The new social front line for Christian persecution and the

[Danus]

This may be difficult for many of you to watch, but let me set the stage.

The speaker is Dan Savage, founder of the "It Get's Better" project, an anti-bullying campaign that has reached more than 40 million viewers with contributors ranging from President Obama to Hollywood stars. Savage also writes a sex advice column called "Savage Love".

[video]http://youtu.be/ao0k9qDsOvs[/video]

In this video he is addressing high school kids. Some of those kids are Christians. The subject is bullying, and he's going to get to the heart of the matter. Watch what happens, and see if you can spot the irony of this hidden agenda.

Also, if your worried about your kids and these types of messages, just look what the Christian kids did in this little meeting.

 

[Mike S]

This may be difficult for many of you to watch, but let me set the stage.

The speaker is Dan Savage, founder of the "It Get's Better" project, an anti-bullying campaign that has reached more than 40 million viewers with contributors ranging from President Obama to Hollywood stars. Savage also writes a sex advice column called "Savage Love".

[video]http://youtu.be/ao0k9qDsOvs[/video]

In this video he is addressing high school kids. Some of those kids are Christians. The subject is bullying, and he's going to get to the heart of the matter. Watch what happens, and see if you can spot the irony of this hidden agenda.

Also, if your worried about your kids and these types of messages, just look what the Christian kids did in this little meeting.

The one complaining about bullying becomes the bully.

Savage is getting a lot of push back against this, notably from conservative gays, who are NOT anti-Christian.



http://www.gaypatriot.net/2012/04/28/if-it-gets-better-why-is-dan-savage-so-bitter/

"Why does Dan Savage harbor so much hatred? Gay organizations, especially GLAAD, should condemn Mr. Savage for his mean-spirited rhetoric and make clear that he does not speak for gay people. He certainly doesn’t speak for me — and I would dare say most of this blog’s readers, including some of our liberal ones. We should expect gay speakers at such fora to show the same respect for Christianity as we would like Christians to show for gays."

 

[Milk-Drops]

I didn't see any bullying in this video. Savage just pointed out what is in the Bible, and what has been used to justify the bullying of LGBT. I don't get it. I've seen some Homosexuality threads on this forum and the verses he gave were thrown into the topic. Dan Savage gave his opinion, and everyone was free to leave. He wasn't even nasty about it. He just explained how if the US culture/ Christian Culture can leave these other passages that we now consider wrong, then Homosexuality will also eventually be the same.

That is it. That isn't bullying.

 

[Mike S]

I didn't see any bullying in this video. Savage just pointed out what is in the Bible, and what has been used to justify the bullying of LGBT. I don't get it. I've seen some Homosexuality threads on this forum and the verses he gave were thrown into the topic. Dan Savage gave his opinion, and everyone was free to leave. He wasn't even nasty about it. He just explained how if the US culture/ Christian Culture can leave these other passages that we now consider wrong, then Homosexuality will also eventually be the same.

That is it. That isn't bullying.

Maybe you missed the whole "pansy ass" thing...because that verbal stuff is like, OMG, so mean. Just ask the anti-bullying crowd. It's amazing what counts as "not bullying" when it works to your advantage, eh?

Oh, the irony!


http://www.bullyingstatistics.org/content/verbal-bullying.html

"When most people think of bullying, they think of physical bullying. However, bullying goes beyond the physical and can encompass the verbal. It may seem strange, but verbal bullying can be just as harmful - in different ways - as physical bullying. With verbal bullying, the goal is still to degrade and demean the victim, while making the aggressor look dominant and powerful. All bullying focuses on creating a situation in which the victim is dominated by the aggressor. And this can happen verbally as well as physically."

 

[Milk-Drops]

Maybe you missed the whole "pansy ass" thing...because that verbal stuff is like, OMG, so mean. Just ask the anti-bullying crowd. It's amazing what counts as "not bullying" when it works to your advantage, eh?

Oh, the irony!

Yeah, I listened to the entire video. I guess I'm the only one who actually caught what the context was. Probably because I wasn't looking for something to be offended at. His "Pansy Ass" remark was aimed at those who bullied him and those of LGBT. Which makes sense since bullying is usually seen as an act of insecurity.

The message was that some Christians use the Bible to justify the bullying of LGBT. Be this through physical, emotional, or social methods. But, the US culture and even Christians have acknowledged that some things in the Biblical code of Leviticus make no sense, and even some things like slavery are even abandoned. So in time and more Christians and Others understand what the LGBT actually are, the social landscape will change as well.


That is it. I don't see the persecution, unless we are talking about persecuting people that justify the abuse/ bullying of others with the Bible. I just don't see Dan calling those people Pansy asses as persecuting/bullying all Christians.

 

[Mike S]

Yeah, I listened to the entire video. I guess I'm the only one who actually caught what the context was. Probably because I wasn't looking for something to be offended at. His "Pansy Ass" remark was aimed at those who bullied him and those of LGBT. Which makes sense since bullying is usually seen as an act of insecurity.

No, you're not the only one to catch what the context was. But you are one who's willing to make excuses for him. Conservative gays - who suffer their own bullying and aren't interested in payback - are less generous.

The message was that some Christians use the Bible to justify the bullying of LGBT. Be this through physical, emotional, or social methods. But, the US culture and even Christians have acknowledged that some things in the Biblical code of Leviticus make no sense, and even some things like slavery are even abandoned. So in time and more Christians and Others understand what the LGBT actually are, the social landscape will change as well.

I know what the message was, and I know what irony is. Irony is using bullying tactics to complain about bullying tactics.

That is it. I don't see the persecution, unless we are talking about persecuting people that justify the abuse/ bullying of others with the Bible. I just don't see Dan calling those people Pansy asses as persecuting/bullying all Christians.

I see you don't.

 

[Pard]

Is bullying really worth some national campaign? I survived 13 years of school, everyone I know did, everyone before me did. Generally speaking, those who are going to commit suicide are going to do it with or without a bully egging them onwards. I know a few suicidal people, bullying wasn't any more to them than it was to me. They were just generally messed up people.

These bullying laws are not going to fix problems, they are just going to make criminals. People should just realize that everyone has been bullied at some point, and everyone has bullied at some point, and darn it everyone has watched another get bullied and done nothing to stop it! It's going to happen, and laws that target it won't work because you are dealing with an age group that doesn't respond to the threat of punishment as most people in school can't even see past next week, let alone what a life without a diploma leads to, and what a life with a juvenile record leads to.

It isn't the most Christian of programs, but I have to say that yet again, South Park has already tackled this issue splendidly.

 

[jasoncran]

pard, sure it will.only the govt will be the bully this time. as we know .. dont steal the govt hates competetion type thing.

 

[Milk-Drops]

Is bullying really worth some national campaign? I survived 13 years of school, everyone I know did, everyone before me did. Generally speaking, those who are going to commit suicide are going to do it with or without a bully egging them onwards. I know a few suicidal people, bullying wasn't any more to them than it was to me. They were just generally messed up people.

These bullying laws are not going to fix problems, they are just going to make criminals. People should just realize that everyone has been bullied at some point, and everyone has bullied at some point, and darn it everyone has watched another get bullied and done nothing to stop it! It's going to happen, and laws that target it won't work because you are dealing with an age group that doesn't respond to the threat of punishment as most people in school can't even see past next week, let alone what a life without a diploma leads to, and what a life with a juvenile record leads to.

It isn't the most Christian of programs, but I have to say that yet again, South Park has already tackled this issue splendidly.

The It Gets Better campaign is mostly just a message that life isn't always going to suck. I don't think there is any real legislative push in this specific campaign.

 

[Milk-Drops]

I see you don't.

Yeah I don't lump all Christians together and I understood wha Dan meant.

 

[Mike S]

Yeah I don't lump all Christians together and I understood wha Dan meant.

Someone else understands what he meant too - someone who ACTUALLY understands, that is - and he's probably a lot more familiar with bullying than you. But, of course, you're free to continue making excuses, if it serves your purpose.



GOProud Condemns Dan Savage’s Anti-Christian Tirade - http://www.goproud.org/page.aspx?pid=425

“Dan Savage should apologize for his comments and should apologize to the high school students in attendance who he called ‘pansy-asses,’†continued LaSalvia. “It is ironic that someone whose claim to fame is fighting bullying would resort to bullying tactics in attacking high school students who were offended by his outrageous remarks.â€

 

[Milk-Drops]

Someone else understands what he meant too - someone who ACTUALLY understands, that is - and he's probably a lot more familiar with bullying than you. But, of course, you're free to continue making excuses, if it serves your purpose.



GOProud Condemns Dan Savage’s Anti-Christian Tirade - http://www.goproud.org/page.aspx?pid=425

“Dan Savage should apologize for his comments and should apologize to the high school students in attendance who he called ‘pansy-asses,’†continued LaSalvia. “It is ironic that someone whose claim to fame is fighting bullying would resort to bullying tactics in attacking high school students who were offended by his outrageous remarks.â€

I'm not going to continue to bicker about this, because I think its stupid. Yeah Dan deserves some criticism. Yes I agree.

Does it change that Danus made a claim that this is persecuting Christians when Dan didn't persecute Christians? No, and that was the point I was making. I don't feel the need to defend Dan all that much, because its his statements and that's it. I'm going to pay more attention to the actual message instead of trying to find something to be offended about in here.

 

[Christ_empowered]

I was bullied in school. I was pre-gay in the south, so that was bound to happen. I don't like the "It gets better" campaign because I think its a lie. If someone chooses to live the gay lifestyle, his life will not get better. His life will get progressively worse.

Dan Savage is a bully. I can't quote what he said about Rick Santorum because of its graphic nature, but if you feel so inclined you can google it. I'm no fan of Rick Santorum, but I don't think Savage's bullying was appropriate. Savage is also a huge fan of open relationships (typical in the gay community, btw). I think this anti-bullying crusade we're seeing emerge is going to lead to the emergence of Thought Police, people (maybe of them in the "helping professions") who will tell us what to think, how to feel, how to live, and what to say. Creepy. Perfectly creepy.

 

[Pard]

"It Gets Better" is their campaign? Wow! Why don't we just tell children when they grow up they will all be brain surgeons and will live in mansions on the hill and will drive Maybachs?

It doesn't get better, I don't care if you are gay or what, life is pretty much the same from the point of 4th grade onwards. There are bullies, and you can choose to associate with them, confront them, or just ignore them. You tell them life gets better and then they figure out it doesn't and now you really are looking at a suicide issue! Instead of lying, wouldn't it be grand to just tell them the truth and tell them how to deal with bullies?

And I was speaking to the anti-bully legislation that many states are considering or have passed. In my state if someone gets bullied at a certain grade level/age it HAS to be reported to the cops and they have to make it a big deal...

 

[Mike S]

I'm not going to continue to bicker about this, because I think its stupid. Yeah Dan deserves some criticism. Yes I agree.

Does it change that Danus made a claim that this is persecuting Christians when Dan didn't persecute Christians? No, and that was the point I was making. I don't feel the need to defend Dan all that much, because its his statements and that's it. I'm going to pay more attention to the actual message instead of trying to find something to be offended about in here.

OK, we're good.

 

[Milk-Drops]

"It Gets Better" is their campaign? Wow! Why don't we just tell children when they grow up they will all be brain surgeons and will live in mansions on the hill and will drive Maybachs?

It doesn't get better, I don't care if you are gay or what, life is pretty much the same from the point of 4th grade onwards. There are bullies, and you can choose to associate with them, confront them, or just ignore them. You tell them life gets better and then they figure out it doesn't and now you really are looking at a suicide issue! Instead of lying, wouldn't it be grand to just tell them the truth and tell them how to deal with bullies?

The "It Gets better campaign" Does teach on how to deal with bullies, and most of the campaign is videos by people who share their stories of being bullied and explain how they got out of it and tell the viewers that things change. That is it.

There are criticisms to this campaign, and you did raise a few, but I think that the campaign itself is not a bad idea. At least some people are trying. I think that is the bigger problem. Whenever anyone tries to improve something, hostility is thrown right on top of them. Even if its something we can all agree on.

 

[Pard]

I don't agree with the notion that anything ought to be done for bullying. Why does something have to be done? I got through it just fine, and so did you. Heck, I learned a thing or to from being bullied. I know how to throw a wicked right hook and I also know how to ignore idiots. You keep kids shelter in grade school and just wait to see the skyrocketing suicide rates once they get into the real world!!!

Whinging, "My boss said I am an awful employee..." *BOOM*

 

[Milk-Drops]

OK, we're good.

Yay! I was subscribed to the man's podcast for a short time. Ended up unsubing because of his snarkyness and ego.

 

[jasoncran]

I don't agree with the notion that anything ought to be done for bullying. Why does something have to be done? I got through it just fine, and so did you. Heck, I learned a thing or to from being bullied. I know how to throw a wicked right hook and I also know how to ignore idiots. You keep kids shelter in grade school and just wait to see the skyrocketing suicide rates once they get into the real world!!!

Whinging, "My boss said I am an awful employee..." *BOOM*

or join the army where sadly that mentallity is becoming common. war is hell and the enemy is a bully! what then cry foul when the enemy attacks and doesnt fight with honor?

 

[Milk-Drops]

I don't agree with the notion that anything ought to be done for bullying. Why does something have to be done?

Depending on the case, there are several reasons. Assault, Theft, Identity theft, ignorance, harassment, Defamation, Vandalism, Child abuse, etc. Bullying isn't just calling people names.

I got through it just fine, and so did you. Heck, I learned a thing or to from being bullied. I know how to throw a wicked right hook and I also know how to ignore idiots. You keep kids shelter in grade school and just wait to see the skyrocketing suicide rates once they get into the real world!!!

Pard their are situation where such incidents I pointed out above can be avoided (unless the person really is stupid).

I do agree that we can't shelter children, but I do think that we can at least try and educate kids a little better and do better to teach critical thinking skills. I'm also a big advocate for self defense. I just also understand that life can catch someone and they need either uplifted by something or someone who dose understand what they are going through to give them advice. That is why I like this campaign. That dosen't mean I support all the Bullying legislation though.

Whinging, "My boss said I am an awful employee..." *BOOM*

There is also the other side of the coin, "My class mate beat my head against the wall because I'm a differn't (insert reason here) then Him/her and no one cares........."*BOOM*