Spirit.

That's 3 baptisms for me.

 

[Mungo]

Hebrews tells of a doctrine of BAPTISMS - plural.

Ephesians tells of one baptism.

Whatcha gonna do?

I was baptized as an infant (so they tell me). (Sprinkled)

After being saved at 19, I chose to be immersed.

A year later, I was baptized in the Holy Spirit.

That's 3 baptisms for me.

Baptisms (plural) in Hebrews is referring to Jewish purification washings, John's baptism and Christian baptism which were all going on (cf the twelve men at Ephesus). But there is only one Christian baptism (and that is with water}, which Eph 4:5 is referring to.

the doctrine of baptisms—paired with “laying on of hands,” as the latter followed on Christian baptism, and answers to the rite of confirmation in Episcopal churches. Jewish believers passed, by an easy transition, from Jewish baptismal purifications (Heb 9:10, “washings”), baptism of proselytes, and John’s baptism, and legal imposition of hands, to their Christian analogues, baptism, and the subsequent laying on of hands, accompanied by the gift of the Holy Ghost (compare Heb 6:4). Greek, “baptismoi,” plural, including Jewish and Christian baptisms, are to be distinguished from baptisma, singular, restricted to Christian baptism

Jamieson, R., Fausset, A. R., & Brown, D. (1997). Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible (Vol. 2, p. 452). Oak Harbor, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.

If you believe there are several baptisms for Christians then please explain Eph 4:5 - baptism (singular - baptisma)

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Episcopius my brother

Ephesians 4:5 says, "One Lord, one faith, ONE BAPTISM. one God and father for all.

Not 3 BAPTISMS !!!
God says only 1 BAPTISM!!
So which one do you choose??

In fact, a lot of people choose at least 2.
I wonder how they justify that??
Some of us only think like God, and choose one baptism of SALVATION by IMMERSION WATER BAPTISM.

I'll probably really hear it for this one .

My name is OLIGOS

 

[Mungo]

Episcopius my brother

Ephesians 4:5 says, "One Lord, one faith, ONE BAPTISM. one God and father for all.

Not 3 BAPTISMS !!!
God says only 1 BAPTISM!!
So which one do you choose??

In fact, a lot of people choose at least 2.
I wonder how they justify that??
Some of us only think like God, and choose one baptism of SALVATION by IMMERSION WATER BAPTISM.

I'll probably really hear it for this one .

My name is OLIGOS

Well, I agree - except for the bit about immersion, but lets not get into that.

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Well, I agree - except for the bit about immersion, but lets not get into that.

 

[Episcopius]

"3. The doctrine of baptisms, that is, of being baptized by a minister of Christ with water, in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, as the initiating sign or seal of the covenant of grace, strongly engaging the person so baptized to get acquainted with the new covenant, to adhere to it, and prepare to renew it at the table of the Lord and sincerely to regulate himself according to it, relying upon the truth and faithfulness of God for the blessings contained in it. And the doctrine of an inward baptism, that of the Spirit sprinkling the blood of Christ upon the soul, for justification, and the graces of the Spirit for sanctification. This ordinance of baptism is a foundation to be rightly laid, and daily remembered, but not repeated. "

That is Matthew Henry's commentary on the doctrine of baptismS verse. To dismiss baptisms PLURAL in this passage as contrasting Jewish purifications with Christian baptism is unfounded.

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

That is Matthew Henry's commentary on the doctrine of baptismS verse. To dismiss baptisms PLURAL in this passage as contrasting Jewish purifications with Christian baptism is unfounded.

Episcopius
I think I'll let Gods word stand against Matthew Henry's opinion anytime.

Ephesians 4:5 says, "One Lord, one faith, , ONE BAPTISM, one God and Father for ALL.

Lies have been told so long, they have become the truth, and the truth has become lies, as Gods word is TWISTED and blinds those who are led astray, and develope DILUSIONAL doctrines, 2nd Thessalonians 2:10-12, that cause them to be led astry and destroyed.

Does anyone here ever question their beliefs???
I did 42 years ago, and have for 42 years to find the truth, if i have been told lies.
With the Bereans in acts as my role model I question EVERYTHING, and that has served me well to find a truth many reject, Matthew 7:14, luke 14:23-24 and Matthew 7:21.

To me, many here hold to a doctrine that will destroy them in the end if they don't see the truth.

I still LOVE everyone here, and will continue my dialogue with you all - unless the Admin. gets tired of me .
My name is OLIGOS

 

[Episcopius]

There were certain brothers of whom Paul asked "Have you received the Holy Ghost SINCE YOU BELIEVED?"
In that case, they said they didn't know there was such a thing as the Holy Ghost - they subsequently received it,

This establishes the fact that there can be BELIEVERS in Christ who have not yet received the Holy Ghost and can later receive it through the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

 

[Episcopius]

Oligos - I have no easy answer for "one baptism" in Ephesians 4 - I simply see a PARADOX with it alongside Hebrews 6 BAPTISMS PLURAL.

Matthew Henry was quoted simply as one commentater who didn't mention "Jewish purifications" as having anything to do with "baptisms plural".

Look at how Hebrews chapter 6 opens:
Heb 6:1

Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection;

The author of Hebrews then lists some of these principles of THE DOCTRINE OF CHRIST which he wants to get away from and go on to something else, and one of those PRINCIPLES OF THE DOCTRINE OF CHRIST is the DOCTRINE OF BAPTISMS (plural)

not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

I know good and well Ephesians 4 has the phrase "one baptism", and that Hebrews 6:2 has the phrase "doctrine of baptisms" PLURAL (as one of the principles of the doctrine of Christ)

I see it as a PARADOX, and reject the idea that "Jewish washings" would be seen as a principle of the doctrine of Christ.

The PARADOX is THERE - in Scripture - Ephesians saying one baptism, and Hebrews saying doctrine of baptismS

It is IMO a weak excuse to try to say that "Jewish washings" explain the baptisms plural, when the entire context of Hebrews 6 is PRINCIPLES OF THE DOCTRINE OF CHRIST.

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Episcopius my brother.
I see no plurality of baptism for salvation. Ephisians 4: 5 says it all for me along with a huge 11 volumn study I did on Immersion in water baptism, unless as you quoted in Acts 19:2-5 where some were re-baptized for the right reason for baptism.

2)" and asked them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?”

They answered, “No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.”

3 So Paul asked, “Then what baptism did you receive?”

“John’s baptism,” they replied.

4 Paul said, “John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” 5 On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ."

My name is OLIGOS

 

[OzSpen]

Episcopius my brother

Ephesians 4:5 says, "One Lord, one faith, ONE BAPTISM. one God and father for all.

Not 3 BAPTISMS !!!
God says only 1 BAPTISM!!
So which one do you choose??

In fact, a lot of people choose at least 2.
I wonder how they justify that??
Some of us only think like God, and choose one baptism of SALVATION by IMMERSION WATER BAPTISM.

I'll probably really hear it for this one .

My name is OLIGOS

SbG,

Do you support this baptism? 'For we were all baptized by one Spirit so as to form one body--whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free--and we were all given the one Spirit to drink' (1 Cor 12:13 NIV).

What about this baptism? Do you affirm it? 'But when they believed Philip as he proclaimed the good news of the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptised, both men and women' (Acts 8:12 NIV).

Do you support these 2 baptisms?

Oz

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Do you support these 2 baptisms?

OzSpen
I'm not sure what your asking, as your question could be interpreted at least 2 ways to me.

Do you mean the 2 examples of one type of baptism,
or do you mean do I support 2 different types of baptisms.

I myself believe in one baptism, water immersion baptism Ephesians 4:5, one Lord, one faith one baptism, for the beginning journey of the PROCESS of salvation.

Your first example !st Corinthians 12:13, I agree with, as we are all baptized by the Spirit, as the verse says, if the verse isn't twisted to mean baptized INTO THE SPIRIT for salvation, which has been twisted many times to represent.

Your second example Acts 8:12, I agree with also, as baptism is an act of WATER IMMERSION for salvation. and coming into contact with the blood of Christ which saves - Hebrews13:12.
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Baptism is a huge topic because so much happens symbolically, and yet some things aren't just symbolic but actually take place at the time of water immersion baptism, like receiving the Gift of the Holy Spirit, being redeemed, being justified, being reconciled, being forgiven, and so on.

The list of some of the things that take place at baptism is below, as I copied it from my THREAD on "CONTACTING THE BLOOD OF CHRIST".


Reconciled - 2nd Cor.5:18, "All of this is a gift from God who RECONCILED us to Himself through the BLOOD OF CHRIST."

Redeemed -1st Peter 1:18, "You were not REDEEMED with corruptible things, but with the precious BLOOD OF CHRIST."

Justified, Romans 5:9, "We have now been JUSTIFIED by HIS BLOOD."

Sanctified - Hebrews 13:12, "Therefore Jesus also, that He might "SANCTIFY" the people WITH HIS OWN BLOOD, suffered outside the gate."

Atonement - Hebrews 5:9, "...be saved, only through the ATONING BLOOD of CHRIST."

Expiation - Colossians 2:13-14, "(13) "He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions, (14) having cancelled out the certificate of debt consisting of charges against us, bringing death, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, (Expiation), BY HIS BLOOD, having nailed it to the cross in Christ."

Propitiation - Romans 3:24-25, "..our redemption which is in Christ Jesus: whom God displayed publicly as a PROPITIATION in CHRISTS BLOOD.

Forgiveness - Rev. 1:5, Acts 2:38, "To Christ who loves us and has freed us from our sins, acts 2:38, BY HIS BLOOD - Rev. 1:5.

Saved - Hebrews 13:12, "And so Jesus suffered outside the city gate, to make the people holy (Sanctified, set apart, saved) through HIS OWN BLOOD.

This is more than you asked for, but helps me answer your question more completely as I see it.

My name is OLIGOS

 

[OzSpen]

OzSpen
Baptism is a huge topic because so much happens symbolically, and yet some things aren't just symbolic but actually take place at the time of water immersion baptism, like receiving the Gift of the Holy Spirit, being redeemed, being justified, being reconciled, being forgiven, and so on.

We are on different pages. I'm not convinced the Bible teaches I'm redeemed, justified, reconciled and forgiven when we are water baptised. I don't find any biblical support for baptismal regeneration (except for the highly questionable verse of Mark 16:16.

 

[Mungo]

We are on different pages. I'm not convinced the Bible teaches I'm redeemed, justified, reconciled and forgiven when we are water baptised. I don't find any biblical support for baptismal regeneration (except for the highly questionable verse of Mark 16:16.

Verses that explicitly say baptism save us:

1. Whoever believes and is baptised will be saved (Mk 16:16)

2. Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, (1Pet 3:21)

3. Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand persons were added that day. ……. And every day the Lord added to their number those who were being saved. (Acts 2:41….47)

Verses that implicitly say baptism saves us:

4. Or are you unaware that we who were baptised into Christ Jesus were baptised into his death? We were indeed buried with him through baptism into death, so that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might live in newness of life. For if we have grown into union with him through a death like his, we shall also be united with him in the resurrection.
(Rom 6:3-4)

5. “..he saved us, not because of any works of righteousness that we had done, but according to his mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal in the Holy Spirit.” (Titus 3:5)

6. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God. (1Cor 6:11)

7. “Amen, amen, I say to you, no one can enter the kingdom of God without being born of water and Spirit. (Jn 3;5)


Verses that link baptism to some aspect of salvation:

8. Repent and be baptised, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. (Acts 2:38)

9. Now, why delay? Get up and have yourself baptised and your sins washed away, calling upon his name. (Acts 22:16).

10. let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. (Heb 10:22)

11. You were buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead. And even when you were dead (in) transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, he brought you to life along with him, having forgiven us all our transgressions; (Col 2:11-13)

12. all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. (Gal 3:27).

But it is God who establishes us with you in Christ and has anointed us, by putting his seal on us and giving us his Spirit in our hearts as a first installment. (2Cor 1:22)

When we are clothed with Christ we have been put into Christ and God gives us the Holy Spirit in our hearts. Just as was prophesied by Ezekial (Ez 36:25-27):
I will sprinkle clean water upon you to cleanse you from all your impurities, and from all your idols I will cleanse you. I will give you a new heart and place a new spirit within you, taking from your bodies your stony hearts and giving you natural hearts. I will put my spirit within you….

13. “In him also you were circumcised with a spiritual circumcision, by putting off the body of the flesh in the circumcision of Christ; when you were buried with him in baptism, you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.” (Col 2:11-12)

Baptism brings us into the body of Christ (the Church).
14. As a body is one though it has many parts, and all the parts of the body, though many, are one body, so also Christ. For in one Spirit we were all baptised into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, slaves or free persons, and we were all given to drink of one Spirit. (1Cor 12:12-13).
15. This text also shows this: one body and one Spirit, as you were also called to the one hope of your call; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; (Eph 4:4-5)

16. Through baptism we are brought into the new covenant “In him also you were circumcised with a spiritual circumcision, by putting off the body of the flesh in the circumcision of Christ; when you were buried with him in baptism, you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.” (Col 2:11-12)
This clearly links a “spiritual circumcision” with baptism, a link from baptism to the covenant, not through physical circumcision (as in the Old Covenant) but a spiritual one.

17. For through faith you are all children of God in Christ Jesus. For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free person, there is not male and female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s descendant, heirs according to the promise. (Gal 3:26-27)

Paul tells us in Romans 9:8 “That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God; but the children of the promise are counted as the seed.” It is in baptism (with water) that we become children of the promise; we are made children of God.

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Great job Mungo

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

We are on different pages. I'm not convinced the Bible teaches I'm redeemed, justified, reconciled and forgiven when we are water baptised. I don't find any biblical support for baptismal regeneration (except for the highly questionable verse of Mark 16:16.

So OzSpen, what do those verses above I quoted on coming into contact with the "BLOOD" of Christ through baptism mean to you?
You may not be far enough along in your faith to link the contacting the "BLOOD OF CHRIST to BAPTISM and both to SALVATION.

We are all in different places in our faith, and that's exactly where you should be - at your own place.
We're just giving you more to consider for your future as you grow and change as we all do.
It's all part of the Christian faith for brothers in Christ to LOVINGLY > "SHARPEN"< another brother.

Proverbs 27:17 says, "Iron sharpens iron, and one man sharpens another."

The New Testament is replete with instructions concerning how believers should relate with one another. They are to do good to each other (Galatians 6:10), bear each other's burdens (Galatians 6:2), forgive each other (Colossians 3:13), restore each other (Galatians 6:1; James 5:19-20), submit to one another (Ephesians 5:21), encourage each other (1 Thessalonians 5:11), admonish and exhort each other (Colossians 3:16; Hebrews 3:13), pursue peace and mutual up-building (Romans 14:19), and stir one another on to love and good deeds (Hebrews 10:24-25). The Body of Christ – believers – should be encouraging and edifying one another. When they do, they are like iron sharpening iron. Each believer becomes more effective in his calling. He comes to know God more and to more effectively carry out the good works for which he has been made (Ephesians 2:10).

OzSpen, we just want the opportunity to love you and share another option for you to consider sometime in your walk with Christ. No hurry. We all have the rest of our lives.

Love you brother and God bless you as we all walk the same path to eternity together.
My name is OLIGOS